Re: GGG might fight Andy Lee in April.. is he the new Erdei?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Hulk
Quote:
Originally Posted by
FinitoElDinamita
Quote:
Originally Posted by
bcollins
Quote:
Originally Posted by
FinitoElDinamita
Is he gonna call out jermaine taylor next? Fuckin the worst paper titlist ive seen in awhile.
I'm not sure you've made yourself clear. Are you saying you don't think much of GGG?
He appears to be a decent fighter but we'll never know what he's really made of if he keeps fighting these part time rental cops and dishwashers. That's what im saying..
He's good but he's not this killer that people make him out to be.. I could be wrong but that's the impression I get..
It's like with Lucas Mythese.. Everybody and their mama made him out to be the boogeyman just because he knocked out Mike Dallas lol and a weight drained Peterson.. Majority of the fans thought he'd knock out Danny Garcia easily ( real talk ) but I sure didnt see it that way.. I knew he wasn't good enough to beat Danny and i can back it up with the Saddoleague thread..
Anyway I kinda see GGG in the same light.. He's a good fighter but all that hype is unwarranted..
I see some parallels with Matthysse as well. Its not like Lucas got schooled and dominated, he lost a close and good match to Garcia.
You are not exactly Nostradamus yourself either (real talk) lol
Honestly, Felix Sturm would be a great test for GGG, but Sturm of all folks should not be hailed as some hero to debunk GGG and his supposed fighting of nobodies. I mean lets look at Sturm's resume. There was a good stretch where he was fighting some truly questionable opposition himself.
Castillejo did stop him after all, so I'd imagine GGG would do the same. Yes, Sturm avenged it, but nonetheless.
Are you putting me on that Boxing God status now, Hulk, like I can never be wrong? lol this high standard you set for me Im flattered but even monkeys fall off trees bruh..
All you need to do is look at the Saddoleague comp and you'll realize how I perform at the elite level consistently but more importantly, I might have one of the best record in picking major upsets.. Jhonny Gonzalez > Mares, Garcia>Lucas etc the list is so long I dont even remember... So " real talk " my friend i dont mean to brag but let's not act like Im not one of the brightest Boxing minds on Saddo.. :cool:
Anyway I agree with you and Ross regarding Felix Sturm.. Sturm is more than credible as an opponent for GGG..
Re: GGG might fight Andy Lee in April.. is he the new Erdei?
His people want him back on hbo so he has to "pick" from network options. Can't see him fighting Sturm unless its on another obscure card stuffed on the side of a Milk Carton to the U.S. They also mentioned Kirkland and I think that would a shame and a bit of a step backwards, but a familiar face to fans and will be flattened like a truck rolling over a speed bump made of Lego logs.
Re: GGG might fight Andy Lee in April.. is he the new Erdei?
Re: GGG might fight Andy Lee in April.. is he the new Erdei?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
erics44
Would look like Hopkins v Pavlik and Dirrell v Abraham (up until the late punch).
Re: GGG might fight Andy Lee in April.. is he the new Erdei?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ross
Quote:
Originally Posted by
erics44
Would look like Hopkins v Pavlik and Dirrell v Abraham (up until the late punch).
The big difference with asking Ward to move up and asking GGG to move is that Ward has already cleaned out the super middleweight division and GGG hasn't done the same with the middleweight division.
With regard to Sturm, Sturm ducked GGG already. He won't face him anytime soon unless he is forced. He avoided him for two years. Just think of this way, GGG is the boogeyman of the division. It's clear. Yet, Sturm has targeted Geale, Barker and now Murray. He wants no piece of GGG. I'll agree that Sturm is a better fight than Lee. Lee doesn't have a chin. GGG will stop him quickly. I want Quillin to leave Golden Boy and make the fight. A win for either guy sets him up as a big name.
Re: GGG might fight Andy Lee in April.. is he the new Erdei?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ross
Quote:
Originally Posted by
erics44
Would look like Hopkins v Pavlik and Dirrell v Abraham (up until the late punch).
I know it's not the same thing but in case you didn't know GGG beat Bute and Dirrell in the amateurs.
Re: GGG might fight Andy Lee in April.. is he the new Erdei?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Ron Swanson
The big difference with asking Ward to move up and asking GGG to move is that Ward has already cleaned out the super middleweight division and GGG hasn't done the same with the middleweight.
I'd say the big differences are
1)That Ward has taken on top guys thus earning the right to do what he wants
2)Ward is not moving up because he wants to make a huge fight. GGG is not moving up because he doesn't want to make a huge fight.
It blows my mind how boxing fans are significantly harder on the guys that have made big fights than they are on the guys that haven't. It's bass ackwards.[/QUOTE]I think a lot of it is a basic as bias to styles for some. Ward has done nothing but taken names and punched tickets, he has done his time. The who you beat should still be on level with how you beat them.
** I totally screwed that reply placement up..
Re: GGG might fight Andy Lee in April.. is he the new Erdei?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
FinitoElDinamita
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Hulk
Quote:
Originally Posted by
FinitoElDinamita
Quote:
Originally Posted by
bcollins
Quote:
Originally Posted by
FinitoElDinamita
Is he gonna call out jermaine taylor next? Fuckin the worst paper titlist ive seen in awhile.
I'm not sure you've made yourself clear. Are you saying you don't think much of GGG?
He appears to be a decent fighter but we'll never know what he's really made of if he keeps fighting these part time rental cops and dishwashers. That's what im saying..
He's good but he's not this killer that people make him out to be.. I could be wrong but that's the impression I get..
It's like with Lucas Mythese.. Everybody and their mama made him out to be the boogeyman just because he knocked out Mike Dallas lol and a weight drained Peterson.. Majority of the fans thought he'd knock out Danny Garcia easily ( real talk ) but I sure didnt see it that way.. I knew he wasn't good enough to beat Danny and i can back it up with the Saddoleague thread..
Anyway I kinda see GGG in the same light.. He's a good fighter but all that hype is unwarranted..
I see some parallels with Matthysse as well. Its not like Lucas got schooled and dominated, he lost a close and good match to Garcia.
You are not exactly Nostradamus yourself either (real talk) lol
Honestly, Felix Sturm would be a great test for GGG, but Sturm of all folks should not be hailed as some hero to debunk GGG and his supposed fighting of nobodies. I mean lets look at Sturm's resume. There was a good stretch where he was fighting some truly questionable opposition himself.
Castillejo did stop him after all, so I'd imagine GGG would do the same. Yes, Sturm avenged it, but nonetheless.
Are you putting me on that Boxing God status now, Hulk, like I can never be wrong? lol this high standard you set for me Im flattered but even monkeys fall off trees bruh..
All you need to do is look at the Saddoleague comp and you'll realize how I perform at the elite level consistently but more importantly, I might have one of the best record in picking major upsets.. Jhonny Gonzalez > Mares, Garcia>Lucas etc the list is so long I dont even remember... So " real talk " my friend i dont mean to brag but let's not act like Im not one of the brightest Boxing minds on Saddo.. :cool:
Anyway I agree with you and Ross regarding Felix Sturm.. Sturm is more than credible as an opponent for GGG..
I didnt say sturm was less credible for the record. I just said Lee is as good as Sturm. Id actually fancy him because he is a good boxer and Sturm hasnt much power. Sturms been ducking GGG for years, I highly doubt he will make himself available for a fight.
Re: GGG might fight Andy Lee in April.. is he the new Erdei?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Spicoli
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Ron Swanson
The big difference with asking Ward to move up and asking GGG to move is that Ward has already cleaned out the super middleweight division and GGG hasn't done the same with the middleweight.
I'd say the big differences are
1)That Ward has taken on top guys thus earning the right to do what he wants
2)Ward is not moving up because he wants to make a huge fight. GGG is not moving up because he doesn't want to make a huge fight.
It blows my mind how boxing fans are significantly harder on the guys that have made big fights than they are on the guys that haven't. It's bass ackwards.
I think a lot of it is a basic as bias to styles for some. Ward has done nothing but taken names and punched tickets, he has done his time. The who you beat should still be on level with how you beat them.
** I totally screwed that reply placement up..[/QUOTE]
The main reason I dont think its fair to ask GGG to move up because hes a relatively small middleweight. I have no doubt he could make light middle. Hes 5'10 and not of particular big frame moving up to a weight where most are 6 foot or more. Ward on the other hand fought at light heavy as an amateur and would not be giving up a big size advantage moving up. If Ward-GGG was to happen it should be at a catchweight but there is 0 chance Ward would accept that.
Re: GGG might fight Andy Lee in April.. is he the new Erdei?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Ron Swanson
The big difference with asking Ward to move up and asking GGG to move is that Ward has already cleaned out the super middleweight division and GGG hasn't done the same with the middleweight.
I'd say the big differences are
1)That Ward has taken on top guys thus earning the right to do what he wants
2)Ward is not moving up because he wants to make a huge fight. GGG is not moving up because he doesn't want to make a huge fight.
It blows my mind how boxing fans are significantly harder on the guys that have made big fights than they are on the guys that haven't. It's bass ackwards.[/QUOTE]
You're twisting my words. Ward has big fights with Kovalev/Stevenson/Hopkins/Pascal at light heavyweight. All are bigger fights than Rodriguez or the Pavlik fight he was chasing before it. They are also arguably bigger fights than GGG.
The main difference in our opinion of GGG is that I haven't seen GGG duck any fight at 160. To me, I don't blame someone for not moving up in weight if they can still make weight legally and safely and there are still opponents for them to fight there.
I feel the same way about Ward frankly, but I also think Ward is out of options at 168 and he should thus consider moving up. Would I blame him for not moving up though? No. I just don't think he can demand 7 figure purses for fighting the Rodriguez's of the world (not that there is anything wrong with Rodriguez).
GGG has options at 160. He hasn't cleaned out the division, unlike Ward. I want to see him do that first. He's genuinely attempting it at least. He fought four times last year and is on pace for the same thing this year.
Re: GGG might fight Andy Lee in April.. is he the new Erdei?
Has GGG avoided anyone at 160?
Re: GGG might fight Andy Lee in April.. is he the new Erdei?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Ron Swanson
I get where your head is now but I still don't agree. The notion is he's not taking a big fight because he's cleaning out 160, well then why has he fought so many 154 fighters? Is he cleaning out 160 or 154?
And since when do you clean out a division by fighting guys outside the top 10?
If a Sergio fight was lined up, Quillen, Sturm I'd say do your thing even though I don't think particularly highly of any of them.(I used to think highly of Sergio but I don't know what he has left, I hope he returns to form) But these guys have shown no interest in fighting him.
If HBO continues to get good ratings for GGG vs guys ranked outside the top 10 and Jr.Middles they're smart to keep lining them up. And if GGGs pay keeps increasing he's smart to keep taking these useless fights. But I don't understand boxing fans supporting this false notion he's "cleaning" out middleweight. "Cleaning" implies it's in process. It's talked about but it's not in process. A Geale fight could qualify but a Lee fight does not, a Kirkland fight does not.
I'm glad we're slowly understanding each other. I too understand your points. Adama wasn't in the top ten, but he was a legitimate middleweight that gave Geale a rough night's work and had never been stopped. However, most importantly, the fight wasn't on HBO. He also fought Ishida off American networks. So, two of the fights you complain about were not on HBO in order to keep active. I see the point in that at least for a certain period of time.
Rosado is a 154/160 guy. He gave Quillin problems. He beat J'Leon Love. I'm not saying he's a world beater but he's decent. GGG sliced him up. This was also on HBO After Dark, which doesn't pay as much, or get the same treatment as a regular HBO show.
Proksa, Macklin and Stevens were top ten middleweights when GGG fought them. Frankly, I put Quillin, Geale, Sturm and Murray on the level of or right above these guys. Quillin won't face GGG because he is on Showtime. Murray and Sturm have avoided GGG and are set to face each other.
Martinez won't fight him before he fights Cotto. If he gets by Cotto, he has to fight GGG or he loses face. I also think a fight with Martinez is worth waiting for because Martinez holds the lineal middleweight belt and is on everyone's list of current best fighters. It would be a good fight for GGG's career.
So, this is how I see things playing out. GGG faces Lee or Geale (who are in the top ten or right outside it) in April and the other one at the end of the summer. He then tries to make a fight with Martinez at the end of the year. If by the end of 2014, we have seen no improvement in challenges, I'm with you, he should move up.
Now also understand that I don't rank GGG in my top ten p4p or anything like that. It's premature to do so when he hasn't faced too much top competition (I felt the same about Broner and Canelo).
Ward is number two on most people's list. He deserves more scrutiny than someone unranked. He needs to find a capable dance partner sooner than later, which probably means he needs to move up.
