Haye Ranked 4th at Heavy WTF!!

[Kel]

He is ranked 4th. I understand 10th. But let me ask this (and I don't know the answer): was Evander Holyfield ranked in the top ten when he moved up to heavyweight as a unified cruiserweight champion?

I don't know where he was ranked bud, it was a much stronger division back then though.

Was it?

How strong was the cruiserweight division when Haye was unified champ?

Again, I understand Haye ranked around 10th. But 4th means he is ranked above established heavyweights like Peters, Ibragimov, Valuev, and Povetkin?

The Heavy and the Cruiser were stronger divisions back then. The Cruiser division is/was 'ok' when Haye unified.

[Fenster]

It's just an indication of how crap the division is.

If it was overflowing with talent Haye wouldn't get a mention yet. But clearly that's not the case.

Plus Valuev is ranked five - the guy that lost to 67-year-old Evander Holyfield in the most boring fight in history. Says it all.

[Kev]

Thats a really good point!

Thanks bud. I understand alot of the hate towards Haye. He's a cocky guy who thinks alot about his image and has engineered his shot well. But the guy doesn't duck anyone. 4th might be a lil steep in the rankings, but he's inside the top 10 no doubt for me.

Has nothing to do with that....Basically it says F*** YOU to the guys who fight through the ranks to earn their spot

Imagine if you are the 5th ranked guy in the division and have been at it fighting everyone willing to fight and have been improving each time out training hard and paying your dues...all of a sudden you are under a guy who just stopped in from somewhere else

Sorry but remind me who this guy in the heavyweight division again?

First off the rankings referred to here are Boxing Monthly's a UK magazine and therefore utterly meaningless in the scheme of things so no top 5 contender is going to feel disgruntles. Secondly, if you are referring to the real alphabet rankings, since when whey they based on merit? It's which promoter is paying them which fees for them to rank you, simple as.

Aside from that I agree with bzkfn, Haye was the unified cruiserweight champ. If it was any other division and the two time unified champ moved it would be seen as a bizarre omission not to have him in the rankings once he had fought and won at a higher weight class.

Barrett fought a world title only a little over a year ago and was rated in the top 10 by one organisation when Haye fought so Haye knocking him out in style along with his cruiserweight credentials means he is deserving of a top ten ranking.

Maybe not top 4 but come on I hate the guy but I'd have a job convincing myself that the likes of Ibragimov, Valuev and Maskaev could beat him. You'd have to fancy Haye to beat all those guys with ease really.

[ICB]

He is ranked 4th. I understand 10th. But let me ask this (and I don't know the answer): was Evander Holyfield ranked in the top ten when he moved up to heavyweight as a unified cruiserweight champion?

I don't know where he was ranked bud, it was a much stronger division back then though.

Was it?

How strong was the cruiserweight division when Haye was unified champ?

Again, I understand Haye ranked around 10th. But 4th means he is ranked above established heavyweights like Peters, Ibragimov, Valuev, and Povetkin?

In 1989 before Evander Holyfield become Heavyweight champion, he was rated number 2 at Heavyweight just behind Mike Tyson. And he moved up to Heavyweight at the end of 1988. Hell i just checked and in 1988 with only two fights at Heavyweight in 1988 he was actually the number 1 contender.

[Fenster]

I remember - albeit vaguely, considering i was about 12 - Holyfield chasing Tyson being the reason he moved up to heavyweight.

Holyfield's critics were saying he had no chance because he was a pumped up lightheavy.

Guess things don't really change that much.

[Kel]

I don't know where he was ranked bud, it was a much stronger division back then though.

Was it?

How strong was the cruiserweight division when Haye was unified champ?

Again, I understand Haye ranked around 10th. But 4th means he is ranked above established heavyweights like Peters, Ibragimov, Valuev, and Povetkin?

In 1989 before Evander Holyfield become Heavyweight champion, he was rated number 2 at Heavyweight just behind Mike Tyson. And he moved up to Heavyweight at the end of 1988. Hell i just checked and in 1988 with only two fights at Heavyweight in 1988 he was actually the number 1 contender.

Good researching ICE thats fucking surprising

[Spicoli]

A unified champ moving up would be considered top ten in every other division. Take into account that the Heavyweight division is so woeful and I think he deserves that ranking. I think people look at the rating of a Heavyweight fighter as if it was 20 years ago.

Thats a really good point!

He is ranked 4th. I understand 10th. But let me ask this (and I don't know the answer): was Evander Holyfield ranked in the top ten when he moved up to heavyweight as a unified cruiserweight champion?

Holyfield Debuted at Heavy vs. Tillis while still reigning as undisputed Cruiser Champion.He vacated World titles in November of 88'

The next month,december 88' he went in against # 4 I.B.F Ranked Pinklon Thomas.Holyfield was ranked #1 by Ring Magazine,not totally sure about world ranking but presumed he took Thomas's spot.In fairness.....Pinklons #4 rank was crap,he had not fought in a year and a half...and that was off a KO loss to Tyson.

Next up in March of 89' he beat Dokes by TKO for the W.B.C continental Americas title...followed by an spectacular howitzer right hand KO of Ranked Adilson Rodriquez for 2nd defense.By the end of the year,he was ranked #1 contender by all three major bodies WBC,IBF,& WBA with Tyson designated as Reigning Champion.

Damn you Buster Douglas

[DaxxKahn]

Thanks bud. I understand alot of the hate towards Haye. He's a cocky guy who thinks alot about his image and has engineered his shot well. But the guy doesn't duck anyone. 4th might be a lil steep in the rankings, but he's inside the top 10 no doubt for me.

Has nothing to do with that....Basically it says F*** YOU to the guys who fight through the ranks to earn their spot

Imagine if you are the 5th ranked guy in the division and have been at it fighting everyone willing to fight and have been improving each time out training hard and paying your dues...all of a sudden you are under a guy who just stopped in from somewhere else

Sorry but remind me who this guy in the heavyweight division again?

First off the rankings referred to here are Boxing Monthly's a UK magazine and therefore utterly meaningless in the scheme of things so no top 5 contender is going to feel disgruntles. Secondly, if you are referring to the real alphabet rankings, since when whey they based on merit? It's which promoter is paying them which fees for them to rank you, simple as.

Aside from that I agree with bzkfn, Haye was the unified cruiserweight champ. If it was any other division and the two time unified champ moved it would be seen as a bizarre omission not to have him in the rankings once he had fought and won at a higher weight class.

Barrett fought a world title only a little over a year ago and was rated in the top 10 by one organisation when Haye fought so Haye knocking him out in style along with his cruiserweight credentials means he is deserving of a top ten ranking.

Maybe not top 4 but come on I hate the guy but I'd have a job convincing myself that the likes of Ibragimov, Valuev and Maskaev could beat him. You'd have to fancy Haye to beat all those guys with ease really.

First off if you had just a bit of thought behind it you would realize the comment was a scenario in general and it matters none on the division, weight class or the fact Haye was the CW champion, fact is he WAS the CRUISERWEIGHT champion

But IF we want to just use the HW rankings we will..

I am sure that if you were lets say Sam Peter who is one fight removed from being a world champion you would be wondering how the hell did this guy get ranked higher then me since he just started a legit campaign at HW 1 fight ago...OR Ibragimov who is also only 1 fight from being a title holder and the last fight was to Wlad...

How about Alexander Dimitrenko who is undefeated or Povetkin who is also undefeated..Maybe you are Valuev who is a belt holder wondering the same thing....

Regardless of your personal opp these guys have put their time in and these guys have fought other top ranked fighters to earn their spot so how is or should I say Haye more worthy of being ranked above them...Ragardless of your personal opp as a fan but in a legit manner..

And Thanks for your attempt on educating me on where Boxing Monthly is..

And as for whether or not Valuev, Ibragimov or Maskaev could or could not beat Haye means zip....Because until he either beats one of them or a fighter of higher caliber in the division it means nothing...

Monte Barrett is a joke of a fighter at this point...

He went on a 3 in a row losing streak..2 by KO...His wins before Haye were a rematch over Causer that he had been ko'd by the fight before and Tye Fields....How does beating that guy merit ranking over a current champion and 2 former title holders 1 fight removed from being champion

[AdamGB]

I think he gets a lot of credit being the unified cruiserweight champ, but its to make him look like a more viable opponent on paper for Klitschko... I am surprised that Don King isn't his promoter, King always had a way of fixing those rankings with all his connections.

Key word there is Crusierweight!!!!!...Sure we see how guys from lower divisions get thrsut into title bouts in higer weight classes because of the former title status but to actually rank them

Almost freaking blasphemy

The majority of them usually end up going straight into a title bout.

[USA LOVES THE KLITSCHKOS]

Number 4 my ass!!! Hell I guess Tomasz Adamek could gain 15 pounds,fight and beat Fabio Eduardo Moli and rank number 5 in the hw division after all he(Tomasz Adamek) is ranked #1 in the cw division
maybe even fight Haye for that number 4 spot while all the other deserving heavyweights line up for a chance at the winner,holy shit!!! maybe one of the deserving heavyweights could even fight for a belt one day.

[eagle]

I have no problem with Haye being ranked high, he was the best at cruiser and moved up.
I doubt we'd be having this conversation if say Cotto moved from 147 to 154 and he got ranked 4.
Its up to one of the so called deserving HW's tp beat him and prove that David doesnt deserve the ranking. I think it'll happen soon enough.

[1_COR_16.13]

I see two things wrong. Despite Haye being an awesome crusierweight doesn't give him cause to be ranked 4th imho.
Also Chagaev? He hasn't done crap for ages. Valuev should be higher technically.

Wlad
Vitali

^^^ This is right though

[El Kabong]

It's the same as it ever was...I don't mind where Haye is ranked, I just want Wladimir to get the credit deserved when he clobbers Haye....and he WILL clobber David Haye

[Kev]

Has nothing to do with that....Basically it says F*** YOU to the guys who fight through the ranks to earn their spot

Imagine if you are the 5th ranked guy in the division and have been at it fighting everyone willing to fight and have been improving each time out training hard and paying your dues...all of a sudden you are under a guy who just stopped in from somewhere else

Sorry but remind me who this guy in the heavyweight division again?

First off the rankings referred to here are Boxing Monthly's a UK magazine and therefore utterly meaningless in the scheme of things so no top 5 contender is going to feel disgruntles. Secondly, if you are referring to the real alphabet rankings, since when whey they based on merit? It's which promoter is paying them which fees for them to rank you, simple as.

Aside from that I agree with bzkfn, Haye was the unified cruiserweight champ. If it was any other division and the two time unified champ moved it would be seen as a bizarre omission not to have him in the rankings once he had fought and won at a higher weight class.

Barrett fought a world title only a little over a year ago and was rated in the top 10 by one organisation when Haye fought so Haye knocking him out in style along with his cruiserweight credentials means he is deserving of a top ten ranking.

Maybe not top 4 but come on I hate the guy but I'd have a job convincing myself that the likes of Ibragimov, Valuev and Maskaev could beat him. You'd have to fancy Haye to beat all those guys with ease really.

First off if you had just a bit of thought behind it you would realize the comment was a scenario in general and it matters none on the division, weight class or the fact Haye was the CW champion, fact is he WAS the CRUISERWEIGHT champion

But IF we want to just use the HW rankings we will..

I am sure that if you were lets say Sam Peter who is one fight removed from being a world champion you would be wondering how the hell did this guy get ranked higher then me since he just started a legit campaign at HW 1 fight ago...OR Ibragimov who is also only 1 fight from being a title holder and the last fight was to Wlad...

How about Alexander Dimitrenko who is undefeated or Povetkin who is also undefeated..Maybe you are Valuev who is a belt holder wondering the same thing....

Regardless of your personal opp these guys have put their time in and these guys have fought other top ranked fighters to earn their spot so how is or should I say Haye more worthy of being ranked above them...Ragardless of your personal opp as a fan but in a legit manner..

And Thanks for your attempt on educating me on where Boxing Monthly is..

And as for whether or not Valuev, Ibragimov or Maskaev could or could not beat Haye means zip....Because until he either beats one of them or a fighter of higher caliber in the division it means nothing...

Monte Barrett is a joke of a fighter at this point...

He went on a 3 in a row losing streak..2 by KO...His wins before Haye were a rematch over Causer that he had been ko'd by the fight before and Tye Fields....How does beating that guy merit ranking over a current champion and 2 former title holders 1 fight removed from being champion

Well as I said before it was boxing monthly who ranked him at 4 so it has no significance to the rest of the world so why would Sam Peter care?

But beyond that considering the dismal insipid displays that both Sam Peter and Sultan Ibragimov produced in their last world title 'effort's I'm suprised anybody is trying to justify their inclusion in the top 5


You mention Alexander Dimitrenko but who has he beat exactly? Luan Krisniqui and Timo Hoffman hardly make for an outstanding resume, personally I'd rank a two time unified cruiserweight champ above him in a heartbeat. In fact I'd say David Haye in beating Tomasz Bonin and Monty Barrett has already beaten as good opposition AT HEAVYWEIGHT as Dimitrenko, Barret fought for a world title in 07, Krusniqui did in 2005 but has done nothing since.

The only guys that imo should be rated higher than Haye are the Klitschko's, Valuev (because of the belt only), Chagaev and Povetkin. There is nobody else in the weight class who you could consider as being deserving of a place at all, the rest are mostly crap.

I fucking hate David Haye personally but his resume speaks for itself. Jermain Taylor was rated in the Ring top 10 at supermiddleweight before he even fought there, hell I think he was 0-1 even after he lost to Pavlik there and is still in the top 10.

I have no problems with Haye being ranked in the top 10.

[Kel]

It's the same as it ever was...I don't mind where Haye is ranked, I just want Wladimir to get the credit deserved when he clobbers Haye....and he WILL clobber David Haye

I would love Haye to win, and I've even made a case for him having a chance. Deep down I know there is a 90% chance he gets knocked out.