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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
No
it means he was too small.
ummm no it proves he sucks ass, cause a guy who started his career in the same division as him, only 15 years earlier, who has about the same build and is half an inch shorter than him, also add in that he's 18 years older than him, outboxed Valuev and made him look like a fool, so don't come with the BS excuses
HOLYFIELD-
Age: 47
Height: 6′ 2½″ / 189cm
Reach: 78″ / 198cm
HAYE -
Age: 29
Height: 6′ 3″ / 191cm
Reach: 78″ / 198cm
Holyfield was a proven heavyweight.
Not all great cruiserweights make great heavyweights. In fact it's very rare. Ask Lyle.
Holyfield was also the man running the pace of the fight despite being a few years away from his 50th birthday
There are no excuses here, if haye cant do what ruiz, chagaev and a borderliner pensioner could then he indeed is a complete fraud who has wasted everybodys time!!
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
No
it means he was too small.
ummm no it proves he sucks ass, cause a guy who started his career in the same division as him, only 15 years earlier, who has about the same build and is half an inch shorter than him, also add in that he's 18 years older than him, outboxed Valuev and made him look like a fool, so don't come with the BS excuses
HOLYFIELD-
Age: 47
Height: 6′ 2½″ / 189cm
Reach: 78″ / 198cm
HAYE -
Age: 29
Height: 6′ 3″ / 191cm
Reach: 78″ / 198cm
Holyfield was a proven heavyweight.
Not all great cruiserweights make great heavyweights. In fact it's very rare. Ask Lyle.
that has to do more with skill, fighting style, and mindset than it does size, you said it'd be cause he was too small, Holyfield is a fraction of an inch shorter, and he's one of the greatest recent heavies,so don't feed me that bull
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
I don't remember Ruiz dropping Valuev either. Of course Valuev's fights with Ruiz and Holyfield I try to block from memory.
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
killersheep
I don't remember Ruiz dropping Valuev either. Of course Valuev's fights with Ruiz and Holyfield I try to block from memory.
From what i do remember (have had therapy since to try and forget) ruiz on several occasions roughed him up particularly in the 1st fight and landed clean hard punches to the FACE with his 6`2 stature
Chagaev just bullied him for 12rounds, completely cut off all space between the 2 and took a comfortable decision
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
Fight Beat | News
"Ruiz was not credited with a legitimate knockdown when he floored Valuev in the second round. Ruiz blasted Valuev with punches, knocking "The Giant" into the ropes, but the referee incorrectly ruled a slip when Valuev's knee hit the canvas after he careened off of the ropes. Scoring that round would have been different, in Ruiz' favor, if it was ruled a knockdown."
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
ummm no it proves he sucks ass, cause a guy who started his career in the same division as him, only 15 years earlier, who has about the same build and is half an inch shorter than him, also add in that he's 18 years older than him, outboxed Valuev and made him look like a fool, so don't come with the BS excuses
HOLYFIELD-
Age: 47
Height: 6′ 2½″ / 189cm
Reach: 78″ / 198cm
HAYE -
Age: 29
Height: 6′ 3″ / 191cm
Reach: 78″ / 198cm
Holyfield was a proven heavyweight.
Not all great cruiserweights make great heavyweights. In fact it's very rare. Ask Lyle.
that has to do more with skill, fighting style, and mindset than it does size, you said it'd be cause he was too small, Holyfield is a fraction of an inch shorter,
and he's one of the greatest recent heavies,so don't feed me that bull
And Haye is not. Haye is one of the best recent cruiserweights.
So should Haye lose to a man he is clearly light-years ahead in talent it will be because he is too small. Simple as.
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
rjj tszyu
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
not really, Ruiz who's hardly a big puncher already dropped the Sasquatch, and an old Holyfield already should have gotten a W against him as well, so if anything, if Haye doesn't beat Valuev, it pretty much proves he's all hype
agreed, like i said, Ruiz of all people dropped him, not too much goin on there
Did Ruiz drop Valuev?? I don't remember that!
yea he dropped him in the rematch
Do you mean the slip in the second round? Everyone slipped over at some point in that fight even the ref. The cnvas was like an ice rink. It wasn't an official knockdown and thats the right decision from the ref.
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
Holyfield was a proven heavyweight.
Not all great cruiserweights make great heavyweights. In fact it's very rare. Ask Lyle.
that has to do more with skill, fighting style, and mindset than it does size, you said it'd be cause he was too small, Holyfield is a fraction of an inch shorter,
and he's one of the greatest recent heavies,so don't feed me that bull
And Haye is not. Haye is one of the best recent cruiserweights.
So should Haye lose to a man he is clearly light-years ahead in talent it will be because he is too small. Simple as.
don't know how the hell you figure it has anything to do with him being too small, if Haye ends up being a flop at HW it's cause he wasn't that good to begin with, nothing to do with him being too small, Holyfield ended up being as great as he was cause of his dedication, workrate, and his heart/warrior mentality, he had NO PHYSICAL ADVANTAGES over any of his opponents in terms of size, nutrition is a different story, but hey guess whatever you're smoking is pretty damn strong,
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
Holyfield was a proven heavyweight.
Not all great cruiserweights make great heavyweights. In fact it's very rare. Ask Lyle.
that has to do more with skill, fighting style, and mindset than it does size, you said it'd be cause he was too small, Holyfield is a fraction of an inch shorter,
and he's one of the greatest recent heavies,so don't feed me that bull
And Haye is not. Haye is one of the best recent cruiserweights.
So should Haye lose to a man he is clearly light-years ahead in talent it will be because he is too small. Simple as.
Your really allowing this heighth advantage to get to your head.
Dont believe the press calls that clearly have valuev wearing clogs and haye slippers. The difference is 10 inches, no more, no less
If he loses and bitches about those 10inches that`ll be the david haye we all expect and will no doubt laugh about for years to come. If he loses and accepts he got beat by the better fighter he`ll actually gain some credibility in the wake of losing some
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
that has to do more with skill, fighting style, and mindset than it does size, you said it'd be cause he was too small, Holyfield is a fraction of an inch shorter, and he's one of the greatest recent heavies,so don't feed me that bull
And Haye is not. Haye is one of the best recent cruiserweights.
So should Haye lose to a man he is clearly light-years ahead in talent it will be because he is too small. Simple as.
don't know how the hell you figure it has anything to do with him being too small, if Haye ends up being a flop at HW it's cause he wasn't that good to begin with, nothing to do with him being too small, Holyfield ended up being as great as he was cause of his dedication, workrate, and his heart/warrior mentality, he had NO PHYSICAL ADVANTAGES over any of his opponents in terms of size, nutrition is a different story, but hey guess whatever you're smoking is pretty damn strong,
Err.. what? So you are saying if Haye doesn't reach the heights Evander Holyfield did at heavyweight it proves that Haye was never any good at boxing?
You do realise Holyfield was a bit special, right?
How many other cruiserweights have stepped up to heavyweight and matched Holyfields achievements?
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
Im picking Valuev to hold /jab / spoil / and maul ( like bonecrusher v Tyson), Haye gets tired and gets stopped in round 9-12.
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
hattonthehammer
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
that has to do more with skill, fighting style, and mindset than it does size, you said it'd be cause he was too small, Holyfield is a fraction of an inch shorter, and he's one of the greatest recent heavies,so don't feed me that bull
And Haye is not. Haye is one of the best recent cruiserweights.
So should Haye lose to a man he is clearly light-years ahead in talent it will be because he is too small. Simple as.
Your really allowing this heighth advantage to get to your head.
Dont believe the press calls that clearly have valuev wearing clogs and haye slippers. The difference is 10 inches, no more, no less
If he loses and bitches about those 10inches that`ll be the david haye we all expect and will no doubt laugh about for years to come. If he loses and accepts he got beat by the better fighter he`ll actually gain some credibility in the wake of losing some
:lol:
Yes, how silly of me, Valuev is ONLY 10 inches taller than a 6'3 man. Nothing. And that 7 stone weight advantage is clearly nothing either.
Fucks sake ;D
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
Quote:
Originally Posted by
hattonthehammer
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
And Haye is not. Haye is one of the best recent cruiserweights.
So should Haye lose to a man he is clearly light-years ahead in talent it will be because he is too small. Simple as.
Your really allowing this heighth advantage to get to your head.
Dont believe the press calls that clearly have valuev wearing clogs and haye slippers. The difference is 10 inches, no more, no less
If he loses and bitches about those 10inches that`ll be the david haye we all expect and will no doubt laugh about for years to come. If he loses and accepts he got beat by the better fighter he`ll actually gain some credibility in the wake of losing some
:lol:
Yes, how silly of me, Valuev is ONLY 10 inches taller than a 6'3 man. Nothing. And that 7 stone weight advantage is clearly nothing either.
Fucks sake ;D
it really isnt when your 300pounds and yet have about as much punch power behind you as paulie malignaggi
Who exactly as nikolay valuev ever steam rollered through to suggest a david haye loss would be an unfortunate occurance rather than the actual realisation of a very average fighter
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Dark Lord Al
Im picking Valuev to hold /jab / spoil / and maul ( like bonecrusher v Tyson), Haye gets tired and gets stopped in round 9-12.
The old yeti hair in the mouth trick, brilliant.
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
And Haye is not. Haye is one of the best recent cruiserweights.
So should Haye lose to a man he is clearly light-years ahead in talent it will be because he is too small. Simple as.
don't know how the hell you figure it has anything to do with him being too small, if Haye ends up being a flop at HW it's cause he wasn't that good to begin with, nothing to do with him being too small, Holyfield ended up being as great as he was cause of his dedication, workrate, and his heart/warrior mentality, he had NO PHYSICAL ADVANTAGES over any of his opponents in terms of size, nutrition is a different story, but hey guess whatever you're smoking is pretty damn strong,
Err.. what? So you are saying if Haye doesn't reach the heights Evander Holyfield did at heavyweight it proves that Haye was never any good at boxing?
You do realise Holyfield was a bit special, right?
How many other cruiserweights have stepped up to heavyweight and matched Holyfields achievements?
are you seriously that dense? yea Holyfield was special cause he had a stronger MENTAL BUILD UP than most fighters out there period, it had nothing to do with his physical build up, so if physically he could have a GREAT RUN against GREAT OPPOSITION why the hell should "size" hold Haye down, especially seeing how he's oh so talented :rolleyes:
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
hattonthehammer
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
Quote:
Originally Posted by
hattonthehammer
Your really allowing this heighth advantage to get to your head.
Dont believe the press calls that clearly have valuev wearing clogs and haye slippers. The difference is 10 inches, no more, no less
If he loses and bitches about those 10inches that`ll be the david haye we all expect and will no doubt laugh about for years to come. If he loses and accepts he got beat by the better fighter he`ll actually gain some credibility in the wake of losing some
:lol:
Yes, how silly of me, Valuev is ONLY 10 inches taller than a 6'3 man. Nothing. And that 7 stone weight advantage is clearly nothing either.
Fucks sake ;D
it really isnt when your 300pounds and yet have about as much punch power behind you as paulie malignaggi
Who exactly as nikolay valuev ever steam rollered through to suggest a david haye loss would be an unfortunate occurance rather than the actual realisation of a very average fighter
Right.. so you are saying Valuev's size is no advantage to him?
Haye hasn't got a great chin. I'm sure even a light punching 300lb man can hurt him.
Very average fighters don't win world amateur medals and top it up by turning pro to become undisputed champion of a division.
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
don't know how the hell you figure it has anything to do with him being too small, if Haye ends up being a flop at HW it's cause he wasn't that good to begin with, nothing to do with him being too small, Holyfield ended up being as great as he was cause of his dedication, workrate, and his heart/warrior mentality, he had NO PHYSICAL ADVANTAGES over any of his opponents in terms of size, nutrition is a different story, but hey guess whatever you're smoking is pretty damn strong,
Err.. what? So you are saying if Haye doesn't reach the heights Evander Holyfield did at heavyweight it proves that Haye was never any good at boxing?
You do realise Holyfield was a bit special, right?
How many other cruiserweights have stepped up to heavyweight and matched Holyfields achievements?
are you seriously that dense? yea Holyfield was special cause he had a stronger MENTAL BUILD UP than most fighters out there period, it had nothing to do with his physical build up, so if physically he could have a GREAT RUN against GREAT OPPOSITION why the hell should "size" hold Haye down, especially seeing how he's oh so talented :rolleyes:
Says the kid that is still judging Haye by the incredible elite standard set by the great Evander Holyfield.
:rolleyes:
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
Quote:
Originally Posted by
hattonthehammer
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
:lol:
Yes, how silly of me, Valuev is ONLY 10 inches taller than a 6'3 man. Nothing. And that 7 stone weight advantage is clearly nothing either.
Fucks sake ;D
it really isnt when your 300pounds and yet have about as much punch power behind you as paulie malignaggi
Who exactly as nikolay valuev ever steam rollered through to suggest a david haye loss would be an unfortunate occurance rather than the actual realisation of a very average fighter
Right.. so you are saying Valuev's size is no advantage to him?
Haye hasn't got a great chin. I'm sure even a light punching 300lb man can hurt him.
Very average fighters don't win world amateur medals and top it up by turning pro to become undisputed champion of a division.
Don't you understand physics Fenster? Mass has nothing to do with velocity................ ;D
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
Quote:
Originally Posted by
hattonthehammer
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
:lol:
Yes, how silly of me, Valuev is ONLY 10 inches taller than a 6'3 man. Nothing. And that 7 stone weight advantage is clearly nothing either.
Fucks sake ;D
it really isnt when your 300pounds and yet have about as much punch power behind you as paulie malignaggi
Who exactly as nikolay valuev ever steam rollered through to suggest a david haye loss would be an unfortunate occurance rather than the actual realisation of a very average fighter
Right.. so you are saying Valuev's size is no advantage to him?
Haye hasn't got a great chin. I'm sure even a light punching 300lb man can hurt him.
Very average fighters don't win world amateur medals and top it up by turning pro to become undisputed champion of a division.
they do when it's an incredibly weak division lol hell both Judah and Spinks were undisputed welterweight champions, and neither are worth shit
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
Err.. what? So you are saying if Haye doesn't reach the heights Evander Holyfield did at heavyweight it proves that Haye was never any good at boxing?
You do realise Holyfield was a bit special, right?
How many other cruiserweights have stepped up to heavyweight and matched Holyfields achievements?
are you seriously that dense? yea Holyfield was special cause he had a stronger MENTAL BUILD UP than most fighters out there period, it had nothing to do with his physical build up, so if physically he could have a GREAT RUN against GREAT OPPOSITION why the hell should "size" hold Haye down, especially seeing how he's oh so talented :rolleyes:
Says the kid that is still judging Haye by the incredible elite standard set by the great Evander Holyfield.
:rolleyes:
coming from the guy who says that Haye will only lose cause of a size disadvantage, and not the fact that he's utter garbage with a big mouth :rolleyes:
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
Quote:
Originally Posted by
hattonthehammer
it really isnt when your 300pounds and yet have about as much punch power behind you as paulie malignaggi
Who exactly as nikolay valuev ever steam rollered through to suggest a david haye loss would be an unfortunate occurance rather than the actual realisation of a very average fighter
Right.. so you are saying Valuev's size is no advantage to him?
Haye hasn't got a great chin. I'm sure even a light punching 300lb man can hurt him.
Very average fighters don't win world amateur medals and top it up by turning pro to become undisputed champion of a division.
they do when it's an incredibly weak division lol hell both Judah and Spinks were undisputed welterweight champions, and neither are worth shit
I actually think Judah was a class act at 140, just 147 was too big for him IMO.
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
rjj tszyu
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
Right.. so you are saying Valuev's size is no advantage to him?
Haye hasn't got a great chin. I'm sure even a light punching 300lb man can hurt him.
Very average fighters don't win world amateur medals and top it up by turning pro to become undisputed champion of a division.
they do when it's an incredibly weak division lol hell both Judah and Spinks were undisputed welterweight champions, and neither are worth shit
I actually think Judah was a class act at 140, just 147 was too big for him IMO.
He was all class at 147 as well, unfortunately only for the first 6 rounds of his fights.
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
are you seriously that dense? yea Holyfield was special cause he had a stronger MENTAL BUILD UP than most fighters out there period, it had nothing to do with his physical build up, so if physically he could have a GREAT RUN against GREAT OPPOSITION why the hell should "size" hold Haye down, especially seeing how he's oh so talented :rolleyes:
Says the kid that is still judging Haye by the incredible elite standard set by the great Evander Holyfield.
:rolleyes:
coming from the guy who says that Haye will only lose cause of a size disadvantage, and not
the fact that he's utter garbage with a big mouth :rolleyes:
So Haye is utter garbage (with a big mouth :lol:).
Judah and Spinks are shit.
Anyone that can't emulate Evander Holyfield is garbage.
;D
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
Says the kid that is still judging Haye by the incredible elite standard set by the great Evander Holyfield.
:rolleyes:
coming from the guy who says that Haye will only lose cause of a size disadvantage, and not
the fact that he's utter garbage with a big mouth :rolleyes:
So Haye is utter garbage (with a big mouth :lol:).
Judah and Spinks are shit.
Anyone that can't emulate Evander Holyfield is garbage.
;D
you keep going around in circles yet don't put any real reason to why Haye is a special exception and should be given the excuse of him being too small, yet guys like Ruiz, Chagaev, Imbragimov, Brewster, and even Tua don't get the same sympathy, say whatever makes you feel better, but you're talking out your ass Fenster, and that is FACT
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
It's in Germany. Haye needs a knockout just to get a draw over there. FACT.
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
:lol:
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
coming from the guy who says that Haye will only lose cause of a size disadvantage, and not the fact that he's utter garbage with a big mouth :rolleyes:
So Haye is utter garbage (with a big mouth :lol:).
Judah and Spinks are shit.
Anyone that can't emulate Evander Holyfield is garbage.
;D
you keep going around in circles yet don't put any real reason to why Haye is a special exception and should be given the excuse of him being too small, yet guys like Ruiz, Chagaev, Imbragimov, Brewster, and even Tua don't get the same sympathy, say whatever makes you feel better, but you're talking out your ass Fenster, and that is FACT
You're making yourself look stupid. Who said Haye should get a special exception?
Ruiz, Chagaev, Imbragimov, Brewster and Tua are proven heavyweights, right? They have had dozens of fights at heavyweight.
Haye started out at cruiserweight. He's had one fight at heavyweight since leaving the cruiserweight divison.
Valuev is 10 inches taller and 100lb heavier. That is a HUGE size advantage, no? So if Valuev beats Haye his SIZE will be a factor.
How the fuck is that hard to understand? Seriously....
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
:lol:
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
So Haye is utter garbage (with a big mouth :lol:).
Judah and Spinks are shit.
Anyone that can't emulate Evander Holyfield is garbage.
;D
you keep going around in circles yet don't put any real reason to why Haye is a special exception and should be given the excuse of him being too small, yet guys like Ruiz, Chagaev, Imbragimov, Brewster, and even Tua don't get the same sympathy, say whatever makes you feel better, but you're talking out your ass Fenster, and that is FACT
You're making yourself look stupid. Who said Haye should get a special exception?
Ruiz, Chagaev, Imbragimov, Brewster and Tua are proven heavyweights, right? They have had dozens of fights at heavyweight.
Haye started out at cruiserweight. He's had one fight at heavyweight since leaving the cruiserweight divison.
Valuev is 10 inches taller and 100lb heavier. That is a HUGE size advantage, no? So if Valuev beats Haye his SIZE will be a factor.
How the fuck is that hard to understand? Seriously....
you're right Haye's unproven as a HW, so then why the fuck has he been lined up for already 3 goddam title shots?
and apart from maybe the Klitschko's everyone is smaller than the damn Sasquatch, yet 3 other fighters (Ruiz, Chagaev, Holyfield) all handled him very well, you keep saying that Haye's lack of experience is gonna play a roll but experience and SIZE don't have anything to do with the other, he doesn't have much experience at the weight and he SHOULDN'T be getting a title shot, but he is, and if he crumbles it's not cause he wasn't PHYSICALLY able, do i have to spell it out in lights for you with big flashing arrows for you to kinda get the picture?
other small heavies have dealt with him fine, and regardless of his experience at the division he's already built up to a heavyweight and isn't killing himself to get into shape, oh wait he's coming off a back injury :rolleyes:
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
:lol:
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
you keep going around in circles yet don't put any real reason to why Haye is a special exception and should be given the excuse of him being too small, yet guys like Ruiz, Chagaev, Imbragimov, Brewster, and even Tua don't get the same sympathy, say whatever makes you feel better, but you're talking out your ass Fenster, and that is FACT
You're making yourself look stupid. Who said Haye should get a special exception?
Ruiz, Chagaev, Imbragimov, Brewster and Tua are proven heavyweights, right? They have had dozens of fights at heavyweight.
Haye started out at cruiserweight. He's had one fight at heavyweight since leaving the cruiserweight divison.
Valuev is 10 inches taller and 100lb heavier. That is a HUGE size advantage, no? So if Valuev beats Haye his SIZE will be a factor.
How the fuck is that hard to understand? Seriously....
you're right Haye's unproven as a HW, so then why the fuck has he been lined up for already 3 goddam title shots?
and apart from maybe the Klitschko's everyone is smaller than the damn Sasquatch, yet 3 other fighters (Ruiz, Chagaev, Holyfield) all handled him very well, you keep saying that Haye's lack of experience is gonna play a roll but experience and SIZE don't have anything to do with the other, he doesn't have much experience at the weight and he SHOULDN'T be getting a title shot, but he is, and if he crumbles it's not cause he wasn't PHYSICALLY able, do i have to spell it out in lights for you with big flashing arrows for you to kinda get the picture?
other small heavies have dealt with him fine, and regardless of his experience at the division he's already built up to a heavyweight and isn't killing himself to get into shape, oh wait he's coming off a back injury :rolleyes:
The reason he's got the title shot is - he's young and exciting and willing to take the money they offered and seen as BEATABLE by both Klits and Valuev.
It's not rocket science, for fucks sake. Your problem should be with Valuev and the Klits for giving him the shot not Haye for taking it. :rolleyes:
I've not said a thing about Haye's "lack of experience." I'm purley talking about size difference.
If a man is 10 inches taller and 100lb heavier he has a SIZE advantage that will be a factor in a fight. Simple as.
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
Depends if Haye can fight for 3mins of every round. If so, and hes ok with his stamina, then its possible he can beat him cos Valuev aint no great shakes. HOWEVER, i question Hayes ability to fight for 12rounds, 3mins a round so my £10 will be on a Valuev win in R10. Or thereabouts. Like to see Haye win as theres a side to him that our American friends have yet to see. Seems like a nice enough guy. Forget all the shouting and shit, thats all to sell tickets.
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
johnmaff36
Depends if Haye can fight for 3mins of every round. If so, and hes ok with his stamina, then its possible he can beat him cos Valuev aint no great shakes. HOWEVER, i question Hayes ability to fight for 12rounds, 3mins a round so my £10 will be on a Valuev win in R10. Or thereabouts. Like to see Haye win as theres a side to him that our American friends have yet to see. Seems like a nice enough guy. Forget all the shouting and shit, thats all to sell tickets.
I don't know that term, what does it mean?
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
as i said earlier, a win over Valuev proves jack shit, right now Sasquatch should have 4 losses on his record (Ruiz-Twice, Chagaev-only guy to get credit and the nod, and Holyfield-the dinosaur schooled him), he's more a freak show than he is a champion, and that's why Haye's taking him on
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
Haye wins this fight - Of that I'm certain. Nothing against 'Big' Nikolai but he is going to have a frightening shock when Hayes super fast bombs hit him from all angles.
I can see Haye doing the moving back and around the ring like Chagaev - keeping out of harms way and then landing a few eye catching shots every round. (without any real commitment to engage) The thing is Haye will hit harder and quicker than Chagaev ever could.
It's gonna be interesting to see how both men handle getting hit - Haye is largely untested at this weight while there aren't really any noted hitters on Valuev's resume.
Both have been out of the ring for approximately a year and the effect could be worse on Haye who relies more on his speed and reflexes than Valuev.
I know Haye has tried to get under the skin of Valuev but I don't think it will work - the man will just fight his usual fight - no surprises. It's up to Haye to have a game plan and execute it and bring a Plan B.
Valuev isn't easy to beat - the sheer size of him causes problems. I do think Haye will KO him but I expect the first few rounds to be pretty quiet. When Haye hurts him in those middle rounds - he will finish him off.
I expect to feel the tremors in my living room in Wales.;D
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
as i said earlier, a win over Valuev proves jack shit, right now Sasquatch should have 4 losses on his record (Ruiz-Twice, Chagaev-only guy to get credit and the nod, and Holyfield-the dinosaur schooled him), he's more a freak show than he is a champion, and that's why Haye's taking him on
I think Haye's taking him on because he needs experience against a big man before he goes for a Klit, Valuev is shit yes but he holds the WBA belt, which when all is said and done is the oldest of all the alphabets and is the one that all the ATG's like Marciano, Louis etc held. Not trying to say it holds any water anymore but it would give him something to use in any negotiating next time he's in talks with the Klits. Lets face it when he signed to fight Wlad the terms were ridiculous, he had to fight both brothers in 3 rematches if he took Wlads belts.
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
rjj tszyu
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
as i said earlier, a win over Valuev proves jack shit, right now Sasquatch should have 4 losses on his record (Ruiz-Twice, Chagaev-only guy to get credit and the nod, and Holyfield-the dinosaur schooled him), he's more a freak show than he is a champion, and that's why Haye's taking him on
I think Haye's taking him on because he needs experience against a big man before he goes for a Klit, Valuev is shit yes but he holds
the WBA belt, which when all is said and done is the oldest of all the alphabets and is the one that all the ATG's like Marciano, Louis etc held. Not trying to say it holds any water anymore but it would give him something to use in any negotiating next time he's in talks with the Klits. Lets face it when he signed to fight Wlad the terms were ridiculous, he had to fight both brothers in 3 rematches if he took Wlads belts.
All that means nothing , because John Ruiz also held it twice , and he is totally shit.
Fact Haye is going for Valuev cos he is the weakest of the champions.
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
rjj tszyu
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
as i said earlier, a win over Valuev proves jack shit, right now Sasquatch should have 4 losses on his record (Ruiz-Twice, Chagaev-only guy to get credit and the nod, and Holyfield-the dinosaur schooled him), he's more a freak show than he is a champion, and that's why Haye's taking him on
I think Haye's taking him on because he needs experience against a big man before he goes for a Klit, Valuev is shit yes but he holds the WBA belt, which when all is said and done is the oldest of all the alphabets and is the one that all the ATG's like Marciano, Louis etc held. Not trying to say it holds any water anymore but it would give him something to use in any negotiating next time he's in talks with the Klits. Lets face it when he signed to fight Wlad the terms were ridiculous, he had to fight both brothers in 3 rematches if he took Wlads belts.
Having read the first half of your first sentence, are you accusing Haye of being some kinda sexual deviant?
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
killersheep
Quote:
Originally Posted by
johnmaff36
Depends if Haye can fight for 3mins of every round. If so, and hes ok with his stamina, then its possible he can beat him cos Valuev aint no great shakes. HOWEVER, i question Hayes ability to fight for 12rounds, 3mins a round so my £10 will be on a Valuev win in R10. Or thereabouts. Like to see Haye win as theres a side to him that our American friends have yet to see. Seems like a nice enough guy. Forget all the shouting and shit, thats all to sell tickets.
I don't know that term, what does it mean?
It just means that hes very ordinary and nothing special.
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
the more I think about this I believe Haye can win a UD over there. I know how difficult it can be to get a decision over there but if he keeps his head and sticks to his gameplan he can give them no choice.
Recklessness and not being in 12 round condition is the only way he can lose this.
However despite how clumsy, and lacking in natural ability, Valuev is let's be honest if Haye can knock him out it will be sensational - and get people talking about the heavies again.
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bilbo
I would LOVE to be wrong though, as nothing would give me greater pleasure than seeing Haye's annoying smirk wiped off his face as his ridiculously buff body gets smashed to the canvas.
;D;D;D;D;D
PMSL Bilbo, that made me laugh. You always have some kind hatred/envy towards good looking boxers with good physiques...
It really does seem to eat away at you!
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Kirkland Laing
It's in Germany. Haye needs a knockout just to get a draw over there. FACT.
Hey KL, you read that book yet in your avatar? I read about it in the paper last week and was thinking about getting it for my old man for Xmas.
After I've read it first of course... ;D
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Re: Haye-Valuev - Who wins? Fact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mark TKO
the more I think about this I believe Haye can win a UD over there. I know how difficult it can be to get a decision over there but if he keeps his head and sticks to his gameplan he can give them no choice.
Recklessness and not being in 12 round condition is the only way he can lose this.
However despite how clumsy, and lacking in natural ability, Valuev is let's be honest if Haye can knock him out it will be sensational - and get people talking about the heavies again.
I agree and think Haye will win this and history tells us that Valuev finds the smaller faster fighters difficult ;)
Haye could even force a stoppage here :cool:
If you can find a way around his freakish size then for me Valuev really is two bob. Fact
