so is that it for angulo??

[OumaFan]

What do you think of as quality opposition? They weren't elite but they weren't bums. Dorin was a bit undersized but had been robbed of a win versus Spadafora. Leija was a bit past it and undersized too but he knew what he was doing. They were solid wins, especially Dorin who was given a good chance of beating Gatti. Combined with the two wins over Ward and that's not a bad run.

I'm not overrating Gatti, I always thought he was more exciting than good but he was far more talented than Angulo.

[ICB]

Maybe the last run but Gatti had a decent run before the Mayweather fight beating Dorin, Leija, Ward a few times plus he has wins over guys like Tracy Harris Patterson, Gabe Ruelas, etc. Angulo I don't think will be that successful.

Another problem is Angulo's gotta step it up activity wise, I'm not sure I'd classify what he did the other night as an exciting performance. It was a solid enough fight but nothing great unless

compared to that shit HBO vomited out for the main event.

oh c`mon theres no possible way you can suggest guys like dorin and leija represent beating quality opposition.

I was brought up on arturo gatti and am a huge fan but the guy was too one dimensional to ever beat a world class opponent

I don't know whether or not you would class Tracy Harris Patterson, as world class but he did beat two good names in Daniel Zaragoza, Thierry Jacob. And beating Daniel Zaragoza who is a HOF and one of the best Super Bantamweight's of all time is a hell of an achievement.

[HattonTheHammer]

What do you think of as quality opposition? They weren't elite but they weren't bums. Dorin was a bit undersized but had been robbed of a win versus Spadafora. Leija was a bit past it and undersized too but he knew what he was doing. They were solid wins, especially Dorin who was given a good chance of beating Gatti. Combined with the two wins over Ward and that's not a bad run.

quality opposition = very talented fighters with good records in the prime of their careers.

Not 2nd/3rd tier fighters with bulked up CVs due to fighting a hell of a lot of average opponents!

[RozzySean]

Gatti was a two weight division major belt champion. At 130, he was top tier fighter. For a variety of reason, including his lifestyle, he couldn't make that weight for that long. He has a rough patch in the middle of his career, and he fought longer than he should have. If you only remember the Gatti who fought Oscar, Floyd, Baldy, and Gomez, than you would probably under rate him.

Gatti was much faster than Angulo and had better boxing skills when he chose to use them. He got outclassed against much a much better bigger Oscar and Floyd Mayweather. His last few fights he was shot.

You beat me to it, Gatti can be a bit underrated, he was far more naturally talented than Angulo, Angulo should consider himself extremely lucky if he has a Gatti-esque career.

Arturo was a deserved champ but even the staunchest of gatti fan has to admit that the last 2-3 years of his career he got those big fights not through merit but in that he was exciting to watch all the time and his wide open defence provided a very solid chin.

Ricardo Mayorga has pretty much made a living of not being a succesful fighter but being a very exciting come forward, solid fighter which is what i fear may end up happening now to angulo

Absolutely, he got those last big money paydays based on his drawing power and to some degree circumstance. He was probably the biggest non-ODLH gate during that stretch, and he probably wouldn't have gotten the Oscar fight if it wasn't for his drawing power. He owned the Atlantic City, even before the Ward fights, and he was probably the East Coasts most consistent draw.

He had a legit claim to fight for the WBC strap. He won and defended twice before the Mayweather fight. It was the biggest reward for the least risk for Mayweather. I don't think Mayweather makes that fight if Gatti didn't have the strap. Gatti really should have retired after that fight, but they kept throwing money at him.

Angulo may end up being a more likable Mayorga, but I see him more as a smaller Librado Andrade. He's tough as nails. He fights relaxed, consistent and he won't give in. Like Andrade, he's on the slow side and he doesn't have great one punch power. His pressure breaks fighters down over time. There would be nothing wrong with him having an Andrade-esque career.

[JazMerkin]

You beat me to it, Gatti can be a bit underrated, he was far more naturally talented than Angulo, Angulo should consider himself extremely lucky if he has a Gatti-esque career.

Arturo was a deserved champ but even the staunchest of gatti fan has to admit that the last 2-3 years of his career he got those big fights not through merit but in that he was exciting to watch all the time and his wide open defence provided a very solid chin.

Ricardo Mayorga has pretty much made a living of not being a succesful fighter but being a very exciting come forward, solid fighter which is what i fear may end up happening now to angulo

Absolutely, he got those last big money paydays based on his drawing power and to some degree circumstance. He was probably the biggest non-ODLH gate during that stretch, and he probably wouldn't have gotten the Oscar fight if it wasn't for his drawing power. He owned the Atlantic City, even before the Ward fights, and he was probably the East Coasts most consistent draw.

He had a legit claim to fight for the WBC strap. He won and defended twice before the Mayweather fight. It was the biggest reward for the least risk for Mayweather. I don't think Mayweather makes that fight if Gatti didn't have the strap. Gatti really should have retired after that fight, but they kept throwing money at him.

Angulo may end up being a more likable Mayorga, but I see him more as a smaller Librado Andrade. He's tough as nails. He fights relaxed, consistent and he won't give in. Like Andrade, he's on the slow side and he doesn't have great one punch power. His pressure breaks fighters down over time. There would be nothing wrong with him having an Andrade-esque career.

Agree with all of that except the bit about Andrade. The difference being that Andrade was a guy who basically fought out of nowhere, whilst Angulo had a lot more hype around him, and all due respect to Cintron, Andrade has only lost to the 2 best guys in his division. I don't see Angulo having a Andrade career, because I think his hype (ie all that stuff about being the next great Mexican fighter) has put him in the position where he can't afford a loss as much as Andrade can, meaning he can't simply bounce back. I think he will end up being more of a Joel Julio kind of situation, where he eventually becomes the last step for a prospect before he goes in against the best of a divison.

[Myk_Myk]

I've never thought Alfredo Anuglo was that good, Victor Ortiz is a better come forward fighter than Alfredo Angulo. And prospects like Abner Mares, Devon Alexander, Yuriorkis Gamboa, always looked like they have much more promising career's than Alfredo Angulo would ever have.

If Alfredo Angulo is the real deal he should of beaten Kermit Cintron, who is a good fighter but not that good and his power is slightly overrated aswell. Even a very limited fighter in Jessie Feliciano was giving Kermit Cintron much more problems.

And even the undersized and past it Lovemore N'dou done not that much worse than Alfredo Angulo. Im sorry but i can't see Alfredo Angulo getting better. He fights one way and if he can't break a fighter with a suspect heart.

Then he isn't that good of a come forward fighter, because B and C class fighters have able to be just as effective against Kermit Cintron. It was the right fight to be made and at the right time no excuses.

The only thing is that Kermit fought Feliciano and N'dou differently they he fought Angulo.

Too see if Alfredo Angulo is the real deal and he isn't, i can't ever see him going very far or picking up a belt. Even though the Jr Middleweight isn't a hot division it still isn't that weak either.

You got fighters like James Kirkland, Daniel Santos, Cory Spinks, Sergiy Dzinziruk, Yuri Foreman, Vernon Forrest, Sergio, Martinez. Who i think would all beat Alfredo Angulo.

Well you do have a good point here when you think about it. I'd love to see Kirkland fight Cintron... I was in a let's-wait-and-see attitude with Angulo, before, and I still am after this fight. Yeah, he's lacking and he has some definite flaws. But, I still think he was a good bit shy of 100%, he didn't get the best advice early, he's young and can still learn, and he has heart. I certainly still look forward to seeing his next fight!

[Hulk]

I think this whole thread is stupid.

A guy's career is done because he had a bad night and lost a decision in ONE fight?

Give me a fucking break.