Could ODLH have beaten PBF?

[ElTerribleMorales]

Oscar lost the fight to PBF, however the Oscar of 1999-2001 was a different story. At 147lb the Oscar of 2000 beats PBF! So does Mosley of the same year!

How was the 2000 version of Oscar any better than he was against Mayweather? He only had better speed, he had no right hand, he didn't have as good of defensive skills, and he over threw his jab which a fast guy would eventually counter over and over again. Also when he would get tired late like he always does and did, he was naturally smaller back then and easier to hurt than later on.

Mosley would be a better fight, but he still doesn't have the boxing skills to beat Mayweather, he had already started to look different from the dominant, brilliant lightweight he was, the combinations weren't as natural or thrown as often, his jab has never been that good, and he would load up on punches Floyd would see coming from a mile away. It would be close just because MOsley is so strong and so fast, but Floyd would win a close fight against Shane if those two versions of them fought. Shane is a much bigger guy with the same speed and much more strength, but he doesn't have the boxing skills.

Robinson was just so physically dominant, and he was adept at fighting on the outside, I doubt he would catch Floyd cleanly very often, but he would have won because he would have kept Floyd on the defensive all night much more effectively than Oscar.

Leonard: I think its a toss up, but Leonard's size advantage and adept ability to fight on the outside would have made it very tough for Floyd. Their similar speed would offset that advantage for either guy, but I think Leonard is the more offensive guy so more often than not the more active guy gets the nod. I bet Floyd would land more punches if they fought though.

dude that's the biggest load of bullshit, i can count the number of times a prime Oscar was hurt on one hand, he had a great chin and could take loads of punishment and yet still be effective

DLH's jab used to be a lot crisper when he was younger and he wouldn't just put it in your face, he would jab to the pit of the stomach and straight back to the head, pretty much what Mayweather did to Corrales

his speed was just as good as Mayweather's and his power was a lot better

if he'd pace himself he'd be able to rough up Mayweather enough to win a decision

[Taeth]

Oscar lost the fight to PBF, however the Oscar of 1999-2001 was a different story. At 147lb the Oscar of 2000 beats PBF! So does Mosley of the same year!

How was the 2000 version of Oscar any better than he was against Mayweather? He only had better speed, he had no right hand, he didn't have as good of defensive skills, and he over threw his jab which a fast guy would eventually counter over and over again. Also when he would get tired late like he always does and did, he was naturally smaller back then and easier to hurt than later on.

Mosley would be a better fight, but he still doesn't have the boxing skills to beat Mayweather, he had already started to look different from the dominant, brilliant lightweight he was, the combinations weren't as natural or thrown as often, his jab has never been that good, and he would load up on punches Floyd would see coming from a mile away. It would be close just because MOsley is so strong and so fast, but Floyd would win a close fight against Shane if those two versions of them fought. Shane is a much bigger guy with the same speed and much more strength, but he doesn't have the boxing skills.

Robinson was just so physically dominant, and he was adept at fighting on the outside, I doubt he would catch Floyd cleanly very often, but he would have won because he would have kept Floyd on the defensive all night much more effectively than Oscar.

Leonard: I think its a toss up, but Leonard's size advantage and adept ability to fight on the outside would have made it very tough for Floyd. Their similar speed would offset that advantage for either guy, but I think Leonard is the more offensive guy so more often than not the more active guy gets the nod. I bet Floyd would land more punches if they fought though.

dude that's the biggest load of bullshit, i can count the number of times a prime Oscar was hurt on one hand, he had a great chin and could take loads of punishment and yet still be effective

DLH's jab used to be a lot crisper when he was younger and he wouldn't just put it in your face, he would jab to the pit of the stomach and straight back to the head, pretty much what Mayweather did to Corrales

his speed was just as good as Mayweather's and his power was a lot better

if he'd pace himself he'd be able to rough up Mayweather enough to win a decision

Watch Oscar against Mayorga and then show me a more dominant fight for Oscar's jab.

You attack my validity, but you try and say that Oscar was ever as fast as Mayweather? That's a fucking joke. Just ask Genaro Hernandez who was faster, Mayweather is a lot faster than Oscar as was Mosley.

Oscar did have a great chin throughout his career, but punches did bother him more when he was younger. I can name the amount of times Mosley stunned him on one hand, but if you add up all the fights he was hurt a few times. Either way Mayweather couldn't stop Oscar in any version except maybe the one who faced Pacquiao.

But you're hate for Floyd and Manny is known by everyone on here. Just a little while ago you were arguing with me about how Marquez was better than Pacquiao. How MOrales would beat Mayweather at 130. Yet every time you are proven wrong.

[Howlin Mad Missy]

could he? yes. I thought he was doing well until he gassed and is when his best days are well behind him.

[THE THIRD MAN]

Oscar lost the fight to PBF, however the Oscar of 1999-2001 was a different story. At 147lb the Oscar of 2000 beats PBF! So does Mosley of the same year!

How was the 2000 version of Oscar any better than he was against Mayweather? He only had better speed, he had no right hand, he didn't have as good of defensive skills, and he over threw his jab which a fast guy would eventually counter over and over again. Also when he would get tired late like he always does and did, he was naturally smaller back then and easier to hurt than later on.

Mosley would be a better fight, but he still doesn't have the boxing skills to beat Mayweather, he had already started to look different from the dominant, brilliant lightweight he was, the combinations weren't as natural or thrown as often, his jab has never been that good, and he would load up on punches Floyd would see coming from a mile away. It would be close just because MOsley is so strong and so fast, but Floyd would win a close fight against Shane if those two versions of them fought. Shane is a much bigger guy with the same speed and much more strength, but he doesn't have the boxing skills.

Robinson was just so physically dominant, and he was adept at fighting on the outside, I doubt he would catch Floyd cleanly very often, but he would have won because he would have kept Floyd on the defensive all night much more effectively than Oscar.

Leonard: I think its a toss up, but Leonard's size advantage and adept ability to fight on the outside would have made it very tough for Floyd. Their similar speed would offset that advantage for either guy, but I think Leonard is the more offensive guy so more often than not the more active guy gets the nod. I bet Floyd would land more punches if they fought though.

I don't doubt Mayweather's skills, he is the best defensive fighter i have ever seen. I just don't think he would have handled both Oscar and Mosley in their primes at 147lb. Check out DLH V Mosley 1 and tell me Floyd would beat them both?

[sanchez786]

Had Oscar stuck to his jab as he did the first few rounds, then absolutely.

[albsur2006]

How was the 2000 version of Oscar any better than he was against Mayweather? He only had better speed, he had no right hand, he didn't have as good of defensive skills, and he over threw his jab which a fast guy would eventually counter over and over again. Also when he would get tired late like he always does and did, he was naturally smaller back then and easier to hurt than later on.

Mosley would be a better fight, but he still doesn't have the boxing skills to beat Mayweather, he had already started to look different from the dominant, brilliant lightweight he was, the combinations weren't as natural or thrown as often, his jab has never been that good, and he would load up on punches Floyd would see coming from a mile away. It would be close just because MOsley is so strong and so fast, but Floyd would win a close fight against Shane if those two versions of them fought. Shane is a much bigger guy with the same speed and much more strength, but he doesn't have the boxing skills.

Robinson was just so physically dominant, and he was adept at fighting on the outside, I doubt he would catch Floyd cleanly very often, but he would have won because he would have kept Floyd on the defensive all night much more effectively than Oscar.

Leonard: I think its a toss up, but Leonard's size advantage and adept ability to fight on the outside would have made it very tough for Floyd. Their similar speed would offset that advantage for either guy, but I think Leonard is the more offensive guy so more often than not the more active guy gets the nod. I bet Floyd would land more punches if they fought though.

dude that's the biggest load of bullshit, i can count the number of times a prime Oscar was hurt on one hand, he had a great chin and could take loads of punishment and yet still be effective

DLH's jab used to be a lot crisper when he was younger and he wouldn't just put it in your face, he would jab to the pit of the stomach and straight back to the head, pretty much what Mayweather did to Corrales

his speed was just as good as Mayweather's and his power was a lot better

if he'd pace himself he'd be able to rough up Mayweather enough to win a decision

Watch Oscar against Mayorga and then show me a more dominant fight for Oscar's jab.

You attack my validity, but you try and say that Oscar was ever as fast as Mayweather? That's a fucking joke. Just ask Genaro Hernandez who was faster, Mayweather is a lot faster than Oscar as was Mosley.

Oscar did have a great chin throughout his career, but punches did bother him more when he was younger. I can name the amount of times Mosley stunned him on one hand, but if you add up all the fights he was hurt a few times. Either way Mayweather couldn't stop Oscar in any version except maybe the one who faced Pacquiao.

But you're hate for Floyd and Manny is known by everyone on here. Just a little while ago you were arguing with me about how Marquez was better than Pacquiao. How MOrales would beat Mayweather at 130. Yet every time you are proven wrong.

Well let's be real here. Oscar's jab BETTER have looked good against Mayorga. If you wanted to point out that Oscar's jab wasn't ALL that great, you should have pointed out the Ike Quartey (amazing fight btw) where Oscar was shocked when Quartey had the better jab and Oscar's jab became less and less effective as the fight went on. Mayorga is pretty much a club fighter, good boxers can take him out of his depth. Well...except Vernon (RIP).

Mayweather was faster than Oscar though, even in Oscar's prime. Oscar's hands were very fast but Mayweather is just SO fast with his head movement and upper body movement it isn't even close in that regard.

I've never really cared for Oscar but the one thing that you can't take away from Oscar is his left hook and his chin. IMO, Oscar had one of the great chins of all time. Every fighter gets buzzed but I've never seen Oscar legitimately hurt once that I can remember. Against Mosley he just took some good shots but he was never in any danger of being knocked out ever.

But I'll agree, I don't see anyway Oscar beats Floyd. Now I do think that Floyd vs Mosley at 135 would have been a monster of a fight. Mosley would have been a fucking NIGHTMARE for anybody to fight at lightweight.

[DaxxKahn]

Oscar lost the fight to PBF, however the Oscar of 1999-2001 was a different story. At 147lb the Oscar of 2000 beats PBF! So does Mosley of the same year!

Agreed....

I would really phrase it like this though personally...

ODH in his prime had the ability to beat any other fighter of his weight class (147 was his best) in history....Also vice versa as the same could be said for Floyd...

They both rank up in the atg class with the greats including the super fighters at WW of the 80's..

It would just depend on who had the better night,,,,Not the same can be said for every fighter...These guys sit in a very elite class that has very few people among them....

Leonard, Hearns, Robinson, Griffin, Cuevas etc

[DaxxKahn]

Oscar lost the fight to PBF, however the Oscar of 1999-2001 was a different story. At 147lb the Oscar of 2000 beats PBF! So does Mosley of the same year!

Agreed....

I would really phrase it like this though personally...

ODH in his prime had the ability to beat any other fighter of his weight class (147 was his best) in history....Also vice versa as the same could be said for Floyd...

They both rank up in the atg class with the greats including the super fighters at WW of the 80's..

It would just depend on who had the better night,,,,Not the same can be said for every fighter...These guys sit in a very elite class that has very few people among them....

Leonard, Hearns, Robinson, Griffith, Cuevas etc

[ElTerribleMorales]

How was the 2000 version of Oscar any better than he was against Mayweather? He only had better speed, he had no right hand, he didn't have as good of defensive skills, and he over threw his jab which a fast guy would eventually counter over and over again. Also when he would get tired late like he always does and did, he was naturally smaller back then and easier to hurt than later on.

Mosley would be a better fight, but he still doesn't have the boxing skills to beat Mayweather, he had already started to look different from the dominant, brilliant lightweight he was, the combinations weren't as natural or thrown as often, his jab has never been that good, and he would load up on punches Floyd would see coming from a mile away. It would be close just because MOsley is so strong and so fast, but Floyd would win a close fight against Shane if those two versions of them fought. Shane is a much bigger guy with the same speed and much more strength, but he doesn't have the boxing skills.

Robinson was just so physically dominant, and he was adept at fighting on the outside, I doubt he would catch Floyd cleanly very often, but he would have won because he would have kept Floyd on the defensive all night much more effectively than Oscar.

Leonard: I think its a toss up, but Leonard's size advantage and adept ability to fight on the outside would have made it very tough for Floyd. Their similar speed would offset that advantage for either guy, but I think Leonard is the more offensive guy so more often than not the more active guy gets the nod. I bet Floyd would land more punches if they fought though.

dude that's the biggest load of bullshit, i can count the number of times a prime Oscar was hurt on one hand, he had a great chin and could take loads of punishment and yet still be effective

DLH's jab used to be a lot crisper when he was younger and he wouldn't just put it in your face, he would jab to the pit of the stomach and straight back to the head, pretty much what Mayweather did to Corrales

his speed was just as good as Mayweather's and his power was a lot better

if he'd pace himself he'd be able to rough up Mayweather enough to win a decision

Watch Oscar against Mayorga and then show me a more dominant fight for Oscar's jab.

You attack my validity, but you try and say that Oscar was ever as fast as Mayweather? That's a fucking joke. Just ask Genaro Hernandez who was faster, Mayweather is a lot faster than Oscar as was Mosley.

Oscar did have a great chin throughout his career, but punches did bother him more when he was younger. I can name the amount of times Mosley stunned him on one hand, but if you add up all the fights he was hurt a few times. Either way Mayweather couldn't stop Oscar in any version except maybe the one who faced Pacquiao.

But you're hate for Floyd and Manny is known by everyone on here. Just a little while ago you were arguing with me about how Marquez was better than Pacquiao. How MOrales would beat Mayweather at 130. Yet every time you are proven wrong.

i'm one of the few who've been defending Mayweather, so might wanna read up a bit more before you end up with your foot in your mouth like you usually do, Marquez is the better fighter of the two when they're at an equal field, and especially now that the roid speculations are buzzing around, Mayweather at 130 isn't the Mayweather of today, so it's not farfetched to believe that the Morales that fought at 130 would have beaten the Mayweather that fought at 130, Castillo basically beat him the first time around, and Castillo couldn't hold Morales' jockstrap when it came down to actual skill, your love for both fighters always leads to the same thing, you saying that both are invincible

[Taeth]

Castillo is a sure in for the hall of fame, was one of the very best body pucnhers ever produced out of Mexico, he had power, he was the king of hte lightweight division for quite a few years if you exclude his fights with Mayweather. Castillo wasn't as skilled as Morales, but he wasn't as skilled as Genaro Hernandez or Diego Corrales either, and they both fought a younger version of Mayweather who beat them much more decisively.

We have seen even in the Ward-Kessler fight among many others what happens when a guy who is orthodox in every fashion, like a traditional mexican boxer tries to fight a slick moving boxer. It almost never goes well for the orthodox fighter because they can't cover the distance quickly enough, and the outside is where their true effectiveness isn't on the very outside, its more at medium range.

To boot physically Mayweather was far superior to how he fights now. He had way more p4p power, probably a little more speed as well, and he was almost as slick as he is now. He would have picked Morales apart from the outside for 12 rounds, just watch the Raheem fight who is the closest guy to Mayweather's style that I saw MOrales face. Sure Morales was old, but Zahir doesn't hold a candle to Floyd.

[Myk_Myk]

Had Oscar stuck to his jab as he did the first few rounds, then absolutely.

This is what I always thought too, and I've said before that I've wondered how much ODLH's pride cost him in two of the biggest fights at the end of his career. Maybe Taeth is right and it was PBF's right counters that put an end to ODLH's jab, but somehow I got the impression that Oscar was too self-conscious to win a fight on his jab alone. It just seemed like he thought he had to land more impressive punches to not have people be disappointed or critical.

Then as evidence that that idea is not so far fetched, he comes in light and doesn't rehydrate after weigh-in for Pac...

So, I actually think it was in his power to win the fight he actually had with PBF, unless Taeth really is right about the counters making him shy away from the jab.

[Taeth]

Morales I am not going to continue this because, this isn't what the board is about. If you want to argue something that is fine, but we don't need to be name calling. It does nothing to further one's opinion. I'm trying not to do that anymore.

[Howlin Mad Missy]

Morales I am not going to continue this because, this isn't what the board is about. If you want to argue something that is fine, but we don't need to be name calling. It does nothing to further one's opinion. I'm trying not to do that anymore.

Boys. Play nice now.

[ElTerribleMorales]

Morales I am not going to continue this because, this isn't what the board is about. If you want to argue something that is fine, but we don't need to be name calling. It does nothing to further one's opinion. I'm trying not to do that anymore.

Boys. Play nice now.

lol, dunno where i resorted to name calling, the known touchy one has always been Taeth hahaha

[Howlin Mad Missy]

I just don't want it to turn in to one of 'those' threads