Mike Jones...2nd times the charm!

[Julius Rain]

I think he definitely learned from the first match....but i am not sold on him. I think he is very limited and I dont see anything that stands out about him. Power, speed, stamina, punch resistance, etc, I dont see anything special.

[:::PSL:::]

berto would destroy him

[Kev]

berto would destroy him

Don't know about destroy but I think Berto beats him for sure.

Mike Jones is the welterweight Allen Green imo.

[Spicoli]

berto would destroy him

Don't know about destroy but I think Berto beats him for sure.

Mike Jones is the welterweight Allen Green imo.

Frame wise I can see it but thats as far as I'd go. One thing Green didn't do is go right back at the man who had given him hell (Miranda) and for all intents and puposes dominate him to close a chapter. He feasted on peanuts until he stepped up again vs Ward and pulled out of a couple of main events. I think that loss to Miranda had Green seeing ghosts & he never conquered the doubt...or stopped looking at his feet Maybe Jones broke even lastnight but he matured and adjusted beyond the record stats vs his only blemish.

Jones vs Berto. Nice! That would be a solid scrap. But while Berto has been sitting on the cusp for quite some time I believe Jones showed patterns that could give him pause. Collazo and Forbes type shifts and distance boxing that I dont think Berto should be given a full pass on? Jones is a step behind and Berto is more physical but when have you seen a Berto make that type of back to back 'big fight' adaptation? I know this is not an elite in Soto Karass but movement and uppercuts off jab kill Berto. Jones needs a couple more large goes and by that time Berto and Ortiz will have sorted one another out.

[Kev]

berto would destroy him

Don't know about destroy but I think Berto beats him for sure.

Mike Jones is the welterweight Allen Green imo.

Frame wise I can see it but thats as far as I'd go. One thing Green didn't do is go right back at the man who had given him hell (Miranda) and for all intents and puposes dominate him to close a chapter. He feasted on peanuts until he stepped up again vs Ward and pulled out of a couple of main events. I think that loss to Miranda had Green seeing ghosts & he never conquered the doubt...or stopped looking at his feet Maybe Jones broke even lastnight but he matured and adjusted beyond the record stats vs his only blemish.

Jones vs Berto. Nice! That would be a solid scrap. But while Berto has been sitting on the cusp for quite some time I believe Jones showed patterns that could give him pause. Collazo and Forbes type shifts and distance boxing that I dont think Berto should be given a full pass on? Jones is a step behind and Berto is more physical but when have you seen a Berto make that type of back to back 'big fight' adaptation? I know this is not an elite in Soto Karass but movement and uppercuts off jab kill Berto. Jones needs a couple more large goes and by that time Berto and Ortiz will have sorted one another out.

To be fair to Green that's because he lost that fight, and compounded to the fact that Miranda was a HBO favourite had zero leverage to force a rematch. That's to say nothing of the fact that he was also out for a year following it due to emergency colon surgery.

I'm sure Green would have loved a rematch.

Also Miranda, for all his limitations I feel is a step up from Soto Karass. At least Miranda failed when he stepped up to world level. Karass failed against the likes of Alfonso Gomez.

Jones definitely did the job right this time around, but getting it wrong in the first place indicates he will probably never reach the top. I think Allan Green is a pretty accurate analagy in terms of how far I think he will go in the sport. He'll get to fight the world champs, he just won't come close to beating any of them.

[Hulk]

berto would destroy him

Don't know about destroy but I think Berto beats him for sure.

Mike Jones is the welterweight Allen Green imo.

Frame wise I can see it but thats as far as I'd go. One thing Green didn't do is go right back at the man who had given him hell (Miranda) and for all intents and puposes dominate him to close a chapter. He feasted on peanuts until he stepped up again vs Ward and pulled out of a couple of main events. I think that loss to Miranda had Green seeing ghosts & he never conquered the doubt...or stopped looking at his feet Maybe Jones broke even lastnight but he matured and adjusted beyond the record stats vs his only blemish.

Jones vs Berto. Nice! That would be a solid scrap. But while Berto has been sitting on the cusp for quite some time I believe Jones showed patterns that could give him pause. Collazo and Forbes type shifts and distance boxing that I dont think Berto should be given a full pass on? Jones is a step behind and Berto is more physical but when have you seen a Berto make that type of back to back 'big fight' adaptation? I know this is not an elite in Soto Karass but movement and uppercuts off jab kill Berto. Jones needs a couple more large goes and by that time Berto and Ortiz will have sorted one another out.

To be fair to Green that's because he lost that fight, and compounded to the fact that Miranda was a HBO favourite had zero leverage to force a rematch. That's to say nothing of the fact that he was also out for a year following it due to emergency colon surgery.

I'm sure Green would have loved a rematch.

Also Miranda, for all his limitations I feel is a step up from Soto Karass. At least Miranda failed when he stepped up to world level. Karass failed against the likes of Alfonso Gomez.

Jones definitely did the job right this time around, but getting it wrong in the first place indicates he will probably never reach the top. I think Allan Green is a pretty accurate analagy in terms of how far I think he will go in the sport. He'll get to fight the world champs, he just won't come close to beating any of them.

Oh Miranda is TWO steps above Karass in terms of class. But no one is above Karass in heart. He is a warrior and I was rootin for him the other night.

He brought it and I had Jones winning 115-113, still by no means a dominant win.

Berto, Cotto, or Mayorga would whip Jones at this point.

[Spicoli]

berto would destroy him

Don't know about destroy but I think Berto beats him for sure.

Mike Jones is the welterweight Allen Green imo.

Frame wise I can see it but thats as far as I'd go. One thing Green didn't do is go right back at the man who had given him hell (Miranda) and for all intents and puposes dominate him to close a chapter. He feasted on peanuts until he stepped up again vs Ward and pulled out of a couple of main events. I think that loss to Miranda had Green seeing ghosts & he never conquered the doubt...or stopped looking at his feet Maybe Jones broke even lastnight but he matured and adjusted beyond the record stats vs his only blemish.

Jones vs Berto. Nice! That would be a solid scrap. But while Berto has been sitting on the cusp for quite some time I believe Jones showed patterns that could give him pause. Collazo and Forbes type shifts and distance boxing that I dont think Berto should be given a full pass on? Jones is a step behind and Berto is more physical but when have you seen a Berto make that type of back to back 'big fight' adaptation? I know this is not an elite in Soto Karass but movement and uppercuts off jab kill Berto. Jones needs a couple more large goes and by that time Berto and Ortiz will have sorted one another out.

To be fair to Green that's because he lost that fight, and compounded to the fact that Miranda was a HBO favourite had zero leverage to force a rematch. That's to say nothing of the fact that he was also out for a year following it due to emergency colon surgery.

I'm sure Green would have loved a rematch.

Also Miranda, for all his limitations I feel is a step up from Soto Karass. At least Miranda failed when he stepped up to world level. Karass failed against the likes of Alfonso Gomez.

Jones definitely did the job right this time around, but getting it wrong in the first place indicates he will probably never reach the top. I think Allan Green is a pretty accurate analagy in terms of how far I think he will go in the sport. He'll get to fight the world champs, he just won't come close to beating any of them.

Thats more then accurate yeh. Network bought into Miranda hook line and sinker and he had bigger fish to fry. Green was follower with subtle push. Jones (camp) might have gone by without risky rematch, seeing as how they won but erased doubts.

Thinking it through and you mention limitations. I personally think Soto Karass a more well rounded fighter then Miranda. Does it translate into the names, not so much but numbers dont tell the whole story and the only thing failing vs Alfonso Gomez was Gomez;s desire to fight through a cut. Very early but Jones showed me alot on his backfoot and composed to a "Green" comparison.

[Kev]

berto would destroy him

Don't know about destroy but I think Berto beats him for sure.

Mike Jones is the welterweight Allen Green imo.

Frame wise I can see it but thats as far as I'd go. One thing Green didn't do is go right back at the man who had given him hell (Miranda) and for all intents and puposes dominate him to close a chapter. He feasted on peanuts until he stepped up again vs Ward and pulled out of a couple of main events. I think that loss to Miranda had Green seeing ghosts & he never conquered the doubt...or stopped looking at his feet Maybe Jones broke even lastnight but he matured and adjusted beyond the record stats vs his only blemish.

Jones vs Berto. Nice! That would be a solid scrap. But while Berto has been sitting on the cusp for quite some time I believe Jones showed patterns that could give him pause. Collazo and Forbes type shifts and distance boxing that I dont think Berto should be given a full pass on? Jones is a step behind and Berto is more physical but when have you seen a Berto make that type of back to back 'big fight' adaptation? I know this is not an elite in Soto Karass but movement and uppercuts off jab kill Berto. Jones needs a couple more large goes and by that time Berto and Ortiz will have sorted one another out.

To be fair to Green that's because he lost that fight, and compounded to the fact that Miranda was a HBO favourite had zero leverage to force a rematch. That's to say nothing of the fact that he was also out for a year following it due to emergency colon surgery.

I'm sure Green would have loved a rematch.

Also Miranda, for all his limitations I feel is a step up from Soto Karass. At least Miranda failed when he stepped up to world level. Karass failed against the likes of Alfonso Gomez.

Jones definitely did the job right this time around, but getting it wrong in the first place indicates he will probably never reach the top. I think Allan Green is a pretty accurate analagy in terms of how far I think he will go in the sport. He'll get to fight the world champs, he just won't come close to beating any of them.

Thats more then accurate yeh. Network bought into Miranda hook line and sinker and he had bigger fish to fry. Green was follower with subtle push. Jones (camp) might have gone by without risky rematch, seeing as how they won but erased doubts.

Thinking it through and you mention limitations. I personally think Soto Karass a more well rounded fighter then Miranda. Does it translate into the names, not so much but numbers dont tell the whole story and the only thing failing vs Alfonso Gomez was Gomez;s desire to fight through a cut. Very early but Jones showed me alot on his backfoot and composed to a "Green" comparison.

Karass definitely has heart, but Miranda had two things in abundance that Karass doesn't, knockout power, and for a while at least, a monstrous aura. He was seen as a Tyson like animal for a while, especially after giving Abraham that nice lantern jaw look in their first fight.

Miranda right now is done. Decent boxers know that if they back him up he will fold, and I think mentally he no longer has the belief.

But the Miranda that fought Green was a far tougher ask than a Soto Karass, who really is on the same level as Jesse Feliciano, David Estrada, Cosme Riveria, Matt Vanda, Walid Smichet etc, imo at least.

Tons of heart, but that doesn't beat the top fighters. The fact it was almost enough to beat Mike Jones means I can't see him ever getting to the top.

I'm much more interested in Victor Ortiz. He is a fighter who has all the tools, but is his mindset strong enough? I'm intrigued by his fight with Berto. I think Ortiz has the skill to beat him, but I think Berto, like Timothy Bradley is prepared to dig deeper.

I got Berto winning a decision in a competitive fight in which Ortiz progressively wilts down the stretch. I dont think he will get stopped, because I think he will fight to survice, much like Taylor did in the Pavlik rematch.

Jones I'd most like to see in with Kell Brook. That would show us a lot about both fighters. Neither is ready for a world title yet imo.