Had A Bad Scare Today.

[marbleheadmaui]

Glad you are okay, Ice. Sounds like a really scary situation.

And what's with all this silly macho talk about guns? What if they threatened Ice with a gun first and he was just stood there with a gun in his pocket? What use would it have served then? And they could very well have shot him whilst running away.

The lack of guns in the UK is one of its better qualities. The fact that there are no guns out here and people are generally quite passive is partly what makes me feel completely safe.

If you American's are happy with your guns, then fair enough I am not going to try and change that. But most countries are happy without them and function more than effectively too.

What's "macho" about not being subject to whims of scum

[Gandalf]

Glad you are okay, Ice. Sounds like a really scary situation.

And what's with all this silly macho talk about guns? What if they threatened Ice with a gun first and he was just stood there with a gun in his pocket? What use would it have served then? And they could very well have shot him whilst running away.

The lack of guns in the UK is one of its better qualities. The fact that there are no guns out here and people are generally quite passive is partly what makes me feel completely safe.

If you American's are happy with your guns, then fair enough I am not going to try and change that. But most countries are happy without them and function more than effectively too.

What's "macho" about not being subject to whims of scum

This isn't the wild west, it's England.

Guns are not an acceptable solution in our culture. If guns were freely available Ice might well have been at the mercy of a gun himself and the fall out could have been far worse.

I am just glad it was only a knife and that he was athletic enough to get away.

[marbleheadmaui]

Glad you are okay, Ice. Sounds like a really scary situation.

And what's with all this silly macho talk about guns? What if they threatened Ice with a gun first and he was just stood there with a gun in his pocket? What use would it have served then? And they could very well have shot him whilst running away.

The lack of guns in the UK is one of its better qualities. The fact that there are no guns out here and people are generally quite passive is partly what makes me feel completely safe.

If you American's are happy with your guns, then fair enough I am not going to try and change that. But most countries are happy without them and function more than effectively too.

What's "macho" about not being subject to whims of scum

This isn't the wild west, it's England.

Guns are not an acceptable solution in our culture. If guns were freely available Ice might well have been at the mercy of a gun himself and the fall out could have been far worse.

I am just glad it was only a knife and that he was athletic enough to get away.

A) You didn't answer the question
B) What if he hadn't been athletic enough? What if he'd been injured or tired or a little older? A knife is a lethal weapon. You're ok at your fellow citizens being at the whim of armed scum?

[VictorCharlie]

Glad you are okay, Ice. Sounds like a really scary situation.

And what's with all this silly macho talk about guns? What if they threatened Ice with a gun first and he was just stood there with a gun in his pocket? What use would it have served then? And they could very well have shot him whilst running away.

The lack of guns in the UK is one of its better qualities. The fact that there are no guns out here and people are generally quite passive is partly what makes me feel completely safe.

If you American's are happy with your guns, then fair enough I am not going to try and change that. But most countries are happy without them and function more than effectively too.

What's "macho" about not being subject to whims of scum

This isn't the wild west, it's England.

Guns are not an acceptable solution in our culture. If guns were freely available Ice might well have been at the mercy of a gun himself and the fall out could have been far worse.

I am just glad it was only a knife and that he was athletic enough to get away.

A) You didn't answer the question
B) What if he hadn't been athletic enough? What if he'd been injured or tired or a little older? A knife is a lethal weapon. You're ok at your fellow citizens being at the whim of armed scum?

Just mentioning guns offends Miles' senstive nature....after all they are so scary

[Kev]

I think the point Miles is making is that if you allow guns, it won't only be the good citizens who have them.

Look at nuclear weapons. What would be better? A world where every country had them so as to defend themselves, or a world where nobody had them?

I know you would best like option 3) Just America has them, but we can't implement a gun law that only allows potential victims to carry them.

[marbleheadmaui]

I think the point Miles is making is that if you allow guns, it won't only be the good citizens who have them.

Look at nuclear weapons. What would be better? A world where every country had them so as to defend themselves, or a world where nobody had them?

I know you would best like option 3) Just America has them, but we can't implement a gun law that only allows potential victims to carry them.

There can be ZERO question that the existence of nuclear weapons has saved many, many, many lives. The single time they were used they probably saved 2 million lives, mostly Japanese. They have also limited those that had them to far smaller proxy wars rather than the total destruction of societies we saw in WWi and WWII. As far as nukes go I am fine with folks like the Brits and French and the having them. I'd be ok with Canada and the Swedes and the Brazilians and the Japanese as well. The problem isn't nukes, it's bad guys.

The notion that criminals are bound by laws is astonishingly silly. The definition of a criminal is one who disregards laws!

[Gandalf]

Glad you are okay, Ice. Sounds like a really scary situation.

And what's with all this silly macho talk about guns? What if they threatened Ice with a gun first and he was just stood there with a gun in his pocket? What use would it have served then? And they could very well have shot him whilst running away.

The lack of guns in the UK is one of its better qualities. The fact that there are no guns out here and people are generally quite passive is partly what makes me feel completely safe.

If you American's are happy with your guns, then fair enough I am not going to try and change that. But most countries are happy without them and function more than effectively too.

What's "macho" about not being subject to whims of scum

This isn't the wild west, it's England.

Guns are not an acceptable solution in our culture. If guns were freely available Ice might well have been at the mercy of a gun himself and the fall out could have been far worse.

I am just glad it was only a knife and that he was athletic enough to get away.

A) You didn't answer the question
B) What if he hadn't been athletic enough? What if he'd been injured or tired or a little older? A knife is a lethal weapon. You're ok at your fellow citizens being at the whim of armed scum?

Just mentioning guns offends Miles' senstive nature....after all they are so scary

Don't be gay. I would quite like to own a gun when I eventually move into the countryside. I would love to live out my survivorman fantasies (but make my wife skin the rabbit). But in a city where there are no problems with drugs, criminals etc? There is just no real need to have one. They aren't scary, just not needed. Maybe this is very different in some parts of America where there is a lot more crime, violence etc. but that just isn't the case here or even in most parts of England. The situation Ice experienced was the exception rather than the norm. I never experienced anything like that in the UK and I am sure most Brits here would say the same thing. You just don't need to walk around with a gun.

[VictorCharlie]

Glad you are okay, Ice. Sounds like a really scary situation.

And what's with all this silly macho talk about guns? What if they threatened Ice with a gun first and he was just stood there with a gun in his pocket? What use would it have served then? And they could very well have shot him whilst running away.

The lack of guns in the UK is one of its better qualities. The fact that there are no guns out here and people are generally quite passive is partly what makes me feel completely safe.

If you American's are happy with your guns, then fair enough I am not going to try and change that. But most countries are happy without them and function more than effectively too.

What's "macho" about not being subject to whims of scum

This isn't the wild west, it's England.

Guns are not an acceptable solution in our culture. If guns were freely available Ice might well have been at the mercy of a gun himself and the fall out could have been far worse.

I am just glad it was only a knife and that he was athletic enough to get away.

A) You didn't answer the question
B) What if he hadn't been athletic enough? What if he'd been injured or tired or a little older? A knife is a lethal weapon. You're ok at your fellow citizens being at the whim of armed scum?

Just mentioning guns offends Miles' senstive nature....after all they are so scary

Don't be gay. I would quite like to own a gun when I eventually move into the countryside. I would love to live out my survivorman fantasies (but make my wife skin the rabbit). But in a city where there are no problems with drugs, criminals etc? There is just no real need to have one. They aren't scary, just not needed. Maybe this is very different in some parts of America where there is a lot more crime, violence etc. but that just isn't the case here or even in most parts of England. The situation Ice experienced was the exception rather than the norm. I never experienced anything like that in the UK and I am sure most Brits here would say the same thing. You just don't need to walk around with a gun.

I'm just giving you the piss...or is it I'm taking a piss Not sure about my UK lingo but anyway I'm just messing with you man.

[Master]

ICB you did the correct thing.

If you had a gun/knife you would end up using it and get into further trouble so best not to carry anything.

[Gandalf]

Glad you are okay, Ice. Sounds like a really scary situation.

And what's with all this silly macho talk about guns? What if they threatened Ice with a gun first and he was just stood there with a gun in his pocket? What use would it have served then? And they could very well have shot him whilst running away.

The lack of guns in the UK is one of its better qualities. The fact that there are no guns out here and people are generally quite passive is partly what makes me feel completely safe.

If you American's are happy with your guns, then fair enough I am not going to try and change that. But most countries are happy without them and function more than effectively too.

What's "macho" about not being subject to whims of scum

This isn't the wild west, it's England.

Guns are not an acceptable solution in our culture. If guns were freely available Ice might well have been at the mercy of a gun himself and the fall out could have been far worse.

I am just glad it was only a knife and that he was athletic enough to get away.

A) You didn't answer the question
B) What if he hadn't been athletic enough? What if he'd been injured or tired or a little older? A knife is a lethal weapon. You're ok at your fellow citizens being at the whim of armed scum?

a) I didn't even realise it was a question with the smilie things going on. I like your rhetorical style, but your question could have been framed a little better. Having given it a second I get the gist though.

I guess it would be great if he had a gun to counter the thugs, but this is England things are quite different. My point is that if Ice had a gun, then it would be more likely the thugs would have had a gun too and they would be aiming first.

b) I am not happy about what Ice experienced, but it was a very unusual situation and not something most of us have gone through. He could well have got hurt, but how would having a gun in his pocket help him? He could reach his hand in and have three bullets in his brain. I could counter it and say look at America. Ice got away and the thugs had a little knife. Look at how Vernon Forrest went out and we know of him because he is famous. It is happening everyday.

A culture with too many guns is not something I approve of. I know some of the American's on here will disagree and this is an argument that has been hashed out many times before. I live in a society with no guns, feel safe and am quite happy in the knowledge that nobody will shoot me. Not even the police. Some societies are really quite relaxed and safe. In comparison even England seems like a gangsters paradise compared to where I live.

[Ghost]

So there are no guns in England, correct?

No rifles, no shot guns?

Or do you mean just no hand guns?

[Gandalf]

So there are no guns in England, correct?

No rifles, no shot guns?

Or do you mean just no hand guns?

I am sure you can find guns in England, but they are the exception rather than the norm. I am also sure you can find weapons in the hands of some gangs and in the posession of officers of the law, but generally speaking you don't have guns in middle England. They clearly exist, but it is far from a gun in every home.

Where I currently live there are clearly no guns. People don't use them and nobody gets shot dead as a consequence. Even the police carry no more than a badge. Family is still strong out here and putting the family honour at risk is enough to keep most people on the straight and narrow. Kids go to school with cutter knives in their pencil cases and nobody is getting carved up either. Obviously there are exceptions, but as a man I feel quite safe in a land with no guns.

[marbleheadmaui]

Glad you are okay, Ice. Sounds like a really scary situation.

And what's with all this silly macho talk about guns? What if they threatened Ice with a gun first and he was just stood there with a gun in his pocket? What use would it have served then? And they could very well have shot him whilst running away.

The lack of guns in the UK is one of its better qualities. The fact that there are no guns out here and people are generally quite passive is partly what makes me feel completely safe.

If you American's are happy with your guns, then fair enough I am not going to try and change that. But most countries are happy without them and function more than effectively too.

What's "macho" about not being subject to whims of scum

This isn't the wild west, it's England.

Guns are not an acceptable solution in our culture. If guns were freely available Ice might well have been at the mercy of a gun himself and the fall out could have been far worse.

I am just glad it was only a knife and that he was athletic enough to get away.

A) You didn't answer the question
B) What if he hadn't been athletic enough? What if he'd been injured or tired or a little older? A knife is a lethal weapon. You're ok at your fellow citizens being at the whim of armed scum?

a) I didn't even realise it was a question with the smilie things going on. I like your rhetorical style, but your question could have been framed a little better. Having given it a second I get the gist though.

I guess it would be great if he had a gun to counter the thugs, but this is England things are quite different. My point is that if Ice had a gun, then it would be more likely the thugs would have had a gun too and they would be aiming first.

b) I am not happy about what Ice experienced, but it was a very unusual situation and not something most of us have gone through. He could well have got hurt, but how would having a gun in his pocket help him? He could reach his hand in and have three bullets in his brain. I could counter it and say look at America. Ice got away and the thugs had a little knife. Look at how Vernon Forrest went out and we know of him because he is famous. It is happening everyday.

A culture with too many guns is not something I approve of. I know some of the American's on here will disagree and this is an argument that has been hashed out many times before. I live in a society with no guns, feel safe and am quite happy in the knowledge that nobody will shoot me. Not even the police. Some societies are really quite relaxed and safe. In comparison even England seems like a gangsters paradise compared to where I live.

There is no reason to believe that if IBC had a gun the thugs would as well. But if the thugs even thought he MIGHT they'd likely move on. Guys like that aren't warriors they are scavengers.

My own personal experience is my guns may have saved my life on two occasions.

The problem is NEVER EVER guns! They are just a tool. A decent man with a gun troubles me not at all. A guy with bad intentions with a knife or a club or a hammer or a boxcutter or a sap or a baseball bat or a tire iron is a far bigger problem. It is the GUY, not the tool that is the issue.

The difference between you and me is I also feel perfectly safe. But it is because I AM perfectly safe. I can enforce my safety. You are only safe at the whim of scum.

[Gandalf]

Glad you are okay, Ice. Sounds like a really scary situation.

And what's with all this silly macho talk about guns? What if they threatened Ice with a gun first and he was just stood there with a gun in his pocket? What use would it have served then? And they could very well have shot him whilst running away.

The lack of guns in the UK is one of its better qualities. The fact that there are no guns out here and people are generally quite passive is partly what makes me feel completely safe.

If you American's are happy with your guns, then fair enough I am not going to try and change that. But most countries are happy without them and function more than effectively too.

What's "macho" about not being subject to whims of scum

This isn't the wild west, it's England.

Guns are not an acceptable solution in our culture. If guns were freely available Ice might well have been at the mercy of a gun himself and the fall out could have been far worse.

I am just glad it was only a knife and that he was athletic enough to get away.

A) You didn't answer the question
B) What if he hadn't been athletic enough? What if he'd been injured or tired or a little older? A knife is a lethal weapon. You're ok at your fellow citizens being at the whim of armed scum?

a) I didn't even realise it was a question with the smilie things going on. I like your rhetorical style, but your question could have been framed a little better. Having given it a second I get the gist though.

I guess it would be great if he had a gun to counter the thugs, but this is England things are quite different. My point is that if Ice had a gun, then it would be more likely the thugs would have had a gun too and they would be aiming first.

b) I am not happy about what Ice experienced, but it was a very unusual situation and not something most of us have gone through. He could well have got hurt, but how would having a gun in his pocket help him? He could reach his hand in and have three bullets in his brain. I could counter it and say look at America. Ice got away and the thugs had a little knife. Look at how Vernon Forrest went out and we know of him because he is famous. It is happening everyday.

A culture with too many guns is not something I approve of. I know some of the American's on here will disagree and this is an argument that has been hashed out many times before. I live in a society with no guns, feel safe and am quite happy in the knowledge that nobody will shoot me. Not even the police. Some societies are really quite relaxed and safe. In comparison even England seems like a gangsters paradise compared to where I live.

There is no reason to believe that if IBC had a gun the thugs would as well. But if the thugs even thought he MIGHT they'd likely move on. Guys like that aren't warriors they are scavengers.

My own personal experience is my guns may have saved my life on two occasions.

The problem is NEVER EVER guns! They are just a tool. A decent man with a gun troubles me not at all. A guy with bad intentions with a knife or a club or a hammer or a boxcutter or a sap or a baseball bat or a tire iron is a far bigger problem. It is the GUY, not the tool that is the issue.

The difference between you and me is I also feel perfectly safe. But it is because I AM perfectly safe. I can enforce my safety. You are only safe at the whim of scum.

I am safe because I choose to live in a place where assault, murder etc are relatively uncommon crimes. Perhaps the fact that you need to carry weapons around with you is a sign that your society has some serious problems and that you are living in undesirable places. I have never had a knife pulled on me nor been threatened with a gun. I have lived in a couple of rather dodgy areas in the UK, but even then I have never experienced any massive problems. However, I can see why it might be useful to take precautions ie pepper spray in those environments. But living in Korea, I can honestly say that as a man, I have never felt anything less than safe. Nobody is going to threaten me with a knife or anything like that. The minute I ever encounter any danger I will revise my opinion, but 8 years and so far so good. I see few signs of that changing.

I think the fact that the family bond is still so strong here, the fact that most people live in high apartments, the fact that teenagers have to study so much and the lack of drugs, means that society is relatively stable. Somehow it all just seems to work out here. No guns and little violence. Knives are out there, but nobody uses them. Kids have woodcutter knives in their pencil cases, nobody batters an eyelid and nobody gets stabbed. Of course, there is crime here, but none of that burglary to pay for the heroin nonsense. The most usual crime is tax evasion and road safety violations.

[marbleheadmaui]

Glad you are okay, Ice. Sounds like a really scary situation.

And what's with all this silly macho talk about guns? What if they threatened Ice with a gun first and he was just stood there with a gun in his pocket? What use would it have served then? And they could very well have shot him whilst running away.

The lack of guns in the UK is one of its better qualities. The fact that there are no guns out here and people are generally quite passive is partly what makes me feel completely safe.

If you American's are happy with your guns, then fair enough I am not going to try and change that. But most countries are happy without them and function more than effectively too.

What's "macho" about not being subject to whims of scum

This isn't the wild west, it's England.

Guns are not an acceptable solution in our culture. If guns were freely available Ice might well have been at the mercy of a gun himself and the fall out could have been far worse.

I am just glad it was only a knife and that he was athletic enough to get away.

A) You didn't answer the question
B) What if he hadn't been athletic enough? What if he'd been injured or tired or a little older? A knife is a lethal weapon. You're ok at your fellow citizens being at the whim of armed scum?

a) I didn't even realise it was a question with the smilie things going on. I like your rhetorical style, but your question could have been framed a little better. Having given it a second I get the gist though.

I guess it would be great if he had a gun to counter the thugs, but this is England things are quite different. My point is that if Ice had a gun, then it would be more likely the thugs would have had a gun too and they would be aiming first.

b) I am not happy about what Ice experienced, but it was a very unusual situation and not something most of us have gone through. He could well have got hurt, but how would having a gun in his pocket help him? He could reach his hand in and have three bullets in his brain. I could counter it and say look at America. Ice got away and the thugs had a little knife. Look at how Vernon Forrest went out and we know of him because he is famous. It is happening everyday.

A culture with too many guns is not something I approve of. I know some of the American's on here will disagree and this is an argument that has been hashed out many times before. I live in a society with no guns, feel safe and am quite happy in the knowledge that nobody will shoot me. Not even the police. Some societies are really quite relaxed and safe. In comparison even England seems like a gangsters paradise compared to where I live.

There is no reason to believe that if IBC had a gun the thugs would as well. But if the thugs even thought he MIGHT they'd likely move on. Guys like that aren't warriors they are scavengers.

My own personal experience is my guns may have saved my life on two occasions.

The problem is NEVER EVER guns! They are just a tool. A decent man with a gun troubles me not at all. A guy with bad intentions with a knife or a club or a hammer or a boxcutter or a sap or a baseball bat or a tire iron is a far bigger problem. It is the GUY, not the tool that is the issue.

The difference between you and me is I also feel perfectly safe. But it is because I AM perfectly safe. I can enforce my safety. You are only safe at the whim of scum.

I am safe because I choose to live in a place where assault, murder etc are relatively uncommon crimes. Perhaps the fact that you need to carry weapons around with you is a sign that your society has some serious problems and that you are living in undesirable places. I have never had a knife pulled on me nor been threatened with a gun. I have lived in a couple of rather dodgy areas in the UK, but even then I have never experienced any massive problems. However, I can see why it might be useful to take precautions ie pepper spray in those environments. But living in Korea, I can honestly say that as a man, I have never felt anything less than safe. Nobody is going to threaten me with a knife or anything like that. The minute I ever encounter any danger I will revise my opinion, but 8 years and so far so good. I see few signs of that changing.

I think the fact that the family bond is still so strong here, the fact that most people live in high apartments, the fact that teenagers have to study so much and the lack of drugs, means that society is relatively stable. Somehow it all just seems to work out here. No guns and little violence. Knives are out there, but nobody uses them. Kids have woodcutter knives in their pencil cases, nobody batters an eyelid and nobody gets stabbed. Of course, there is crime here, but none of that burglary to pay for the heroin nonsense. The most usual crime is tax evasion and road safety violations.

LOL! One of my comebacks prior to reading this was "If you prize safety over other things so much, move to Singapore!" Guess I can't use that one huh?

I will say that in the UK, the law taking citizens guns led to a huge spike in home invasions. Why? Because that crime became far less risky for criminals. Allowing criminals more certainty about the risks involved in a crime will always have an impact. IIRC England now has more total home invasions than the US. Not per capita, but in total!