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By that rationale - If Wilder wanted to prove he's the best he'd take the $12.5 million (5 x his biggest purse), by the mans own admission he has plenty of money already, businesses, homes, and ya'll should stop worrying about how much money he got. He doing just fine, baby.
He - like his fans - sure is concerned about how much Joshua makes for someone desperate to make the fight.
I don’t understand people’s comments on this thread.
Wilder should accept what he is offered.
Hearn has been 💯 correct in his comments.
The PR machine has been running from day 1 on joshuna. He has traveled all around the uk. Had fights up and down the country, England, Scotland, Ireland. Built up that fan base. Had his fights shown on America. He has earned the uk fans, to the normal fight fans, the outsiders, the house wife’s. He has earned those pay per views. Maximum exposure to bring in as much money as possible, all calculated and good buisness sense to get where they are now.
Wilder has a belt yes, but what else? No fans, no filled stadiums, it is what it is, take humble pie and accept your position in the pecking order. Whether he beats or is better than joshuna is irrelevant. Matchroom and joshuna have worked hard to get to the position where they are. Wilder and his camp can’t say the same. His position and fan base for being an American heavy weight champion is almost embarrassing.
I think you are confused about people being Wilder fans and people thinking that he deserves a bigger cut. Two different things.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fenster
Wilder doesn't deserve even 40%. He needs to eat humble pie.
But he WILL KO AJ in 6
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Originally Posted by Memphis
Maybe it's accurate, maybe it isn't. Good reason to negotiate percentages instead of dollar figures.
damn Im all over your ass lately estoy bromiando tu sabesQuote:
Originally Posted by TitoFanQuote:
Originally Posted by Memphis
Maybe it's accurate, maybe it isn't. Good reason to negotiate percentages instead of dollar figures.
They're saying the same thing.Quote:
Originally Posted by powerpuncherI think you are confused about people being Wilder fans and people thinking that he deserves a bigger cut. Two different things.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fenster
Everyone, apart from Wilder fans, and, "he deserves a bigger cut, Joshua is ducking him" fans are happy to see the fight regardless of how many millions these already filthy rich millionaires make.
Does that cover everyone?
I don't have a problem with that, that's Wilder's decision to make.Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFanQuote:
Originally Posted by Memphis
Maybe it's accurate, maybe it isn't. Good reason to negotiate percentages instead of dollar figures.
What I'm struggling with is the premise that $12.5m represents a derisory offer that's closer to 20% than it is 40%.
I spoke to a Kiwi guy I used to work with yesterday about this and he was in the 'Wilder isn't getting paid enough' camp. His basis, Parker got 13 million, Wilder should get more. Fuck off did Parker get 13 million I say. Yeah.....yeah......13 million New Zealand Dollars!!
Now I'm not suggesting anyone here is that stupid, but it does highlight the point that numbers are being thrown about with little care or thought.
There seems to be this idea that the fight is worth vastly more than it actually is and no one wants to say where that money is coming from. Master will but he just makes up nonsense.
Looks like AJ has been reading my posts. “If Team Wilder think it’s a $100million fight, MAKE A COUNTER OFFER!”
https://www.boxingscene.com/joshua-t...morrow--127099
Wilder should carry on defending his title and just continue to make noise to irritate AJ and Eddie.
Eventually everyone will pressurise AJ to accept the fight and pay Wilder more than they really want.
AJ will get bored of mandatories and poor defences no matter how sky sells it.
Dude seriously you cant be saying this shit with a straight face, tell me you're on a massive wind up?Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
I am very serious. It is high stakes poker.Quote:
Originally Posted by MemphisDude seriously you cant be saying this shit with a straight face, tell me you're on a massive wind up?Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
And you know about high stakes poker now, like you do about assessing the value of a fight.:rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterI am very serious. It is high stakes poker.Quote:
Originally Posted by MemphisDude seriously you cant be saying this shit with a straight face, tell me you're on a massive wind up?Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
The thing that is annoying me is that both camps are discussing it differently, AJ is offering a money up front deal Wilder is requesting a % split.
We can only speculate on how much the fight will make so when we are talking in percentages it is sheer guess work.
why doesnt Eddie say we are offering £12m which we believe is equal to a 25% split"
Why doesn't Wilder say "we will accept a 40/60 split which we believe is equal to £30m"
I know that as fans we have no right to concern themselves with the financials during negotiations but it would be interesting to see just how far apart they both actually are.
So Shelly is reported as saying “Team Wilder are gonna make a counter offer in the next couple of days!”
I cannot fucking wait! Only it won’t be an offer, will it?
What it’ll be is “GIVE US X AMOUNT” or WE’LL TAKE X %”
That is not an offer, that is saying “you give us”.
An offer is “We’ll give you” .
Be prepared for a lot more shit talk from all parties.
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Originally Posted by MemphisI don't have a problem with that, that's Wilder's decision to make.Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFanQuote:
Originally Posted by Memphis
Maybe it's accurate, maybe it isn't. Good reason to negotiate percentages instead of dollar figures.
What I'm struggling with is the premise that $12.5m represents a derisory offer that's closer to 20% than it is 40%.
I spoke to a Kiwi guy I used to work with yesterday about this and he was in the 'Wilder isn't getting paid enough' camp. His basis, Parker got 13 million, Wilder should get more. Fuck off did Parker get 13 million I say. Yeah.....yeah......13 million New Zealand Dollars!!
Now I'm not suggesting anyone here is that stupid, but it does highlight the point that numbers are being thrown about with little care or thought.
There seems to be this idea that the fight is worth vastly more than it actually is and no one wants to say where that money is coming from. Master will but he just makes up nonsense.
Frankly I don't know many of us can predict accurately how much that fight is finally going to be worth. It is, after all, a mega-heavyweight-world-title unification bout between the champions from the U.S. and the U.K. It has mega bucks written all over it. You might say it's being over estimated..... but who's to say you're not wrong? What it boils down to is, Wilder would be taking an unnecessary chance to be paid A LOT LESS than Joshua if he accepts the $12.5 million..... and that would go over like a glass of castor oil after a good meal. Hearn is a veteran businessman, and should know better than to throw a flat dollar figure, instead of the normal split. He's obviously hoping it turns out to be a measly percentage of the eventual earnings.
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Originally Posted by Batman
Same thing I said, only different. :)
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Originally Posted by TitoFan
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Originally Posted by Primo Carnera
Seriously? We're going to get into semantics now? They should be haggling over the splits, regardless of who gives what to whom.
Mate, if you think it’s semantics and unimportant, you are either seriously missing the point or deliberately choosing to.
The wording used was deliberately chosen to give people a false reading of the situation.
We all know what it means.
Obviously we want the fight done, and it probably will be, but there will be a lot of bullshit along the way!
Yes my gut feel is that certain parties are over valuing this fight
I've never suggested that anyone should have the numbers down to the last bean. Only apply a bit of common sense, a bit of basic maths, precedent and from there answer the question where does the rest of the money come from.
Using the Klitschko fight as a template. It reportedly made 40-50 million quid. It has to have been closer to 50, so $70 million US. That money was chiefly made up of UK TV money. Allegedly 1.5 million PPV view buys at £20 = £30 million. Gate money was reportedly around £9 million. RTL TV £4 million, US TV £2 million. Rest of the World TV and merchandise £5 million.
You're quite right in that none of us know the exact numbers, but we can see that they are in the ballpark. The 1.5m PPV buys in the UK was a number Eddie Hearn mentioned, they (SKY/Matchroom) don't generally release them. He's no way going to under cook those numbers so it's either accurate, or he's adding a bit on top in which case the pot was actually less.
As far as I can see certain elements have a ceiling. Wembley, Cardiff, can't get any fuller. They've maxed out that revenue stream. 'Rest of the World TV and merchandise' Are Norway going to pull an extra bundle of cash out their ass pocket because it's Deontay Wilder? I don't think so. Is someone going to pay an obscene amount of dough for the rights to sell a T-Shirt with a windmill attached to the front?
I've got no problem with anyone suggesting that AJ Wilder does better than AJ Klitschko. I'd have my doubts of course....
As I've said already, the problem I have with this $100m number is that not only does it suggest AJ Wilder is bigger than AJ Klitschko, the biggest fight in UK boxing history, but it suggests that it absolutely blows it out of the water. I just don't see it.
I would have thought Klitschko had a bigger following then Wilder.Quote:
Originally Posted by Memphis
Wilder will bring huge US TV ppv money compared to Wlad.
Now give him 40%.
Me too. He brought the RTL money, he brought the HBO money (wasnt a great amount granted)Quote:
Originally Posted by BeanzI would have thought Klitschko had a bigger following then Wilder.Quote:
Originally Posted by Memphis
Showtime are going to sell this PPV in the states, in the afternoon? Or is the fight going to happen at silly o'clock UK time to align? That would have a knock on the UK market surely?Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
Explain how this happens.
He can’t explain cos he’s a fuckin donut! He reckons 90,000 are gonna turn up at Wembley, paying £200 to be a mile away from the action and people are gonna pay £50k ringside.Quote:
Originally Posted by MemphisShowtime are going to sell this PPV in the states, in the afternoon? Or is the fight going to happen at silly o'clock UK time to align? That would have a knock on the UK market surely?Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
Explain how this happens.
Meanwhile 10 million people in the states are gonna ppv it a 3pm on a Saturday.:rolleyes:
I'd be surprised if this fight doesn't cater to US time as they are really trying to push wilder mainstream here. It will be interesting to see what happens time wise, they did Vlad fights in the afternoon here. Actually an afternoon showing would be more convenient for me but they usually don't consult with me about air timesQuote:
Originally Posted by MemphisShowtime are going to sell this PPV in the states, in the afternoon? Or is the fight going to happen at silly o'clock UK time to align? That would have a knock on the UK market surely?Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
Explain how this happens.
Bottom line is that Wilder needs more fights like the Ortiz one to build his profile more, the Barclays Centre wasn't even sold out for the Ortiz fight and it only holds 18,000 people.
Joshua's last 3 fights have pulled in around 250,000 people.
Those figures and the fact Josh holds 3 of the 4 belts tell us all we need to know.
Wilder and his people are shit businessmen, they should have jumped at the chance to be ringside on Sky Sports the other week and taken the Whyte fight without even thinking about it whether it was in the UK or the USA.
Shows you just how potent Eddie Hearn is at promoting ;)
Deontay Wilder has nowhere near the clout that AJ has. I'm talking promotional clout. AJ also has far far better names on his resume. There is no way wilder should be getting more than 40% of the purse.
I think Wilder has accepted 40%.Quote:
Originally Posted by brocktonblockbust
That's interesting news. I just threw that number out there 40% but if this is true now what you're saying that was a pretty good guess on my part. I mean AJ has fought Wladimir Klitschko but who has Wilder fought? Bermane Stiverne and Ortiz are his two best wins and that is not saying much although Ortiz did very well for himself at the age of 41. Perhaps AJ should demand 65% and force Wilder into a 35% humiliation. In the end Wilder will have to accept if he wants to continue with his careerQuote:
Originally Posted by MasterI think Wilder has accepted 40%.Quote:
Originally Posted by brocktonblockbust
cracking estimation Brocko, have you thought about becoming a promoter? the press conferences would be awesomeQuote:
Originally Posted by brocktonblockbustThat's interesting news. I just threw that number out there 40% but if this is true now what you're saying that was a pretty good guess on my part. I mean AJ has fought Wladimir Klitschko but who has Wilder fought? Bermane Stiverne and Ortiz are his two best wins and that is not saying much although Ortiz did very well for himself at the age of 41. Perhaps AJ should demand 65% and force Wilder into a 35% humiliation. In the end Wilder will have to accept if he wants to continue with his careerQuote:
Originally Posted by MasterI think Wilder has accepted 40%.Quote:
Originally Posted by brocktonblockbust
Easy. Sky pretend it will start at 11 but really it will be 2am.Quote:
Originally Posted by MemphisShowtime are going to sell this PPV in the states, in the afternoon? Or is the fight going to happen at silly o'clock UK time to align? That would have a knock on the UK market surely?Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
Explain how this happens.
If I was Wilder I would ask for $40 million or 40% of the revenue whichever is higher.
;D:LOLATYOU::LOLATYOU::LMAO::rofmaoal::rotflmao::r otflmao::rotflmao:Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterEasy. Sky pretend it will start at 11 but really it will be 2am.Quote:
Originally Posted by MemphisShowtime are going to sell this PPV in the states, in the afternoon? Or is the fight going to happen at silly o'clock UK time to align? That would have a knock on the UK market surely?Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
Explain how this happens.
If I was Wilder I would ask for $40 million or 40% of the revenue whichever is higher.
You have surpassed yourself !
Let me teach you guys something. America never gave a shit about Klitschko. Wilder is from here and can bring fat money with PPV. So yes the fight could bring in 100 million. I don't know if AJ is trying to price himself out of a fight. I think AJ is a better fighter. Still if I was his management team I would have at least one or two more fight to sharpen my skills.
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Originally Posted by mrbig1
Let me teach you something. Your American fighter is not PPV in your country, never has been, not once, ever, 40 fights. He doesn't even have an exclusive deal with a major cable outlet. He got paid $2 million for his last fight (his biggest payday).
So you're claiming that $98 million extra is on the line, Wilder is going from a $2 million to $50 million fighter overnight. Get real.
Be honest with yourselves. Are you really trying to use Wilder's past fights against powderpuffs to gauge what his following would be for a mega-heavyweight-unification fight involving an American, the likes of which haven't been seen in decades? So because the American public has been slow to warm up to Wilder, they would stay home or tune in to something else if and when they find out Wilder is going to be fighting the great AJ? There's two sides to this coin, and it amazes me how many people are only willing to look at one.
1. Why have the Americans been”slow to warm up” to Wilder? Ans. because he doesn’t compare with what went before him.Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
2. AJ isn’t a great, nowhere near it, he’s the best of the current bunch, that’s all. Consequently , that’s why it won’t sell on a Saturday afternoon in the States.
3. If I’m wrong and it is a mega-heavyweight-unification fight involving an American, and it is a $100 million fight, then Wilder’s team will have no trouble stumping up an offer to get AJ over there. And if AJ refuses to take the bait, then they can start to say AJ is ducking Wilder.
See below.
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Originally Posted by Primo Carnera1. Why have the Americans been”slow to warm up” to Wilder? Ans. because he doesn’t compare with what went before him.Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
Things don't occur in a time vacuum. Prior to AJ and Wilder there was Wlad, the boxing equivalent of a gigantic chloroform blanket over U.S. boxing fandom... for well over a decade. Waking up from this slumber takes more than one or two fights. It doesn't help that Wilder started off his career fighting a multitude of bums. He's since corrected that.
2. AJ isn’t a great, nowhere near it, he’s the best of the current bunch, that’s all. Consequently , that’s why it won’t sell on a Saturday afternoon in the States.
The guy who dethroned Wlad?? (I don't count Fury). In one of the most exciting heavyweight title fights in recent memory?? Now you're selling AJ short. So he's basically God in the UK.... but a nobody in the States? Nah... I don't buy it.
3. If I’m wrong and it is a mega-heavyweight-unification fight involving an American, and it is a $100 million fight, then Wilder’s team will have no trouble stumping up an offer to get AJ over there. And if AJ refuses to take the bait, then they can start to say AJ is ducking Wilder.
One thing I'll agree on with everyone else is that Wilder's team is shitty at self-promotion. I can't say where the fight should be, other than to also agree it would have a much bigger gate in the UK than in the States. They're both undefeated champions, representing countries with a vast tradition of boxing rivalry. All I'm saying is that should be worth something.
I agree Wilder has piss poor promotion but for 10 years no one gave a shit about the heavyweight division here in America. After a Floyd fight people would talk boxing a bit and they would ask me who the heavyweight champ was. Putting this all on Wilder is a bit much. His " I want to kill someone" comment is probably the most press he ever got here. When you pick up the New York Times or other major paper rarely do they have anything about boxing. There would always be a few articles about Floyd up or Manny around fight time, I've read a couple on GGG and Canelo but boxing is a very niche sport here and the heavyweight division even more so. If u are blaming Wilder for screwing up the division u are giving him way to much credit. He is trying to get out and do interviews etc but this will not be an overnight revival of the heavyweight division.Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFanSee below.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo Carnera1. Why have the Americans been”slow to warm up” to Wilder? Ans. because he doesn’t compare with what went before him.Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
Things don't occur in a time vacuum. Prior to AJ and Wilder there was Wlad, the boxing equivalent of a gigantic chloroform blanket over U.S. boxing fandom... for well over a decade. Waking up from this slumber takes more than one or two fights. It doesn't help that Wilder started off his career fighting a multitude of bums. He's since corrected that.
2. AJ isn’t a great, nowhere near it, he’s the best of the current bunch, that’s all. Consequently , that’s why it won’t sell on a Saturday afternoon in the States.
The guy who dethroned Wlad?? (I don't count Fury). In one of the most exciting heavyweight title fights in recent memory?? Now you're selling AJ short. So he's basically God in the UK.... but a nobody in the States? Nah... I don't buy it.
3. If I’m wrong and it is a mega-heavyweight-unification fight involving an American, and it is a $100 million fight, then Wilder’s team will have no trouble stumping up an offer to get AJ over there. And if AJ refuses to take the bait, then they can start to say AJ is ducking Wilder.
One thing I'll agree on with everyone else is that Wilder's team is shitty at self-promotion. I can't say where the fight should be, other than to also agree it would have a much bigger gate in the UK than in the States. They're both undefeated champions, representing countries with a vast tradition of boxing rivalry. All I'm saying is that should be worth something.
Quote:
Originally Posted by walrusI agree Wilder has piss poor promotion but for 10 years no one gave a shit about the heavyweight division here in America. After a Floyd fight people would talk boxing a bit and they would ask me who the heavyweight champ was. Putting this all on Wilder is a bit much. His " I want to kill someone" comment is probably the most press he ever got here. When you pick up the New York Times or other major paper rarely do they have anything about boxing. There would always be a few articles about Floyd up or Manny around fight time, I've read a couple on GGG and Canelo but boxing is a very niche sport here and the heavyweight division even more so. If u are blaming Wilder for screwing up the division u are giving him way to much credit. He is trying to get out and do interviews etc but this will not be an overnight revival of the heavyweight division.Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFanSee below.
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Originally Posted by Primo Carnera1. Why have the Americans been”slow to warm up” to Wilder? Ans. because he doesn’t compare with what went before him.Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
Things don't occur in a time vacuum. Prior to AJ and Wilder there was Wlad, the boxing equivalent of a gigantic chloroform blanket over U.S. boxing fandom... for well over a decade. Waking up from this slumber takes more than one or two fights. It doesn't help that Wilder started off his career fighting a multitude of bums. He's since corrected that.
2. AJ isn’t a great, nowhere near it, he’s the best of the current bunch, that’s all. Consequently , that’s why it won’t sell on a Saturday afternoon in the States.
The guy who dethroned Wlad?? (I don't count Fury). In one of the most exciting heavyweight title fights in recent memory?? Now you're selling AJ short. So he's basically God in the UK.... but a nobody in the States? Nah... I don't buy it.
3. If I’m wrong and it is a mega-heavyweight-unification fight involving an American, and it is a $100 million fight, then Wilder’s team will have no trouble stumping up an offer to get AJ over there. And if AJ refuses to take the bait, then they can start to say AJ is ducking Wilder.
One thing I'll agree on with everyone else is that Wilder's team is shitty at self-promotion. I can't say where the fight should be, other than to also agree it would have a much bigger gate in the UK than in the States. They're both undefeated champions, representing countries with a vast tradition of boxing rivalry. All I'm saying is that should be worth something.
I think I said all that, except for the Wilder screwing up the heavyweight division part.
Yes but I said it better and more concise @TitoFanQuote:
Originally Posted by TitoFanQuote:
Originally Posted by walrusI agree Wilder has piss poor promotion but for 10 years no one gave a shit about the heavyweight division here in America. After a Floyd fight people would talk boxing a bit and they would ask me who the heavyweight champ was. Putting this all on Wilder is a bit much. His " I want to kill someone" comment is probably the most press he ever got here. When you pick up the New York Times or other major paper rarely do they have anything about boxing. There would always be a few articles about Floyd up or Manny around fight time, I've read a couple on GGG and Canelo but boxing is a very niche sport here and the heavyweight division even more so. If u are blaming Wilder for screwing up the division u are giving him way to much credit. He is trying to get out and do interviews etc but this will not be an overnight revival of the heavyweight division.Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFanSee below.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo Carnera1. Why have the Americans been”slow to warm up” to Wilder? Ans. because he doesn’t compare with what went before him.Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
Things don't occur in a time vacuum. Prior to AJ and Wilder there was Wlad, the boxing equivalent of a gigantic chloroform blanket over U.S. boxing fandom... for well over a decade. Waking up from this slumber takes more than one or two fights. It doesn't help that Wilder started off his career fighting a multitude of bums. He's since corrected that.
2. AJ isn’t a great, nowhere near it, he’s the best of the current bunch, that’s all. Consequently , that’s why it won’t sell on a Saturday afternoon in the States.
The guy who dethroned Wlad?? (I don't count Fury). In one of the most exciting heavyweight title fights in recent memory?? Now you're selling AJ short. So he's basically God in the UK.... but a nobody in the States? Nah... I don't buy it.
3. If I’m wrong and it is a mega-heavyweight-unification fight involving an American, and it is a $100 million fight, then Wilder’s team will have no trouble stumping up an offer to get AJ over there. And if AJ refuses to take the bait, then they can start to say AJ is ducking Wilder.
One thing I'll agree on with everyone else is that Wilder's team is shitty at self-promotion. I can't say where the fight should be, other than to also agree it would have a much bigger gate in the UK than in the States. They're both undefeated champions, representing countries with a vast tradition of boxing rivalry. All I'm saying is that should be worth something.
I think I said all that, except for the Wilder screwing up the heavyweight division part.
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Originally Posted by walrusYes but I said it better and more concise @TitoFanQuote:
Originally Posted by TitoFanQuote:
Originally Posted by walrusI agree Wilder has piss poor promotion but for 10 years no one gave a shit about the heavyweight division here in America. After a Floyd fight people would talk boxing a bit and they would ask me who the heavyweight champ was. Putting this all on Wilder is a bit much. His " I want to kill someone" comment is probably the most press he ever got here. When you pick up the New York Times or other major paper rarely do they have anything about boxing. There would always be a few articles about Floyd up or Manny around fight time, I've read a couple on GGG and Canelo but boxing is a very niche sport here and the heavyweight division even more so. If u are blaming Wilder for screwing up the division u are giving him way to much credit. He is trying to get out and do interviews etc but this will not be an overnight revival of the heavyweight division.Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFanSee below.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo Carnera1. Why have the Americans been”slow to warm up” to Wilder? Ans. because he doesn’t compare with what went before him.Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
Things don't occur in a time vacuum. Prior to AJ and Wilder there was Wlad, the boxing equivalent of a gigantic chloroform blanket over U.S. boxing fandom... for well over a decade. Waking up from this slumber takes more than one or two fights. It doesn't help that Wilder started off his career fighting a multitude of bums. He's since corrected that.
2. AJ isn’t a great, nowhere near it, he’s the best of the current bunch, that’s all. Consequently , that’s why it won’t sell on a Saturday afternoon in the States.
The guy who dethroned Wlad?? (I don't count Fury). In one of the most exciting heavyweight title fights in recent memory?? Now you're selling AJ short. So he's basically God in the UK.... but a nobody in the States? Nah... I don't buy it.
3. If I’m wrong and it is a mega-heavyweight-unification fight involving an American, and it is a $100 million fight, then Wilder’s team will have no trouble stumping up an offer to get AJ over there. And if AJ refuses to take the bait, then they can start to say AJ is ducking Wilder.
One thing I'll agree on with everyone else is that Wilder's team is shitty at self-promotion. I can't say where the fight should be, other than to also agree it would have a much bigger gate in the UK than in the States. They're both undefeated champions, representing countries with a vast tradition of boxing rivalry. All I'm saying is that should be worth something.
I think I said all that, except for the Wilder screwing up the heavyweight division part.
That's why I keep you around @walrus