Thanks for the post herb thats made things clearer now the post was rushed and i know what your saying not everything can be explained over a forum even if you explain in as much detail as you do yourself half of the time the point doesnt come across as it can do when shown in person properly, i dont have time to get online anymore and im not exactly an academic or anything lol so sometimes i struggle to follow parts of your posts i.e the physics in the last post lol, ill have a look on youtube for some of those names you mentioned, im just interested in seeing systema as a whole like if its all stand up? maybe some systema vs systema to see a bigger variety of its techniques are there kicks? knees, elbows etc. im curious, i may have seen it before but obveousely dont know what style i was watching.

when i was talking about snap and pop what i was refering to is the way the guy in this video hits which takes time to learn and build up the coordination and range and it helps if you know the ideal biomechanical triggers for the strikes your using, in a sense the punch doesnt look snappy because hes keeping his arms more relaxed than they need to be to attempt to get the point across on video i think and its coming off as not a push but i would say slighly lazy in pulling the shot back hes not bringing his shot back to a guard so it doesnt actually look snappy on video but i would consider it snappy, it might have been more obveouse to viewers if he pulled his hands straight back to a guard. hes certainly not pushing through the target and or missing the que to pull back, hes not pulling it back early, so in my words its a snappy shot lol and this is how most boxers should aim to throw. lots of starters seem to miss the point of what an actual punch is about and tend to push the bag or pull the shot early resulting in poor economy of energy (unless these shots are used as a sort of feint theyre obveousely not totally useless but lots of energy for a fairley weak shot) and then once youve got them past the pushing and pulling too early there are more traps that people seem to fall into..

i think i see what your saying now and i agree 100% you need to let the target stop the punch but not overly much just for like a set period of time then the reverse muscles to rotate back should kick in and this is what i was talking about it seems 2 lads ive been training have fallen right into the trap of letting the shots go too much, letting the bag fully stop their shot and lazily pulling back and when i tell them about it then they pull back too early and its taking a while to build up the coordination/skill required to get the timing right, you mentioned about training this skill do you know of any nice tricks?.

obveousely working the bag is a good way but theres the problem of hardly ever really missing a heavy bag (or at least you shouldnt be lol) so it can become a habit to land heavy shots and suddenly if they miss on the mits it leaves them not off balance but like you said i would say theyve missed the que to explode with the reverse muscles back to guard so leaves them with a very counterable shot or wound up for a right hand depends on their technique and if the punch has been delivered and carried through with good form, using the knees and everything properly.

Im glad i took the time to post about the video now it could be quite useful if anyone knows and willing to share of any good ways to train this skill it would be interesting to throw ideas around, i think the best way to go is probably through feel somehow get them reacting to the feel of landing the shot somehow, maybe add a bit of resistance to the reverse motion of the shot to further outline to the fighter through feel which muscles hes actually using as triggers to pull the shot back. feel seems to have helped them to no end on the inside as they couldnt see shots coming but with a bit of contact at the knee, glove, elbow wherever really is much easier for them to react to it seems you can feel when a shot is coming much sooner than you can see one.

Thinking about it now i think scrap has already had me doing a little trick that works on this 'feel' with resistance a while back, i just dont think i realised what it was doing at the time lol, happens all the time you sit down later in the day and think about what youve been doing and how the body might adapt or react to the training, what skills/coordination have been trained and in what way, very interesting stuff. but this post has helped me further in underlining this 'skill' (not sure what to call it maybe coordination? timing? might just stick with snap lol) either way its a very important skill in striking and its not often brought up.