Pacman vs JMM 11/5 2011 at.........145

[generalbulldog]

If they both come into the ring at the same weight then I can't complain really, but Marquez having to weigh in so much heavier than at any time beyond Mayweather and being so much older makes me fear the worst.

As a boxing fan, all I want to see is good fights and that basically means a few compromises to give the fans a great fight and in return the fighters take home their massive paychecks.

What I don't like is fighters who have become too powerful picking and choosing their opponents and playing games with weights. And that is what Manny has become. In time it will cloud his greatness.

Marquez can weigh in at 141. My Lord he was a lightweight fighting at feather. At fight time they are a pound or two different. So what?

They should certainly have something in the contract stipulating that on the day neither man be allowed to weigh more than 146 pounds. I just see Marquez putting on that weight as an older man and Manny having already done so as a younger man. Manny is the naturally bigger fighter now. If this wasn't the case then he would have been fighting at LW himself. Manny is a proven WW, whilst Marquez is a proven LW.

Any sensible person can agree that a 140 weigh in would have been fair, what we currently have are the scales turned in Manny's favour. Still, what's done is done.

Do you know what was Margarito's fight night weight? 165 pounds to Manny's 148. Do you know what was JMM's fight night weight against Katsidis? 146 pounds. So Manny on fight night will be 2 pounds heavier more than likely. Don't really see a major weight advantage there.

On fight night JMM is a welterweight fighting at lightweight. He doesn't have to cut that much weight anymore when he fights at ww, just like Manny. JMM got his ass whooped by Floyd who has never weighed more than 150 pounds upon rehydration was not because of size but because of skill.

So are you going to tell me that Manny will have such a massive weight advantage with 2 pounds? Manny has never weighed more than 148 upon rehydration in his fights.

[IamInuit]

If they both come into the ring at the same weight then I can't complain really, but Marquez having to weigh in so much heavier than at any time beyond Mayweather and being so much older makes me fear the worst.

As a boxing fan, all I want to see is good fights and that basically means a few compromises to give the fans a great fight and in return the fighters take home their massive paychecks.

What I don't like is fighters who have become too powerful picking and choosing their opponents and playing games with weights. And that is what Manny has become. In time it will cloud his greatness.

Marquez can weigh in at 141. My Lord he was a lightweight fighting at feather. At fight time they are a pound or two different. So what?

They should certainly have something in the contract stipulating that on the day neither man be allowed to weigh more than 146 pounds. I just see Marquez putting on that weight as an older man and Manny having already done so as a younger man. Manny is the naturally bigger fighter now. If this wasn't the case then he would have been fighting at LW himself. Manny is a proven WW, whilst Marquez is a proven LW.

Any sensible person can agree that a 140 weigh in would have been fair, what we currently have are the scales turned in Manny's favour. Still, what's done is done.

Manny is not the bigger fighter. He has chosen to fight at a bigger weight. Marquez weighed 148 I think against Katsidis. The weight difference thing to be honest is taxing on the frontal lobe. Their is no weight difference.

[mafiajoey]

Manny has to eat 10,000 calories and eat like a whale in order to hit these marks of 145lbs. It's just an excuse to make JMM fight at a disadvantage. Manny could just eat like a normal human and fight at a weight he wouldn't have to gorge at.

Valid point.

but the problem is. Pacquiao as general knowledge plans on staying at Welterweight and has been 144-145 range at the scales. If he drops for a single fight say at 140 then the routine will be disrupted.

Yeah its a little sacrifice if we intend to satisfy some forum posters who would love to see him lose. but the reality is he could really be affected not just in the one fight that he will take at 140 BUT after this fight when he needs to be 145 again. see the point?


and the heck he needs to do all this against someone who has been chasing him for but not limited to a payday to add that he had already beaten this fighter makes it EXTREMELY RIDICULOUS




1. Roy looks inhuman at 175 went North and beat a Heavyweight went back and got kayoed silly by men not even worth to be mentioned along him legacy wise.

2. Chrys Byrd Went up went down and looks garbage in an embarrasing KO loss.

3. SRL looks out of it going down from his previous bout againts Terry Norris.


** Both men will be 145 to 148 fight night **

Pac struggles to make 144-145......he eats like 500lb Gorilla.....its hard for him to make that weight. Pac struggles to make 144-145 lets remember that. All this "He's a natural welterweight talk 147" is bullshit. He has a story for the weight that best suits him and gives him the advantage. He has the power to require this.



Pacquiao-134 Diaz-135 (weigh in) Pacquiao-147 Diaz-148 (fight night) 06-2008

Pacquiao-142 Delahoya-145 (weigh in) Pacquiao-148 Delahoya-147 (fight night) 12-2008

Pacquiao-138 Hatton-140 (weigh in) Pacquiao-148 Hatton-152 (fight night) 05-2009

Pacquiao-144 Cotto-145 (weigh in) Fight night weight..? 11-2009

Pacquiao-145 Clottey-147 (weigh in) Fight night...? 03-2010

Pacquiao-144.5 Marg-150


Not buying his routine will be affected. Look at the jump from Delahoya then Hatton then Cotto. Pac makes 140-142 easily. Or he cuts back on his calories. He did it for Hatton.

[IamInuit]

Manny has to eat 10,000 calories and eat like a whale in order to hit these marks of 145lbs. It's just an excuse to make JMM fight at a disadvantage. Manny could just eat like a normal human and fight at a weight he wouldn't have to gorge at.

Valid point.

but the problem is. Pacquiao as general knowledge plans on staying at Welterweight and has been 144-145 range at the scales. If he drops for a single fight say at 140 then the routine will be disrupted.

Yeah its a little sacrifice if we intend to satisfy some forum posters who would love to see him lose. but the reality is he could really be affected not just in the one fight that he will take at 140 BUT after this fight when he needs to be 145 again. see the point?


and the heck he needs to do all this against someone who has been chasing him for but not limited to a payday to add that he had already beaten this fighter makes it EXTREMELY RIDICULOUS




1. Roy looks inhuman at 175 went North and beat a Heavyweight went back and got kayoed silly by men not even worth to be mentioned along him legacy wise.

2. Chrys Byrd Went up went down and looks garbage in an embarrasing KO loss.

3. SRL looks out of it going down from his previous bout againts Terry Norris.


** Both men will be 145 to 148 fight night **

Pac struggles to make 144-145......he eats like 500lb Gorilla.....its hard for him to make that weight. Pac struggles to make 144-145 lets remember that. All this "He's a natural welterweight talk 147" is bullshit. He has a story for the weight that best suits him and gives him the advantage. He has the power to require this.



Pacquiao-134 Diaz-135 (weigh in) Pacquiao-147 Diaz-148 (fight night) 06-2008

Pacquiao-142 Delahoya-145 (weigh in) Pacquiao-148 Delahoya-147 (fight night) 12-2008

Pacquiao-138 Hatton-140 (weigh in) Pacquiao-148 Hatton-152 (fight night) 05-2009

Pacquiao-144 Cotto-145 (weigh in) Fight night weight..? 11-2009

Pacquiao-145 Clottey-147 (weigh in) Fight night...? 03-2010

Pacquiao-144.5 Marg-150


Not buying his routine will be affected. Look at the jump from Delahoya then Hatton then Cotto. Pac makes 140-142 easily. Or he cuts back on his calories. He did it for Hatton.

Excellent post.

[miron_lang]

Not buying his routine will be affected. Look at the jump from Delahoya then Hatton then Cotto. Pac makes 140-142 easily. Or he cuts back on his calories. He did it for Hatton.

You know that for sure?


Can you give an example in the history of this SPORT where the Bigger named Champion being chased in the higher weight moved down for the B-Side opponent?

Even Sugar Ray Leonard moved up to 160 to fight the B-Side opponent in Hagler.


You want Pacquiao to do something that has never been done in this SPORT WTF you guys realize that dont you?

[Gandalf]

If they both come into the ring at the same weight then I can't complain really, but Marquez having to weigh in so much heavier than at any time beyond Mayweather and being so much older makes me fear the worst.

As a boxing fan, all I want to see is good fights and that basically means a few compromises to give the fans a great fight and in return the fighters take home their massive paychecks.

What I don't like is fighters who have become too powerful picking and choosing their opponents and playing games with weights. And that is what Manny has become. In time it will cloud his greatness.

Marquez can weigh in at 141. My Lord he was a lightweight fighting at feather. At fight time they are a pound or two different. So what?

They should certainly have something in the contract stipulating that on the day neither man be allowed to weigh more than 146 pounds. I just see Marquez putting on that weight as an older man and Manny having already done so as a younger man. Manny is the naturally bigger fighter now. If this wasn't the case then he would have been fighting at LW himself. Manny is a proven WW, whilst Marquez is a proven LW.

Any sensible person can agree that a 140 weigh in would have been fair, what we currently have are the scales turned in Manny's favour. Still, what's done is done.

Manny is not the bigger fighter. He has chosen to fight at a bigger weight. Marquez weighed 148 I think against Katsidis. The weight difference thing to be honest is taxing on the frontal lobe. Their is no weight difference.

He is though, it might be artificial size as he is basically eating a small child for every meal, but by doing that he is the bigger man. Pac will come in extremely muscular, if Marquez comes in at 148 that is because of liquids gained. If Marquez weighs in at 144, then that means he will have bulked up and will be slower. We have seen it before. Manny has the proven track record, Marquez doesn't.

I maintain my argument, the only way to even it out was for it to be at 140. What we now have is Manny taking all the advantages. It is shameful really.

[miron_lang]

Valid point.

but the problem is. Pacquiao as general knowledge plans on staying at Welterweight and has been 144-145 range at the scales. If he drops for a single fight say at 140 then the routine will be disrupted.

Yeah its a little sacrifice if we intend to satisfy some forum posters who would love to see him lose. but the reality is he could really be affected not just in the one fight that he will take at 140 BUT after this fight when he needs to be 145 again. see the point?


and the heck he needs to do all this against someone who has been chasing him for but not limited to a payday to add that he had already beaten this fighter makes it EXTREMELY RIDICULOUS




1. Roy looks inhuman at 175 went North and beat a Heavyweight went back and got kayoed silly by men not even worth to be mentioned along him legacy wise.

2. Chrys Byrd Went up went down and looks garbage in an embarrasing KO loss.

3. SRL looks out of it going down from his previous bout againts Terry Norris.


** Both men will be 145 to 148 fight night **

Excellent post.

Thanks!

[IamInuit]

If they both come into the ring at the same weight then I can't complain really, but Marquez having to weigh in so much heavier than at any time beyond Mayweather and being so much older makes me fear the worst.

As a boxing fan, all I want to see is good fights and that basically means a few compromises to give the fans a great fight and in return the fighters take home their massive paychecks.

What I don't like is fighters who have become too powerful picking and choosing their opponents and playing games with weights. And that is what Manny has become. In time it will cloud his greatness.

Marquez can weigh in at 141. My Lord he was a lightweight fighting at feather. At fight time they are a pound or two different. So what?

They should certainly have something in the contract stipulating that on the day neither man be allowed to weigh more than 146 pounds. I just see Marquez putting on that weight as an older man and Manny having already done so as a younger man. Manny is the naturally bigger fighter now. If this wasn't the case then he would have been fighting at LW himself. Manny is a proven WW, whilst Marquez is a proven LW.

Any sensible person can agree that a 140 weigh in would have been fair, what we currently have are the scales turned in Manny's favour. Still, what's done is done.

Manny is not the bigger fighter. He has chosen to fight at a bigger weight. Marquez weighed 148 I think against Katsidis. The weight difference thing to be honest is taxing on the frontal lobe. Their is no weight difference.

He is though, it might be artificial size as he is basically eating a small child for every meal, but by doing that he is the bigger man. Pac will come in extremely muscular, if Marquez comes in at 148 that is because of liquids gained. If Marquez weighs in at 144, then that means he will have bulked up and will be slower. We have seen it before. Manny has the proven track record, Marquez doesn't.

I maintain my argument, the only way to even it out was for it to be at 140. What we now have is Manny taking all the advantages. It is shameful really.

He is not the bigger man and the facts support it. Marquez walks around at the same weight as Manny and fights a couple of divisions under. Something like Manny did. This Manny is bigger then Marquez is the biggest urban legend today. It all goes to show you that if you say something patently false enough times certain folks will buy it. That does not change the fact that the yarn is bullshit. Maintain it then. Let your opinion cloud the facts of the matter.

[Gandalf]

If they both come into the ring at the same weight then I can't complain really, but Marquez having to weigh in so much heavier than at any time beyond Mayweather and being so much older makes me fear the worst.

As a boxing fan, all I want to see is good fights and that basically means a few compromises to give the fans a great fight and in return the fighters take home their massive paychecks.

What I don't like is fighters who have become too powerful picking and choosing their opponents and playing games with weights. And that is what Manny has become. In time it will cloud his greatness.

Marquez can weigh in at 141. My Lord he was a lightweight fighting at feather. At fight time they are a pound or two different. So what?

They should certainly have something in the contract stipulating that on the day neither man be allowed to weigh more than 146 pounds. I just see Marquez putting on that weight as an older man and Manny having already done so as a younger man. Manny is the naturally bigger fighter now. If this wasn't the case then he would have been fighting at LW himself. Manny is a proven WW, whilst Marquez is a proven LW.

Any sensible person can agree that a 140 weigh in would have been fair, what we currently have are the scales turned in Manny's favour. Still, what's done is done.

Manny is not the bigger fighter. He has chosen to fight at a bigger weight. Marquez weighed 148 I think against Katsidis. The weight difference thing to be honest is taxing on the frontal lobe. Their is no weight difference.

He is though, it might be artificial size as he is basically eating a small child for every meal, but by doing that he is the bigger man. Pac will come in extremely muscular, if Marquez comes in at 148 that is because of liquids gained. If Marquez weighs in at 144, then that means he will have bulked up and will be slower. We have seen it before. Manny has the proven track record, Marquez doesn't.

I maintain my argument, the only way to even it out was for it to be at 140. What we now have is Manny taking all the advantages. It is shameful really.

He is not the bigger man and the facts support it. Marquez walks around at the same weight as Manny and fights a couple of divisions under. Something like Manny did. This Manny is bigger then Marquez is the biggest urban legend today. It all goes to show you that if you say something patently false enough times certain folks will buy it. That does not change the fact that the yarn is bullshit. Maintain it then. Let your opinion cloud the facts of the matter.

I don't know what weight either guy is walking around at and neither do you. We can make assumptions though. Clearly they are closer in weight to one another than they are to Ricky Hatton, but anything more is guesswork.

If one fighter regularly fights at 135 and the other at 147, then one guy is obviously bigger than the other. They are operating on quite distinct levels, they have different playgrounds. One plays on the big slide, the other one plays on the smaller one.

That's why if they are to play together you should find a medium sized slide so neither is too far outside their comfort zone. You don't just say "Oi you, get on this big slide if you want to play with me!".

[miron_lang]

If one fighter regularly fights at 135 and the other at 147, then one guy is obviously bigger than the other.

Not always and WRONG in Pac-JMM case.

Pac fights at 147 because there's more money there and he has the attribute to be successfull despite being smaller.

JMM's attributes magnifies 10 times when fighting someone like Pacquiao but that doesnt mean he'll be as successfull as Pacquiao @147

[generalbulldog]

If they both come into the ring at the same weight then I can't complain really, but Marquez having to weigh in so much heavier than at any time beyond Mayweather and being so much older makes me fear the worst.

As a boxing fan, all I want to see is good fights and that basically means a few compromises to give the fans a great fight and in return the fighters take home their massive paychecks.

What I don't like is fighters who have become too powerful picking and choosing their opponents and playing games with weights. And that is what Manny has become. In time it will cloud his greatness.

Marquez can weigh in at 141. My Lord he was a lightweight fighting at feather. At fight time they are a pound or two different. So what?

They should certainly have something in the contract stipulating that on the day neither man be allowed to weigh more than 146 pounds. I just see Marquez putting on that weight as an older man and Manny having already done so as a younger man. Manny is the naturally bigger fighter now. If this wasn't the case then he would have been fighting at LW himself. Manny is a proven WW, whilst Marquez is a proven LW.

Any sensible person can agree that a 140 weigh in would have been fair, what we currently have are the scales turned in Manny's favour. Still, what's done is done.

Manny is not the bigger fighter. He has chosen to fight at a bigger weight. Marquez weighed 148 I think against Katsidis. The weight difference thing to be honest is taxing on the frontal lobe. Their is no weight difference.

He is though, it might be artificial size as he is basically eating a small child for every meal, but by doing that he is the bigger man. Pac will come in extremely muscular, if Marquez comes in at 148 that is because of liquids gained. If Marquez weighs in at 144, then that means he will have bulked up and will be slower. We have seen it before. Manny has the proven track record, Marquez doesn't.

I maintain my argument, the only way to even it out was for it to be at 140. What we now have is Manny taking all the advantages. It is shameful really.

He is not the bigger man and the facts support it. Marquez walks around at the same weight as Manny and fights a couple of divisions under. Something like Manny did. This Manny is bigger then Marquez is the biggest urban legend today. It all goes to show you that if you say something patently false enough times certain folks will buy it. That does not change the fact that the yarn is bullshit. Maintain it then. Let your opinion cloud the facts of the matter.

I don't know what weight either guy is walking around at and neither do you. We can make assumptions though. Clearly they are closer in weight to one another than they are to Ricky Hatton, but anything more is guesswork.

If one fighter regularly fights at 135 and the other at 147, then one guy is obviously bigger than the other. They are operating on quite distinct levels, they have different playgrounds. One plays on the big slide, the other one plays on the smaller one.

That's why if they are to play together you should find a medium sized slide so neither is too far outside their comfort zone. You don't just say "Oi you, get on this big slide if you want to play with me!".

Actually no, it means that one guy is just more talented than the other in handling bigger guys. FLoyd Mayweather was 147 on fight night against Carlos Baldomir even smaller than what JMM weighed against Katsidis on fightnight, if JMM was indeed 148.

So are you going to tell me that 148 is smaller than 147? BTW, a fighter's fight night weight is his true fighting weight inside that boxing ring, not the scale weight. Hence why you have quite a few people saying that it's much better to go back to same day weigh ins to even out this discrepancy.

[Gandalf]

If they both come into the ring at the same weight then I can't complain really, but Marquez having to weigh in so much heavier than at any time beyond Mayweather and being so much older makes me fear the worst.

As a boxing fan, all I want to see is good fights and that basically means a few compromises to give the fans a great fight and in return the fighters take home their massive paychecks.

What I don't like is fighters who have become too powerful picking and choosing their opponents and playing games with weights. And that is what Manny has become. In time it will cloud his greatness.

Marquez can weigh in at 141. My Lord he was a lightweight fighting at feather. At fight time they are a pound or two different. So what?

They should certainly have something in the contract stipulating that on the day neither man be allowed to weigh more than 146 pounds. I just see Marquez putting on that weight as an older man and Manny having already done so as a younger man. Manny is the naturally bigger fighter now. If this wasn't the case then he would have been fighting at LW himself. Manny is a proven WW, whilst Marquez is a proven LW.

Any sensible person can agree that a 140 weigh in would have been fair, what we currently have are the scales turned in Manny's favour. Still, what's done is done.

Manny is not the bigger fighter. He has chosen to fight at a bigger weight. Marquez weighed 148 I think against Katsidis. The weight difference thing to be honest is taxing on the frontal lobe. Their is no weight difference.

He is though, it might be artificial size as he is basically eating a small child for every meal, but by doing that he is the bigger man. Pac will come in extremely muscular, if Marquez comes in at 148 that is because of liquids gained. If Marquez weighs in at 144, then that means he will have bulked up and will be slower. We have seen it before. Manny has the proven track record, Marquez doesn't.

I maintain my argument, the only way to even it out was for it to be at 140. What we now have is Manny taking all the advantages. It is shameful really.

He is not the bigger man and the facts support it. Marquez walks around at the same weight as Manny and fights a couple of divisions under. Something like Manny did. This Manny is bigger then Marquez is the biggest urban legend today. It all goes to show you that if you say something patently false enough times certain folks will buy it. That does not change the fact that the yarn is bullshit. Maintain it then. Let your opinion cloud the facts of the matter.

I don't know what weight either guy is walking around at and neither do you. We can make assumptions though. Clearly they are closer in weight to one another than they are to Ricky Hatton, but anything more is guesswork.

If one fighter regularly fights at 135 and the other at 147, then one guy is obviously bigger than the other. They are operating on quite distinct levels, they have different playgrounds. One plays on the big slide, the other one plays on the smaller one.

That's why if they are to play together you should find a medium sized slide so neither is too far outside their comfort zone. You don't just say "Oi you, get on this big slide if you want to play with me!".

Actually no, it means that one guy is just more talented than the other in handling bigger guys. FLoyd Mayweather was 147 on fight night against Carlos Baldomir even smaller than what JMM weighed against Katsidis on fightnight, if JMM was indeed 148.

So are you going to tell me that 148 is smaller than 147? BTW, a fighter's fight night weight is his true fighting weight inside that boxing ring, not the scale weight. Hence why you have quite a few people saying that it's much better to go back to same day weigh ins to even out this discrepancy.

Probably true. Manny has a proven record of dealing with bigger men whilst Marquez has no such track record. I agree strongly with your final point too. The only way to really have men of equal size facing each other is the same day weigh in, obviously that is never going to happen though.

[mafiajoey]

Not buying his routine will be affected. Look at the jump from Delahoya then Hatton then Cotto. Pac makes 140-142 easily. Or he cuts back on his calories. He did it for Hatton.

You know that for sure?


Can you give an example in the history of this SPORT where the Bigger named Champion being chased in the higher weight moved down for the B-Side opponent?

Even Sugar Ray Leonard moved up to 160 to fight the B-Side opponent in Hagler.


You want Pacquiao to do something that has never been done in this SPORT WTF you guys realize that dont you?

Yes I know for sure his routine won't be affected or they wouldn't allow him to do it,

Yes I know he can jump up and down from weight with no issue because the below weights and dates prove it.

Pacquiao-134 Diaz-135 (weigh in) Pacquiao-147 Diaz-148 (fight night) 06-2008

Pacquiao-142 Delahoya-145 (weigh in) Pacquiao-148 Delahoya-147 (fight night) 12-2008

Pacquiao-138 Hatton-140 (weigh in) Pacquiao-148 Hatton-152 (fight night) 05-2009

Pacquiao-144 Cotto-145 (weigh in) Fight night weight..? 11-2009

Pacquiao-145 Clottey-147 (weigh in) Fight night...? 03-2010

Pacquiao-144.5 Marg-150



I understand he has the leverage to have his way with demands (God Forbid Floyd Have A Demand LOL)

What I don't understand is why your acting like a Pactard....because you said in your first response it will affect his routine. So I showed you where he has done it before...see above. But just like Pac does himself you have now changed it to something else.........was it his performance being affected (no proved that with the record) or is it who is the bigger champion? Which one is it....? Sound like Pac himself with another excuse on top of an excuse. And if you want to make it about "Name Recognition" Oscar came down to fight Manny and I have a feeling at that time.....Uh..Oscar was the as you put it......"Bigger Named Champion"

EPIC FAIL BACK TO PACLAND........



And for the record before this wishy washy started ranting and changing his story and adding more to my reply here is the deal.......

Manny has to eat like the 3 "Fat Boys" at that "All You Can Eat" Buffet to make it even near the 147. Thats why he fights for a 154 title and weighs in at 144.5. So all I'm saying is either man up Manny and just say your going to flex your power and do as you wish or stop B.Sing with all your different B.S. weight stories.



For your viewing pleasure......







Min 2:13 is classic....R.I.P. to "The Human Beatbox"

[mafiajoey]

Not buying his routine will be affected. Look at the jump from Delahoya then Hatton then Cotto. Pac makes 140-142 easily. Or he cuts back on his calories. He did it for Hatton.

You know that for sure?


Can you give an example in the history of this SPORT where the Bigger named Champion being chased in the higher weight moved down for the B-Side opponent?

Even Sugar Ray Leonard moved up to 160 to fight the B-Side opponent in Hagler.


You want Pacquiao to do something that has never been done in this SPORT WTF you guys realize that dont you?

This was from your mouth....

Quote Originally Posted by miron_lang View Post

By going down it means Pac is going for legacy.

My point is. If Pac agrees to go down it means he's going for Legacy. 140 doesnt make sense it should be 135 for Juan's Title. Why are you arguing about 135? that is Marquez's current weight right? he has zero fight at 140. so what's the problem with Lightweight?

[miron_lang]

This was from your mouth....

Quote Originally Posted by miron_lang View Post

By going down it means Pac is going for legacy.

My point is. If Pac agrees to go down it means he's going for Legacy. 140 doesnt make sense it should be 135 for Juan's Title. Why are you arguing about 135? that is Marquez's current weight right? he has zero fight at 140. so what's the problem with Lightweight?

"By going down" <======

Is he going down by weighing 144-145lbs?


*Let me help you. The post you quoted means going down to 140. but why go down to 140 if you're going down for legacy. go to 135 if you are indeed going for legacy.

No matter how you bombard it with bollocks Lineal titles are the goods. if you worry about kids today reading boxing history in the future.