The only top team England have beat in the world cup since 1966 in Argentina in 2002.

[Kirkland Laing]

Seems to me that England are on the slide and it's about time Scotland or Ireland got it going again

England right now are like a bad Duke basketball team, slow, predictable, and too reliant on miraculous plays by unimaginative players that lack creativity.

Before the game vs the US everyone said position by position (bar Goal Keeper) England had the best players.....what do you guys make of that now?

I'd bet you'd rather have Dempsey and Donovan than Lampard and Lennon/SWP

In short, no.

Donovan and Dempsey are good players, but not on Lampards level. The problem is England don't have a ball carrier, nor do we have enough players who are extremely comfortable on the ball. Rooney is out most technically gifted player, but his technical skill is probably pretty similar to most other countries run of the mill attacking midfielders.

The problem begins at a grass roots level. The fast and the strong prosper at junior level because the football is kick and rush, and the big fast guy upfront will score hat fulls of goals. Technically gifted footballers are harder to spot than the big guy who can 'do a job' unfortunately.

Take Theo Lolcott for example. Stick him up front at junior level and he will score masses of goals. He's much quicker than everyone, the pitch is massive and a punt upfield will be all he needs. Great, he scores a lot and stands out. But once he reaches a certain age and his physical attributes are no longer as decisive (in other words he's up against players who know how to play against pace)he will struggle, because he doesn't have the footballing ability nor does he have the footballing brain to fall back on. And this is evident for a lot of players - Agbonlahor, SWP, Lennon, Walcott....

It's also worth mentioning that the conditions in England don't exactly favour 'ball-players'. You try dribbling with the ball on an absolute mire of a pitch on a cold and wet Saturday morning, surrounded by 10 dicks heads who want to kick you. It doesn't encourage you to play with the ball or to try and keep possession.

Seriously, it's a problem. I play on Astro Turf myself, purely because the quality of football is better, because the surface forces you to play actual football. It's more enjoyable and technique shines bright. With this in mind i'd like to see the FA promote some form of 11 aside summer league throughout the country, played on Astro Turf and have the competitions heavily scouted.

There are technically brilliant players out there, but like i said, they slip through the net because technique isn't as effective as pace and power at junior and amatuer levels.

Maybe one day we'll address this problem, but until then we will see disappointment after disappointment at International level.

This is right on. If Xavi and Iniesta were English they wouldn't have made the grade because they were too small and wouldn't have developed their skills anyway because they'd have spent their formative years watching the ball soar over their heads all game. Trevor Brooking was given the job years ago of sorting out the whole youth coaching system but everything he tried got blocked by the clubs or the FA.

[Master]

I remember England beat France in 1982, Robson's 28 sec goal and they were a top side.

[ono]

Seems to me that England are on the slide and it's about time Scotland or Ireland got it going again

England right now are like a bad Duke basketball team, slow, predictable, and too reliant on miraculous plays by unimaginative players that lack creativity.

Before the game vs the US everyone said position by position (bar Goal Keeper) England had the best players.....what do you guys make of that now?

I'd bet you'd rather have Dempsey and Donovan than Lampard and Lennon/SWP

In short, no.

Donovan and Dempsey are good players, but not on Lampards level. The problem is England don't have a ball carrier, nor do we have enough players who are extremely comfortable on the ball. Rooney is out most technically gifted player, but his technical skill is probably pretty similar to most other countries run of the mill attacking midfielders.

The problem begins at a grass roots level. The fast and the strong prosper at junior level because the football is kick and rush, and the big fast guy upfront will score hat fulls of goals. Technically gifted footballers are harder to spot than the big guy who can 'do a job' unfortunately.

Take Theo Lolcott for example. Stick him up front at junior level and he will score masses of goals. He's much quicker than everyone, the pitch is massive and a punt upfield will be all he needs. Great, he scores a lot and stands out. But once he reaches a certain age and his physical attributes are no longer as decisive (in other words he's up against players who know how to play against pace)he will struggle, because he doesn't have the footballing ability nor does he have the footballing brain to fall back on. And this is evident for a lot of players - Agbonlahor, SWP, Lennon, Walcott....

It's also worth mentioning that the conditions in England don't exactly favour 'ball-players'. You try dribbling with the ball on an absolute mire of a pitch on a cold and wet Saturday morning, surrounded by 10 dicks heads who want to kick you. It doesn't encourage you to play with the ball or to try and keep possession.

Seriously, it's a problem. I play on Astro Turf myself, purely because the quality of football is better, because the surface forces you to play actual football. It's more enjoyable and technique shines bright. With this in mind i'd like to see the FA promote some form of 11 aside summer league throughout the country, played on Astro Turf and have the competitions heavily scouted.

There are technically brilliant players out there, but like i said, they slip through the net because technique isn't as effective as pace and power at junior and amatuer levels.

Maybe one day we'll address this problem, but until then we will see disappointment after disappointment at International level.

This is right on. If Xavi and Iniesta were English they wouldn't have made the grade because they were too small and wouldn't have developed their skills anyway because they'd have spent their formative years watching the ball soar over their heads all game. Trevor Brooking was given the job years ago of sorting out the whole youth coaching system but everything he tried got blocked by the clubs or the FA.

Exactly mate. Until we fix this, we will always struggle, and we'll have to listen to so called experts telling us it's 'cos the lads don't show passion'. It's nothing to do with that and it's all to do with the talent that never gets to display itself at a professional level in England, and until the style of play and playing conditions change, it never will. I half hope we go out on Wednesday, if only to urge the FA into looking into it properly.

[Drago]

if we could convert more than 50% of our penalties we woulda beating fkin loadsa good teams!

[Drago]

top team england beat in the world qualifiers





gotta remember that one

[Master]

Even Heskey scored against the Germans.