A dozen moments since 2000

[ruthless rocco]

hard to believe it is possible, but Calzaghe's shots did more damage to Lacy, than Tito's did to Vargas. Vargas was still able to be a pretty good fighter after Tito, though it was clearly he had left quite a bit in the ring with Tito. Lacy-he was a shell aftewards. Couple that with his bad shoulder and Calzaghe completely ruined him.

Duuuuuuuuuude!

Yup. My question is this. I am convinced Vargas was the goods. Just a monster talent. Wins already over Raul Marquez and Bazooka Quartey and he really fought great against Tito. Lacey, even at the time, seemed like hype as much as anything. But yeah, Calzaghe wrecked him, no question.

there are a few differences that should come into play here...

1-vargas was far more naturally talented and had greater ability & boxing knowledge & skill than lacy.
2- tito was fighting with loaded gloves which caused so much damage to be done to vargas, where joe didn't have that much pop on each punch but just beat on lacy like a drum.
i know people hate the thought of this but i believe evidence of the loaded gloves can be found in his fight against bernard. yes bernard is a master boxer who makes people look bad by forcing them to fight his fight...but tito came out and a showed no confidence in his power because he knew that he didn't have the loaded gloves to hurt bernard. i like tito he was great and fun to watch but i can't ignore what seems so obvious to me. you see the same pattern in the margarito v mosely fight. a cheater gets caught and then doesn't look the same in the ring cause they know they were successful in part cause of cheating.

great list you've put together. i'm gonna go and look a few of them up. thnaks!

[marbleheadmaui]

hard to believe it is possible, but Calzaghe's shots did more damage to Lacy, than Tito's did to Vargas. Vargas was still able to be a pretty good fighter after Tito, though it was clearly he had left quite a bit in the ring with Tito. Lacy-he was a shell aftewards. Couple that with his bad shoulder and Calzaghe completely ruined him.

Duuuuuuuuuude!

Yup. My question is this. I am convinced Vargas was the goods. Just a monster talent. Wins already over Raul Marquez and Bazooka Quartey and he really fought great against Tito. Lacey, even at the time, seemed like hype as much as anything. But yeah, Calzaghe wrecked him, no question.

there are a few differences that should come into play here...

1-vargas was far more naturally talented and had greater ability & boxing knowledge & skill than lacy.
2- tito was fighting with loaded gloves which caused so much damage to be done to vargas, where joe didn't have that much pop on each punch but just beat on lacy like a drum.
i know people hate the thought of this but i believe evidence of the loaded gloves can be found in his fight against bernard. yes bernard is a master boxer who makes people look bad by forcing them to fight his fight...but tito came out and a showed no confidence in his power because he knew that he didn't have the loaded gloves to hurt bernard. i like tito he was great and fun to watch but i can't ignore what seems so obvious to me. you see the same pattern in the margarito v mosely fight. a cheater gets caught and then doesn't look the same in the ring cause they know they were successful in part cause of cheating.

great list you've put together. i'm gonna go and look a few of them up. thnaks!

I simply disagree on Tito and how he wrapped. It was no different than how Arguello wrapped or how Bob Foster wrapped. What Naz did, to his eternal credit, was play one hell of a mind game.

[Mars_ax]

Out of the one's you mentioned Marble:

Bernard Hopkins Takes Out Felix Trinidad-I'd seen 25 BHOP fights before this and this was the first time it struck me that BHOP might be an all-time great fighter. It wasn't that he defeated Tito. It was HOW he defeated him. As clear a display of boxing IQ manifested as you will ever see. Tito did himself proud in defeat, ferocious and full of heart to the end.


This was Hopkin's best performance ever, and one of my all-time favorite fights, a thing of beauty to watch. (unless you were a Tito fan)

[greynotsoold]

Hopkins fought a very smart fight against Trinidad, who, by that time, had practically forgotten that he had, at one time, thrown punches other than left hooks.
And, for the baker's dozen, how about the first Carbajal vs. Chiquita Gonzalez fight?

[greynotsoold]

Hopkins fought a very smart fight against Trinidad, who, by that time, had practically forgotten that he had, at one time, thrown punches other than left hooks.
And, for the baker's dozen, how about the first Carbajal vs. Chiquita Gonzalez fight?

What a dingbat...SINCE 2000!!! Duh.

[armyash]

Really good thread enjoyed reading it.

Good shout on the tito vs vargas fight. Vargas had the potential to be HoF i reckon. He was my favourite fighter and i was devastated when he lost to tito. He showed an amazing fighting spirit though. I personally think it was too early to face trinidad but Vargas was desperate for his fight with Dlh and winning a title so soon in his career he had put himself in to a position where he had to fae the top boys.

With Lacy i think he showed some balls to not quit against Calzaghe but he was a mentally broken man after which is why his career went in to a downward spiral. He shouldn't have listened to the hype because once he realised it wasnt true he didnt have enough about him to come back. Same with Vargas though he may have faced JC a bit too early but he too didnt have much choice after getting a title early.

[marbleheadmaui]

Really good thread enjoyed reading it.

Good shout on the tito vs vargas fight. Vargas had the potential to be HoF i reckon. He was my favourite fighter and i was devastated when he lost to tito. He showed an amazing fighting spirit though. I personally think it was too early to face trinidad but Vargas was desperate for his fight with Dlh and winning a title so soon in his career he had put himself in to a position where he had to fae the top boys.
With Lacy i think he showed some balls to not quit against Calzaghe but he was a mentally broken man after which is why his career went in to a downward spiral. He shouldn't have listened to the hype because once he realised it wasnt true he didnt have enough about him to come back. Same with Vargas though he may have faced JC a bit too early but he too didnt have much choice after getting a title early.

At the time I couldn't for the life of me figure out why Vargas had to be put in with a monster like Tito then. I mean he was what? 21 with 20 fights under his belt? I told people then he was being fed to the wolves. He could have taken fights with guys like Boudouani and Harry Simon and Bronco McKart just to give him another year to mature.

Having said all of that, he fought far more effectively against Tito than I thought he could.