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Kessler is a perfect example. If he had comeback from the Calzaghe loss and taken on legit dangerous opponents at 168 (and there are plenty of those guys), he would get some serious consideration for Top 10 PFP. Instead he's fighting stiffs.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fenster
It's hard for a fighter to avoid an american connection if you want be in the top ten p4p because so many of the best boxers have a connection with the United States. While I don't necessarily agree, your argument about John may be the exception. It is difficult to name another example.Quote:
Originally Posted by FensterRight. You can't get away from the American connection.Quote:
Originally Posted by RantcatratAs to John, does he have any other quality wins besides Rojas? Was Rojas even ranked in the top ten for featherweights when he beat him? Molitor was in the featherweight top ten.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fenster
Unless I'm mistaken, your questions about Froch and Abraham don't directly follow your point because Froch will fight Taylor (an American) in the United States. Thus, he'll be another American-connected fighter if he ends up on the p4p list. Maybe he should break the top ten with a win over Taylor or at least get very close. Should Taylor break the top ten with a win over Froch?
Yes, Abraham will be p4p if he beats Pavlik, but again, the fight will be in the US and Pavlik is an American. Thus, he'll be another American-connected fighter who is on the p4p list.
A better question would be whether Sturm ever should be considered a p4p fighter if he never again fights in the US and like Erdei is content to fight German fighters. Does beating the Ghevor's and the Demers' of the world propel you into the top ten p4p?
The point about John is.. he is UNBEATEN with a "WIN" over the current P4P no 2. That gives him better credentials than many a P4P entrant. Many guys enter without beating a fellow P4P member, nor are they as dominant an alphabet champion as John appears to be.
To disprove the American connection we would need this to happen - Sturm beats Abraham, in Germany, after Abraham beats Pavlik? This would give Sturm the beating of Pavlik and Taylor going by formlines. Would they make the German based Sturm P4P? :scratchchin:
Is there anything wrong with the American connection?
Ask yourself: if Erdei continues to fight without facing any american connected fighter, does he deserve to be in the top ten p4p? And on that note, how many examples can you name where that would be the case?
No.Quote:
Originally Posted by RantcatratIt's hard for a fighter to avoid an american connection if you want be in the top ten p4p because so many of the best boxers have a connection with the United States. While I don't necessarily agree, your argument about John may be the exception. It is difficult to name another example.Quote:
Originally Posted by FensterRight. You can't get away from the American connection.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rantcatrat
The point about John is.. he is UNBEATEN with a "WIN" over the current P4P no 2. That gives him better credentials than many a P4P entrant. Many guys enter without beating a fellow P4P member, nor are they as dominant an alphabet champion as John appears to be.
To disprove the American connection we would need this to happen - Sturm beats Abraham, in Germany, after Abraham beats Pavlik? This would give Sturm the beating of Pavlik and Taylor going by formlines. Would they make the German based Sturm P4P? :scratchchin:
Is there anything wrong with the American connection?
Ask yourself: if Erdei continues to fight without facing any american connected fighter, does he deserve to be in the top ten p4p? And on that note, how many examples can you name where that would be the case?
But it does highlight a bias. Is that justifed considering the majority of big fights happen in the States? Probably yes. Maybe it also shows it's easier for Americans to get recognition? Or maybe the competition in America is far tougher than anywhere else?
Zsolt Erdei isn't good enough to be P4P. There's half-a-dozen light-heavyweights in front of him. Guys like Kessler, Hasegawa, Abraham have all shown top level form/skill. They lack the American-connected win though.
Where it starts to look inconsistent is here - I noticed Hopkins entered The Ring P4P in 1999 (according to a certain list posted). I thought it was after he beat Trinidad in 2001, which is perfectly understandable. But 1999 Hopkins had no MAJOR win. He must have been awarded the P4P spot for successfully defending his alphabet title. This is no different to plenty of non-American based alphabet holders, right? I wonder if Hopkins had been from a different continent whether this would have the case? Or maybe P4P was weak in 1999?
:)
When only 2 of the top 10 are currently American,Im not buying what your selling
3 are Mexican,is there a Mexican bias?
2 are British,a British bias perhaps?
Of course there's an American connection,this is where the big money fights happen
Chris John: Aside that his one big win was a gift. There's also the fact that he's only faced one elite fighter in over 40 career fights. Wins over shot once decent fighters Derrick Gainer and Jose Rojas are his biggest highlights. I'm shocked when ever I read that John is p4p or close to being a p4p fighter. How? The man ain't even p4p top 50. Let alone top 10.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fenster
Hozumi Hasegawa: His comp level is much better than John's. He's top 20. A win over another top fighter could put him in the top 10. Him and Anselmo Moreno should fight.
Mikkel Kessler: His biggest news since losing to Calzaghe was punking out of a very winnable fight against Edoson Miranda. To face some obscure fighter. You don't reward cowards.
I'm not selling anything.Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainer Monkey
But yes, the two Americans, two Brits and three Mexicans have all fought "world" title fights in America, hence a connection to America. That fact was established on page one.
Hope this helps.
If America has more boxers,and more venues,how could you avoid fighting in the states if you want to make a case for P4P,its just math,not a great big conspiracy. If I had a guy who had never fought outside the Blue Horizon,and you made him P4P top 10 Id think that was ludicrousQuote:
Originally Posted by FensterI'm not selling anything.Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainer Monkey
But yes, the two Americans, two Brits and three Mexicans have all fought "world" title fights in America, hence a connection to America. That fact was established on page one.
Hope this helps.
Hope that helps
No - that doesn't make any sense at all.Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainer MonkeyIf America has more boxers,and more venues,how could you avoid fighting in the states if you want to make a case for P4P,its just math,not a great big conspiracy. If I had a guy who had never fought outside the Blue Horizon,and you made him P4P top 10 Id think that was ludicrousQuote:
Originally Posted by FensterI'm not selling anything.Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainer Monkey
But yes, the two Americans, two Brits and three Mexicans have all fought "world" title fights in America, hence a connection to America. That fact was established on page one.
Hope this helps.
Hope that helps
Hatton and Calzaghe were both ranked top 10 P4P without fighting in the States.
America has more venues than everywhere else in the entire world?
Does America have more Strawweights than Japan/Mexico/Thailand? ;)
Yes America does have more venues then anywhere in the entire world,we dont even use alot of them for boxing,but easily could.Quote:
Originally Posted by FensterNo - that doesn't make any sense at all.Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainer MonkeyIf America has more boxers,and more venues,how could you avoid fighting in the states if you want to make a case for P4P,its just math,not a great big conspiracy. If I had a guy who had never fought outside the Blue Horizon,and you made him P4P top 10 Id think that was ludicrousQuote:
Originally Posted by Fenster
Hope that helps
Hatton and Calzaghe were both ranked top 10 P4P without fighting in the States.
America has more venues than everywhere else in the entire world?
Does America have more Strawweights than Japan/Mexico/Thailand? ;)
In any major American city they have at least 3 major venues
Any one of which could hold a major prize fight
A mid sized prize fight,do you know how many minor league baseball stadiums we have alone.
And I havent even gotten in to the Casino's yet.
Sooner or later if you want to be taken seriously,you'll come to the states
Lets just go baseball stadiums,and major league ones not minor league,and leave football hockey and basketball out of it,and casino halls,or boxing only halls
Arizona Diamondbacks Chase Field 1998 49,033 Grass $355,000,000 76% 10871087 feet 407' (124m) Atlanta Braves Turner Field 1996 50,091 Grass $235,000,000 0% 0928928 feet 401' (122m) Baltimore Orioles Oriole Park at Camden Yards 1992 48,876 Grass $235,000,000 96% 003030 feet 400' (121.9m) Boston Red Sox Fenway Park 1912 39,928 Grass $420,000 0% 001515 feet 389' 9" (118.8m) Chicago Cubs Wrigley Field 1914 41,118 Grass $250,000 0% 0600600 feet 400' (121.9m) Chicago White Sox U.S. Cellular Field 1991 40,615 Grass $150,000,000 100% 0595595 feet 400' (121.92m) Cincinnati Reds Great American Ball Park 2003 42,059 Grass $297,000,000 17% 0542542 feet 404' (123m) Cleveland Indians Progressive Field 1994 43,345 Grass $173,000,000 87% 0656656 feet 405' (123.5m) Colorado Rockies Coors Field 1995 50,445 Grass $215,000,000 75% 51985198 feet 415' (126.5m) Detroit Tigers Comerica Park 2000 41,782 Grass $300,000,000 50% 0600600 feet 420' (128m) Florida Marlins Dolphin Stadium 1987 38,560 Grass $115,000,000 3% 00055 feet 404' (123.1m) Houston Astros Minute Maid Park 2000 40,950 Grass $266,000,000 67% 004848 feet 435' (133m) Kansas City Royals Kauffman Stadium 1973 40,793 Grass $43,000,000 100% 0877877 feet 410' (124m) Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim Angel Stadium of Anaheim 1966 45,050 Grass $24,000,000 100% 0153153 feet 400' (121.9) Los Angeles Dodgers Dodger Stadium 1962 56,000 Grass $18,000,000 0% 0517517 feet 400' (122m) Milwaukee Brewers Miller Park 2001 42,200 Grass $322,000,000 64% 0598598 feet 400' (122m) Minnesota Twins Metrodome 1982 46,564◊ FieldTurf $102,800,000 87% 0992992 feet 408' (124m) New York Mets Citi Field 2009 45,000 Grass $850,000,000 31%
408' (124m) New York Yankees New Yankee Stadium 2009 52,325 Grass $1,300,000,000 39%
408' (124.3m) Oakland Athletics Oakland-Alameda County Coliseum 1966 35,067◊◊ Grass $30,000,000 100% 00077 feet 400' (122m) Philadelphia Phillies Citizens Bank Park 2004 43,647 Grass $346,000,000 50% 001919 feet 401' (122m) Pittsburgh Pirates PNC Park 2001 38,496 Grass $230,000,000 71% 0726726 feet 399' (122m) St. Louis Cardinals New Busch Stadium 2006 46,861 Grass $346,000,000 0% 0453453 feet 400' (122m) San Diego Padres PETCO Park 2004 42,445 Grass $411,000,000 70% 002121 feet 396' (120.7m) San Francisco Giants AT&T Park 2000 41,503 Grass $319,000,000 5% 001010 feet 399' (122m) Seattle Mariners Safeco Field 1999 47,116 Grass $517,000,000 76% 001717 feet 405' (123m) Tampa Bay Rays Tropicana Field 1990 36,048◊◊◊ FieldTurf $85,000,000 100% 003838 feet 404' (123m) Texas Rangers Rangers Ballpark in Arlington 1994 49,115 Grass $181,000,000 80% 0546546 feet 400' (122m) Toronto Blue Jays Rogers Centre 1989 50,516 FieldTurf $570,000,000 63% 0290290 feet 400' (122m) Washington Nationals Nationals Park 2008 41,888 Grass $611,000,000 100% 001717 feet 402' (122.5m)Suffice to say,we have WAY more stadiums
WTF did you just paste a whole list of baseball stadiums for? How many of those have hosted a fight within the last 20 years? Bizarre.
Anyways, I don't think it's a bias just it's true that most of the money is in America. More of the lower weight fighters would be ranked but while we may know the top 107 lbers in Thailand, we don't know the guys there are facing day in and day out. It's just hard to sell a case for those guys when most of the public doesn't see their fights and if they do they don't know who it is the champions are fighting. Thailand is so interesting to me I wish we knew more about it.
Lets go football by capacity
1 Beaver Stadium 107,282[1] State College http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...lvania.svg.png Pennsylvania Penn State Nittany Lions football 2 Michigan Stadium 106,201[2] Ann Arbor http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...chigan.svg.png Michigan Michigan Wolverines football 3 Ohio Stadium 102,329[3] Columbus http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...f_Ohio.svg.png Ohio Ohio State Buckeyes football 4 Neyland Stadium 102,037[4] Knoxville http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...nessee.svg.png Tennessee Tennessee Volunteers football 5 Darrell K. Royal-Texas Memorial Stadium 94,113[5] Austin http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi..._Texas.svg.png Texas Texas Longhorns football 6 Los Angeles Memorial Coliseum 93,607[6][7] Los Angeles http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...fornia.svg.png California USC Trojans football 7 Sanford Stadium 92,746[8] Athens http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...ate%29.svg.png Georgia Georgia Bulldogs football 8 Rose Bowl 92,542[9] Pasadena http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...fornia.svg.png California UCLA Bruins football and the Rose Bowl game 9 Tiger Stadium 92,400[10] Baton Rouge
Trainer Monkey,
you are completely off your rocker son. ;D
Hahaha - no kidding. Train of thought runs on completely different tracks.
You kidding,I had fighter fighting in the Sacramento Bee's stadium recentlyQuote:
Originally Posted by amat
The question was,does the United States have more Stadiums then the rest of the world,the answer,is, yes
You asked a simple question,does the United States have more stadiums then the rest of the world,you got your answerQuote:
Originally Posted by Fenster
And its pretty conclusive
Who? The Sacramento Bee is a newspaper. Raley's Field is where the Sacramento Rivercats play and yes, they occasionally have some very small scale boxing cards. That is literally the only baseball field I know of that they have boxing cards.
And the question was not if the US has more stadiums then any other country. That wasn't the question at all.
That was the question posed directly to me.Quote:
Originally Posted by amat
So I answered it,and you are right,it used to be the Bee's now it is the Rivercats,my bad on that,I could have just opened up my pictures and gotten that right.
But the point is,I was asked does the United States have more venues
Yes we do is the correct answer
And again,I havent even touched Casino's,Basketball,Hockey,or Boxing only arena's
We get it, you are important. With that said, what does a list of stadiums where they don't hold boxing cards have to do with P4P lists having a bias towards Americans?
;DQuote:
Originally Posted by Trainer MonkeyYou asked a simple question,does the United States have more stadiums then the rest of the world,you got your answerQuote:
Originally Posted by Fenster
And its pretty conclusive
I never asked that question. I never even mentioned stadiums. Venue!!! That was YOUR word - Venue!!!
Venue could be a small club, sports hall or pub (bar)
You donut ;D
Considering you were talking about title fights,I was pretty sure that was a safe assumptiveQuote:
Originally Posted by Fenster;DQuote:
Originally Posted by Trainer MonkeyYou asked a simple question,does the United States have more stadiums then the rest of the world,you got your answerQuote:
Originally Posted by Fenster
And its pretty conclusive
I never asked that question. I never even mentioned stadiums. Venue!!! That was YOUR word - Venue!!!
Venue could be a small club, or sports hall, or pub (bar)
You donut ;D
I mean it was supposed to be about P4P champions,I dont think their fighting in bars
And if they are,there's a trainer somewhere crying
So they're fighting in baseball stadiums? How many of those stadiums you listed have had a fight in the past 5 years?
Yankee StadiumQuote:
Originally Posted by amat
Held fights?
Yes
The Spectrum in Philly
Held fights?
Yes
List could go on endlessly
Yes
If there are more fighters,and more venues that can hold fights,sooner or later you will fight in the States
Fenster wants exclusion of every fighter who's fought in the states,well guess where the money is,in the states
Endlessly? Really? Let's see you name more then 5 of the stadiums you listed that have had cards within the last 10 years. That's the only way anything you posted is at all relevant to the discussion.
Using those rules, Yankee Stadium wouldn't count. Neither would any of those. Please this is nonsense dribble ruining a fairly interesting topic.
They're not fighting in stadiums either.Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainer MonkeyConsidering you were talking about title fights,I was pretty sure that was a safe assumptiveQuote:
Originally Posted by Fenster;DQuote:
Originally Posted by Trainer Monkey
I never asked that question. I never even mentioned stadiums. Venue!!! That was YOUR word - Venue!!!
Venue could be a small club, or sports hall, or pub (bar)
You donut ;D
I mean it was supposed to be about P4P champions,I dont think their fighting in bars
And if they are,there's a trainer somewhere crying
Most big fights in America are held in Vegas.. maybe New York - MSG.. Los Angeles. Especially if involving a non-American.
How many fights per year are held in US stadiums? ;D
I missed this. I guess he's already looking for the answer ;DQuote:
Originally Posted by amat
MSG would be in there,just recently scheduledQuote:
Originally Posted by amat
2009-05-07Main Street Armory, Rochester, New York, United Stateshttp://static.boxrec.com/view.gif
2009-05-02MGM Grand, Las Vegas, Nevada, United Stateshttp://static.boxrec.com/view.gif
2009-05-01Blue Horizon, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, United Stateshttp://static.boxrec.com/view.gif
2009-04-25The Village, Little Rock, Arkansas, United Stateshttp://static.boxrec.com/view.gif
2009-04-11Mandalay Bay Resort & Casino, Las Vegas, Nevada, United Stateshttp://static.boxrec.com/view.gif
2009-04-11Woodlands Resort, Wilkes-Barre, Pennsylvania, United Stateshttp://static.boxrec.com/view.gif
2009-04-11City Armory, Lynchburg, Virginia, United Stateshttp://static.boxrec.com/view.gif
2009-04-10Morongo Casino Resort & Spa, Cabazon, California, United Stateshttp://static.boxrec.com/view.gif
2009-04-04Texas, United Stateshttp://static.boxrec.com/view.gif
2009-04-04Masonic Temple, Norfolk, Virginia, United Stateshttp://static.boxrec.com/view.gif
2009-04-03Amelia Island, Fernandina Beach, Florida, United Stateshttp://static.boxrec.com/view.gif
2009-03-28Red & Jerrys, Denver, Colorado, United Stateshttp://static.boxrec.com/view.gif
2009-03-28Grand Casino, Hinckley, Minnesota, United Stateshttp://static.boxrec.com/view.gif
2009-03-28Harlingen Field, Harlingen, Texas, United Stateshttp://static.boxrec.com/view.gif
2009-03-27United Stateshttp://static.boxrec.com/view.gif
2009-03-27A La Carte Event Pavilion, Tampa, Florida, United Stateshttp://static.boxrec.com/view.gif
2009-03-21Playboy Mansion, Beverly Hills, California, United Stateshttp://static.boxrec.com/view.gif
2009-03-21Civic Center, Pensacola, Florida, United Stateshttp://static.boxrec.com/view.gif
2009-03-21Ramada Inn, Saint Joseph, Missouri, United Stateshttp://static.boxrec.com/view.gif
2009-03-16Madison Square Garden, New York, New York, United Stateshttp://static.boxrec.com/view.gif
2009-03-14Dorchester Armory, Dorchester, Massachusetts, United States
Back to the topic at hand, when did Calzaghe and Hatton crack the P4P lists? Surely Joe made it before fighting Hopkins and Hatton never fought stateside until he fought Collazo. I'm not sure if he was on the P4P lists by that time or not but I'm fairly confident he was.
Abraham doesn't really have a case to be on the P4P list because the only guy he has beaten that opens any eyes is Miranda. Ivan Calderon was at the 10 spot in the January issue which I have right now. He may have fought in the US before but he's definitely a Puerto Rico based fighter.
Actually, I'll go ahead and list the guys in the Ring 100 who haven't fought in America or who at least aren't American based.
10. Calderon
18. Abraham
19. John
20. Kessler
23. Hasegawa
32. Naito
35. Haye
37. Gonzalez
43. Pongslakek
44. Sakata
45. Erdei
48. Valero
Those are it for the top 50. I think most of those are about right but there are some American fighters who probably are to high up on the list like Pavlik at 11.
What does that even mean? SeriouslyQuote:
Originally Posted by Trainer Monkey
Every time we pointed out a foreign based fighter is in the top ten,that would be 8 out out of the top 10 by the way,you claimed it didnt count because theyd fought in the states at some pointQuote:
Originally Posted by FensterWhat does that even mean? SeriouslyQuote:
Originally Posted by Trainer Monkey
Well it doesn't count. My question was spefically about fighters without ties to America. I can see the word "based" confused you. But i did explain a billion times what i meant.Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainer MonkeyEvery time we pointed out a foreign based fighter is in the top ten,that would be 8 out out of the top 10 by the way,you claimed it didnt count because theyd fought in the states at some pointQuote:
Originally Posted by FensterWhat does that even mean? SeriouslyQuote:
Originally Posted by Trainer Monkey
The answer is just ONE fighter.
And the answer is,with bigger venues,larger paychecks,and more fighters to choose from,sooner or later your coming to the statesQuote:
Originally Posted by FensterWell it doesn't count. My question was spefically about fighters without ties to America. I can see the word "based" confused you. But i did explain a billion times after what i meant.Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainer MonkeyEvery time we pointed out a foreign based fighter is in the top ten,that would be 8 out out of the top 10 by the way,you claimed it didnt count because theyd fought in the states at some pointQuote:
Originally Posted by Fenster
The answer is just ONE fighter.
Which Ive said a dozen times now
Hatton after beating Tszyu and Calzaghe when he beat Lacy.Quote:
Originally Posted by amat
I was just trying to show how crap P4P is. But really it just highlighted America is the daddy of boxing. Without a connection to the States a fighter will never get recognition.
Fair enough. That's the way she goes... most top fighters want to fight in the States anyway.
Stop with the bigger venues crap. Germany, Britain, Japan they fight in front of huge audiences. MOST big fights happen in Vegas.Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainer MonkeyAnd the answer is,with bigger venues,larger paychecks,and more fighters to choose from,sooner or later your coming to the statesQuote:
Originally Posted by FensterWell it doesn't count. My question was spefically about fighters without ties to America. I can see the word "based" confused you. But i did explain a billion times after what i meant.Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainer Monkey
The answer is just ONE fighter.
Which Ive said a dozen times now
Ive shown you DON'T need to fight in the States to be P4P ranked.
America has the glamour the glitz and pizzazz, so naturally will produce popular fighters who inturn will become P4P rated. ;)
Quote:
Originally Posted by FensterStop with the bigger venues crap. Germany, Britain, Japan they fight in front of huge audiences. MOST big fights happen in Vegas.Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainer MonkeyAnd the answer is,with bigger venues,larger paychecks,and more fighters to choose from,sooner or later your coming to the statesQuote:
Originally Posted by Fenster
Which Ive said a dozen times now
Ive shown you DON'T need to fight in the States to be P4P ranked.
America has the glamour the glitz and pizzazz, so naturally will produce popular fighters who inturn will become P4P rated. ;)
i think UK can create their own P4P list... why bother US P4P list if you don't agree with it.. Lets get real here, lots of big fights happen in america, im not saying happening only in america. If you dont fight in US how are they going to rate you? same goes to UK and other countries. So go on create your UK P4P myth list nobody is going to stop you guys anyway.. stop this America bias crap..
hell wasn't the Arce/Darchinyan fight in the Astrodome?!?!?!Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainer MonkeyYankee StadiumQuote:
Originally Posted by amat
Held fights?
Yes
The Spectrum in Philly
Held fights?
Yes
List could go on endlessly
Yes
If there are more fighters,and more venues that can hold fights,sooner or later you will fight in the States
Fenster wants exclusion of every fighter who's fought in the states,well guess where the money is,in the states
Fens honest to god I see what your saying but it's just insane to see it that way.
Of course almost every boxer is gonna be connected to the states most big fights happen here where they make dollars.
I personally don't see that as biased I see it as just the way the sport has always been and I'll tell you why.
I still think a US based fighter is someone who lives, trains & fights here.
Why would just fighting here make you based here.
The US is the mecca of boxing I think that's been established for 100s of years it is seemingly impossible to be a top fighter and not fight here.
I just feel this thread leads nowhere for me and has left me scratching my head... Cause again I understand what your getting to but it's only obvious Top rated fighters would somehow be connected to the US.
I mean what your saying is Hatton is a US based fighter?
Maybe based wasn't the word you were looking for.
That's where I'm getting mixed up... To me based like I said is where you train, live & fight.
I think it impossible not to be connected with the US, because most top rated fighters and or title holders have stepped foot here in the US from early in their careers.
I mean take this new wave of Germans that just landed here in the US at Roachs gym? Or how about the Filipino wave that we got here in the US with Pac impact?
You got top venues, you got dollars, you got world wide networks, promoters etc. etc. etc.
I think I'm going in circles here but anyway Fens. I just think it's like saying "Why are the majority winners of the Best Pic. at the Oscars" most often American films then foreign films... Well I don't know you tell me?
The fight was fought at the Pond in Anaheim, CA.Quote:
Originally Posted by ElTerribleMoraleshell wasn't the Arce/Darchinyan fight in the Astrodome?!?!?!Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainer MonkeyYankee StadiumQuote:
Originally Posted by amat
Held fights?
Yes
The Spectrum in Philly
Held fights?
Yes
List could go on endlessly
Yes
If there are more fighters,and more venues that can hold fights,sooner or later you will fight in the States
Fenster wants exclusion of every fighter who's fought in the states,well guess where the money is,in the states
Spot on. It is mostly BASED on the fights that happen in the US. IMO it would be a such a big honor to be in the list if you haven't even fought here. Pongsalek, Calzaghe.. to get the recognition was great. Must have been making enough noise to be heard in the US. and it's fukkin true you Brits can create your own list. But it will only sound more biased if you won't put 'American based' fighters in the list and instead put Chris John in it. I was wonderin if this thread was actually made for Chris John.:pQuote:
i think UK can create their own P4P list... why bother US P4P list if you don't agree with it.. Lets get real here, lots of big fights happen in america, im not saying happening only in america. If you dont fight in US how are they going to rate you? same goes to UK and other countries. So go on create your UK P4P myth list nobody is going to stop you guys anyway.. stop this America bias crap..
and why does the NBA call their champs the World Champs if the teams were only American and Canadian based cities? It's because basketball,(like boxing) is a worldwide sport and the NBA is an open league which means any player of any nationality can play if they were skilled enough for the big stage. It only happened that the NBA is american based and the venues happens in American cities. Do they deserve to call themselves the best in the world? Yes. Just like boxing. The best fighters fight here and the best fights happens here. And the Ring, they just tell America what they think and what they feel. It just happens that you Brits can hear it too. sorryQuote:
I think I'm going in circles here but anyway Fens. I just think it's like saying "Why are the majority winners of the Best Pic. at the Oscars" most often American films then foreign films... Well I don't know you tell me?