The Wilder Excuses Begin

[TitoFan]

See below.

Be honest with yourselves. Are you really trying to use Wilder's past fights against powderpuffs to gauge what his following would be for a mega-heavyweight-unification fight involving an American, the likes of which haven't been seen in decades? So because the American public has been slow to warm up to Wilder, they would stay home or tune in to something else if and when they find out Wilder is going to be fighting the great AJ? There's two sides to this coin, and it amazes me how many people are only willing to look at one.

1. Why have the Americans been”slow to warm up” to Wilder? Ans. because he doesn’t compare with what went before him.

Things don't occur in a time vacuum. Prior to AJ and Wilder there was Wlad, the boxing equivalent of a gigantic chloroform blanket over U.S. boxing fandom... for well over a decade. Waking up from this slumber takes more than one or two fights. It doesn't help that Wilder started off his career fighting a multitude of bums. He's since corrected that.


2. AJ isn’t a great, nowhere near it, he’s the best of the current bunch, that’s all. Consequently , that’s why it won’t sell on a Saturday afternoon in the States.

The guy who dethroned Wlad?? (I don't count Fury). In one of the most exciting heavyweight title fights in recent memory?? Now you're selling AJ short. So he's basically God in the UK.... but a nobody in the States? Nah... I don't buy it.

3. If I’m wrong and it is a mega-heavyweight-unification fight involving an American, and it is a $100 million fight, then Wilder’s team will have no trouble stumping up an offer to get AJ over there. And if AJ refuses to take the bait, then they can start to say AJ is ducking Wilder.

One thing I'll agree on with everyone else is that Wilder's team is shitty at self-promotion. I can't say where the fight should be, other than to also agree it would have a much bigger gate in the UK than in the States. They're both undefeated champions, representing countries with a vast tradition of boxing rivalry. All I'm saying is that should be worth something.

[walrus]

See below.

Be honest with yourselves. Are you really trying to use Wilder's past fights against powderpuffs to gauge what his following would be for a mega-heavyweight-unification fight involving an American, the likes of which haven't been seen in decades? So because the American public has been slow to warm up to Wilder, they would stay home or tune in to something else if and when they find out Wilder is going to be fighting the great AJ? There's two sides to this coin, and it amazes me how many people are only willing to look at one.

1. Why have the Americans been”slow to warm up” to Wilder? Ans. because he doesn’t compare with what went before him.

Things don't occur in a time vacuum. Prior to AJ and Wilder there was Wlad, the boxing equivalent of a gigantic chloroform blanket over U.S. boxing fandom... for well over a decade. Waking up from this slumber takes more than one or two fights. It doesn't help that Wilder started off his career fighting a multitude of bums. He's since corrected that.


2. AJ isn’t a great, nowhere near it, he’s the best of the current bunch, that’s all. Consequently , that’s why it won’t sell on a Saturday afternoon in the States.

The guy who dethroned Wlad?? (I don't count Fury). In one of the most exciting heavyweight title fights in recent memory?? Now you're selling AJ short. So he's basically God in the UK.... but a nobody in the States? Nah... I don't buy it.

3. If I’m wrong and it is a mega-heavyweight-unification fight involving an American, and it is a $100 million fight, then Wilder’s team will have no trouble stumping up an offer to get AJ over there. And if AJ refuses to take the bait, then they can start to say AJ is ducking Wilder.

One thing I'll agree on with everyone else is that Wilder's team is shitty at self-promotion. I can't say where the fight should be, other than to also agree it would have a much bigger gate in the UK than in the States. They're both undefeated champions, representing countries with a vast tradition of boxing rivalry. All I'm saying is that should be worth something.

I agree Wilder has piss poor promotion but for 10 years no one gave a shit about the heavyweight division here in America. After a Floyd fight people would talk boxing a bit and they would ask me who the heavyweight champ was. Putting this all on Wilder is a bit much. His " I want to kill someone" comment is probably the most press he ever got here. When you pick up the New York Times or other major paper rarely do they have anything about boxing. There would always be a few articles about Floyd up or Manny around fight time, I've read a couple on GGG and Canelo but boxing is a very niche sport here and the heavyweight division even more so. If u are blaming Wilder for screwing up the division u are giving him way to much credit. He is trying to get out and do interviews etc but this will not be an overnight revival of the heavyweight division.

[TitoFan]

See below.

Be honest with yourselves. Are you really trying to use Wilder's past fights against powderpuffs to gauge what his following would be for a mega-heavyweight-unification fight involving an American, the likes of which haven't been seen in decades? So because the American public has been slow to warm up to Wilder, they would stay home or tune in to something else if and when they find out Wilder is going to be fighting the great AJ? There's two sides to this coin, and it amazes me how many people are only willing to look at one.

1. Why have the Americans been”slow to warm up” to Wilder? Ans. because he doesn’t compare with what went before him.

Things don't occur in a time vacuum. Prior to AJ and Wilder there was Wlad, the boxing equivalent of a gigantic chloroform blanket over U.S. boxing fandom... for well over a decade. Waking up from this slumber takes more than one or two fights. It doesn't help that Wilder started off his career fighting a multitude of bums. He's since corrected that.


2. AJ isn’t a great, nowhere near it, he’s the best of the current bunch, that’s all. Consequently , that’s why it won’t sell on a Saturday afternoon in the States.

The guy who dethroned Wlad?? (I don't count Fury). In one of the most exciting heavyweight title fights in recent memory?? Now you're selling AJ short. So he's basically God in the UK.... but a nobody in the States? Nah... I don't buy it.

3. If I’m wrong and it is a mega-heavyweight-unification fight involving an American, and it is a $100 million fight, then Wilder’s team will have no trouble stumping up an offer to get AJ over there. And if AJ refuses to take the bait, then they can start to say AJ is ducking Wilder.

One thing I'll agree on with everyone else is that Wilder's team is shitty at self-promotion. I can't say where the fight should be, other than to also agree it would have a much bigger gate in the UK than in the States. They're both undefeated champions, representing countries with a vast tradition of boxing rivalry. All I'm saying is that should be worth something.

I agree Wilder has piss poor promotion but for 10 years no one gave a shit about the heavyweight division here in America. After a Floyd fight people would talk boxing a bit and they would ask me who the heavyweight champ was. Putting this all on Wilder is a bit much. His " I want to kill someone" comment is probably the most press he ever got here. When you pick up the New York Times or other major paper rarely do they have anything about boxing. There would always be a few articles about Floyd up or Manny around fight time, I've read a couple on GGG and Canelo but boxing is a very niche sport here and the heavyweight division even more so. If u are blaming Wilder for screwing up the division u are giving him way to much credit. He is trying to get out and do interviews etc but this will not be an overnight revival of the heavyweight division.

I think I said all that, except for the Wilder screwing up the heavyweight division part.

[walrus]

See below.

Be honest with yourselves. Are you really trying to use Wilder's past fights against powderpuffs to gauge what his following would be for a mega-heavyweight-unification fight involving an American, the likes of which haven't been seen in decades? So because the American public has been slow to warm up to Wilder, they would stay home or tune in to something else if and when they find out Wilder is going to be fighting the great AJ? There's two sides to this coin, and it amazes me how many people are only willing to look at one.

1. Why have the Americans been”slow to warm up” to Wilder? Ans. because he doesn’t compare with what went before him.

Things don't occur in a time vacuum. Prior to AJ and Wilder there was Wlad, the boxing equivalent of a gigantic chloroform blanket over U.S. boxing fandom... for well over a decade. Waking up from this slumber takes more than one or two fights. It doesn't help that Wilder started off his career fighting a multitude of bums. He's since corrected that.


2. AJ isn’t a great, nowhere near it, he’s the best of the current bunch, that’s all. Consequently , that’s why it won’t sell on a Saturday afternoon in the States.

The guy who dethroned Wlad?? (I don't count Fury). In one of the most exciting heavyweight title fights in recent memory?? Now you're selling AJ short. So he's basically God in the UK.... but a nobody in the States? Nah... I don't buy it.

3. If I’m wrong and it is a mega-heavyweight-unification fight involving an American, and it is a $100 million fight, then Wilder’s team will have no trouble stumping up an offer to get AJ over there. And if AJ refuses to take the bait, then they can start to say AJ is ducking Wilder.

One thing I'll agree on with everyone else is that Wilder's team is shitty at self-promotion. I can't say where the fight should be, other than to also agree it would have a much bigger gate in the UK than in the States. They're both undefeated champions, representing countries with a vast tradition of boxing rivalry. All I'm saying is that should be worth something.

I agree Wilder has piss poor promotion but for 10 years no one gave a shit about the heavyweight division here in America. After a Floyd fight people would talk boxing a bit and they would ask me who the heavyweight champ was. Putting this all on Wilder is a bit much. His " I want to kill someone" comment is probably the most press he ever got here. When you pick up the New York Times or other major paper rarely do they have anything about boxing. There would always be a few articles about Floyd up or Manny around fight time, I've read a couple on GGG and Canelo but boxing is a very niche sport here and the heavyweight division even more so. If u are blaming Wilder for screwing up the division u are giving him way to much credit. He is trying to get out and do interviews etc but this will not be an overnight revival of the heavyweight division.

I think I said all that, except for the Wilder screwing up the heavyweight division part.

Yes but I said it better and more concise @TitoFan

[TitoFan]

See below.

Be honest with yourselves. Are you really trying to use Wilder's past fights against powderpuffs to gauge what his following would be for a mega-heavyweight-unification fight involving an American, the likes of which haven't been seen in decades? So because the American public has been slow to warm up to Wilder, they would stay home or tune in to something else if and when they find out Wilder is going to be fighting the great AJ? There's two sides to this coin, and it amazes me how many people are only willing to look at one.

1. Why have the Americans been”slow to warm up” to Wilder? Ans. because he doesn’t compare with what went before him.

Things don't occur in a time vacuum. Prior to AJ and Wilder there was Wlad, the boxing equivalent of a gigantic chloroform blanket over U.S. boxing fandom... for well over a decade. Waking up from this slumber takes more than one or two fights. It doesn't help that Wilder started off his career fighting a multitude of bums. He's since corrected that.


2. AJ isn’t a great, nowhere near it, he’s the best of the current bunch, that’s all. Consequently , that’s why it won’t sell on a Saturday afternoon in the States.

The guy who dethroned Wlad?? (I don't count Fury). In one of the most exciting heavyweight title fights in recent memory?? Now you're selling AJ short. So he's basically God in the UK.... but a nobody in the States? Nah... I don't buy it.

3. If I’m wrong and it is a mega-heavyweight-unification fight involving an American, and it is a $100 million fight, then Wilder’s team will have no trouble stumping up an offer to get AJ over there. And if AJ refuses to take the bait, then they can start to say AJ is ducking Wilder.

One thing I'll agree on with everyone else is that Wilder's team is shitty at self-promotion. I can't say where the fight should be, other than to also agree it would have a much bigger gate in the UK than in the States. They're both undefeated champions, representing countries with a vast tradition of boxing rivalry. All I'm saying is that should be worth something.

I agree Wilder has piss poor promotion but for 10 years no one gave a shit about the heavyweight division here in America. After a Floyd fight people would talk boxing a bit and they would ask me who the heavyweight champ was. Putting this all on Wilder is a bit much. His " I want to kill someone" comment is probably the most press he ever got here. When you pick up the New York Times or other major paper rarely do they have anything about boxing. There would always be a few articles about Floyd up or Manny around fight time, I've read a couple on GGG and Canelo but boxing is a very niche sport here and the heavyweight division even more so. If u are blaming Wilder for screwing up the division u are giving him way to much credit. He is trying to get out and do interviews etc but this will not be an overnight revival of the heavyweight division.

I think I said all that, except for the Wilder screwing up the heavyweight division part.

Yes but I said it better and more concise @TitoFan

That's why I keep you around @walrus

[Primo Carnera]

Quotes are getting way too long , but it’s no good saying “it doesn’t matter where it is” it does! If Team Wilder think the fight is worth $100 Million,( and it may well be) GREAT! Back your Man and give him what he wants.
It’s not about semantics, it’s not about hype, it’s not about who’s ducking who , put up or shut up!

[TitoFan]

My main point, which we veered from, is that if Hearn is serious about making a bonafide offer to Wilder, he shouldn't be a dick and offer a flat dollar figure when in fights like this it makes more sense to talk percentages. If it's a $50 million fight.... great. If it's $100 million... even better. Precisely BECAUSE no one knows for sure is the reason why a flat figure at this point is ridiculous and equivalent to not making a serious offer at all. That Team Wilder is shitty at negotiations is besides the point. Shame on them. But let them argue over whether it should be 60/40 or 70/30.

[mrbig1]

The Wilder vs AJ fight would by far be the biggest HW fight since Lewis vs Tyson. Nobody would pay to see Wilder beat on a fat old HW. Believe me if it is promoted right. We would see fat money coming from the U.S. and Europe.

[Primo Carnera]

My main point, which we veered from, is that if Hearn is serious about making a bonafide offer to Wilder, he shouldn't be a dick and offer a flat dollar figure when in fights like this it makes more sense to talk percentages. If it's a $50 million fight.... great. If it's $100 million... even better. Precisely BECAUSE no one knows for sure is the reason why a flat figure at this point is ridiculous and equivalent to not making a serious offer at all. That Team Wilder is shitty at negotiations is besides the point. Shame on them. But let them argue over whether it should be 60/40 or 70/30.

You keep saying about Hearn and what he offered. Why don’t Team Wilder make Hearn/Joshua an offer if they’re not happy with what was offered?
Nobody is answering this , why?

[TitoFan]

My main point, which we veered from, is that if Hearn is serious about making a bonafide offer to Wilder, he shouldn't be a dick and offer a flat dollar figure when in fights like this it makes more sense to talk percentages. If it's a $50 million fight.... great. If it's $100 million... even better. Precisely BECAUSE no one knows for sure is the reason why a flat figure at this point is ridiculous and equivalent to not making a serious offer at all. That Team Wilder is shitty at negotiations is besides the point. Shame on them. But let them argue over whether it should be 60/40 or 70/30.

You keep saying about Hearn and what he offered. Why don’t Team Wilder make Hearn/Joshua an offer if they’re not happy with what was offered?
Nobody is answering this , why?

I'll ask them the next time I see them.

[TitoFan]

My main point, which we veered from, is that if Hearn is serious about making a bonafide offer to Wilder, he shouldn't be a dick and offer a flat dollar figure when in fights like this it makes more sense to talk percentages. If it's a $50 million fight.... great. If it's $100 million... even better. Precisely BECAUSE no one knows for sure is the reason why a flat figure at this point is ridiculous and equivalent to not making a serious offer at all. That Team Wilder is shitty at negotiations is besides the point. Shame on them. But let them argue over whether it should be 60/40 or 70/30.

You keep saying about Hearn and what he offered. Why don’t Team Wilder make Hearn/Joshua an offer if they’re not happy with what was offered?
Nobody is answering this , why?

I'll ask them the next time I see them.

Just got off the phone with them, expressed your concerns.... and they said they'll be making a counter offer within the next 48 hours.


http://www.skysports.com/boxing/news...-next-48-hours

[Primo Carnera]

My main point, which we veered from, is that if Hearn is serious about making a bonafide offer to Wilder, he shouldn't be a dick and offer a flat dollar figure when in fights like this it makes more sense to talk percentages. If it's a $50 million fight.... great. If it's $100 million... even better. Precisely BECAUSE no one knows for sure is the reason why a flat figure at this point is ridiculous and equivalent to not making a serious offer at all. That Team Wilder is shitty at negotiations is besides the point. Shame on them. But let them argue over whether it should be 60/40 or 70/30.

You keep saying about Hearn and what he offered. Why don’t Team Wilder make Hearn/Joshua an offer if they’re not happy with what was offered?
Nobody is answering this , why?

I'll ask them the next time I see them.

Just got off the phone with them, expressed your concerns.... and they said they'll be making a counter offer within the next 48 hours.


http://www.skysports.com/boxing/news...-next-48-hours

Yep, and this was over 48 hours ago, and this is what I said.

Quote Originally Posted by Primo Carnera View Post
So Shelly is reported as saying “Team Wilder are gonna make a counter offer in the next couple of days!”
I cannot fucking wait! Only it won’t be an offer, will it?
What it’ll be is “GIVE US X AMOUNT” or WE’LL TAKE X %”
That is not an offer, that is saying “you give us”.
An offer is “We’ll give you” .
Be prepared for a lot more shit talk from all parties.

And this is what you said.

“Seriously? We're going to get into semantics now? They should be haggling over the splits, regardless of who gives what to whom.”

And guess what the “offer” was? It was EXACTLY how I said. #We’ll take 40%” that is not an offer! That is a beg/request for more money. They NEVER MADE AN “OFFER!”
Making this like Groundhog Day will not make it go away. If you haven’t got an answer, no problem, but don’t try to fudge over it with your “phone a friend” routine.
Ps. As you can see, I’m fucking useless at cut and pasting previous posts!

[TitoFan]

My main point, which we veered from, is that if Hearn is serious about making a bonafide offer to Wilder, he shouldn't be a dick and offer a flat dollar figure when in fights like this it makes more sense to talk percentages. If it's a $50 million fight.... great. If it's $100 million... even better. Precisely BECAUSE no one knows for sure is the reason why a flat figure at this point is ridiculous and equivalent to not making a serious offer at all. That Team Wilder is shitty at negotiations is besides the point. Shame on them. But let them argue over whether it should be 60/40 or 70/30.

You keep saying about Hearn and what he offered. Why don’t Team Wilder make Hearn/Joshua an offer if they’re not happy with what was offered?
Nobody is answering this , why?

I'll ask them the next time I see them.

Just got off the phone with them, expressed your concerns.... and they said they'll be making a counter offer within the next 48 hours.


http://www.skysports.com/boxing/news...-next-48-hours

Yep, and this was over 48 hours ago, and this is what I said.

Quote Originally Posted by Primo Carnera View Post
So Shelly is reported as saying “Team Wilder are gonna make a counter offer in the next couple of days!”
I cannot fucking wait! Only it won’t be an offer, will it?
What it’ll be is “GIVE US X AMOUNT” or WE’LL TAKE X %”
That is not an offer, that is saying “you give us”.
An offer is “We’ll give you” .
Be prepared for a lot more shit talk from all parties.

And this is what you said.

“Seriously? We're going to get into semantics now? They should be haggling over the splits, regardless of who gives what to whom.”

And guess what the “offer” was? It was EXACTLY how I said. #We’ll take 40%” that is not an offer! That is a beg/request for more money. They NEVER MADE AN “OFFER!”
Making this like Groundhog Day will not make it go away. If you haven’t got an answer, no problem, but don’t try to fudge over it with your “phone a friend” routine.
Ps. As you can see, I’m fucking useless at cut and pasting previous posts!

Yes you are.

My bad. You had already seen that. Oh well.... it's really not a big deal, is it. They'll get there eventually, if they really want to fight. Good thing is.... we can wait one or two fights. Only danger there is one of them getting knocked out, and that would obviously bring down the value of a fight between them. Maybe a risk worth taking, I don't know.

I'll stick to my previous point, though. Offering $12.5 million on a fight that could foreseeably be worth $100 million is not much of an offer. If Hearn is playing the negotiating game, that's fine. Just don't go dragging the fight into Pac-Floyd territory, 'cause that will just piss everybody off.

[brocktonblockbust]

My only question is when was the last time anyone ever saw anybody use the adverb foreseeably?

[Fenster]

$12.5m represents 33% of the standard projected pot based on previous AJ events.

Has team Wilder still not come up with that $100 million then? Funny that....