Mike Tyson v Sonny Liston

[OumaFan]

Agreed, Fenster.

And while he never beat any elite guys during his prime some of those wins are better than people give Mike credit for. Larry Holmes was old, etc., etc., but yet he was able to beat Mercer four years later. And went the distance with Holyfield. And I'm not sure what that whole "glove caught in the ropes" excuse was all about, if anything Larry probably saw the writing on the wall and was looking for a way out.

[rjj tszyu]

Agreed, Fenster.

And while he never beat any elite guys during his prime some of those wins are better than people give Mike credit for. Larry Holmes was old, etc., etc., but yet he was able to beat Mercer four years later. And went the distance with Holyfield. And I'm not sure what that whole "glove caught in the ropes" excuse was all about, if anything Larry probably saw the writing on the wall and was looking for a way out.

Yes but you cannot judge what one fighter does against anothers common opponent in the way you have above. Evander would have always beaten Tyson.

You saying look what Tyson did to Holmes and then point out that Holmes wen tthe distance with Evander means nothing. Look what Frazier did to Ali in the first fight and then look what Foreman did to Frazier. Doesn't mean Foreman is going to destroy Ali does it??

[Fenster]

Agreed, Fenster.

And while he never beat any elite guys during his prime some of those wins are better than people give Mike credit for. Larry Holmes was old, etc., etc., but yet he was able to beat Mercer four years later. And went the distance with Holyfield. And I'm not sure what that whole "glove caught in the ropes" excuse was all about, if anything Larry probably saw the writing on the wall and was looking for a way out.

You mean he purposely got his glove caught in the ropes? Hmm.. it does sort of make sense.

Quality of opposition is totally overrated. I agree. Fact.

[OumaFan]

I think its the most likely explanation. Sometimes its easy to over think things and miss what's right in front of you, Occam's Razor and such.

As far as Tyson-Holyfield, it just wasn't a prime Tyson, maybe Holyfield was a bad style matchup but we'll never know

[ICB]

Agreed, Fenster.

And while he never beat any elite guys during his prime some of those wins are better than people give Mike credit for. Larry Holmes was old, etc., etc., but yet he was able to beat Mercer four years later. And went the distance with Holyfield. And I'm not sure what that whole "glove caught in the ropes" excuse was all about, if anything Larry probably saw the writing on the wall and was looking for a way out.

Larry Holmes went through a bad patch during the mid 80's, he didn't look good vs Carl Williams or Michael Spinks. Plus he was ring rusty, and didn't have alot of time to train for Mike Tyson, i think the early 40's version of Larry Holmes was better than the late 30's Larry Holmes.