Would Juan Manuel Marquez's Brother Have Done Better Against Manny Pacquiao P4P ?

[Taeth]

I said right hand from the beginning. That was pretty clear. Why you decided to mention Pacquiao's right and than back track, i have no idea. Like I said a couple of posts back your not really familar with Rafael Marquez career. So really your not fit to discuss him. Vazquez is not the only p4p fighter Marquez has beaten. Mark Johnson was a p4p fighter who hadn't been beaten in 11 years. Marquez out pointed him and than knocked him out. He also knocked out the unbeaten and underrated Tim Austin. Who was boarderline p4p. But you don't recongnize the names. So to you they don't count.

I didn't back track, I just never mentioned pacquiao's right hand, you didn't read what I was saying and you assumed when I was talkign about Pacquiao that I was talking about the right hand when I was talking about the cross. Second you have no idea about how much Rafael Marquez I've watched, I guarantee I watch more fights than you do. Also when was Mark Johnson a legitimate p4p fighter? I can easily name 10-15 guys better than him at any period in his career, he hadn't foughten anybody before Rafael Marquez, he didn't have credibility, there are so many better fighters that were out there in the late 90's and early 00's.

I rest my case. If you knew who Johnson was you would not make such a stupid statement. This is exactly why I tell you muthafukkas to actually watch a fighter fight. Instead of just reading his record. That way you can have your own opinion about him instead of going off some one else. And it stops you from making stupid posts that make you look like an idiot

Mark Johnson was a badass back in the day. He wasn't at his best versus Rafa but also 118 was a bit much.

JMM's just the better of the brothers IMO, P4P at their best I'd always take Pacquaio over Rafa. If you want to get into 122 and all that I'd still probably take Pacquaio but he's improved a lot over the fighter he was there.

He did comeback to hand Fernando Montiel his first loss. So he was obviously still an excellent fighter

I watch way more boxing than you do Violent stop being a dumb ass

Anyone who knows boxing knows
Lennox Lewis
Winky Wright
Oscar Dela Hoya
Felix Trinidad
Marco Antonio Barrera
Floyd Mayweather
Roy Jones Jr
Bernard Hopkins
Eric Morales
Shane Mosley
Kostya Tszyu
Are all better than Mark Johnson, there is a reason he isn't going into the hall of fame.

Yet your the person who says Mark Johnson is better than all these guys who most of which were near their prime around this period.

Manny was an absolute beast at 122, Rafael hasn't had the same chance to beat lesser opponents at the weight, but Manny naturally bigger stronger, faster, and while Rafael is better technically, he isn't better technically than Barrera who Pacquiao chewed up. If Rafael fought the version of Manny who was at 122, but was naturally the bigger man it might be a different story, but coming up like he has to 122, he isn't as powerful, and Vazquez isn't what Pacquiao was at 122, he doesn't hit as hard, he's not as quick, and he isn't southpaw.

Violent Demise, you are truly an idiot, you can't even come up with a good arguement, the only thing you can say is that I haven't seen this fighter or that, I had no idea that you've seen my fight archive and what fights I've seen. Its pretty surprising seeing as I've got my videos on an external hard drive, and if you did see it you would see fights with Mark Johnson and Rafael MArquez on there, and I've watched Rafael Marquez probably more than you have. Try coming up with a valid arguement of why Mark Johnson is better than the list I mentioned before, try coming up with examples of where Rafael showed his right hand to be better than Hopkin, Roy Jones Jr, or Floyd Mayweather Jr's crosses. You also must be dumb because if you had seen any of them fight this whole arguement would be void, its clear the guys I've mentioned have the best crosses in boxing, and have had them for awhile.

[OumaFan]

I guess I should tell you two to chill out on the insults on the main board. I think its generally accepted that you think each other is a dumb ass so maybe we could just leave it at that instead of constantly expressing it.

[Violent Demise]

I didn't back track, I just never mentioned pacquiao's right hand, you didn't read what I was saying and you assumed when I was talkign about Pacquiao that I was talking about the right hand when I was talking about the cross. Second you have no idea about how much Rafael Marquez I've watched, I guarantee I watch more fights than you do. Also when was Mark Johnson a legitimate p4p fighter? I can easily name 10-15 guys better than him at any period in his career, he hadn't foughten anybody before Rafael Marquez, he didn't have credibility, there are so many better fighters that were out there in the late 90's and early 00's.

I rest my case. If you knew who Johnson was you would not make such a stupid statement. This is exactly why I tell you muthafukkas to actually watch a fighter fight. Instead of just reading his record. That way you can have your own opinion about him instead of going off some one else. And it stops you from making stupid posts that make you look like an idiot

Mark Johnson was a badass back in the day. He wasn't at his best versus Rafa but also 118 was a bit much.

JMM's just the better of the brothers IMO, P4P at their best I'd always take Pacquaio over Rafa. If you want to get into 122 and all that I'd still probably take Pacquaio but he's improved a lot over the fighter he was there.

He did comeback to hand Fernando Montiel his first loss. So he was obviously still an excellent fighter

True but that was at 115 and I still think Montiel choked a bit in that fight. Johnson was a great 112 pounder.

I actually think Montiel rally to pull it out at the end by a point. But it was no robbery. And it clearly showed Johnson wasn't done

I didn't back track, I just never mentioned pacquiao's right hand, you didn't read what I was saying and you assumed when I was talkign about Pacquiao that I was talking about the right hand when I was talking about the cross. Second you have no idea about how much Rafael Marquez I've watched, I guarantee I watch more fights than you do. Also when was Mark Johnson a legitimate p4p fighter? I can easily name 10-15 guys better than him at any period in his career, he hadn't foughten anybody before Rafael Marquez, he didn't have credibility, there are so many better fighters that were out there in the late 90's and early 00's.

I rest my case. If you knew who Johnson was you would not make such a stupid statement. This is exactly why I tell you muthafukkas to actually watch a fighter fight. Instead of just reading his record. That way you can have your own opinion about him instead of going off some one else. And it stops you from making stupid posts that make you look like an idiot

Mark Johnson was a badass back in the day. He wasn't at his best versus Rafa but also 118 was a bit much.

JMM's just the better of the brothers IMO, P4P at their best I'd always take Pacquaio over Rafa. If you want to get into 122 and all that I'd still probably take Pacquaio but he's improved a lot over the fighter he was there.

He did comeback to hand Fernando Montiel his first loss. So he was obviously still an excellent fighter

I watch way more boxing than you do Violent stop being a dumb ass

Anyone who knows boxing knows
Lennox Lewis
Winky Wright
Oscar Dela Hoya
Felix Trinidad
Marco Antonio Barrera
Floyd Mayweather
Roy Jones Jr
Bernard Hopkins
Eric Morales
Shane Mosley
Kostya Tszyu
Are all better than Mark Johnson, there is a reason he isn't going into the hall of fame.

Yet your the person who says Mark Johnson is better than all these guys who most of which were near their prime around this period.

Manny was an absolute beast at 122, Rafael hasn't had the same chance to beat lesser opponents at the weight, but Manny naturally bigger stronger, faster, and while Rafael is better technically, he isn't better technically than Barrera who Pacquiao chewed up. If Rafael fought the version of Manny who was at 122, but was naturally the bigger man it might be a different story, but coming up like he has to 122, he isn't as powerful, and Vazquez isn't what Pacquiao was at 122, he doesn't hit as hard, he's not as quick, and he isn't southpaw.

If you came to that conclusion based on my posts than your a bigger idiot than I orignally thought. And that's pretty fukking big. When exactly did I say Johnson was better than the fighters listed? I said he was a p4p fighter. Which he was. There's a difference. Anybody that seen Johnson fight knows he's not the crap fighter your trying to make him out to be. He was an outstanding fighter.

You can make all the claims you want. But I figuered you out a long time ago. You know about the mainstream fighters. And that's pretty much it. You only know what's popular. The fact that you would use Jones-Trinidad as an example for anything positive still makes laugh

[Taeth]

I rest my case. If you knew who Johnson was you would not make such a stupid statement. This is exactly why I tell you muthafukkas to actually watch a fighter fight. Instead of just reading his record. That way you can have your own opinion about him instead of going off some one else. And it stops you from making stupid posts that make you look like an idiot



He did comeback to hand Fernando Montiel his first loss. So he was obviously still an excellent fighter

True but that was at 115 and I still think Montiel choked a bit in that fight. Johnson was a great 112 pounder.

I actually think Montiel rally to pull it out at the end by a point. But it was no robbery. And it clearly showed Johnson wasn't done

I rest my case. If you knew who Johnson was you would not make such a stupid statement. This is exactly why I tell you muthafukkas to actually watch a fighter fight. Instead of just reading his record. That way you can have your own opinion about him instead of going off some one else. And it stops you from making stupid posts that make you look like an idiot



He did comeback to hand Fernando Montiel his first loss. So he was obviously still an excellent fighter

I watch way more boxing than you do Violent stop being a dumb ass

Anyone who knows boxing knows
Lennox Lewis
Winky Wright
Oscar Dela Hoya
Felix Trinidad
Marco Antonio Barrera
Floyd Mayweather
Roy Jones Jr
Bernard Hopkins
Eric Morales
Shane Mosley
Kostya Tszyu
Are all better than Mark Johnson, there is a reason he isn't going into the hall of fame.

Yet your the person who says Mark Johnson is better than all these guys who most of which were near their prime around this period.

Manny was an absolute beast at 122, Rafael hasn't had the same chance to beat lesser opponents at the weight, but Manny naturally bigger stronger, faster, and while Rafael is better technically, he isn't better technically than Barrera who Pacquiao chewed up. If Rafael fought the version of Manny who was at 122, but was naturally the bigger man it might be a different story, but coming up like he has to 122, he isn't as powerful, and Vazquez isn't what Pacquiao was at 122, he doesn't hit as hard, he's not as quick, and he isn't southpaw.

If you came to that conclusion based on my posts than your a bigger idiot than I orignally thought. And that's pretty fukking big. When exactly did I say Johnson was better than the fighters listed? I said he was a p4p fighter. Which he was. There's a difference. Anybody that seen Johnson fight knows he's not the crap fighter your trying to make him out to be. He was an outstanding fighter.

You can make all the claims you want. But I figuered you out a long time ago. You know about the mainstream fighters. And that's pretty much it. You only know what's popular. The fact that you would use Jones-Trinidad as an example for anything positive still makes laugh

How am I suppose to say Roy Jones Jr's cross is still potent without using recent fights? You really must not be capable thinking very hard because your linear logic is getting redundant. Also I didn't say Mark Johnson wasn't a good fighter, I am just saying no way in hell should he have been p4p at that point, he had a lot of talent, but he didn't have the competition to prove he was a great fighter, there is a difference. Being p4p on the ring magazine list is pointless, they often put guys who don't deserve to be on it, there because
1) Guys on the list lose to good fighters and get dropped down much too quickly.
2) Fighters can be popular coming up, but they haven't proven themselves yet.
3) Bad choices.

Your admitting that he should be way up there, so I don't see the point argueing further, all you can do is resort to name calling because you can't have a decent debate about fighters, I wouldn't mind the name calling if you came up with intelligent arguements, but you don't. You think you know everything about me, you think you know so much about boxing, but you obviously don't or you would be able to come up with valid points.

[Violent Demise]

Violent Demise, you are truly an idiot, you can't even come up with a good arguement, the only thing you can say is that I haven't seen this fighter or that, I had no idea that you've seen my fight archive and what fights I've seen. Its pretty surprising seeing as I've got my videos on an external hard drive, and if you did see it you would see fights with Mark Johnson and Rafael MArquez on there, and I've watched Rafael Marquez probably more than you have. Try coming up with a valid arguement of why Mark Johnson is better than the list I mentioned before, try coming up with examples of where Rafael showed his right hand to be better than Hopkin, Roy Jones Jr, or Floyd Mayweather Jr's crosses. You also must be dumb because if you had seen any of them fight this whole arguement would be void, its clear the guys I've mentioned have the best crosses in boxing, and have had them for awhile.

When are you going to understand that the year is 2009. Not 1999. Roy Jones doesn't have the best of anything any more. His right hand (the only thing I been talking about) is not among the best any more. Why is that so hard for you to understand? I don't care if he hit Trinidad at will. You know why? Cuz it was a old, fat Trinidad who was fighting above his best weight. He wasn't a threat. As for Hopkins? He right was murder. Back in 2001. It was still among the best till 2005. It's not any more. It's not even the same punch. The duck your head, close you eyes right that Hopkins throws today is no where near the right that broke Trinidad. It's not even close to the right that ruined Joppy. Your going off names alone. Only an uneducated fool like yourself would say otherwise