The Recent Demise of American Boxing

[Fenster]

#1 These things are cyclical but due to there being no more USSR that deepens the talent pool. There are also more defectors from Cuba. The US has not been challenged to produce true great boxers for a while, it was a given we'd have them and look how our Olympic team has suffered. Never to fear, we'll be back, like I said its cyclical.

#2 The NBA and MLB have WORLD Champions because the best players in the world play in those leagues....anybody doubt that?

Outside of America no-one gives a shit about those sports. You can't compare a predominant American sport with one like football (soccer). Everywhere on the planet it is played and worshipped in astronomical numbers, by all walks of life.

Is being the worlds best baseball team any better than being the worlds best sumo?

Well since America is the center of the sports world, I'd say they're a big deal. The only reason soccer is so popular is because it's cheap to play. It's poplular in all countries that haven't figured out how to build a basketball goal or a two story building yet. And just because soccer is the most played, doesn't mean its the most entertaining. It's like watching cross country in a box. I mean come on...a sport where 2-1 is a high scoring game? Wake me up when its over. All other nations are scared shitless of feilding a football team because of the chance they might have to play the americans.

Now you're just being silly, soccer draws in far more money world wide than any other sport, it's not even close. And the NFL tried a Euro league, how did that pan out? 1-2 seasons maybe?

The NFL is the no. 1 sports league in generating revenue. Not bad for a sport that only Americans watch.

9 Billion USD for the NFL. For a soccer league like the EPL it's only £2.5 billion, the most profitable of all the soccer leagues. You're right it's not even close.

And for people shitting on basketball and baseball. Those are probably the no. 2 and 3 sports in the world in being watched. Europe might not like those sports that doesn't mean Asia and Latin America doesn't.

Now all the soccer leagues in the world vs. all the football leagues in the world. Further add in revenues from national team matches.

I do concede that Baseball is very popular in Asia and Latin America

Even if American Football generates more money than football (the proper stuff) it is irrelevant to it's worldwide popularity. Football (soccer) is clearly the most popular sport on earth. Watched and played. I'm not even gonna look for stats because it's so blatantly obvious.

If Baseball and Basketball are the 2nd and 3rd most watched sports in the world I would be totally amazed. Maybe it has something to do with the size of nation watching it, however, that is very impressive for sports that seems soley American.

[VictorCharlie]

If the decline is due to people not wanting to be punched in the face to make money, shouldn't mma be in just of bad as shape?

I think MMA's rise in popularity has a couple things working for it.

1. First and foremost it is on free TV more often and the UFC does a much better job marketing itself to the 18-35 male market than boxing. Personally I became more of a MMA fan b/c I felt my $50 paid for a better product. Obviously entertainment is subjective but a MMA card has at a minimum 5 fights, most of which are good relevant fights that the fans want to see.

2. While the UFC isn't the only MMA org it is far and away the predominant one. Fans for the most part get to see the fights they want to see in a timely fashion. The frustration with the alphabet orgs and dodgy promoters doesn't exist in MMA like it does in boxing. A federal boxing commission that only recognized one belt and one sanctioning body would go a long way to improving the American fan's opinion of the sport.

3. Boxers take years to hone their craft to be at a world class level. MMA has a technical side that is ever evolving but it puts much more of an emphasis on athleticism. A guy that was a good at wrestling, BJJ, Judo, Muy Thai, Kick boxing and is a great athelete can be competitive in the sport at this point as they evolve the other aspects of the sport. As the sport evolves more and more this may eventually not be true. My hometown's only boxing gym is largely unknown to most but there are several martial arts academies that cater to the MMA crowd.

4. Lastly there is a generational issue. Young people regardless of their likes/dislikes about boxing will veiw it as their parent's combat sport and MMA, which is for all intents and purposes 20 years old in the U.S., their combat sport. I work with lots of 18-35 yr old males and very few could name 10 professional boxers but most regularly watch MMA.

[#1FightFan]

I'm american and I'm embarrassed by our fighters, minus a few!
I for one welcome great foreign fighters. they fight to win!!
matthyesse, kotelnik, maidana, pacman, donaire, froch, kessler, bute...all are great, and don't act like complete douchebag thugs like Judah, Gayweather, etc.

i just wish these guys would not get robbed by us Americans, like matthyesse, kotelnik & maidana did. it's BULLSHIT! and pisses me off, an American, bigtime!!

[VictorCharlie]

#1 These things are cyclical but due to there being no more USSR that deepens the talent pool. There are also more defectors from Cuba. The US has not been challenged to produce true great boxers for a while, it was a given we'd have them and look how our Olympic team has suffered. Never to fear, we'll be back, like I said its cyclical.

#2 The NBA and MLB have WORLD Champions because the best players in the world play in those leagues....anybody doubt that?

Outside of America no-one gives a shit about those sports. You can't compare a predominant American sport with one like football (soccer). Everywhere on the planet it is played and worshipped in astronomical numbers, by all walks of life.

Is being the worlds best baseball team any better than being the worlds best sumo?

Well since America is the center of the sports world, I'd say they're a big deal. The only reason soccer is so popular is because it's cheap to play. It's poplular in all countries that haven't figured out how to build a basketball goal or a two story building yet. And just because soccer is the most played, doesn't mean its the most entertaining. It's like watching cross country in a box. I mean come on...a sport where 2-1 is a high scoring game? Wake me up when its over. All other nations are scared shitless of feilding a football team because of the chance they might have to play the americans.

Now you're just being silly, soccer draws in far more money world wide than any other sport, it's not even close. And the NFL tried a Euro league, how did that pan out? 1-2 seasons maybe?

The NFL is the no. 1 sports league in generating revenue. Not bad for a sport that only Americans watch.

9 Billion USD for the NFL. For a soccer league like the EPL it's only £2.5 billion, the most profitable of all the soccer leagues. You're right it's not even close.

And for people shitting on basketball and baseball. Those are probably the no. 2 and 3 sports in the world in being watched. Europe might not like those sports that doesn't mean Asia and Latin America doesn't.

Now all the soccer leagues in the world vs. all the football leagues in the world. Further add in revenues from national team matches.

I do concede that Baseball is very popular in Asia and Latin America

Even if American Football generates more money than football (the proper stuff) it is irrelevant to it's worldwide popularity. Football (soccer) is clearly the most popular sport on earth. Watched and played. I'm not even gonna look for stats because it's so blatantly obvious.

If Baseball and Basketball are the 2nd and 3rd most watched sports in the world I would be totally amazed. Maybe it has something to do with the size of nation watching it, however, that is very impressive for sports that seems soley American.

You probably did not watch the last NBA draft but a hefty portion of the top 10 picks were international players suggesting an ever rising participation in the sport.

[Fenster]

#1 These things are cyclical but due to there being no more USSR that deepens the talent pool. There are also more defectors from Cuba. The US has not been challenged to produce true great boxers for a while, it was a given we'd have them and look how our Olympic team has suffered. Never to fear, we'll be back, like I said its cyclical.

#2 The NBA and MLB have WORLD Champions because the best players in the world play in those leagues....anybody doubt that?

Outside of America no-one gives a shit about those sports. You can't compare a predominant American sport with one like football (soccer). Everywhere on the planet it is played and worshipped in astronomical numbers, by all walks of life.

Is being the worlds best baseball team any better than being the worlds best sumo?

Well since America is the center of the sports world, I'd say they're a big deal. The only reason soccer is so popular is because it's cheap to play. It's poplular in all countries that haven't figured out how to build a basketball goal or a two story building yet. And just because soccer is the most played, doesn't mean its the most entertaining. It's like watching cross country in a box. I mean come on...a sport where 2-1 is a high scoring game? Wake me up when its over. All other nations are scared shitless of feilding a football team because of the chance they might have to play the americans.

Now you're just being silly, soccer draws in far more money world wide than any other sport, it's not even close. And the NFL tried a Euro league, how did that pan out? 1-2 seasons maybe?

The NFL is the no. 1 sports league in generating revenue. Not bad for a sport that only Americans watch.

9 Billion USD for the NFL. For a soccer league like the EPL it's only £2.5 billion, the most profitable of all the soccer leagues. You're right it's not even close.

And for people shitting on basketball and baseball. Those are probably the no. 2 and 3 sports in the world in being watched. Europe might not like those sports that doesn't mean Asia and Latin America doesn't.

Now all the soccer leagues in the world vs. all the football leagues in the world. Further add in revenues from national team matches.

I do concede that Baseball is very popular in Asia and Latin America

Even if American Football generates more money than football (the proper stuff) it is irrelevant to it's worldwide popularity. Football (soccer) is clearly the most popular sport on earth. Watched and played. I'm not even gonna look for stats because it's so blatantly obvious.

If Baseball and Basketball are the 2nd and 3rd most watched sports in the world I would be totally amazed. Maybe it has something to do with the size of nation watching it, however, that is very impressive for sports that seems soley American.

You probably did not watch the last NBA draft but a hefty portion of the top 10 picks were international players suggesting an ever rising participation in the sport.

I certainly did not. I know absolutely nothing about basketball, baseball or American football (well I know about the superbowl and have seen the Harlem Globetrotters live).

Basketball courts are far more common on London council estates than they were 20 years ago. I know that too.

Maybe they are more popular sports than I thought, they are certainly not challenging football though (soccer).

[johnsebastianmiran]

I did not create the situations I am about to describe but television network executives killed boxing on prime time. Doctors got on line to condemn and try to abolish boxing. This sport has taken many forms since the emergence of the Greek and Roman Empires and boxing goes further back. Give it any name you want, it has endured along with wrestling in Europe and Asia. Most men in America are formidable but the wimps have the jobs to put boxing in the background instead of the fore front. Wimpy executives canceled the highly rated Tuesday night fights and people on skateboards called themselves extreme sports. It's the mentality and the greed of the executives that keeps men from becoming champions in my country. Priorities have changed and I don't care to badmouth anyone that is second in line. Fighters like Mayweather put themselves in a position that makes them the most viable opponents while better men walk away because they couldn't attract flies laced in honey. This is truly a case of the few fucking the many. Professionals in fields screwing boxing wanted it abolished and suddenly Contact Karate finally called kick boxing came along but no one mentioned fatalities in MMA or legalized mayhem where you wear lighter gloves than boxers and get to hit your opponent when he's down. It's all how one packages it. Right now the wimps are in power. I still love boxing and soccer. I may even go to a basketball game once in a while but the most manly sport on earth is where you have to wear eight to ten ounce gloves and a cup under your shorts. Just before the bell rings the ref says,"May the best man win." That is what it is all about and boxing is better than ever and if I have to follow a foreign boxer then so be it, it is the manly art of self defense.

[marbleheadmaui]

I did not create the situations I am about to describe but television network executives killed boxing on prime time. Doctors got on line to condemn and try to abolish boxing. This sport has taken many forms since the emergence of the Greek and Roman Empires and boxing goes further back. Give it any name you want, it has endured along with wrestling in Europe and Asia. Most men in America are formidable but the wimps have the jobs to put boxing in the background instead of the fore front. Wimpy executives canceled the highly rated Tuesday night fights and people on skateboards called themselves extreme sports. It's the mentality and the greed of the executives that keeps men from becoming champions in my country. Priorities have changed and I don't care to badmouth anyone that is second in line. Fighters like Mayweather put themselves in a position that makes them the most viable opponents while better men walk away because they couldn't attract flies laced in honey. This is truly a case of the few fucking the many. Professionals in fields screwing boxing wanted it abolished and suddenly Contact Karate finally called kick boxing came along but no one mentioned fatalities in MMA or legalized mayhem where you wear lighter gloves than boxers and get to hit your opponent when he's down. It's all how one packages it. Right now the wimps are in power. I still love boxing and soccer. I may even go to a basketball game once in a while but the most manly sport on earth is where you have to wear eight to ten ounce gloves and a cup under your shorts. Just before the bell rings the ref says,"May the best man win." That is what it is all about and boxing is better than ever and if I have to follow a foreign boxer then so be it, it is the manly art of self defense.

Damn! [applause]

[Master]

The boxers like Tyson and B Hop are probably staying in jail because it is easier. If they are athletic they will take a less brutal sport than break their noses. Boxing is pricing itself out of existence, corrupt and losing interest from the next generation.

[amat]

#1 These things are cyclical but due to there being no more USSR that deepens the talent pool. There are also more defectors from Cuba. The US has not been challenged to produce true great boxers for a while, it was a given we'd have them and look how our Olympic team has suffered. Never to fear, we'll be back, like I said its cyclical.

#2 The NBA and MLB have WORLD Champions because the best players in the world play in those leagues....anybody doubt that?

Outside of America no-one gives a shit about those sports. You can't compare a predominant American sport with one like football (soccer). Everywhere on the planet it is played and worshipped in astronomical numbers, by all walks of life.

Is being the worlds best baseball team any better than being the worlds best sumo?

That's actually incredibly ignorant, South America is baseball crazy and I doubt there is a single roster in the MLB that doesn't have at least 5 dudes who's first language is Spanish. Asia has also taken to baseball, so it's basically just Europe and Africa that hasn't.

The Giants last year won the World Series with Pablo Sandoval, Juan Uribe, Edgar Renteria, Guillermo Mota, Santiago Cassilla, Jonathan Sanchez (Puerto Rican but still spanish is first language) and Denny Bautista. That's 7 of 25 men not from America. And other teams have much more.

So yes, it is a "World Series" because not a soul would argue that any other baseball team outside of America would beat the Giants in a 7 game series. No German team would beat the Mavs because the best German is on the Mavs. When the best players come over, because the 50 best baseball players play in America no doubt. Well maybe Cuba has a few of those guys but you know the deal there. Just like the best Sumo are in Japan but that sport doesn't have anything close to the influence of baseball or basketball.

[Fenster]

#1 These things are cyclical but due to there being no more USSR that deepens the talent pool. There are also more defectors from Cuba. The US has not been challenged to produce true great boxers for a while, it was a given we'd have them and look how our Olympic team has suffered. Never to fear, we'll be back, like I said its cyclical.

#2 The NBA and MLB have WORLD Champions because the best players in the world play in those leagues....anybody doubt that?

Outside of America no-one gives a shit about those sports. You can't compare a predominant American sport with one like football (soccer). Everywhere on the planet it is played and worshipped in astronomical numbers, by all walks of life.

Is being the worlds best baseball team any better than being the worlds best sumo?

That's actually incredibly ignorant, South America is baseball crazy and I doubt there is a single roster in the MLB that doesn't have at least 5 dudes who's first language is Spanish. Asia has also taken to baseball, so it's basically just Europe and Africa that hasn't.

The Giants last year won the World Series with Pablo Sandoval, Juan Uribe, Edgar Renteria, Guillermo Mota, Santiago Cassilla, Jonathan Sanchez (Puerto Rican but still spanish is first language) and Denny Bautista. That's 7 of 25 men not from America. And other teams have much more.

So yes, it is a "World Series" because not a soul would argue that any other baseball team outside of America would beat the Giants in a 7 game series. No German team would beat the Mavs because the best German is on the Mavs. When the best players come over, because the 50 best baseball players play in America no doubt. Well maybe Cuba has a few of those guys but you know the deal there. Just like the best Sumo are in Japan but that sport doesn't have anything close to the influence of baseball or basketball.

Thanks for that amat. So the Giants are the world champs? But tell me...

Where was the last baseball world cup held?

and

What countries did the Giants beat?

[Nameless]

#1 These things are cyclical but due to there being no more USSR that deepens the talent pool. There are also more defectors from Cuba. The US has not been challenged to produce true great boxers for a while, it was a given we'd have them and look how our Olympic team has suffered. Never to fear, we'll be back, like I said its cyclical.

#2 The NBA and MLB have WORLD Champions because the best players in the world play in those leagues....anybody doubt that?

Outside of America no-one gives a shit about those sports. You can't compare a predominant American sport with one like football (soccer). Everywhere on the planet it is played and worshipped in astronomical numbers, by all walks of life.

Is being the worlds best baseball team any better than being the worlds best sumo?

That's actually incredibly ignorant, South America is baseball crazy and I doubt there is a single roster in the MLB that doesn't have at least 5 dudes who's first language is Spanish. Asia has also taken to baseball, so it's basically just Europe and Africa that hasn't.

The Giants last year won the World Series with Pablo Sandoval, Juan Uribe, Edgar Renteria, Guillermo Mota, Santiago Cassilla, Jonathan Sanchez (Puerto Rican but still spanish is first language) and Denny Bautista. That's 7 of 25 men not from America. And other teams have much more.

So yes, it is a "World Series" because not a soul would argue that any other baseball team outside of America would beat the Giants in a 7 game series. No German team would beat the Mavs because the best German is on the Mavs. When the best players come over, because the 50 best baseball players play in America no doubt. Well maybe Cuba has a few of those guys but you know the deal there. Just like the best Sumo are in Japan but that sport doesn't have anything close to the influence of baseball or basketball.

The only 2 spanish speakingcountries where baseball is really crazy popular are Domminican Republics, Cuba and Puerto Rico and none of them are in South America (rather in the Carribeans), which is not exactly he same thing. Spanish speaking player absolutely doesn't mean south america, you have tons of spanish speaking players in US and the others are from the Carribean countries I just mentioned. Baseball is played a bit in S.A but it is terribly, terribly marginal compared to football/soccer over there.

[marbleheadmaui]

If the decline is due to people not wanting to be punched in the face to make money, shouldn't mma be in just of bad as shape?

I think MMA's rise in popularity has a couple things working for it.

1. First and foremost it is on free TV more often and the UFC does a much better job marketing itself to the 18-35 male market than boxing. Personally I became more of a MMA fan b/c I felt my $50 paid for a better product. Obviously entertainment is subjective but a MMA card has at a minimum 5 fights, most of which are good relevant fights that the fans want to see.

2. While the UFC isn't the only MMA org it is far and away the predominant one. Fans for the most part get to see the fights they want to see in a timely fashion. The frustration with the alphabet orgs and dodgy promoters doesn't exist in MMA like it does in boxing. A federal boxing commission that only recognized one belt and one sanctioning body would go a long way to improving the American fan's opinion of the sport.

3. Boxers take years to hone their craft to be at a world class level. MMA has a technical side that is ever evolving but it puts much more of an emphasis on athleticism. A guy that was a good at wrestling, BJJ, Judo, Muy Thai, Kick boxing and is a great athelete can be competitive in the sport at this point as they evolve the other aspects of the sport. As the sport evolves more and more this may eventually not be true. My hometown's only boxing gym is largely unknown to most but there are several martial arts academies that cater to the MMA crowd.

4. Lastly there is a generational issue. Young people regardless of their likes/dislikes about boxing will veiw it as their parent's combat sport and MMA, which is for all intents and purposes 20 years old in the U.S., their combat sport. I work with lots of 18-35 yr old males and very few could name 10 professional boxers but most regularly watch MMA.

Great post! It kills me, but a lot of it is on the money.

[Mars_ax]

I gotta wonder, is Pro Baseball in the U.S. really that popular anymore? 'Roids fucked up my interest in Baseball.

How 'bout the NBA, is it still popular? I haven't watched a Pro basketball game since Larry Bird still played for the Celtics.

[boxingbantz]

Well since America is the center of the sports world, I'd say they're a big deal. The only reason soccer is so popular is because it's cheap to play. It's poplular in all countries that haven't figured out how to build a basketball goal or a two story building yet. And just because soccer is the most played, doesn't mean its the most entertaining. It's like watching cross country in a box. I mean come on...a sport where 2-1 is a high scoring game? Wake me up when its over. All other nations are scared shitless of feilding a football team because of the chance they might have to play the americans.

This is one of the stupidest posts I have ever read on here.

[TitoFan]

I bleed stars and stripes but ya know, I think it's a great thing. Frankly long overdue. Boxing is a true international sport and for the longest time we have seemed to live in a cacoon with little exposure to fighters overseas. You used to literally have to hunt fighters from Asia down, all the while American fans missed some quality gems. Higher visability, easier viewing possibility mean more oppurtunities and wider fan base. I think we- Networks are wayyyy to stuck on fast tracking guys and polishing as unfinished product for the flavor of the month, manufacturing stars rather than letting them rise. I've always thought a early lose is where the real learning and defining begins. It strips a guy to the bones of development. Oh and we still have K-9 Bundrage man, not all is lost

Wise, "big-picture-view" post.