Quote Originally Posted by AdamGB View Post
140.1-147 is the Welterweight class? Wow... you learn something everyday.

Maybe if we still had same day weigh ins then people who walk around at or near to 147 would be Welterweights...

But that's not how things are any more, as I have said things have changed... virtually everybody drys up now... they find a weight that they can do it effectivly at.

Guys who campaign at 140/147/154/160... what ever... none of them walk around at the weight anymore.

Things have changed since same day weigh ins and a whole entire division of established fighters aren't going to be shifted up a division or two just so that manny can dominate an 8th division. By beating the man at Light Welterweight he's already beat the top fighter of the people who would end up in the 147 class anyway if we had same day weigh ins again

Every time Pac has fought with the exception of ODLH I guarantee you that he will have been heavier than he was when he weighed in, even Hatton... the same habits of drying up apply to Pac too... not a problem then though is it? If you weighed Pacman in the ring against Hatton he would of been in the Welterweight divison... it's a good thing that we go off the WEIGH IN then isn't it?

The more he moves up the less he'll have to do it... eventually he will get too far and that's just a fact. That's the only reason Mosely is tempted down is because Roach suspects that he has finally moved up to the limit were these guys are just too big.

Well in that case fight guys who are weighing in as Light Welters... If guys weighing in as Welters are too big then they're too big.
You agree about the definition of the welterweight class and proclaim fighter safety is the reason Pacquiao shouldn't be fighting in the welterweight class. You state it's unsafe for Mosley because he has to dehydrate to make weight. What an absolute hypocrite! If you were concerned about fighter safety you would put in a limit a fighter can be allowed to "rehydrate". I already highlighted your response. Some boxing commissions actually set a limit.

This article articulates my position on this issue better than I can.

It's a good article a bit long but worth it if you can get though it.
Boxing and the Law: Weighing In On Jose Luis Castillo | TheSweetScience.com Boxing
By David Berlin

The weigh-in before the fight is controlled by rules and by ritual. Two men, bare-chested, challenging each other with hard eyes and hard muscles, as each takes his turn stepping on the scale. The weight is made. Biceps are flexed in a show of triumph. It is a moment of drama, the last chance for opponents to take stock of each other, to measure each other, before they meet in the ring.

But the weigh-in, however dramatic, is only prelude. Thousands may have filled the seats of the MGM Grand Garden Arena ...... (see link for the complete article)....... Joan Guzman, has been known to come into a fight nineteen pounds heavier than he was at the weigh-in. He achieves this by hooking up to an IV in order to re-hydrate his body.

These massive weight gains between weigh-in and fight are possible because of the length of time between the two events. The WBC directs that “[t]he weigh-in ceremony shall be held from 24 to 30 hours prior to the start of the boxing event.” The WBA rule mandates that the weigh-in take place between 4 and 8 pm the day before the fight. The IBF states that “[t]he initial weigh-in shall be no less than twelve (12) nor more than twenty four (24) hours before the start of the bout,” but, in practice, it is routinely more than 24 hours; the IBF, however, does direct that a second weigh-in take place on the morning of the fight, at which the fighters can weigh no more than ten pounds above the weight limit. The WBO fails to set forth a time in their rules, but the practice is to hold the weigh-in ceremony the day before the fight. The rules of the sanctioning organizations apply only to championship fights, but most state commissions also hold day-before weigh-ins. In all cases, hours passed translate into pounds gained.

It wasn’t always that way. In the past, weigh-ins took place on the day of the fight. That practice changed for the wrong reasons – reasons that have to do with the promotion of the fight, and not with the health and safety of the fighters. “Promoters use weigh-ins as a way of marketing their fighters,” explains Larry Merchant, expert analyst for HBO Boxing since 1978. Holding the weigh-in the day before the fight provides another opportunity for publicity and television exposure. It is part of the hype leading to the fight, hype which sells tickets and attracts television viewers. Promoters and television executives are not wrong to want this publicity, but finally it must take a back seat to the more important considerations of safety and fairness. It is those interests that state commissions and sanctioning organizations must protect.

Proponents of day-before weigh-ins argue that the practice promotes the health and safety of boxers, as it gives them sufficient time to become properly re-hydrated before entering the ring. But that assumes that they have become improperly dehydrated leading up to the weigh-in. Greg Sirb, director of the Pennsylvania State Athletic Commission since 1987 and a vocal advocate of day-of-the-fight weigh-ins, makes the logical argument: “If a fighter has to starve himself and dehydrate himself in order to make weight, that is a sign that the fighter should not be in that weight class.” Starvation and dehydration, needless to say, cannot be good for the body, yet that is exactly what is promoted by day-before weigh-ins.

“The scientific or medical argument for early weigh-ins has largely been discounted,” says Merchant. Since there is no scientific basis to support day-before weigh-ins, a return to day-of-the-fight weigh-ins seems in order. “If it doesn’t make fighting safer,” argues Merchant, “then on an observational basis it makes boxing less safe.” That is because it allows a naturally bigger man to gain an unfair advantage in size and strength over a smaller opponent. Merchant illustrates his point: “Emmanuel Steward told me that Gerald McClellan used to wake up on the day of the weigh-in ten pounds over the weight limit. He would put on a rubber suit and go in and out of a steam room until he made weight.” McClellan, a middleweight knockout artist, was almost always the bigger, stronger man in the ring.

Holding the weigh-in on the day of the fight, as Pennsylvania does, encourages fighters to make weight in the proper way, and to fight in their proper weight classes. “What’s more important,” asks Sirb, “what the kid weighs before the fight or what he weighs at competition?” And that, finally, is the point. The reason that weight classes exist at all is to ensure a fair fight. Fair and safe competition begins with the requirement that the two men facing each other are the same size. If that is the goal, as it must be, then the way to achieve that goal is by holding day-of-the-fight weigh-ins. That is the only way to encourage boxers to fight in their proper weight classes. “Pick on someone your own size” may be a schoolyard rebuke, but it is a call, at bottom, for fairness.

Any change from the present system of day-before weigh-ins is bound to meet with resistance from both promoters and fighters. But Merchant believes that a combination of creative and legal thinking can overcome this resistance. On the creative side, promoters need to find different ways to market their fights so that they do not have to depend on weigh-ins. Adjusting the times of press conferences, making fighters available to the press and holding public work-outs are among a number of suggestions offered by Merchant. Administratively, commissioners, particularly those in the major fight venues of Nevada and California in the west, and New York and New Jersey in the east, need to institute a policy of day-of-the-fight weigh-ins. “Ultimately what will happen is that fighters will start to fight at a weight that is more natural for them,” says Merchant.

In his lead-in to the HBO-televised Barrios-Guzman fight, Merchant spoke on air about a movement to return to weigh-ins on the day of the fight in order to stop the practice of fighters trying to make weight in the wrong way. He was speaking about Jorge Barrios, but hovering behind his comments was the shadow of Jose Luis Castillo. Both fighters failed to make weight for title fights, and the only reason they tried to make a weight that was unnaturally low given the size of their bodies was that they knew they would have more than 24 hours to put weight back on. Early weigh-ins, says Merchant, “discourage some fighters from training as hard as they have to because they think they can finesse it.” If Castillo knew that he would not have more than a day to replenish his body, he would not have pretended to be a lightweight. Safety and fairness matter – they matter more than publicity – and we will move one step closer to those goals by having fighters fight in their proper weight classes.