Fair enough. It just didn't make much sense as it was and I was curious why you posted it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Quinito
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Fair enough. It just didn't make much sense as it was and I was curious why you posted it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Quinito
Going to get off topic so please excuse me for a sec while i post. The heavyweights when it comes to pound for pound get fucked. The only heavy that gets credit is Ali and that is it people give Lopez all this credit but tell you truth i would rate Holyfeild, Lennox and Holmes above him. I mean Lopez record is about the same as Rocky's so undefeated ok.
How can Heavyweight's be P4P ?Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr140
I don't see a problem with having a heavyweight P4P, its just who you think would be the best fighters if they were all equal size and if there's a guy that good he should be in. We just don't have anybody that good these days.
Well what i am saying is that alot of the lower weights stay around the same weight dont move to many divsion like Lopez did in his career. Now i am not a expert on the man i seen few fights he was a good boxer. Also he was undefeated and held titles and fly and super fly iam guessing. If i am wrong on the weight classes my bad not looking it up right now. But from the list of names seen him beat his resume is on par with Rocky. Hence when people rate him above say Holyfeild, Lennox and Holmes i really dont think based on his comp that he should be ahead of them. Also to me it seems if your a heavyweight and not Ali you get no respect in pound for pound. I mean like i said before you got Foreman, Fraizer, Holyfeild, Lennox and Holmes none of which get tha much mention in the pound for pound picture. All i am saying i thik no matter what size they were great fighters. the heavyweights for some reason dont seem to be include in it and i think it is unfair that is all considering how many great champs have come for the divsion.
If I remember correctly Mike Tyson at his height did get rated as a top 10 p4p in the old issues of Ring Magazine in the late 80s. I guess it also depends on how dominant a guy is at his weight.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr140
problem is, he calls out this other elite fighters on the lower division but quite frankly, they just cower in fear from him: going up in weight, fighting each other, etc as if he is just a ghost... he has been one of the most avoided one in his division. fact is: he has called out arce, mijares, darchinyan for an immediate rematch,hussein, and just recently montiel but again montiel turned him down in the last minute for a fight in the philippines just as everbody on the above list did. however his previous list of victims after that darch fight is'nt that bad either. like xadu said all were top contenders for the belt and one being undefeated. his skills is unquestionable, in fact, skillwise, he has been considered by some pacfans better than pac, and you can include me on that one.Quote:
Originally Posted by C-LoAgreed!Quote:
Originally Posted by CFH
I don't think Donaire should be in the top 10 P4P but he's definitely a talented fighter. IMO he hasn't done enough in his career to get such a prestigious ranking. He beat one name, a good name though, but it's not enough to get that high. He has the talent to have that ranking but you need to prove it to actually have it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mad_takamuraproblem is, he calls out this other elite fighters on the lower division but quite frankly, they just cower in fear from him: going up in weight, fighting each other, etc as if he is just a ghost... he has been one of the most avoided one in his division. fact is: he has called out arce, mijares, darchinyan for an immediate rematch,hussein, and just recently montiel but again montiel turned him down in the last minute for a fight in the philippines just as everbody on the above list did. however his previous list of victims after that darch fight is'nt that bad either. like xadu said all were top contenders for the belt and one being undefeated. his skills is unquestionable, in fact, skillwise, he has been considered by some pacfans better than pac, and you can include me on that one.Quote:
Originally Posted by C-LoAgreed!Quote:
Originally Posted by CFH
I don't think Donaire should be in the top 10 P4P but he's definitely a talented fighter. IMO he hasn't done enough in his career to get such a prestigious ranking. He beat one name, a good name though, but it's not enough to get that high. He has the talent to have that ranking but you need to prove it to actually have it.
So true...
.
None of that has any bearing on his inclusion in the top 10 P4P. In fact, it only reinforces the notion that he should not be included as his resume is lacking.Quote:
Originally Posted by mad_takamuraproblem is, he calls out this other elite fighters on the lower division but quite frankly, they just cower in fear from him: going up in weight, fighting each other, etc as if he is just a ghost... he has been one of the most avoided one in his division. fact is: he has called out arce, mijares, darchinyan for an immediate rematch,hussein, and just recently montiel but again montiel turned him down in the last minute for a fight in the philippines just as everbody on the above list did. however his previous list of victims after that darch fight is'nt that bad either. like xadu said all were top contenders for the belt and one being undefeated. his skills is unquestionable, in fact, skillwise, he has been considered by some pacfans better than pac, and you can include me on that one.Quote:
Originally Posted by C-LoAgreed!Quote:
Originally Posted by CFH
I don't think Donaire should be in the top 10 P4P but he's definitely a talented fighter. IMO he hasn't done enough in his career to get such a prestigious ranking. He beat one name, a good name though, but it's not enough to get that high. He has the talent to have that ranking but you need to prove it to actually have it.
I agree, Darchinyan has improved alot since the donaire fight and was not a multi division world champion when he was beat so you cant say at the time he beat a multi-division champion, you can say he beat a guy who went on to be a multi-division champion ;) I dont think Donaire has beaten anyone great to get into the p4p list either. Yes he beat darchinyan, but didnt everyone think darchynian was begging to be outboxed and was over rated? So what makes it such a big accomplishment now?Quote:
Originally Posted by BilboQuote:
Originally Posted by OumaFanBeating Ponce and Penalosa isn't equivalent to beating Vic though. And outside of those two JML has nothing on his resume, Donaire's is better.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bilbo
Well I did mention Dawson and Williams ;D I would probably rank Dawson and Williams above, maybe, but its not by much. Donaire has the best win of anybody being discussed here IMO. Dawson and Williams maybe have a better overall body of work. At least Dawson.
Of course P4P is not just about accomplishments, its subjective too but generally I think all four guys have top ten P4P talent.
A bit off the point but I have to disagree with CFH on Caballero. Not the other guys though.
How is Donaire's much better? Who (vic aside) has Donaire beaten that was better than Ponce De Leon and Penalosa?
Remember Darchinyan became a two weight world champ and defeated Mijares and Arce AFTER the Donaire fight, so you can't give Donaire the credit of beating a superflyweight multi divisional conquerorer because he hasn't beaten one at all.
What about his the rest of his opposition? He's beaten nobody of note whatsoever. Since fighting Vic he's beaten Maldonado who Vic ko'd in 8 and Montiel in 3. He's fought some unknown South African who nobody had heard of in Mthlane and then fought again a complete unknown in Rual Martinez.
Yes Martinez was unbeaten but so what, Dimitri Sartisan was unbeaten when Kessler fought him last time out as was Koji Sato who Felix Sturm beat last time, why not put Sturm in the top 10 p4p for acomplishing such a great feat?
His resume has a single name on it, and the acomplishments of that opponent were made largely after that fight.
Putting Donaire at 7th is more erroneous than putting Mijares in there last year.
it's seems you're questioning my list. p4p would always be debatable and you could go on and on and it would never get resolve. it's about who's the best at the moment if they fight and they're the same size. it so happen i think highly of donaire and imo he beats those guys you mentioned. of course i could be wrong but its just what it is, an opinion. it's just that i know a lot about donaire and although he hasn't faced notable competition, the way he's been dismantling opposition as of late prompts me to place him where i did. imo, he still beats darchi handily if they face again.Quote:
Originally Posted by BilboQuote:
Originally Posted by OumaFanBeating Ponce and Penalosa isn't equivalent to beating Vic though. And outside of those two JML has nothing on his resume, Donaire's is better.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bilbo
Well I did mention Dawson and Williams ;D I would probably rank Dawson and Williams above, maybe, but its not by much. Donaire has the best win of anybody being discussed here IMO. Dawson and Williams maybe have a better overall body of work. At least Dawson.
Of course P4P is not just about accomplishments, its subjective too but generally I think all four guys have top ten P4P talent.
A bit off the point but I have to disagree with CFH on Caballero. Not the other guys though.
How is Donaire's much better? Who (vic aside) has Donaire beaten that was better than Ponce De Leon and Penalosa?
Remember Darchinyan became a two weight world champ and defeated Mijares and Arce AFTER the Donaire fight, so you can't give Donaire the credit of beating a superflyweight multi divisional conquerorer because he hasn't beaten one at all.
What about his the rest of his opposition? He's beaten nobody of note whatsoever. Since fighting Vic he's beaten Maldonado who Vic ko'd in 8 and Montiel in 3. He's fought some unknown South African who nobody had heard of in Mthlane and then fought again a complete unknown in Rual Martinez.
Yes Martinez was unbeaten but so what, Dimitri Sartisan was unbeaten when Kessler fought him last time out as was Koji Sato who Felix Sturm beat last time, why not put Sturm in the top 10 p4p for acomplishing such a great feat?
His resume has a single name on it, and the acomplishments of that opponent were made largely after that fight.
Putting Donaire at 7th is more erroneous than putting Mijares in there last year.
putting mijares in the p4p last year would have been a mistake now because you are looking at it at hindsight. that's why our personal list changes ever so often depending on what happens on future match-ups. it's about the moment, right now, about the fighters we know, so i don't see what the fuzz is all about.
can't blame nonito. nonito called them up and what did they do? nothing. or if one did he cancelled it due to an "injury"(montiel). is nonito blamed for this? he did everything for those fights to happen but they avoided him, i guess quite contrast to your opinion, the notion he called out this fighters but none of them have bitten the bait proves that he should be there. fighters know if the one they are going to face are heavy risks (like nonito) thus nonito is for real. you could include jmm on that scenario wayback for they almost share the same crisis. jmm was avoided by em, mab, and hamed. and if i was'nt for pac, he won't be known as the p4p #2 now, right? question is: will history repeat itself thru nonito like what happened to jmm? only time will tell who will be the fighter that would make that breakthrough for him. (like pac did for jmm tll everybody praised him to who he is today: the #2 p4p!)Quote:
Originally Posted by CFHNone of that has any bearing on his inclusion in the top 10 P4P. In fact, it only reinforces the notion that he should not be included as his resume is lacking.Quote:
Originally Posted by mad_takamuraproblem is, he calls out this other elite fighters on the lower division but quite frankly, they just cower in fear from him: going up in weight, fighting each other, etc as if he is just a ghost... he has been one of the most avoided one in his division. fact is: he has called out arce, mijares, darchinyan for an immediate rematch,hussein, and just recently montiel but again montiel turned him down in the last minute for a fight in the philippines just as everbody on the above list did. however his previous list of victims after that darch fight is'nt that bad either. like xadu said all were top contenders for the belt and one being undefeated. his skills is unquestionable, in fact, skillwise, he has been considered by some pacfans better than pac, and you can include me on that one.Quote:
Originally Posted by C-Lo
this ring mag people knew that nonito is the real deal base on how he is avoided by this fighters. i guess that answers your question, bilbo, no matter how senseless it looks. the whole quality of opposition cowers away from him like he is an evovled specie of h1n1!
or you can also ask people here who will win if those fights happen.(nonito vs a, vs b, vs c...) only guy who can stand a chance actually against nonito is montiel imo. we can all predict that, can't we? of course it's just a prediction but arce vs nonito? you can guess right who would win easily there, right?
oh, you're talking about ring magazine? they also have him at no. 7? i guess they have it spot on then. ;D
I'm happy with Nonito. I think he's really in good hands with Arum. Shaw treated him crap after the Darchinyan fight and gave all the opportunities to Vic instead of Nonito. So nobody can really Donaire for bailing out on his ass. I cant wait for Donaire to snatch that 115 WBA like taking a lolypop from 3 year old girl this august. lol.
Being an avoided fighter means nothing in the context of P4P lists. If it did, a highly skilled fighter like Paul Williams who has a better resume that Donaire, comparable skills, and who is avoided by fighters in three separate divisions should still be ranked well above Donaire. By your criteria he could be ranked in the top 5.Quote:
Originally Posted by mad_takamuracan't blame nonito. nonito called them up and what did they do? nothing. or if one did he cancelled it due to an "injury"(montiel). is nonito blamed for this? he did everything for those fights to happen but they avoided him, i guess quite contrast to your opinion, the notion he called out this fighters but none of them have bitten the bait proves that he should be there. fighters know if the one they are going to face are heavy risks (like nonito) thus nonito is for real. you could include jmm on that scenario wayback for they almost share the same crisis. jmm was avoided by em, mab, and hamed. and if i was'nt for pac, he won't be known as the p4p #2 now, right? question is: will history repeat itself thru nonito like what happened to jmm? only time will tell who will be the fighter that would make that breakthrough for him. (like pac did for jmm tll everybody praised him to who he is today: the #2 p4p!)Quote:
Originally Posted by CFHNone of that has any bearing on his inclusion in the top 10 P4P. In fact, it only reinforces the notion that he should not be included as his resume is lacking.Quote:
Originally Posted by mad_takamura
this ring mag people knew that nonito is the real deal base on how he is avoided by this fighters. i guess that answers your question, bilbo, no matter how senseless it looks. the whole quality of opposition cowers away from him like he is an evovled specie of h1n1!
or you can also ask people here who will win if those fights happen.(nonito vs a, vs b, vs c...) only guy who can stand a chance actually against nonito is montiel imo. we can all predict that, can't we? of course it's just a prediction but arce vs nonito? you can guess right who would win easily there, right?
Again, regardless of the reasons, Donaire does not have the resume to be included in the P4P list in my opinion. He has fought one legitimate opponent in his entire career.
PWill should be ranked ahead Izzy, Rafa, Donaire, and Darchinyan. Donaire is avoided in 3 separate divisions by champions too btw.. 112, 115, and 118. Darchinyan didn't avoid him, but look what happened to that fight. And now Donaire is being duck more, including Darchinyan because of that fight.
Exactly, but the people defending Donaire will disregard this post.Quote:
Originally Posted by CFHBeing an avoided fighter means nothing in the context of P4P lists. If it did, a highly skilled fighter like Paul Williams who has a better resume that Donaire, comparable skills, and who is avoided by fighters in three separate divisions should still be ranked well above Donaire. By your criteria he could be ranked in the top 5.Quote:
Originally Posted by mad_takamuracan't blame nonito. nonito called them up and what did they do? nothing. or if one did he cancelled it due to an "injury"(montiel). is nonito blamed for this? he did everything for those fights to happen but they avoided him, i guess quite contrast to your opinion, the notion he called out this fighters but none of them have bitten the bait proves that he should be there. fighters know if the one they are going to face are heavy risks (like nonito) thus nonito is for real. you could include jmm on that scenario wayback for they almost share the same crisis. jmm was avoided by em, mab, and hamed. and if i was'nt for pac, he won't be known as the p4p #2 now, right? question is: will history repeat itself thru nonito like what happened to jmm? only time will tell who will be the fighter that would make that breakthrough for him. (like pac did for jmm tll everybody praised him to who he is today: the #2 p4p!)Quote:
Originally Posted by CFH
this ring mag people knew that nonito is the real deal base on how he is avoided by this fighters. i guess that answers your question, bilbo, no matter how senseless it looks. the whole quality of opposition cowers away from him like he is an evovled specie of h1n1!
or you can also ask people here who will win if those fights happen.(nonito vs a, vs b, vs c...) only guy who can stand a chance actually against nonito is montiel imo. we can all predict that, can't we? of course it's just a prediction but arce vs nonito? you can guess right who would win easily there, right?
Again, regardless of the reasons, Donaire does not have the resume to be included in the P4P list in my opinion. He has fought one legitimate opponent in his entire career.
I don't disregard a valid opinion.
the answer is simple $$$$Quote:
Originally Posted by Bilbo
how? donaire paid them? :confused:Quote:
Originally Posted by ElTerribleMoralesthe answer is simple $$$$Quote:
Originally Posted by Bilbo
i wouldn't be shocked if his promoter dished out a couple bucks for a ranking, would be the first timeQuote:
Originally Posted by mad_takamurahow? donaire paid them? :confused:Quote:
Originally Posted by ElTerribleMoralesthe answer is simple $$$$Quote:
Originally Posted by Bilbo
and makes sense seeing how he's done jack shit to merit a place in the top 10 much less a #7 spot
Do you really believed Donaire's promoter paid for that #7 P4P ranking?? :confused:Quote:
Originally Posted by ElTerribleMoralesi wouldn't be shocked if his promoter dished out a couple bucks for a ranking, would be the first timeQuote:
Originally Posted by mad_takamurahow? donaire paid them? :confused:Quote:
Originally Posted by ElTerribleMorales
and makes sense seeing how he's done jack shit to merit a place in the top 10 much less a #7 spot
RING Mag is owned by GBP and Donaire is a Top Rank boxer... Go figure...
.
Lol! Donaire bribed Ring Mag to put him at #7? That's some funny shit right there. Hehe!
A King-Size Scandal in the Ring - TIMEQuote:
Anything is possible with the Ring magazine. Money talks, maybe Donaire and Arum slipped a little money for those rankings eh?
He bribed the wrong people thats for sure, if it only got him 7th spot then hes doing something wrong ;DQuote:
Originally Posted by Quinito
7 is a lot higher than where he SHOULD BE, i'd rank Donaire at something like #30 p4p if thatQuote:
Originally Posted by snakeyHe bribed the wrong people thats for sure, if it only got him 7th spot then hes doing something wrong ;DQuote:
Originally Posted by Quinito
and Pacquiao is a top rank fighter yet was ranked #5 at welter after beating DLH, wtf
Lol Mr Erik. I have no problem ranking Donaire at #30, #300, #3000, or #30,000... and infinity. I'm good with it as long as he's ahead of Darchickenyan. Get my drift?
Can you post your top 30 p4p please.Quote:
Originally Posted by ElTerribleMorales7 is a lot higher than where he SHOULD BE, i'd rank Donaire at something like #30 p4p if thatQuote:
Originally Posted by snakeyHe bribed the wrong people thats for sure, if it only got him 7th spot then hes doing something wrong ;DQuote:
Originally Posted by Quinito
and Pacquiao is a top rank fighter yet was ranked #5 at welter after beating DLH, wtf
I'm not sure about that, Darchinyan has done a lot more than Donaire since they fought. Darchinyan, in addition to being a unified champion, has been on the list for 19 weeks; Donaire has been on for 7. What has he done in those 7 weeks to deserve to be ranked above Darchinyan? Because prior to that he clearly wasn't seen as good enough to be ahead of him according to those who make the list.Quote:
Originally Posted by Quinito
Exactly, once Williams had defeated Margarito and sparked Quintana in one round to get his world title back no welterweight wanted anything to do with him. So unlike Donaire who just chooses to fight nobodies, Williams moved up and won a world title at junior middle, than jumped two more weight classes and defeated a former p4p legend in Winky Wright and dominated him.Quote:
Originally Posted by CFHBeing an avoided fighter means nothing in the context of P4P lists. If it did, a highly skilled fighter like Paul Williams who has a better resume that Donaire, comparable skills, and who is avoided by fighters in three separate divisions should still be ranked well above Donaire. By your criteria he could be ranked in the top 5.Quote:
Originally Posted by mad_takamuracan't blame nonito. nonito called them up and what did they do? nothing. or if one did he cancelled it due to an "injury"(montiel). is nonito blamed for this? he did everything for those fights to happen but they avoided him, i guess quite contrast to your opinion, the notion he called out this fighters but none of them have bitten the bait proves that he should be there. fighters know if the one they are going to face are heavy risks (like nonito) thus nonito is for real. you could include jmm on that scenario wayback for they almost share the same crisis. jmm was avoided by em, mab, and hamed. and if i was'nt for pac, he won't be known as the p4p #2 now, right? question is: will history repeat itself thru nonito like what happened to jmm? only time will tell who will be the fighter that would make that breakthrough for him. (like pac did for jmm tll everybody praised him to who he is today: the #2 p4p!)Quote:
Originally Posted by CFH
this ring mag people knew that nonito is the real deal base on how he is avoided by this fighters. i guess that answers your question, bilbo, no matter how senseless it looks. the whole quality of opposition cowers away from him like he is an evovled specie of h1n1!
or you can also ask people here who will win if those fights happen.(nonito vs a, vs b, vs c...) only guy who can stand a chance actually against nonito is montiel imo. we can all predict that, can't we? of course it's just a prediction but arce vs nonito? you can guess right who would win easily there, right?
Again, regardless of the reasons, Donaire does not have the resume to be included in the P4P list in my opinion. He has fought one legitimate opponent in his entire career.
Yet Doniare is voted higher than him, it makes no sense. Donaire has only fought one single world rated fighter. No other opponent has ever held a world title at any time, only one had ever fought for one prior to meeting Donaire, and they had been knocked out.
If you take Darchinyan out of his resume he's not even top 100 and that's a fact, there is not a single name on his record that stands out.
All he did was suprisingly KO a fighter who has since gone on to do great things after the Donaire loss.
It's Vic who went on to win titles at multiple weight classes, who destroyed Jorge Arce and Christian Mijares and yet for some reason despite doing nothing in the last two years (he's fought 3 nobodies) Donaire has been promoted every time Vic achieves something.
It's ridiculous, a man should get into the p4p rankings based on his own merits, not because a fighter he beat goes on to achieve p4p worthy feats over the next couple years
I agree about Williams and Dawson. They certainly belong ahead of Donaire.
Haye's resume isn't that good though.
my thoughts exactlyQuote:
Originally Posted by CFHI'm not sure about that, Darchinyan has done a lot more than Donaire since they fought. Darchinyan, in addition to being a unified champion, has been on the list for 19 weeks; Donaire has been on for 7. What has he done in those 7 weeks to deserve to be ranked above Darchinyan? Because prior to that he clearly wasn't seen as good enough to be ahead of him according to those who make the list.Quote:
Originally Posted by Quinito
give me a couple days and i'll put my list togetherQuote:
Originally Posted by Julius RainCan you post your top 30 p4p please.Quote:
Originally Posted by ElTerribleMorales7 is a lot higher than where he SHOULD BE, i'd rank Donaire at something like #30 p4p if thatQuote:
Originally Posted by snakey
and Pacquiao is a top rank fighter yet was ranked #5 at welter after beating DLH, wtf
Who has Nonito beaten that are better than Frogemmini, Mormeck and Maccerinelli?Quote:
Originally Posted by Pugilistic
When he beat Vic Darchinyan, Vic was not a multiweight divisional champ and had not beaten Mijares and Arce, his career defining wins. That was probably on a par with beating Mormeck by KO in his back yard.
At least when Haye knocked out Mormeck he had just defeated O'Neil Bell to become the unified Cruiseweight champ, only the third since Holyfield I believe.
And you can mock the likes of Enzo and Frogemmini on Haye's record but they eclipse any fighter on Nonito's other than Darchinyan, he's not even fought a single other world class fighter, the only other 'name' on his resume being Maldonado famous only for being knocked out by Vic, Montiel and Nonito.
His record apart from the Vic fight is crap, he has beaten nobody at all.
Kelly Pavliks record is far better than Nonito's with wins over Taylor twice, Miranda and Rubio all world class operators. Sure he lost to Hopkins one of the greatest fighters of the modern era, but Nonito Donaire has one defeat also to a certain Rosendo Sanchez who I'm sure we are all familiar with.
You can try and say well Pavliks defeat was recent as if that makes it more damaging but if we are going on recent form isn't that even more reason for Donaire not to be in the top 10 seeing as he does absolutely nothing in 2 years?
Even Arthur Abrahams wins over Miranda, Eastmen, Sebastion Demers, Kinglesy Ikicke is beter is a better resume imo.
Donaiare beat a decent world champ who later went on to become a very good world champ whilst Donaire himself has just stood still.
If he is p4p nunber 7 the James Buster Douglas must SURELY be in the Top 10 greatest heavyweights of all time right? How could you dispute it, after all he toppled Tyson when he was undefeated at the very height of his powers not before he had achieved them, he beat the champ, not a fighter with potential.......
Computer must be on the fritz over at the Ring. Haye I can agree with but not Dawson and Williams.
i was thinking the same thing.Quote:
Originally Posted by XaduBoxerDo you really believed Donaire's promoter paid for that #7 P4P ranking?? :confused:Quote:
Originally Posted by ElTerribleMoralesi wouldn't be shocked if his promoter dished out a couple bucks for a ranking, would be the first timeQuote:
Originally Posted by mad_takamura
and makes sense seeing how he's done jack shit to merit a place in the top 10 much less a #7 spot
RING Mag is owned by GBP and Donaire is a Top Rank boxer... Go figure...
.
my friend, on that note: nobody's to blame here really but donaire's former promoter gary shaw. donaire could have fought kirilov, mijares or arce, but shaw chose the guy nonito dominated over. isn't that a little bit surprising? for me as a donaire fan: that's also disappointing. that's called mismanagement if not betrayal. i don't care whatever issues they had against each other but i feel bad for nonito, really.Quote:
Originally Posted by BilboWho has Nonito beaten that are better than Frogemmini, Mormeck and Maccerinelli?Quote:
Originally Posted by Pugilistic
When he beat Vic Darchinyan, Vic was not a multiweight divisional champ and had not beaten Mijares and Arce, his career defining wins. That was probably on a par with beating Mormeck by KO in his back yard.
At least when Haye knocked out Mormeck he had just defeated O'Neil Bell to become the unified Cruiseweight champ, only the third since Holyfield I believe.
And you can mock the likes of Enzo and Frogemmini on Haye's record but they eclipse any fighter on Nonito's other than Darchinyan, he's not even fought a single other world class fighter, the only other 'name' on his resume being Maldonado famous only for being knocked out by Vic, Montiel and Nonito.
His record apart from the Vic fight is crap, he has beaten nobody at all.
Kelly Pavliks record is far better than Nonito's with wins over Taylor twice, Miranda and Rubio all world class operators. Sure he lost to Hopkins one of the greatest fighters of the modern era, but Nonito Donaire has one defeat also to a certain Rosendo Sanchez who I'm sure we are all familiar with.
You can try and say well Pavliks defeat was recent as if that makes it more damaging but if we are going on recent form isn't that even more reason for Donaire not to be in the top 10 seeing as he does absolutely nothing in 2 years?
Even Arthur Abrahams wins over Miranda, Eastmen, Sebastion Demers, Kinglesy Ikicke is beter is a better resume imo.
Donaiare beat a decent world champ who later went on to become a very good world champ whilst Donaire himself has just stood still.
If he is p4p nunber 7 the James Buster Douglas must SURELY be in the Top 10 greatest heavyweights of all time right? How could you dispute it, after all he toppled Tyson when he was undefeated at the very height of his powers not before he had achieved them, he beat the champ, not a fighter with potential.......
nonito could have a better resume than what he have now if these fighters answered to his challenge:
carita lopez, mijares, arce, montiel, darchinyan..
but for some reason those fights didn't pushed through.
Yep. Gary Shaw was not really doing a good job promoting Donaire. It was negligence on his part. It had nothing to do with Donaire being disloyal.
I think Shaw started disliking Flip boxers after the Darchinyan-Gorres fight in Cebu. That was wild.
give me a break, Donaire is no Paul Williams, in terms of being highly avoided :rolleyes:
he's happy keeping his little trinket, could have easily jumped weight when Montiel said that he wanted to fight him, but well he decided to settle with Martinez
That's another bullshit excuse by Montiel. FYI, Donaire spent most of his career fighting at 115-118. He spent more of his time in Montiel's weight class than Darchinyan's at 112, and Montiel never accepted Donaire's challenge at 115.