What the fuck is it with the Ring and Nonito Donaire?

[killersheep]

The question between Caballero and Donaire is who would win if they were the same weight? The answer to me is at the end of the day Caballero is still the same height as Margarito, has a ridiculous reach advantage and would make it virtually impossible for Donaire (based on his style) to get anything meaningful going. Now this is of course all subjective. I do admit Donaire is a talent, but I don't think his talent level would be able to overcome the physical advantages off Caballero.

[Julius Rain]

the Ring recognize skill, thats why he's top 5 p4p.

[ICB]

the Ring recognize skill, thats why he's top 5 p4p.

So why not rate Yuriorkis Gamboa in the top 10 then ? or Juan Manuel Lopez ETC ? thats biased bro, its not just to do with skill, its about the whole package, resume, longevity, opponents, titles, ETC.

No way Nonito Donaire is P4P top 5, Chad Dawson is just as skilled. And has beaten better opponents yet he is only 8, im not dissing Nonito Donaire. I love watching him fight, his last KO was just fantastic to watch.

But his ranking makes no sense what so ever, its like the Ring Magazine is just randomly placing him.

[Julius Rain]

the Ring recognize skill, thats why he's top 5 p4p.

So why not rate Yuriorkis Gamboa in the top 10 then ? or Juan Manuel Lopez ETC ? thats biased bro, its not just to do with skill, its about the whole package, resume, longevity, opponents, titles, ETC.

No way Nonito Donaire is P4P top 5, Chad Dawson is just as skilled. And has beaten better opponents yet he is only 8, im not dissing Nonito Donaire. I love watching him fight, his last KO was just fantastic to watch.

But his ranking makes no sense what so ever, its like the Ring Magazine is just randomly placing him.

you right and all but nonito is the guy they think highly of.

[DaxxKahn]

the Ring recognize skill, thats why he's top 5 p4p.

So why not rate Yuriorkis Gamboa in the top 10 then ? or Juan Manuel Lopez ETC ? thats biased bro, its not just to do with skill, its about the whole package, resume, longevity, opponents, titles, ETC.

No way Nonito Donaire is P4P top 5, Chad Dawson is just as skilled. And has beaten better opponents yet he is only 8, im not dissing Nonito Donaire. I love watching him fight, his last KO was just fantastic to watch.

But his ranking makes no sense what so ever, its like the Ring Magazine is just randomly placing him.

In truth if we are going on opponent level IMO Dawson does not deserve his spot either...Since Adamek he has fought Epifano Mendoza who had wins over questionable opp at best and the next 2 fights after Dawson..

Jesus Ruiz....then spent the next 2 years fighting Tarver and Johnson....

Not exactly P4P material there is it?...Not saying Dawson is not a top level fighter but if we are going to factor in opp then that should effect him as well

[killersheep]

the Ring recognize skill, thats why he's top 5 p4p.

So why not rate Yuriorkis Gamboa in the top 10 then ? or Juan Manuel Lopez ETC ? thats biased bro, its not just to do with skill, its about the whole package, resume, longevity, opponents, titles, ETC.

No way Nonito Donaire is P4P top 5, Chad Dawson is just as skilled. And has beaten better opponents yet he is only 8, im not dissing Nonito Donaire. I love watching him fight, his last KO was just fantastic to watch.

But his ranking makes no sense what so ever, its like the Ring Magazine is just randomly placing him.

In truth if we are going on opponent level IMO Dawson does not deserve his spot either...Since Adamek he has fought Epifano Mendoza who had wins over questionable opp at best and the next 2 fights after Dawson..

Jesus Ruiz....then spent the next 2 years fighting Tarver and Johnson....

Not exactly P4P material there is it?...Not saying Dawson is not a top level fighter but if we are going to factor in opp then that should effect him as well

Well take into consideration that we are talking about the Ring's p4p list, Tarver and Johnson were both ring ranked fighters, so you could also say he's only fought ranked fighters over the last two years as well.

I really hold the Vargas fight against Donaire. The equivalent of that would be Chad Dawson fighting DeAndre Latimore quite literally.

[DaxxKahn]

So why not rate Yuriorkis Gamboa in the top 10 then ? or Juan Manuel Lopez ETC ? thats biased bro, its not just to do with skill, its about the whole package, resume, longevity, opponents, titles, ETC.

No way Nonito Donaire is P4P top 5, Chad Dawson is just as skilled. And has beaten better opponents yet he is only 8, im not dissing Nonito Donaire. I love watching him fight, his last KO was just fantastic to watch.

But his ranking makes no sense what so ever, its like the Ring Magazine is just randomly placing him.

In truth if we are going on opponent level IMO Dawson does not deserve his spot either...Since Adamek he has fought Epifano Mendoza who had wins over questionable opp at best and the next 2 fights after Dawson..

Jesus Ruiz....then spent the next 2 years fighting Tarver and Johnson....

Not exactly P4P material there is it?...Not saying Dawson is not a top level fighter but if we are going to factor in opp then that should effect him as well

Well take into consideration that we are talking about the Ring's p4p list, Tarver and Johnson were both ring ranked fighters, so you could also say he's only fought ranked fighters over the last two years as well.

I really hold the Vargas fight against Donaire. The equivalent of that would be Chad Dawson fighting DeAndre Latimore quite literally.

I am going to have to go back and check but I don't think Tarver and Johnson were P4P when they fought Dawson...

Let me ask this...

Would you have held it against DLH if he beat Pacquiao?

Manny Jumped 2 weight classes to fight dlh LW to WW

DLH....5' 10 1/2" w 73" reach

Manny..5' 6 1/2" w 67" reach

DLH had a 4 inch height and 6 inch reach advantage

Donaire is 5' 6" w 68" reach

Vargas is 5' 6" w 63" reach

So Donaire fought a guy same height who was coming up 2 weight classes and had a 5 inch reach advantage

Oscar fought a guy 4 inches shorter and had a 6 inch reach advantage who was moving up 2 weight classes and had only 1 fight in the weight class he jumped up from

So if DLH beat Pac would that not be just as bad in fact worse because he had a much more sizable advantage...But DLH lost so it is OK?

Kind of a catch 22 no?

[killersheep]

In truth if we are going on opponent level IMO Dawson does not deserve his spot either...Since Adamek he has fought Epifano Mendoza who had wins over questionable opp at best and the next 2 fights after Dawson..

Jesus Ruiz....then spent the next 2 years fighting Tarver and Johnson....

Not exactly P4P material there is it?...Not saying Dawson is not a top level fighter but if we are going to factor in opp then that should effect him as well

Well take into consideration that we are talking about the Ring's p4p list, Tarver and Johnson were both ring ranked fighters, so you could also say he's only fought ranked fighters over the last two years as well.

I really hold the Vargas fight against Donaire. The equivalent of that would be Chad Dawson fighting DeAndre Latimore quite literally.

I am going to have to go back and check but I don't think Tarver and Johnson were P4P when they fought Dawson...

Let me ask this...

Would you have held it against DLH if he beat Pacquiao?

Manny Jumped 2 weight classes to fight dlh LW to WW

DLH....5' 10 1/2" w 73" reach

Manny..5' 6 1/2" w 67" reach

DLH had a 4 inch height and 6 inch reach advantage

Donaire is 5' 6" w 68" reach

Vargas is 5' 6" w 63" reach

So Donaire fought a guy same height who was coming up 2 weight classes and had a 5 inch reach advantage

Oscar fought a guy 4 inches shorter and had a 6 inch reach advantage who was moving up 2 weight classes and had only 1 fight in the weight class he jumped up from

So if DLH beat Pac would that not be just as bad in fact worse because he had a much more sizable advantage...But DLH lost so it is OK?

Kind of a catch 22 no?

No not at all a catch 22 it was three weight classes for Vargas vs. Donaire (from Straw to Super Fly) and unless you are saying Vargas is the equivalent skill level of Pacquiao (#1 p4p), which he wasn't even rated by the ring at 105, and Donaire was as past it as ODLH it's apples to oranges. Certainly you will admit if ODLH would have beaten Pac, the issue of weight, reach etc. would have been brought up and Pac's loss would have been justified as a condition of those factors, of course it would put ODLH on the ring's p4p rankings not because he beat a much smaller man, but because he beat #1 p4p fighter in the world based on their own ranking system. I wasn't saying p4p rated in regards to Tarver and Johnson, I was saying Ring rated as in rated at light heavyweight Tarver and Johnson were both definately in the top 4 at light heavyweight each time Dawson fought them and the First time Dawson fought Tarver he was the #1 guy at 175.

[Kev]

In truth if we are going on opponent level IMO Dawson does not deserve his spot either...Since Adamek he has fought Epifano Mendoza who had wins over questionable opp at best and the next 2 fights after Dawson..

Jesus Ruiz....then spent the next 2 years fighting Tarver and Johnson....

Not exactly P4P material there is it?...Not saying Dawson is not a top level fighter but if we are going to factor in opp then that should effect him as well

Well take into consideration that we are talking about the Ring's p4p list, Tarver and Johnson were both ring ranked fighters, so you could also say he's only fought ranked fighters over the last two years as well.

I really hold the Vargas fight against Donaire. The equivalent of that would be Chad Dawson fighting DeAndre Latimore quite literally.

I am going to have to go back and check but I don't think Tarver and Johnson were P4P when they fought Dawson...

Let me ask this...

Would you have held it against DLH if he beat Pacquiao?

Manny Jumped 2 weight classes to fight dlh LW to WW

DLH....5' 10 1/2" w 73" reach

Manny..5' 6 1/2" w 67" reach

DLH had a 4 inch height and 6 inch reach advantage

Donaire is 5' 6" w 68" reach

Vargas is 5' 6" w 63" reach

So Donaire fought a guy same height who was coming up 2 weight classes and had a 5 inch reach advantage

Oscar fought a guy 4 inches shorter and had a 6 inch reach advantage who was moving up 2 weight classes and had only 1 fight in the weight class he jumped up from

So if DLH beat Pac would that not be just as bad in fact worse because he had a much more sizable advantage...But DLH lost so it is OK?

Kind of a catch 22 no?

Come on Daxx you can't be serious. First of all Manny is a legend at the lower weights, a p4p great and was an emerging superstar of world boxing. Can you even name the straweight that Nonito Donaire fought? What Hall of Famers had he beaten on the way to that showdown with Donaire? How many world titles had he won (I can tell you, the same as EVERY Donaire oponent exluding Vic - ZERO!!! )

And if Oscar had have beaten Manny I can guarantee the Ring wouldn't have put him at number 6 p4p as they would have just said he was expected to win.

Donaire is the least deserving p4p entrant in the last decade.

Can you name ANY other fighter EVER who has been on the p4p top 10 for 3 years having fought NO, NONE, ZERO, NOT A SINGLE world champ past or present in that time?

His record is appalling. They dropped Hopkins down a place for beating an all time great in Roy Jones. Prior to that he fought Pavlik, Calzaghe, Tarver and Winky, all great fighters, at least two Hall of Famers.

Who has Donaire fought since Darchinyan? It's a scandal that he is in the top 10 at all to be above BHop is plain retarded.

He might have skills, but Juan Guzman is slicker and I sure as hell wouldn't want him in the top 10.

[Kev]

the Ring recognize skill, thats why he's top 5 p4p.

So why not rate Yuriorkis Gamboa in the top 10 then ? or Juan Manuel Lopez ETC ? thats biased bro, its not just to do with skill, its about the whole package, resume, longevity, opponents, titles, ETC.

No way Nonito Donaire is P4P top 5, Chad Dawson is just as skilled. And has beaten better opponents yet he is only 8, im not dissing Nonito Donaire. I love watching him fight, his last KO was just fantastic to watch.

But his ranking makes no sense what so ever, its like the Ring Magazine is just randomly placing him.

In truth if we are going on opponent level IMO Dawson does not deserve his spot either...Since Adamek he has fought Epifano Mendoza who had wins over questionable opp at best and the next 2 fights after Dawson..

Jesus Ruiz....then spent the next 2 years fighting Tarver and Johnson....

Not exactly P4P material there is it?...Not saying Dawson is not a top level fighter but if we are going to factor in opp then that should effect him as well

Actually I think going 5-0 in 5 fights against Tarver, Johnson and Adamek is very commendable.

There is no question that all three were the best opposition available to him at the time, and Tarver was a reigning world champ the first time they met.

For me Pavlik, Williams, Ward, Guzman, Bradley and even Carl Froch have better resumes than Nonito Donaire.

Froch has wins over Pascal, Taylor and Dirrell, controversial or not, that smokes Donaire's resume.

Why did Jospeh Agbeko not get in the p4p rankings when he beat Donaire more recently?

I know Donaire won by knockout, but a huge percentage of upset wins are by KO as the unfancied fighter has less chance of outboxing the better fighter over 12 rounds.

I'm not suggesting that is the case with Vic and Donaire, but there is no reason to go overboard based on a KO win.