Top 5 P4P Now?

[Kev]

Pretty good list.

I'll go with

Pacquaio
Mayweather
Martinez
Donaire (I guess)
Bradley

Marquez for me is now a sideshow, great fighter but no longer competing to try and win world titles and unify divisions. He's the past so I won't include him.

I think Andre Ward will prove himself top 4 as well.

The second Diaz fight aside, Marquez' recent level of opposition has been very impressive IMO. I think he's looked old in his last couple of fights and I think his time is getting short, but (to me) it seems like he's still trying to fight the best. He's been trying to land a third Pacquiao fight forever.

I don't really think he's been impressive for a while. Casamayor, Juan Diaz and Katsidis are the kind of fighters up and comers and new champions face not those at the top of the p4p rankings. Pacquaio gets slated for fighting the likes of Margarito, Cotto and Mosley, even though he's been destroying them.

In comparison Casa, Diaz and Katsidis are B- level fighters and Marquez has gone life and death with all of them. He lost every single round to Floyd who imo carried him through to the final bell.

He's an old warhorse at the same stage as Morales was when Manny finished him and Barrera was when he lost to Marquez himself and Manny for the second time.

Not a factor any more imo.

When compared to Manny Pacquiao almost any fighter's level of competition pales, he's one of the greatest fighters of all time, but that doesn't mean that Marquez hasn't been fighting high-level opposition. Katsidis was a legitimate opponent who was coming off a complete destruction of a very good, unbeaten fighter, and while the second Diaz fight was a garbage cash-grab, he was considered an excellent fighter when they first met.

I'm not disputing he's a top world class fighter. I just don't think he's as relavent to boxing any more as Manny, Floyd, Martinez, Donaire, Bradley, Ward etc. Those are the guys who will be fighting to unify belts and fight megafights.

Marquez will probably fight the winner of Morales Maidana and retire.

[ICB]

Pretty good list.

I'll go with

Pacquaio
Mayweather
Martinez
Donaire (I guess)
Bradley

Marquez for me is now a sideshow, great fighter but no longer competing to try and win world titles and unify divisions. He's the past so I won't include him.

I think Andre Ward will prove himself top 4 as well.

The second Diaz fight aside, Marquez' recent level of opposition has been very impressive IMO. I think he's looked old in his last couple of fights and I think his time is getting short, but (to me) it seems like he's still trying to fight the best. He's been trying to land a third Pacquiao fight forever.

I don't really think he's been impressive for a while. Casamayor, Juan Diaz and Katsidis are the kind of fighters up and comers and new champions face not those at the top of the p4p rankings. Pacquaio gets slated for fighting the likes of Margarito, Cotto and Mosley, even though he's been destroying them.

In comparison Casa, Diaz and Katsidis are B- level fighters and Marquez has gone life and death with all of them. He lost every single round to Floyd who imo carried him through to the final bell.

He's an old warhorse at the same stage as Morales was when Manny finished him and Barrera was when he lost to Marquez himself and Manny for the second time.

Not a factor any more imo.

Joel Casamayor was the "Lineal Champion", Juan Diaz at that time was considered a dangerous opponent, so was Michael Katsidis.

I mean who else could he have fought ? unfortunately Edwin Valero passed away, Ali Funeka was a possibility. But he's lost some of his rep after being caught with the banned substance.

There was no one else really, as they had other fights planned or moved up. JMM beat the best available fighters at that time.

He was severly undersized vs Floyd Mayweather Jr, and had no business at Welterweight. But he still tried his best despite all the disadvantages.

If that doesn't show he doesn't want to fight the best, or isn't "competing" anymore, i don't know what is.

JMM takes on all the best fighters he can, he hasn't had a real gimme fight in years. Yes even a rematch vs Juan Diaz isn't a gimme fight.

Im big fan of JMM i love his fighting style, and his attitude. And i think he beat Manny Pacquiao twice.

[:::PSL:::]

Most of us here are talking about him being one of top 10 best now. He's starting to receive some respect (even from Bilbo ). That's a good thing.

[CFH]

..... let's not get carried away.

getting carried away is putting donaire at no. 2. imo he deserve to move at least a position up the p4p ranking.

Even I won't argue against a number 4 ranking now. He's fought the two fighters regarded as the best opposition out there at that time and totally smashed them. I don't think anybody else has done that lately. Martinez hasn't, Bradley, Marquez, Lopez, Ward etc.

Only Pacquaio has been toppling top guys as impressively.

How could Martinez recent opposition have been better? He completely outclassed the top fighters in two divisions.

His opposition has been steller but he hasn't destroyed them the way Donaire has. He lost the first fight with Williams, fought to a draw with Kermit Cintron (yes I know it was bullshit).

Meanwhile Donaire has wrecked his opposition, completely sparking them like Martinez did in the Williams rematch.

I think Martinez is 1-1-1 in his last three fights?

Oh he did beat Pavlik too. But again it was a competive fight until down the stretch and it went to the cards. Not a demolition like Donaire did tonight and against Vic.

His second victory over Williams was every bit as impressive as Donaire's victory tonight. Williams wildly considered a top 3-5 p4p fighter at the time and Martinez absolutely wrecked him. He also completely outclassed Pavlik (who I thought would knock him out) who had only lost to Hopkins at that point and was still the undisputed MW champ. Those victories might look somewhat less impressive in retrospect, but at the time they were very good.

And the Cintron fight was one of the most egregious robberies in the last 20 years. He literally beat him twice in the same night.

[CFH]

Pretty good list.

I'll go with

Pacquaio
Mayweather
Martinez
Donaire (I guess)
Bradley

Marquez for me is now a sideshow, great fighter but no longer competing to try and win world titles and unify divisions. He's the past so I won't include him.

I think Andre Ward will prove himself top 4 as well.

The second Diaz fight aside, Marquez' recent level of opposition has been very impressive IMO. I think he's looked old in his last couple of fights and I think his time is getting short, but (to me) it seems like he's still trying to fight the best. He's been trying to land a third Pacquiao fight forever.

I don't really think he's been impressive for a while. Casamayor, Juan Diaz and Katsidis are the kind of fighters up and comers and new champions face not those at the top of the p4p rankings. Pacquaio gets slated for fighting the likes of Margarito, Cotto and Mosley, even though he's been destroying them.

In comparison Casa, Diaz and Katsidis are B- level fighters and Marquez has gone life and death with all of them. He lost every single round to Floyd who imo carried him through to the final bell.

He's an old warhorse at the same stage as Morales was when Manny finished him and Barrera was when he lost to Marquez himself and Manny for the second time.

Not a factor any more imo.

Joel Casamayor was the "Lineal Champion", Juan Diaz at that time was considered a dangerous opponent, so was Michael Katsidis.

I mean who else could he have fought ? unfortunately Edwin Valero passed away, Ali Funeka was a possibility. But he's lost some of his rep after being caught with the banned substance.

There was no one else really, as they had other fights planned or moved up. JMM beat the best available fighters at that time.

He was severly undersized vs Floyd Mayweather Jr, and had no business at Welterweight. But he still tried his best despite all the disadvantages.

If that doesn't show he doesn't want to fight the best, or isn't "competing" anymore, i don't know what is.

JMM takes on all the best fighters he can, he hasn't had a real gimme fight in years. Yes even a rematch vs Juan Diaz isn't a gimme fight.

Im big fan of JMM i love his fighting style, and his attitude. And i think he beat Manny Pacquiao twice.

That's the only thing I disagree with. The second Diaz fight was a total cash-grab and, had Marquez not been on the slide at that point, he should have knocked him out within 8 or 9 rounds.

[Kev]

Pretty good list.

I'll go with

Pacquaio
Mayweather
Martinez
Donaire (I guess)
Bradley

Marquez for me is now a sideshow, great fighter but no longer competing to try and win world titles and unify divisions. He's the past so I won't include him.

I think Andre Ward will prove himself top 4 as well.

The second Diaz fight aside, Marquez' recent level of opposition has been very impressive IMO. I think he's looked old in his last couple of fights and I think his time is getting short, but (to me) it seems like he's still trying to fight the best. He's been trying to land a third Pacquiao fight forever.

I don't really think he's been impressive for a while. Casamayor, Juan Diaz and Katsidis are the kind of fighters up and comers and new champions face not those at the top of the p4p rankings. Pacquaio gets slated for fighting the likes of Margarito, Cotto and Mosley, even though he's been destroying them.

In comparison Casa, Diaz and Katsidis are B- level fighters and Marquez has gone life and death with all of them. He lost every single round to Floyd who imo carried him through to the final bell.

He's an old warhorse at the same stage as Morales was when Manny finished him and Barrera was when he lost to Marquez himself and Manny for the second time.

Not a factor any more imo.

Joel Casamayor was the "Lineal Champion", Juan Diaz at that time was considered a dangerous opponent, so was Michael Katsidis.

I mean who else could he have fought ? unfortunately Edwin Valero passed away, Ali Funeka was a possibility. But he's lost some of his rep after being caught with the banned substance.

There was no one else really, as they had other fights planned or moved up. JMM beat the best available fighters at that time.

He was severly undersized vs Floyd Mayweather Jr, and had no business at Welterweight. But he still tried his best despite all the disadvantages.

If that doesn't show he doesn't want to fight the best, or isn't "competing" anymore, i don't know what is.

JMM takes on all the best fighters he can, he hasn't had a real gimme fight in years. Yes even a rematch vs Juan Diaz isn't a gimme fight.

Im big fan of JMM i love his fighting style, and his attitude. And i think he beat Manny Pacquiao twice.

I'm not criticising his choice of opposition Ice I just don;t think they (or his performances against them) have been as good as those who I rated above him.

Casamayor was completely done. He lost virtually every round to a gatekeeper fighter in Santa Cruz, he was nowhere the top of his game when Marquez fought him.

Juan Diaz, let's be honest he got battered by Nate Cambell and was never the same. Maliggnaggi beat him twice, let's be fair.

Katsidis was knocked out by a faded Casa, and beaten soundly by Diaz, he's not a world class fighter, more like a poor man's Gatti.

There would have been an uproar had Manny or Floyd even fought those guys let alone got dropped by them all as Marquez was.

He's a great fighter, world class no doubt but right now the guys I mentioned are all above him imo.

[Kev]

..... let's not get carried away.

getting carried away is putting donaire at no. 2. imo he deserve to move at least a position up the p4p ranking.

Even I won't argue against a number 4 ranking now. He's fought the two fighters regarded as the best opposition out there at that time and totally smashed them. I don't think anybody else has done that lately. Martinez hasn't, Bradley, Marquez, Lopez, Ward etc.

Only Pacquaio has been toppling top guys as impressively.

How could Martinez recent opposition have been better? He completely outclassed the top fighters in two divisions.

His opposition has been steller but he hasn't destroyed them the way Donaire has. He lost the first fight with Williams, fought to a draw with Kermit Cintron (yes I know it was bullshit).

Meanwhile Donaire has wrecked his opposition, completely sparking them like Martinez did in the Williams rematch.

I think Martinez is 1-1-1 in his last three fights?

Oh he did beat Pavlik too. But again it was a competive fight until down the stretch and it went to the cards. Not a demolition like Donaire did tonight and against Vic.

His second victory over Williams was every bit as impressive as Donaire's victory tonight. Williams wildly considered a top 3-5 p4p fighter at the time and Martinez absolutely wrecked him. He also completely outclassed Pavlik (who I thought would knock him out) who had only lost to Hopkins at that point and was still the undisputed MW champ. Those victories might look somewhat less impressive in retrospect, but at the time they were very good.

And the Cintron fight was one of the most egregious robberies in the last 20 years. He literally beat him twice in the same night.

I don't know what your disagreeing with me on? All I said was, that Pacquaio aside nobody has been smashing their best opposition the way Donaire has.

Martinez lost to Williams, and whether he was robbed of the win or not got taken the distance against Cintron and Pavlik.

All I was saying is that Donaire has smashed his opponents in a way that none of the other guys in the p4p, Manny aside have been doing. Martinez smashed Willaims for sure, but he lost to him a few monthsprevious.

That's all I'm saying.

[CFH]

..... let's not get carried away.

getting carried away is putting donaire at no. 2. imo he deserve to move at least a position up the p4p ranking.

Even I won't argue against a number 4 ranking now. He's fought the two fighters regarded as the best opposition out there at that time and totally smashed them. I don't think anybody else has done that lately. Martinez hasn't, Bradley, Marquez, Lopez, Ward etc.

Only Pacquaio has been toppling top guys as impressively.

How could Martinez recent opposition have been better? He completely outclassed the top fighters in two divisions.

His opposition has been steller but he hasn't destroyed them the way Donaire has. He lost the first fight with Williams, fought to a draw with Kermit Cintron (yes I know it was bullshit).

Meanwhile Donaire has wrecked his opposition, completely sparking them like Martinez did in the Williams rematch.

I think Martinez is 1-1-1 in his last three fights?

Oh he did beat Pavlik too. But again it was a competive fight until down the stretch and it went to the cards. Not a demolition like Donaire did tonight and against Vic.

His second victory over Williams was every bit as impressive as Donaire's victory tonight. Williams wildly considered a top 3-5 p4p fighter at the time and Martinez absolutely wrecked him. He also completely outclassed Pavlik (who I thought would knock him out) who had only lost to Hopkins at that point and was still the undisputed MW champ. Those victories might look somewhat less impressive in retrospect, but at the time they were very good.

And the Cintron fight was one of the most egregious robberies in the last 20 years. He literally beat him twice in the same night.

I don't know what your disagreeing with me on? All I said was, that Pacquaio aside nobody has been smashing their best opposition the way Donaire has.

Martinez lost to Williams, and whether he was robbed of the win or not got taken the distance against Cintron and Pavlik.

All I was saying is that Donaire has smashed his opponents in a way that none of the other guys in the p4p, Manny aside have been doing. Martinez smashed Willaims for sure, but he lost to him a few monthsprevious.

That's all I'm saying.

You said that Donaire had fought the two best opponents available to them and had smashed them. You then said that Martinez had not and that is what I am disagreeing with. He might not have knocked out Pavlik, but he outclassed him, and I would argue that Martinez' victories over Williams and Pavlik were comparable or superior to Donaire's over Montiel and Darchinyan.

[Kev]

..... let's not get carried away.

getting carried away is putting donaire at no. 2. imo he deserve to move at least a position up the p4p ranking.

Even I won't argue against a number 4 ranking now. He's fought the two fighters regarded as the best opposition out there at that time and totally smashed them. I don't think anybody else has done that lately. Martinez hasn't, Bradley, Marquez, Lopez, Ward etc.

Only Pacquaio has been toppling top guys as impressively.

How could Martinez recent opposition have been better? He completely outclassed the top fighters in two divisions.

His opposition has been steller but he hasn't destroyed them the way Donaire has. He lost the first fight with Williams, fought to a draw with Kermit Cintron (yes I know it was bullshit).

Meanwhile Donaire has wrecked his opposition, completely sparking them like Martinez did in the Williams rematch.

I think Martinez is 1-1-1 in his last three fights?

Oh he did beat Pavlik too. But again it was a competive fight until down the stretch and it went to the cards. Not a demolition like Donaire did tonight and against Vic.

His second victory over Williams was every bit as impressive as Donaire's victory tonight. Williams wildly considered a top 3-5 p4p fighter at the time and Martinez absolutely wrecked him. He also completely outclassed Pavlik (who I thought would knock him out) who had only lost to Hopkins at that point and was still the undisputed MW champ. Those victories might look somewhat less impressive in retrospect, but at the time they were very good.

And the Cintron fight was one of the most egregious robberies in the last 20 years. He literally beat him twice in the same night.

I don't know what your disagreeing with me on? All I said was, that Pacquaio aside nobody has been smashing their best opposition the way Donaire has.

Martinez lost to Williams, and whether he was robbed of the win or not got taken the distance against Cintron and Pavlik.

All I was saying is that Donaire has smashed his opponents in a way that none of the other guys in the p4p, Manny aside have been doing. Martinez smashed Willaims for sure, but he lost to him a few monthsprevious.

That's all I'm saying.

You said that Donaire had fought the two best opponents available to them and had smashed them. You then said that Martinez had not and that is what I am disagreeing with. He might not have knocked out Pavlik, but he outclassed him, and I would argue that Martinez' victories over Williams and Pavlik were comparable or superior to Donaire's over Montiel and Darchinyan.

This is what I wrote

He's fought the two fighters regarded as the best opposition out there at that time and totally smashed them. I don't think anybody else has done that lately. Martinez hasn't, Bradley, Marquez, Lopez, Ward etc.

Only Pacquaio has been toppling top guys as impressively.

I don't know how that is debatable. Martinez has gone to points in three of his last four with a loss and a draw amongst them. That's not smashing everybody.

That's all I'm saying. It was just a throwaway comment geez

Since when did you become such a pedant?

I'm not arguing whether Pavlik and Williams were better opp than Montiel and Donaire just that one punch ko'ing both Montiel and Darchinyan is more explosive than going 1-1 wit Williams and winning on points against Pavlik.

Let it go, you're starting to sound like Miles

[gest12645]

I think that Martinez ko'ing Wiliams was still more impressive than Donaire's win tonight. Here's my top 10 p4p

Pac
Pbf
Martinez
Donaire
JMM
Wlad Klitschko
Bradley
Hopkins
Ward
V.Klitschko

give your opinions ladies and gentelmen

[:::PSL:::]

I got a feeling Lucian Bute will be up there too this year.

He's one of my fav fighter.

[ElTerribleMorales]

it was a great punch by Donaire, but i gotta say that the ref was a complete moron, he should have either stopped the fight once Montiel got up, or make sure Donaire was in the neutral corner before allowing it to continue (can't really blame Nonito for pouncing on him, it's not his job it's the refs)

gotta give Montiel credit though the way he just popped up from such a hellish shot (and the Simon Brown replay) was crazy, i honestly wouldn't mind a rematch down the road, cause i honestly think it would play differently

but back the the original topic, i still don't have Donaire in the top 5, i have him barely making the top 10 (probably at around 7 or my top 5 as of right now is

Pacquiao
Mayweather
Martinez
Marquez
Lopez

[KananKrus]

it was a great punch by Donaire, but i gotta say that the ref was a complete moron, he should have either stopped the fight once Montiel got up, or make sure Donaire was in the neutral corner before allowing it to continue (can't really blame Nonito for pouncing on him, it's not his job it's the refs)

gotta give Montiel credit though the way he just popped up from such a hellish shot (and the Simon Brown replay) was crazy, i honestly wouldn't mind a rematch down the road, cause i honestly think it would play differently

but back the the original topic, i still don't have Donaire in the top 5, i have him barely making the top 10 (probably at around 7 or my top 5 as of right now is

Pacquiao
Mayweather
Martinez
Marquez
Lopez

Like anybody will believe you.... nice joke tho'. Anyone who reads how you bash Filipino fighters witrh your posts now know how your hatred turned you into a BIG joke. Did you not see the huge crater-like damage left on the side of Montiel's face where Nonito's counter left hook landed? And here you are talking about a rematch! Nice joke... haha! You have got to buy humble pie to go with the crow for your next meal!

And get rid of your joke sig, not only that it's old, it's irrelevant! LOL!

[ElTerribleMorales]

it was a great punch by Donaire, but i gotta say that the ref was a complete moron, he should have either stopped the fight once Montiel got up, or make sure Donaire was in the neutral corner before allowing it to continue (can't really blame Nonito for pouncing on him, it's not his job it's the refs)

gotta give Montiel credit though the way he just popped up from such a hellish shot (and the Simon Brown replay) was crazy, i honestly wouldn't mind a rematch down the road, cause i honestly think it would play differently

but back the the original topic, i still don't have Donaire in the top 5, i have him barely making the top 10 (probably at around 7 or my top 5 as of right now is

Pacquiao
Mayweather
Martinez
Marquez
Lopez

Like anybody will believe you.... nice joke tho'

believe me about what jackass? i put my take on it, you don't have to like it haha

[:::PSL:::]

You're a man of your word ElTerrible. That's cool.

Your new sig will probably annoy VD more, than you.