Disappointed in Hayes performance!

[ono]

Fair enough response, but I think Wlad's defense is pretty underrated he's improved a lot. Meanwhile the other guy we're talking about has hands down and tries to be cute, Ruiz touched him a time or two, Barrett knocked him down...he doesn't have the best balance, he can throw wide at times, and his power at heavyweight is NOT 1 punch = lights out power....it's above average but it's not amazing.

Wlad has been caught a time or two but he hasn't been rocked in a long time, I think that's partially due to his improved confidence and better game plan, he has faith in what he does and perhaps that is a reason Chagaev didn't hurt him when he hit him and caught Wlad pretty good at the end of one round and Wlad didn't react in any negative fashion and Ruslan has decent power about average.

I just don't think anyone in the heavyweight division right now can get around Wlad's 1-2 and improved defense and hell most guys that fight him don't even try after a round or two.

He's been fighting guys who don't have the ambition or fitness to execute any form of a gameplan that resembles anything other than survial.

[El Kabong]

He's been fighting guys who don't have the ambition or fitness to execute any form of a gameplan that resembles anything other than survial.

...and yet guys that are better than anything your boy has stepped in the ring with.

Wlad makes people play on his terms and nobody has the vision or the skill to take that away from him.

[ono]

He's been fighting guys who don't have the ambition or fitness to execute any form of a gameplan that resembles anything other than survial.

...and yet guys that are better than anything your boy has stepped in the ring with.

Wlad makes people play on his terms and nobody has the vision or the skill to take that away from him.

He's not my boy.

Dress it up however you like, he hasn't faced an inshape and dangerous fighter for a long time.

[El Kabong]

[quote=ono;857536]

He's not my boy.

Dress it up however you like, he hasn't faced an inshape and dangerous fighter for a long time.

OK, whatever

What's the deal with all these qualifiers? In shape AND dangerous....well it's also been a while since Wlad fought a white Jamaican too . Recently Wlad fights the guys that are his mandatories because SOMEONE wouldn't take a fight with him. Ruslan Chagaev was an unknown quantity due to his injury and only a 20 some fight record but I would venture to say he was "in shape" and in being unknown I would say he was kind of dangerous. Eddie Chambers at 209 was "in shape" sure he carries extra weight in order to actually be a heavyweight but he's in shape. Tony Thompson was in shape albeit he wasn't dangerous with power but he is most assuredly dangerous in terms of style. Sultan Ibragimov was in shape and dangerous although he certainly didn't fight like it. Sultan has fast hands and his career shouldn't be judged solely on how he fought Wlad or Ray Austin.

Does Povetkin qualify as "in shape" or "dangerous" He's next on the hit list......when has the WBA title holder fought an "in shape" and "dangerous" heavyweight......I would venture to guess NEVER

[ninjaspy3]

[QUOTE=Lyle;857540]

He's not my boy.

Dress it up however you like, he hasn't faced an inshape and dangerous fighter for a long time.

OK, whatever

What's the deal with all these qualifiers? In shape AND dangerous....well it's also been a while since Wlad fought a white Jamaican too . Recently Wlad fights the guys that are his mandatories because SOMEONE wouldn't take a fight with him. Ruslan Chagaev was an unknown quantity due to his injury and only a 20 some fight record but I would venture to say he was "in shape" and in being unknown I would say he was kind of dangerous. Eddie Chambers at 209 was "in shape" sure he carries extra weight in order to actually be a heavyweight but he's in shape. Tony Thompson was in shape albeit he wasn't dangerous with power but he is most assuredly dangerous in terms of style. Sultan Ibragimov was in shape and dangerous although he certainly didn't fight like it. Sultan has fast hands and his career shouldn't be judged solely on how he fought Wlad or Ray Austin.

Does Povetkin qualify as "in shape" or "dangerous" He's next on the hit list......when has the WBA title holder fought an "in shape" and "dangerous" heavyweight......I would venture to guess NEVER

By your own words: When Valuev fought Chagaev (because you just called Chagaev in shape and dangerous) Therefore, Valuev fought an "inshape and dangerous" fighter lol

[Saddo]

no matter who you rate, like or root for, we must all be in agreement that klit - haye fight should happen

i still think they both beat him but would prefer him to face Wlad as he will always have a punchers chance.

Vitali would destroy him IMO

[mattboxingfan]

[quote=Lyle;857540]

He's not my boy.

Dress it up however you like, he hasn't faced an inshape and dangerous fighter for a long time.

OK, whatever

What's the deal with all these qualifiers? In shape AND dangerous....well it's also been a while since Wlad fought a white Jamaican too . Recently Wlad fights the guys that are his mandatories because SOMEONE wouldn't take a fight with him. Ruslan Chagaev was an unknown quantity due to his injury and only a 20 some fight record but I would venture to say he was "in shape" and in being unknown I would say he was kind of dangerous. Eddie Chambers at 209 was "in shape" sure he carries extra weight in order to actually be a heavyweight but he's in shape. Tony Thompson was in shape albeit he wasn't dangerous with power but he is most assuredly dangerous in terms of style. Sultan Ibragimov was in shape and dangerous although he certainly didn't fight like it. Sultan has fast hands and his career shouldn't be judged solely on how he fought Wlad or Ray Austin.

Does Povetkin qualify as "in shape" or "dangerous" He's next on the hit list......when has the WBA title holder fought an "in shape" and "dangerous" heavyweight......I would venture to guess NEVER

Ruiz was in shape and relatively dangerous thus why neither of the Klits have fought him..... (thsi should be intresting)

[El Kabong]

At this point in time if anyone has any kind of chance vs one of the brothers it's going to be vs Vitali, he's older, he's slower, he's not punching as hard and I think he is about at retiring age.

Wladimir is 100% on his game right now, there's not a fighter more comfortable in the ring than he is right now and from the opening bell Wlad owns the pace of a fight with only his left arm. The jab is great but the ability to hook off the jab is PHENOMENAL and the right cross is just icing on the cake.

[El Kabong]

Ruiz was in shape and relatively dangerous thus why neither of the Klits have fought him..... (thsi should be intresting)

....lots of guys are dangerous to the WBA title holder. There aren't many figthers that are dangerous to The Klitschko's

[Saddo]

At this point in time if anyone has any kind of chance vs one of the brothers it's going to be vs Vitali, he's older, he's slower, he's not punching as hard and I think he is about at retiring age.

Wladimir is 100% on his game right now, there's not a fighter more comfortable in the ring than he is right now and from the opening bell Wlad owns the pace of a fight with only his left arm. The jab is great but the ability to hook off the jab is PHENOMENAL and the right cross is just icing on the cake.

he's always been the better fighter of the 2... i just still feel he has a lennox lewis type of chin.

if you can punch you have more of a chance with Wlad (Ross Purity puncher beat Wlad but lost to vitali)

if you can box your better going against Vitali (Chris Byrd boxer beat Vitali but lost to wlad)

[ono]

[quote=Lyle;857540]

He's not my boy.

Dress it up however you like, he hasn't faced an inshape and dangerous fighter for a long time.

OK, whatever

What's the deal with all these qualifiers? In shape AND dangerous....well it's also been a while since Wlad fought a white Jamaican too . Recently Wlad fights the guys that are his mandatories because SOMEONE wouldn't take a fight with him. Ruslan Chagaev was an unknown quantity due to his injury and only a 20 some fight record but I would venture to say he was "in shape" and in being unknown I would say he was kind of dangerous. Eddie Chambers at 209 was "in shape" sure he carries extra weight in order to actually be a heavyweight but he's in shape. Tony Thompson was in shape albeit he wasn't dangerous with power but he is most assuredly dangerous in terms of style. Sultan Ibragimov was in shape and dangerous although he certainly didn't fight like it. Sultan has fast hands and his career shouldn't be judged solely on how he fought Wlad or Ray Austin.

Does Povetkin qualify as "in shape" or "dangerous" He's next on the hit list......when has the WBA title holder fought an "in shape" and "dangerous" heavyweight......I would venture to guess NEVER

That's what i'm saying. There isn't anybody there to take Wald or Vitali out of their comfort zones. Haye at least on paper should be able to.

Not saying he'll win, just saying i'd rather watch him have a go than overweight plodders who don't the fitness or agility to do anything other than stand infront of Wlad/Vitali and eat jabs and crossed all night.

[El Kabong]

he's always been the better fighter of the 2... i just still feel he has a lennox lewis type of chin.

if you can punch you have more of a chance with Wlad (Ross Purity puncher beat Wlad but lost to vitali)

if you can box your better going against Vitali (Chris Byrd boxer beat Vitali but lost to wlad)

Well to be honest vs Wlad the only "puncher" that got to him and won was Sanders. Purrity and Brewster took massive beatings and Wlad just tired out. Not discounting their power, I'm just relaying how the fights ended, Sanders caught him flush in the 1st and 2nd and Purrity got Wlad in the 10th and Brewster got Wlad in the 5th after Wlad threw like 600 some odd punches or something and was forced to move from Brewster's pressure.

Vitali doesn't throw wild and crazy anymore because his back and shoulders won't allow it. I think someone durable could give him a solid go....if Arreola had been in shape and had any defense he might have stood a better chance as would Sam Peter

[Saddo]

he's always been the better fighter of the 2... i just still feel he has a lennox lewis type of chin.

if you can punch you have more of a chance with Wlad (Ross Purity puncher beat Wlad but lost to vitali)

if you can box your better going against Vitali (Chris Byrd boxer beat Vitali but lost to wlad)

Well to be honest vs Wlad the only "puncher" that got to him and won was Sanders. Purrity and Brewster took massive beatings and Wlad just tired out. Not discounting their power, I'm just relaying how the fights ended, Sanders caught him flush in the 1st and 2nd and Purrity got Wlad in the 10th and Brewster got Wlad in the 5th after Wlad threw like 600 some odd punches or something and was forced to move from Brewster's pressure.

Vitali doesn't throw wild and crazy anymore because his back and shoulders won't allow it. I think someone durable could give him a solid go....if Arreola had been in shape and had any defense he might have stood a better chance as would Sam Peter

i think we are on the same page mate.

good thread guys

[ICB]

Jimmy Thunder.Dear god ...Knocking Ruiz out in that fashion,he nearly turned his back at the end and quit...is impressive and we should all send Mr. Haye a thank you card...Holyfield can hit with sharp fast combinations and had a very underrated left hook.Hurt and stunned some of the thickest and best with it.One shot no,but a hurtful combo hitter.

Haye is pretty flawed in set up and defense.Lacks fluid combos and can be crowded and arms and legs start coming apart wide.He's a cocky puncher,lowering arms,throwing from hips at times etc.Who ever can...and they will have to....walk through his pot shot sharp and jarring one-twos stands a very good chance of exploiting his gaps.Ruiz though battered was on his feet at end and had some moments.

Jimmy Thunder wasn't that good of a fighter, but he could punch. Remember when he knocked out Crawford Grimsley in like 10 seconds ? the same Crawford Grimsley who went 12 rounds with George Foreman.

[Spicoli]

Jimmy Thunder.Dear god ...Knocking Ruiz out in that fashion,he nearly turned his back at the end and quit...is impressive and we should all send Mr. Haye a thank you card...Holyfield can hit with sharp fast combinations and had a very underrated left hook.Hurt and stunned some of the thickest and best with it.One shot no,but a hurtful combo hitter.

Haye is pretty flawed in set up and defense.Lacks fluid combos and can be crowded and arms and legs start coming apart wide.He's a cocky puncher,lowering arms,throwing from hips at times etc.Who ever can...and they will have to....walk through his pot shot sharp and jarring one-twos stands a very good chance of exploiting his gaps.Ruiz though battered was on his feet at end and had some moments.

Jimmy Thunder wasn't that good of a fighter, but he could punch. Remember when he knocked out Crawford Grimsley in like 10 seconds ? the same Crawford Grimsley who went 12 rounds with George Foreman.

Yeh but Ice...trust me here bud.Thunder was an eratic open armed swing from the backseat guy who was aside from that one flukish out of the gate shot saw his hype of being a huge puncher come crashing down around him.He was a fast puncher but off his feet,no balance,open handed at times and heavily hyped up off that very Grimsley fight.Tubbs took it all as did string bean Mo harris who exposed him brutally.Grimsley caught a tired and done Foreman in China who also could not TKO Morrison,Briggs and Savarese at the time....no chins of steel they.Different devilery system