When Pacquiao beats Cotto

[Taeth]

Are half of you finally going to accept how good he is? People were saying that if he beat Hatton they would respect his p4p standing, even willingly place him in the top 20 p4p AT, but now people are making excuses for every single win he has had. So my question is...

When Pacquiao beats Cotto, and if he beats him very one sidedly, will you guys finally give him the credit he deserves? Or will you hide behind the weight, and the fact that Cotto was washed up, even though he clearly isn't?

I am just saying I have a strong feeling this could be a lopsided win for Manny, and it seems like the more impressively he wins the bigger the excuses get. I am not saying he is far and away better than Cotto, IMO maybe only Mayweather can say that, but that Pacquiao's style is terrible for Cotto's skill set.

[Gandalf]

My only issue is the weight. Why go ahead with 145 when 147 is so close and no question marks could be added if it were so?

If Manny dominates Cotto I will be surprised, but if he gets the win I will give him a lot of credit but not quite all the credit because he is taking Cotto down an entire 1000 grammes (or something like that) below what the fight should have been made at.

I'm sure Manny doesn't care less about credibility when he is earning all this money and taking away elements of risk in the process. He is a sensible business man.

[mnmc10]

My only issue is the weight. Why go ahead with 145 when 147 is so close and no question marks could be added if it were so?

cause if they fight at 147 then the advantage goes to cotto he being the bigger man. if they fight at 143 then advantage goes to pac being the smaller man.

if they fight at 145 then both of them has no advantage.

its just so hard for people to understand it. look if they fought at 147 then pac loses well thats because he is fighting a giant. if they fought at 143 and cotto loses then cotto is weightdrained. so to eliminate excuses why not fight at 145? so there would be no excuses. still hard to understand?

[OumaFan]

Hatton got beat because he was Ricky Hatton, I still have yet to see what he did that was so out of character in the Manny fight. He spent his career lunging in with the left hook. Manny is an all time great and Hatton was a good champion who couldn't hang, no shame in that, he only got beat by the best. And Luis Collazo Nah I actually scored that for Ricky.

[amat]

Life would be so much easier if I was just a fair weather boxing fan who watched boxing a dozen times a year, would make my life easier.

I like Pacquiao but people get so damned carried away. The win over Hatton was awesome and what he was supposed to do. He kept the fight in the center of the ring and he picked Ricky off as Ricky lunged in. Pac stepped up to the challenge and Ricky Hatton didn't. He may have trained well and been in top shape but tactically he was the same fighter. Following Roach's plan, I'm sure it came easy to Pacquiao especially with his sharp punching.

Against De La Hoya he had a flatfooted fighter who couldn't cope with Pac's speed and accuracy. Hatton or De La Hoya, neither were Cotto. No question this is his hardest fight yet. It just sucks that Cotto's biggest flaws are some of Pacquiao's biggest advantages but Cotto is fully capable of pulling this off. It is no certainty, Taeth you of all people should know it is foolish to assume ANYTHING in boxing.

[Taeth]

A flat-footed Oscar De La Hoya is faster than Cotto on his toes, he doesn't move quickly.

+ if you are talking about me, I watch more fights than 90% of hte people on here. Just because I spent more time watching the top end guys, or the guys who are up and coming wiht potential, doesn't mean I don't watch as much as you guys who watch c or d level guys a lot.

I read shit like JT is spouting that Pacquiao has never been tested above 135, then I guess Oscar's fights against Steve Forbes, Mayorga, and Mayweather count for nothing. It had absolutely nothing to do with how good Pacquiao that he won the way he did against Oscar. Or how he beat Ricky Hatton. Who is better than Ricky Hatton at 140? Nobody.

Who is better than Cotto who is still active at welterweight? Nobody.
Yes I think Cotto is better than more athletic guys like MOsley, Berto, and Zab Judah, but none of them are as good as Pacquiao.

People say I always pick the athlete, but I remember of late picking Oscar over Pacquiao, I thought Hatton-Pacquiao was going to be tough, but I was wrong both times, and even Pacquiao-Diaz I thought was going to be a really tough fight for Manny, because I thought he would be an easy target, but I was wrong.

You guys say I am getting carried away with Manny? I am not the one who things Cotto is a superb counter puncher. He's good at it, but its definitely not his bread and butter.

I am not assuming 100% that Manny wins, but I am sure like I was with Hopkins-Pavlik, Mayweather vs anyone(except Maybe Pacquiao), Calzaghe-Jones.

Pacquiao will win, but I already have my answer in regards to people. I already know 90% of you who don't like Manny will have excuses just like you did after he beat ODLH and Hatton. All I have to say is look back 3 years, I used to hate Manny, and there is a reason why I don't anymore, he has changed my mind.

IMO this isn't Manny's hardest fight, Marquez, Morales, and Barrera as complete fighters all brought more to the table than Cotto. I think Cotto is a great fighter, but his lack of durablity IMO takes him off ATG charts. Despite his great heart, he is too easy to hit, and too easy to hurt.

[RP33]

Are half of you finally going to accept how good he is? People were saying that if he beat Hatton they would respect his p4p standing, even willingly place him in the top 20 p4p AT, but now people are making excuses for every single win he has had. So my question is...

When Pacquiao beats Cotto, and if he beats him very one sidedly, will you guys finally give him the credit he deserves? Or will you hide behind the weight, and the fact that Cotto was washed up, even though he clearly isn't?

I am just saying I have a strong feeling this could be a lopsided win for Manny, and it seems like the more impressively he wins the bigger the excuses get. I am not saying he is far and away better than Cotto, IMO maybe only Mayweather can say that, but that Pacquiao's style is terrible for Cotto's skill set.

It's weird how it works.. because if Pac beats him "easily", then the weight excuses will come out.. But if it's a great fight and Pac BARELY edges out an SD or something, after lets say getting knocked down once or twice, then he will get more credit..

Also, because of Cotto's loss to margarito, and close decision to Clottey, it's easy to say he's not the same fight as he was before margarito.. that's just the nature of it.. If he had one more decent win after those two fights, i feel that there could be less excuses.

As far as i'm concerned, I think it's stupid that it's at 145, but a 2lb difference, as opposed to a 4lb difference (if it was going to be at 143) isn't TOO much of a deal. I don't think 2lb will affect Cotto and i believe he will be in top shape.

[Fenster]

Don't be silly, the start of the excuses have already been highlighted in this thread - Cotto was weight drained, he wasn't the same after Margarito, looked shit against Clotty.. and they'll be a dozen more by time he loses.

No-one ever loses fair and square in boxing.

[Gandalf]

Cotto should not have agreed to the catchweight fullstop. Who else was Manny going to fight that could have stimulated some interest at a catchweight and make the same money? Mosley....Berto...Collazo?

Cotto is a bigger draw than those guys and he yet he gives up some of his natural weight advantage. A bit of a cop out. Manny had nowhere else to turn really. He really doesn't want to fight Mosley nor resort to fighting minor players like Berto. And yet we got the cop out result.

If Cotto beats the living Jesus out of him it's all good. Which I think he might do. But otherwise, catchweights really, really suck. Cotto beats a midget then I say fair enough because he drained down to the midgets current size.

[Fenster]

Cotto should not have agreed to the catchweight fullstop. Who else was Manny going to fight that could have stimulated some interest at a catchweight and make the same money? Mosley....Berto...Collazo?

Cotto is a bigger draw than those guys and he yet he gives up some of his natural weight advantage. A bit of a cop out. Manny had nowhere else to turn really. He really doesn't want to fight Mosley nor resort to fighting minor players like Berto. And yet we got the cop out result.

If Cotto beats the living Jesus out of him it's all good. Which I think he might do. But otherwise, catchweights really, really suck. Cotto beats a midget then I say fair enough because he drained down to the midgets current size.

Don't worry Miles,

Cotto's career high payday compensated for the couple of pounds lost in weight

[Gandalf]

Cotto should not have agreed to the catchweight fullstop. Who else was Manny going to fight that could have stimulated some interest at a catchweight and make the same money? Mosley....Berto...Collazo?

Cotto is a bigger draw than those guys and he yet he gives up some of his natural weight advantage. A bit of a cop out. Manny had nowhere else to turn really. He really doesn't want to fight Mosley nor resort to fighting minor players like Berto. And yet we got the cop out result.

If Cotto beats the living Jesus out of him it's all good. Which I think he might do. But otherwise, catchweights really, really suck. Cotto beats a midget then I say fair enough because he drained down to the midgets current size.

Don't worry Miles,

Cotto's career high payday compensated for the couple of pounds lost in weight

Yep, he's a smart businessman too. I don't like these catchweights, that's all. Pac beat Hatton up fair and square and that was cool. I can give credit. Manny beat him up, Hatton was stupid but that's life. But to now try and use catchweights to secure advantages is really crappy and weak. It shows a Manny at the end of his limits trying to take what he can at the least cost. And as a purist, I just hate that.

[Howlin Mad Missy]

Don't be silly, the start of the excuses have already been highlighted in this thread - Cotto was weight drained, he wasn't the same after Margarito, looked shit against Clotty.. and they'll be a dozen more by time he loses.

No-one ever loses fair and square in boxing.

not when the boxer/trainer start dictating the rules/weights.

[Fenster]

Don't be silly, the start of the excuses have already been highlighted in this thread - Cotto was weight drained, he wasn't the same after Margarito, looked shit against Clotty.. and they'll be a dozen more by time he loses.

No-one ever loses fair and square in boxing.

not when the boxer/trainer start dictating the rules/weights.

Well if the other guy is happy enough to agree where's the problem?

[LEGION]

Are half of you finally going to accept how good he is? People were saying that if he beat Hatton they would respect his p4p standing, even willingly place him in the top 20 p4p AT, but now people are making excuses for every single win he has had. So my question is...

When Pacquiao beats Cotto, and if he beats him very one sidedly, will you guys finally give him the credit he deserves? Or will you hide behind the weight, and the fact that Cotto was washed up, even though he clearly isn't?

I am just saying I have a strong feeling this could be a lopsided win for Manny, and it seems like the more impressively he wins the bigger the excuses get. I am not saying he is far and away better than Cotto, IMO maybe only Mayweather can say that, but that Pacquiao's style is terrible for Cotto's skill set.

I give him credit right now. I never thought Hatton had a snow balls chance in hell of beating Pac. That was the quickest, worst beating of a supposedly elite fighter I ever saw; it wasn't even a fight. I knew he would win but damn

Oscar was drained but too bad that was his own ego and lack of regard for Pac, and he got beat silly. I'd still think Pac could beat Oscar without the weight issues; maybe not a prime Oscar mind you, but a hydrated Oscar of the last few years.

I actually did get impressed with his pummeling of Diaz. Diaz granted wasn't a GOAT candidate but Pac knocked out a guy in a higher division who had only been stoped once and it was a one sided affair from a guy who started at fleaweight fighting a big LW. I actually thought Diaz would win due to his chin and just being bigger; dumb prediction.

If he pulls off this win against Cotto how can anyone take credit away? I don't like the 145 thing personally; because if you want the title and stupid trinket to wrap around your waist, then play within the rules. But Cotto doesn't have a problem with it, nor the governing bodies, so it's on and if he wins it's massive; I won't rain on his parade. I think he wins a decision in an epic fight.