Edwin Valero

[Gandalf]

I don't think Valero beats Marquez right now. Valero hasn't really done too much yet, and from what I've seen he's a hard puncher, but has no defence.

Marquez is still just about on the top of his game and is knocking people clean out.

He won't last forever though, and has about a year left at the top IMO.

[CutMeMick]

He won't last forever though, and has about a year left at the top IMO.

Spot on miles.
I actually think he's got 3 fights left in him. The last one being really shakey.

But I think he's good for 2 more top caliber fights.

[CutMeMick]

Bilbo didn't you predict a Juan Diaz win?

[Kev]

Bilbo didn't you predict a Juan Diaz win?

If he was more durable he would have won. Clearly on that showing at least Marquez would have been manhandled by the Nate Campbell that bullied Diaz.

I think Marquez is a terrific fighter I just think the ring wars have caught up with him.

Both Juan Diaz and Casamayor had both been beaten a lot easier in recent fights than Marquez managed.

Santa Cruz cruised to a win over Casa but was robbed, Marquez's win was much more emphatic, he literally destroyed Casa at the end, but he had to go to war with him to do it.

You can think I'm crazy but when I picture Marquez in the ring with Valero (or Cory Spinks for that matter) I just see him getting dominated in the exchange. He will go toe to toe with Valero and I think Valero will stop him, younger, fresher, stronger.

Not dissing Marquez at all I just think the lightweight division is the extreme for his weight and size and that he's come to the end of his prime career and is now on the slide.

He's older than Barrera remember. We've seen Morales go, Barrera lasted maybe a year longer, and Marquez a year longer again, but he's past his prime now. Not shot by any means, but slipped enough for a younger hungry fighter like Valero or Juan Guzman to take advantage.

It will be interesting to see who his next fight is against, but you are right in that I will probably be backing against him for the third time in his last 4 fights

[CutMeMick]

Bilbo didn't you predict a Juan Diaz win?

If he was more durable he would have won. Clearly on that showing at least Marquez would have been manhandled by the Nate Campbell that bullied Diaz.

I think Marquez is a terrific fighter I just think the ring wars have caught up with him.

Both Juan Diaz and Casamayor had both been beaten a lot easier in recent fights than Marquez managed.

Santa Cruz cruised to a win over Casa but was robbed, Marquez's win was much more emphatic, he literally destroyed Casa at the end, but he had to go to war with him to do it.

You can think I'm crazy but when I picture Marquez in the ring with Valero (or Cory Spinks for that matter) I just see him getting dominated in the exchange. He will go toe to toe with Valero and I think Valero will stop him, younger, fresher, stronger.

Not dissing Marquez at all I just think the lightweight division is the extreme for his weight and size and that he's come to the end of his prime career and is now on the slide.

He's older than Barrera remember. We've seen Morales go, Barrera lasted maybe a year longer, and Marquez a year longer again, but he's past his prime now. Not shot by any means, but slipped enough for a younger hungry fighter like Valero or Juan Guzman to take advantage.

It will be interesting to see who his next fight is against, but you are right in that I will probably be backing against him for the third time in his last 4 fights

A simple yes-no would have suffice but thanks for trying to somewhat "back" why you've picked against him.

You've got good reasons to believe eveything you post but, if JMM loses now it will be a great fighter. He will not lose to someone like Valero not now a year from now possibly but not now.

As for your entire post it's quite simple.
Styles make fights.
JMM & Casa both counter punchers.
Diaz a fucking bull that lives up to his nickame.

If Casa was done and all this talk why didn't Pac fight him when he moved up to Lightweight? Why did he go and face David Diaz?
JMM took on 2 of the best available Lightweights in the world at that time and he won.

[Kev]

Bilbo didn't you predict a Juan Diaz win?

If he was more durable he would have won. Clearly on that showing at least Marquez would have been manhandled by the Nate Campbell that bullied Diaz.

I think Marquez is a terrific fighter I just think the ring wars have caught up with him.

Both Juan Diaz and Casamayor had both been beaten a lot easier in recent fights than Marquez managed.

Santa Cruz cruised to a win over Casa but was robbed, Marquez's win was much more emphatic, he literally destroyed Casa at the end, but he had to go to war with him to do it.

You can think I'm crazy but when I picture Marquez in the ring with Valero (or Cory Spinks for that matter) I just see him getting dominated in the exchange. He will go toe to toe with Valero and I think Valero will stop him, younger, fresher, stronger.

Not dissing Marquez at all I just think the lightweight division is the extreme for his weight and size and that he's come to the end of his prime career and is now on the slide.

He's older than Barrera remember. We've seen Morales go, Barrera lasted maybe a year longer, and Marquez a year longer again, but he's past his prime now. Not shot by any means, but slipped enough for a younger hungry fighter like Valero or Juan Guzman to take advantage.

It will be interesting to see who his next fight is against, but you are right in that I will probably be backing against him for the third time in his last 4 fights

A simple yes-no would have suffice but thanks for trying to somewhat "back" why you've picked against him.

You've got good reasons to believe eveything you post but, if JMM loses now it will be a great fighter. He will not lose to someone like Valero not now a year from now possibly but not now.

As for your entire post it's quite simple.
Styles make fights.
JMM & Casa both counter punchers.
Diaz a fucking bull that lives up to his nickame.

If Casa was done and all this talk why didn't Pac fight him when he moved up to Lightweight? Why did he go and face David Diaz?
JMM took on 2 of the best available Lightweights in the world at that time and he won.

Out of interest Mick do you also think Marquez could move up to 154 lbs and knock out Cory Spinks?

[CutMeMick]

If he was more durable he would have won. Clearly on that showing at least Marquez would have been manhandled by the Nate Campbell that bullied Diaz.

I think Marquez is a terrific fighter I just think the ring wars have caught up with him.

Both Juan Diaz and Casamayor had both been beaten a lot easier in recent fights than Marquez managed.

Santa Cruz cruised to a win over Casa but was robbed, Marquez's win was much more emphatic, he literally destroyed Casa at the end, but he had to go to war with him to do it.

You can think I'm crazy but when I picture Marquez in the ring with Valero (or Cory Spinks for that matter) I just see him getting dominated in the exchange. He will go toe to toe with Valero and I think Valero will stop him, younger, fresher, stronger.

Not dissing Marquez at all I just think the lightweight division is the extreme for his weight and size and that he's come to the end of his prime career and is now on the slide.

He's older than Barrera remember. We've seen Morales go, Barrera lasted maybe a year longer, and Marquez a year longer again, but he's past his prime now. Not shot by any means, but slipped enough for a younger hungry fighter like Valero or Juan Guzman to take advantage.

It will be interesting to see who his next fight is against, but you are right in that I will probably be backing against him for the third time in his last 4 fights

A simple yes-no would have suffice but thanks for trying to somewhat "back" why you've picked against him.

You've got good reasons to believe eveything you post but, if JMM loses now it will be a great fighter. He will not lose to someone like Valero not now a year from now possibly but not now.

As for your entire post it's quite simple.
Styles make fights.
JMM & Casa both counter punchers.
Diaz a fucking bull that lives up to his nickame.

If Casa was done and all this talk why didn't Pac fight him when he moved up to Lightweight? Why did he go and face David Diaz?
JMM took on 2 of the best available Lightweights in the world at that time and he won.

Out of interest Mick do you also think Marquez could move up to 154 lbs and knock out Cory Spinks?

Fuck NO.

However I said this after the Casa win that JMM if he's smart he will capture a 4th title in 4 divisions and will be the 1st Mexican to ever do this.
At 140 I think he beats any of the title holders.

[Julius Rain]

Bilbo didn't you predict a Juan Diaz win?

If he was more durable he would have won. Clearly on that showing at least Marquez would have been manhandled by the Nate Campbell that bullied Diaz.

I think Marquez is a terrific fighter I just think the ring wars have caught up with him.

Both Juan Diaz and Casamayor had both been beaten a lot easier in recent fights than Marquez managed.

Santa Cruz cruised to a win over Casa but was robbed, Marquez's win was much more emphatic, he literally destroyed Casa at the end, but he had to go to war with him to do it.

You can think I'm crazy but when I picture Marquez in the ring with Valero (or Cory Spinks for that matter) I just see him getting dominated in the exchange. He will go toe to toe with Valero and I think Valero will stop him, younger, fresher, stronger.

Not dissing Marquez at all I just think the lightweight division is the extreme for his weight and size and that he's come to the end of his prime career and is now on the slide.

He's older than Barrera remember. We've seen Morales go, Barrera lasted maybe a year longer, and Marquez a year longer again, but he's past his prime now. Not shot by any means, but slipped enough for a younger hungry fighter like Valero or Juan Guzman to take advantage.

It will be interesting to see who his next fight is against, but you are right in that I will probably be backing against him for the third time in his last 4 fights

A simple yes-no would have suffice but thanks for trying to somewhat "back" why you've picked against him.

You've got good reasons to believe eveything you post but, if JMM loses now it will be a great fighter. He will not lose to someone like Valero not now a year from now possibly but not now.

As for your entire post it's quite simple.
Styles make fights.
JMM & Casa both counter punchers.
Diaz a fucking bull that lives up to his nickame.

If Casa was done and all this talk why didn't Pac fight him when he moved up to Lightweight? Why did he go and face David Diaz?
JMM took on 2 of the best available Lightweights in the world at that time and he won.

Mick we all know both Pac and JMM will fight anyone. David Diaz became pacs oppenent at lightweight because he was the easy fight to make and so Bob wouldn't need to share profit with another promoter. Diaz was given the chance but he was just a tune up for bigger things to come for pac.

BTW Im real proud of JMM he is KIng at 135 and after saturday Pac will be king of 140. Can we even begin to image the legacy these two are creating!!!!

[CutMeMick]

If he was more durable he would have won. Clearly on that showing at least Marquez would have been manhandled by the Nate Campbell that bullied Diaz.

I think Marquez is a terrific fighter I just think the ring wars have caught up with him.

Both Juan Diaz and Casamayor had both been beaten a lot easier in recent fights than Marquez managed.

Santa Cruz cruised to a win over Casa but was robbed, Marquez's win was much more emphatic, he literally destroyed Casa at the end, but he had to go to war with him to do it.

You can think I'm crazy but when I picture Marquez in the ring with Valero (or Cory Spinks for that matter) I just see him getting dominated in the exchange. He will go toe to toe with Valero and I think Valero will stop him, younger, fresher, stronger.

Not dissing Marquez at all I just think the lightweight division is the extreme for his weight and size and that he's come to the end of his prime career and is now on the slide.

He's older than Barrera remember. We've seen Morales go, Barrera lasted maybe a year longer, and Marquez a year longer again, but he's past his prime now. Not shot by any means, but slipped enough for a younger hungry fighter like Valero or Juan Guzman to take advantage.

It will be interesting to see who his next fight is against, but you are right in that I will probably be backing against him for the third time in his last 4 fights

A simple yes-no would have suffice but thanks for trying to somewhat "back" why you've picked against him.

You've got good reasons to believe eveything you post but, if JMM loses now it will be a great fighter. He will not lose to someone like Valero not now a year from now possibly but not now.

As for your entire post it's quite simple.
Styles make fights.
JMM & Casa both counter punchers.
Diaz a fucking bull that lives up to his nickame.

If Casa was done and all this talk why didn't Pac fight him when he moved up to Lightweight? Why did he go and face David Diaz?
JMM took on 2 of the best available Lightweights in the world at that time and he won.

Mick we all know both Pac and JMM will fight anyone. David Diaz became pacs oppenent at lightweight because he was the easy fight to make and so Bob wouldn't need to share profit with another promoter. Diaz was given the chance but he was just a tune up for bigger things to come for pac.

BTW Im real proud of JMM he is KIng at 135 and after saturday Pac will be king of 140. Can we even begin to image the legacy these two are creating!!!!

Def. JR...
These 2 are doing big things.
Pac more then JMM as it's clear he's far more popular world wide.
But as far as boxing goes I think it's rivalries like this that make our sport one of a kind and a sport that will live on forever.