Quote Originally Posted by erics44 View Post
Quote Originally Posted by Rantcatrat View Post

more credit is due to the person who beat the better opponents in my book. the straps the come along with it are just straps. i give some credence to being the lineal champion of course or the man in the division and some credence to the length of time being the best in the division and whether he cleaned out the division etc.

take wlad, in another thread started by you, "is the general opinion of wlad deserved," you argue that although wlad is an unified belt holder, he is overrated because he hasn't faced any good competition. haye would beat all of wlad's opposition and so on.

here, you argue that Haye is great because he held a lot of belts even though he didn't face any tough competition. it's a little hypocritical, isn't it? there's a difference though. when haye was at cruiserweight the division was crap, but haye wasn't in the division for very long. he didn't clean it out. wlad has literally cleaned out the entire division and faced the top in his division. haye left the division before he did that.

to be fair, with haye i feel like it's all about potential because his resume is thin. he has looked good dispatching weak opposition, but he doesn't really have a career defining victory. so if he beats wlad, that'll be i and he'll retire on top. he'll be p4p in my book. so far he hasn't beat anyone even remotely close to wlad. not even close.

paragraph 1 - more credit maybe maybe not, we are talking achievements tho, i said who has acheived what haye has you said that was simply ridiculous

paragraph 2 - I havent argued that wlad is over rated, i have asked the question do you think he is? i dont think he is, on his day he could be good enough to beat any HW in history. i do also think that on his day haye would have dealt with all of wlads opposition since peter 1, whether or not he could do it as consitently as wlad has is another question

paragraph 3 - do you know what hypocritical means? someone said that they dont think haye was a top cruiser, i said that was ridiculous look what he acheived (a top cruiser, not the best ever)

paragraph 4 - you are right haye hasnt had the defining fights that other fighters have had, he hasnt got an amazing HW run or anything like that, he was however a top cruiser and he is however a very real threat to wlad because of the potential that you talk about
that's probably the fairest post I've seen from you on the Wlad v. Haye beef. good play.