https://www.axios.com/taliban-war-ch...alibanwarchest
Look at all this. These fuckers armed with all this shit gave up overnight to a bunch of cunts in pickup trucks armed with AKs.
Printable View
https://www.axios.com/taliban-war-ch...alibanwarchest
Look at all this. These fuckers armed with all this shit gave up overnight to a bunch of cunts in pickup trucks armed with AKs.
This is a pretty good thread, good posting...Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
So what will China do here? Surely they will be concerned about the Taliban inciting stuff in west China maybe? And the Chinese do like their belt and road iniative but if the Taliban reportedly bugger all money so surely the Chinese can't loan em that much, but they also have a lot invested in the famously calm Pakistan and if the Taliban start rabble rousing there maybe the Chinese will pay/help them to behave?.. This can't be good for China though, which of course would be good for America.
Also in continuation of the mindless ramblings @Kirkland Laing there is a Canadian election coming up and the economy is of course the big talking point, now you know about this stuff is there any reputable economist gits(bit like krugman) who write about the Canadian economy that you know of? I'm as clueless about these matters as usual.
Manny Pacquiaio doesn’t existQuote:
Originally Posted by TIC
All I know is Trump fans are having a field day with what's going on in Afghanistan. Not that they need much encouragement to throw rocks at Biden.
The truth of the matter in a nutshell is that the U.S. has fukked up in Afghanistan since Day One. Biden's horribly planned (or lack thereof) retreat has had a terrible human cost... and more is yet to come.
The basic difference between a few years ago and now is that some of us can criticize Biden when it's merited, without holding back.
A few years ago... the incumbent walked on water and could do nothing wrong.
Quote:
Originally Posted by palmerqThis is a pretty good thread, good posting...Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
So what will China do here? Surely they will be concerned about the Taliban inciting stuff in west China maybe? And the Chinese do like their belt and road iniative but if the Taliban reportedly bugger all money so surely the Chinese can't loan em that much, but they also have a lot invested in the famously calm Pakistan and if the Taliban start rabble rousing there maybe the Chinese will pay/help them to behave?.. This can't be good for China though, which of course would be good for America.
Also in continuation of the mindless ramblings @Kirkland Laing there is a Canadian election coming up and the economy is of course the big talking point, now you know about this stuff is there any reputable economist gits(bit like krugman) who write about the Canadian economy that you know of? I'm as clueless about these matters as usual.
China don't give a shit about authoritarian regimes and will happily deal with the Taliban. Lots of lithium and other minerals in Afghanistan, China will want first dibs on all of it. The Taliban are basically a creature of the Pakistan intelligence service, they're not going to do anything to upset Pakistan, China or anybody else. They'll be looking to make commercial deals with both of them and gain at least two allies. The last thing they want to do is upset either of them.
Canadian politics don't really matter as you have nice moderate parties and nice moderate policies. The liberals get in for a while and shift things a little to the left then the conservatives get in and shift things a little to the right and they just basically take turns at running the country. No drama and good results.
You fuckers dodged a bullet by not being a big enough market for Rupert Murdoch to turn up and fuck your politics up. Out of the English speaking countries you, Ireland and New Zealand got lucky. Australia, Britain and especially the United States got the poison. You did have Conrad Black but he's nothing compared to what Murdoch does to your politics.
Aha fair point.. So the Taliban are sort of buggered and bent over a barrel by the superpowers?... China can bail them out a bit and get mining and the Americans have all their money and can withhold it until they get their guys out or whatever they want..Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland LaingQuote:
Originally Posted by palmerqThis is a pretty good thread, good posting...Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
So what will China do here? Surely they will be concerned about the Taliban inciting stuff in west China maybe? And the Chinese do like their belt and road iniative but if the Taliban reportedly bugger all money so surely the Chinese can't loan em that much, but they also have a lot invested in the famously calm Pakistan and if the Taliban start rabble rousing there maybe the Chinese will pay/help them to behave?.. This can't be good for China though, which of course would be good for America.
Also in continuation of the mindless ramblings @Kirkland Laing there is a Canadian election coming up and the economy is of course the big talking point, now you know about this stuff is there any reputable economist gits(bit like krugman) who write about the Canadian economy that you know of? I'm as clueless about these matters as usual.
China don't give a shit about authoritarian regimes and will happily deal with the Taliban. Lots of lithium and other minerals in Afghanistan, China will want first dibs on all of it. The Taliban are basically a creature of the Pakistan intelligence service, they're not going to do anything to upset Pakistan, China or anybody else. They'll be looking to make commercial deals with both of them and gain at least two allies. The last thing they want to do is upset either of them.
Canadian politics don't really matter as you have nice moderate parties and nice moderate policies. The liberals get in for a while and shift things a little to the left then the conservatives get in and shift things a little to the right and they just basically take turns at running the country. No drama and good results.
You fuckers dodged a bullet by not being a big enough market for Rupert Murdoch to turn up and fuck your politics up. Out of the English speaking countries you, Ireland and New Zealand got lucky. Australia, Britain and especially the United States got the poison. You did have Conrad Black but he's nothing compared to what Murdoch does to your politics.
And yes luckily Canadian politics and news is a good bit calmer than America and the Conservatives seem pretty reasonable this time round too(he's talking about a carbon tax)... I do worry the crazies are making Their way over though, I've noticed an increase in some of the more extreme ramblings from some people... Although none of them have much of a problem with me being an immigrant which is nice............. :S
I have noticed a newfound empathy(from some) for people who live in terrible conditions under brutal regimes, it's nice to see that some fellows are now thinking the way these foreigners are treated isn't right....I mean imagine if someone suggested these guys should stay over there in their own shithole countries and fight to improve things instead of abandoning it! (I know, every other country but Afghanistan is fine) .........Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
It really is great that more people understand their plight now.... And I can only assume this will be a long lasting change in the way we view asylum seekers... Especially if we can blast one political party for it!
Quote:
Originally Posted by palmerqAha fair point.. So the Taliban are sort of buggered and bent over a barrel by the superpowers?... China can bail them out a bit and get mining and the Americans have all their money and can withhold it until they get their guys out or whatever they want..Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland LaingQuote:
Originally Posted by palmerqThis is a pretty good thread, good posting...Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
So what will China do here? Surely they will be concerned about the Taliban inciting stuff in west China maybe? And the Chinese do like their belt and road iniative but if the Taliban reportedly bugger all money so surely the Chinese can't loan em that much, but they also have a lot invested in the famously calm Pakistan and if the Taliban start rabble rousing there maybe the Chinese will pay/help them to behave?.. This can't be good for China though, which of course would be good for America.
Also in continuation of the mindless ramblings @Kirkland Laing there is a Canadian election coming up and the economy is of course the big talking point, now you know about this stuff is there any reputable economist gits(bit like krugman) who write about the Canadian economy that you know of? I'm as clueless about these matters as usual.
China don't give a shit about authoritarian regimes and will happily deal with the Taliban. Lots of lithium and other minerals in Afghanistan, China will want first dibs on all of it. The Taliban are basically a creature of the Pakistan intelligence service, they're not going to do anything to upset Pakistan, China or anybody else. They'll be looking to make commercial deals with both of them and gain at least two allies. The last thing they want to do is upset either of them.
Canadian politics don't really matter as you have nice moderate parties and nice moderate policies. The liberals get in for a while and shift things a little to the left then the conservatives get in and shift things a little to the right and they just basically take turns at running the country. No drama and good results.
You fuckers dodged a bullet by not being a big enough market for Rupert Murdoch to turn up and fuck your politics up. Out of the English speaking countries you, Ireland and New Zealand got lucky. Australia, Britain and especially the United States got the poison. You did have Conrad Black but he's nothing compared to what Murdoch does to your politics.
And yes luckily Canadian politics and news is a good bit calmer than America and the Conservatives seem pretty reasonable this time round too(he's talking about a carbon tax)... I do worry the crazies are making Their way over though, I've noticed an increase in some of the more extreme ramblings from some people... Although none of them have much of a problem with me being an immigrant which is nice............. :S
I was saying a couple of days ago about how a lot of the Afghan players looked to have agreed a lot of stuff in advance of the Taliban storming through the country in a few days:
https://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog...s-coverage-but
Where did you immigrate to Canada from? I had you down as French Canadian.
Must be Scotland.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland LaingQuote:
Originally Posted by palmerqAha fair point.. So the Taliban are sort of buggered and bent over a barrel by the superpowers?... China can bail them out a bit and get mining and the Americans have all their money and can withhold it until they get their guys out or whatever they want..Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland LaingQuote:
Originally Posted by palmerqThis is a pretty good thread, good posting...Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
So what will China do here? Surely they will be concerned about the Taliban inciting stuff in west China maybe? And the Chinese do like their belt and road iniative but if the Taliban reportedly bugger all money so surely the Chinese can't loan em that much, but they also have a lot invested in the famously calm Pakistan and if the Taliban start rabble rousing there maybe the Chinese will pay/help them to behave?.. This can't be good for China though, which of course would be good for America.
Also in continuation of the mindless ramblings @Kirkland Laing there is a Canadian election coming up and the economy is of course the big talking point, now you know about this stuff is there any reputable economist gits(bit like krugman) who write about the Canadian economy that you know of? I'm as clueless about these matters as usual.
China don't give a shit about authoritarian regimes and will happily deal with the Taliban. Lots of lithium and other minerals in Afghanistan, China will want first dibs on all of it. The Taliban are basically a creature of the Pakistan intelligence service, they're not going to do anything to upset Pakistan, China or anybody else. They'll be looking to make commercial deals with both of them and gain at least two allies. The last thing they want to do is upset either of them.
Canadian politics don't really matter as you have nice moderate parties and nice moderate policies. The liberals get in for a while and shift things a little to the left then the conservatives get in and shift things a little to the right and they just basically take turns at running the country. No drama and good results.
You fuckers dodged a bullet by not being a big enough market for Rupert Murdoch to turn up and fuck your politics up. Out of the English speaking countries you, Ireland and New Zealand got lucky. Australia, Britain and especially the United States got the poison. You did have Conrad Black but he's nothing compared to what Murdoch does to your politics.
And yes luckily Canadian politics and news is a good bit calmer than America and the Conservatives seem pretty reasonable this time round too(he's talking about a carbon tax)... I do worry the crazies are making Their way over though, I've noticed an increase in some of the more extreme ramblings from some people... Although none of them have much of a problem with me being an immigrant which is nice............. :S
I was saying a couple of days ago about how a lot of the Afghan players looked to have agreed a lot of stuff in advance of the Taliban storming through the country in a few days:
https://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog...s-coverage-but
Where did you immigrate to Canada from? I had you down as French Canadian.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterMust be Scotland.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland LaingQuote:
Originally Posted by palmerqAha fair point.. So the Taliban are sort of buggered and bent over a barrel by the superpowers?... China can bail them out a bit and get mining and the Americans have all their money and can withhold it until they get their guys out or whatever they want..Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland LaingQuote:
Originally Posted by palmerqThis is a pretty good thread, good posting...Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
So what will China do here? Surely they will be concerned about the Taliban inciting stuff in west China maybe? And the Chinese do like their belt and road iniative but if the Taliban reportedly bugger all money so surely the Chinese can't loan em that much, but they also have a lot invested in the famously calm Pakistan and if the Taliban start rabble rousing there maybe the Chinese will pay/help them to behave?.. This can't be good for China though, which of course would be good for America.
Also in continuation of the mindless ramblings @Kirkland Laing there is a Canadian election coming up and the economy is of course the big talking point, now you know about this stuff is there any reputable economist gits(bit like krugman) who write about the Canadian economy that you know of? I'm as clueless about these matters as usual.
China don't give a shit about authoritarian regimes and will happily deal with the Taliban. Lots of lithium and other minerals in Afghanistan, China will want first dibs on all of it. The Taliban are basically a creature of the Pakistan intelligence service, they're not going to do anything to upset Pakistan, China or anybody else. They'll be looking to make commercial deals with both of them and gain at least two allies. The last thing they want to do is upset either of them.
Canadian politics don't really matter as you have nice moderate parties and nice moderate policies. The liberals get in for a while and shift things a little to the left then the conservatives get in and shift things a little to the right and they just basically take turns at running the country. No drama and good results.
You fuckers dodged a bullet by not being a big enough market for Rupert Murdoch to turn up and fuck your politics up. Out of the English speaking countries you, Ireland and New Zealand got lucky. Australia, Britain and especially the United States got the poison. You did have Conrad Black but he's nothing compared to what Murdoch does to your politics.
And yes luckily Canadian politics and news is a good bit calmer than America and the Conservatives seem pretty reasonable this time round too(he's talking about a carbon tax)... I do worry the crazies are making Their way over though, I've noticed an increase in some of the more extreme ramblings from some people... Although none of them have much of a problem with me being an immigrant which is nice............. :S
I was saying a couple of days ago about how a lot of the Afghan players looked to have agreed a lot of stuff in advance of the Taliban storming through the country in a few days:
https://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog...s-coverage-but
Where did you immigrate to Canada from? I had you down as French Canadian.
His English is far too good for him to be Scottish.
You gits, I am from Scotland originally and speak and type terrible English like any good self depricating scotsman:S... Actually don't think I've even been a Canadian citizen for a year yet immigration timelines all blend together, I've lived in Canada for a few years though and I'm not leaving.
https://twitter.com/Charles_Lister/s...65865593868293
It's a matter of time before things go very wrong in Kabul.
Quote:
Originally Posted by palmerq
Where are you in Canada?
Around the Vancouver area but obviously not in Vancouver because I'm not a millionaire :S
I have loads of relatives that live in Surrey, Vancouver. Beautiful place makes our country look like a hell hole.Quote:
Originally Posted by palmerq
Yes this area is world class scenery wise. I don't think there is a big difference either way for quality of life when comparing this part of Canada and where I lived in Britain though, both have good and bad things... But that is not the topic of the thread so I will cease and desist my pro Canuck propaganda for now.Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterI have loads of relatives that live in Surrey, Vancouver. Beautiful place makes our country look like a hell hole.Quote:
Originally Posted by palmerq
Yeah... back to the topic at hand.
https://www.npr.org/2021/08/22/10301...tan-evacuation
"Biden Touts 'Incredible' Evacuation Operation From Kabul, But Warns Of Ongoing Danger"
Sorry... I don't buy the "touting." Too bad all pro-Trump fans have evacuated this forum... because right now I'd be agreeing with them about just how badly this administration screwed this up.
Hostile Country Evacuation 101 -
First you systematically and safely evacuate American citizens, while maintaining sufficient military presence to ensure the operation. This includes control of the airport and/or other ports of exit.
Then... you begin to withdraw other key personnel not vital to the military presence that must be maintained throughout the evacuation.
And so on and so forth.
In short... there is (or should be) some heavy-duty logistics involved to ensure everything goes well, safely, and according to plan.
This not only to guarantee the safety of all evacuees... but to avoid looking foolish to the rest of the world.
It's not like the U.S. hasn't had practice at this already.
omg not one of them has a mask or is social distancingQuote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
That is because they do not believe in the virus.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
If they'd started evacuating earlier the Afghan army would have collapsed even faster and Biden would be getting the blame for the collapse of the army. There's no good way this could have worked out.
With the benefit of hindsight once the provincial capitals stated falling the military should have told Biden to surge thousands of troops into the country but then you'd have the US military eventually retrating and leaving the country chased out by the Taliban and thousands of Americans who were out in the provinces taken hostage etc etc. It's a horrific situation any way you look at it. This is probably the least worst scenario once the Afghan army had folded up overnight. Still really bad though. Lots of blame to go round.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TIComg not one of them has a mask or is social distancingQuote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
Two groups of pig ignorant bearded religious conservatives. They probably all think that dying from a virus is god's will. These idiots are not people you should be taking cues from on avoiding becoming infected.
Anybody wanting to know what kind of economic situation the Taliban are facing and the main reason they're being so considerate with the west in Kabul right now:
https://fullstackeconomics.com/afgha...shock-taliban/
There's at least one honest/undeluded senior military guy:
https://twitter.com/mviser/status/1429453432134508547
by comparison:
https://twitter.com/JustinTLogan/sta...03463572135937
The question that subsequent investigations should be asking but wont:
https://twitter.com/mattyglesias/sta...76135767793664
i was mentioning something that you missed cause it doesn't fit your belief. you have already admitted that what someone else says is good enough for you. that's a belief. not knowingQuote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland LaingQuote:
Originally Posted by TIComg not one of them has a mask or is social distancingQuote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
Two groups of pig ignorant bearded religious conservatives. They probably all think that dying from a virus is god's will. These idiots are not people you should be taking cues from on avoiding becoming infected.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland LaingQuote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
If they'd started evacuating earlier the Afghan army would have collapsed even faster and Biden would be getting the blame for the collapse of the army. There's no good way this could have worked out.
With the benefit of hindsight once the provincial capitals stated falling the military should have told Biden to surge thousands of troops into the country but then you'd have the US military eventually retrating and leaving the country chased out by the Taliban and thousands of Americans who were out in the provinces taken hostage etc etc. It's a horrific situation any way you look at it. This is probably the least worst scenario once the Afghan army had folded up overnight. Still really bad though. Lots of blame to go round.
I wasn't advocating evacuating earlier. I was advocating better planning.
All the planning in the world isn't going to help you if the Afghan army collapses overnight. You're left having to choose which turd you'd most like to step in.Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFanQuote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland LaingQuote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
If they'd started evacuating earlier the Afghan army would have collapsed even faster and Biden would be getting the blame for the collapse of the army. There's no good way this could have worked out.
With the benefit of hindsight once the provincial capitals stated falling the military should have told Biden to surge thousands of troops into the country but then you'd have the US military eventually retrating and leaving the country chased out by the Taliban and thousands of Americans who were out in the provinces taken hostage etc etc. It's a horrific situation any way you look at it. This is probably the least worst scenario once the Afghan army had folded up overnight. Still really bad though. Lots of blame to go round.
I wasn't advocating evacuating earlier. I was advocating better planning.
I served in Afghanistan as a US Marine, twice. Here’s the truth in two sentences
What we are seeing in Afghanistan right now shouldn’t shock you. It only seems that way because our institutions are steeped in systematic dishonesty. It doesn’t require a dissertation to explain what you’re seeing. Just two sentences.
One: For 20 years, politicians, elites and D.C. military leaders lied to us about Afghanistan.
Two: What happened last week was inevitable, and anyone saying differently is still lying to you.
I know because I was there. Twice. On special operations task forces. I learned Pashto as a U.S. Marine captain and spoke to everyone I could there: everyday people, elites, allies and yes, even the Taliban.
The truth is that the Afghan National Security Forces was a jobs program for Afghans, propped up by U.S. taxpayer dollars — a military jobs program populated by nonmilitary people or “paper” forces (that didn’t really exist) and a bevy of elites grabbing what they could when they could.
You probably didn’t know that. That’s the point.
And it wasn’t just in Afghanistan. They also lied about Iraq.
I led a team of Marines training Iraqi security forces to defend their country. When I arrived I received a “stoplight” chart on their supposed capabilities in dozens of missions and responsibilities. Green meant they were good. Yellow was needed improvement; red said they couldn’t do it at all.
I was delighted to see how far along they were on paper — until I actually began working with them. I attempted to adjust the charts to reflect reality and was quickly shut down. The ratings could not go down. That was the deal. It was the kind of lie that kept the war going.
So when people ask me if we made the right call getting out of Afghanistan in 2021, I answer truthfully: Absolutely not. The right call was getting out in 2002. 2003. Every year we didn’t get out was another year the Taliban used to refine their skills and tactics against us — the best fighting force in the world. After two decades, $2 trillion and nearly 2,500 American lives lost, 2021 was way too late to make the right call......
https://news.yahoo.com/served-afghan...l?guccounter=2
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland LaingAll the planning in the world isn't going to help you if the Afghan army collapses overnight. You're left having to choose which turd you'd most like to step in.Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFanQuote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland LaingQuote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
If they'd started evacuating earlier the Afghan army would have collapsed even faster and Biden would be getting the blame for the collapse of the army. There's no good way this could have worked out.
With the benefit of hindsight once the provincial capitals stated falling the military should have told Biden to surge thousands of troops into the country but then you'd have the US military eventually retrating and leaving the country chased out by the Taliban and thousands of Americans who were out in the provinces taken hostage etc etc. It's a horrific situation any way you look at it. This is probably the least worst scenario once the Afghan army had folded up overnight. Still really bad though. Lots of blame to go round.
I wasn't advocating evacuating earlier. I was advocating better planning.
Better planning would've saved some lives, many of whom might still be in danger because of the poor planning. The Afghan army collapse was inevitable given the U.S. exit. It was gonna happen anyway. Better planning and communication wouldn't have prevented the Afghan army collapse. But it would've saved some lives and done a better job at preserving public opinion on the administration's handling of the matter.
The U.S. had been in Afghanistan for two decades. What was the rush that poor planning had to cause the chaos and PR disaster it did? The decision had been made. But planning and execution was piss poor. You see... that's the problem with politics. It takes away the objectivity to admit your guy f*cked up when he actually did.
Don't argue with me. Argue with them.
https://edition.cnn.com/2021/08/23/p...den/index.html
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/afghani...-opinion-poll/
Before Tim Russert of Meet the Press passed he interviewed Biden asking him what would he propose. Joe replied he had 2 answers.
1. if we pull out now, we will look bad.
2. Wait to pull out and see it get worse.
In that regard I concur with Biden- but the Democratic Party weren't listening. it was about Hillary or Barrack...
Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFanQuote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland LaingAll the planning in the world isn't going to help you if the Afghan army collapses overnight. You're left having to choose which turd you'd most like to step in.Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFanQuote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland LaingQuote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
If they'd started evacuating earlier the Afghan army would have collapsed even faster and Biden would be getting the blame for the collapse of the army. There's no good way this could have worked out.
With the benefit of hindsight once the provincial capitals stated falling the military should have told Biden to surge thousands of troops into the country but then you'd have the US military eventually retrating and leaving the country chased out by the Taliban and thousands of Americans who were out in the provinces taken hostage etc etc. It's a horrific situation any way you look at it. This is probably the least worst scenario once the Afghan army had folded up overnight. Still really bad though. Lots of blame to go round.
I wasn't advocating evacuating earlier. I was advocating better planning.
Better planning would've saved some lives, many of whom might still be in danger because of the poor planning. The Afghan army collapse was inevitable given the U.S. exit. It was gonna happen anyway. Better planning and communication wouldn't have prevented the Afghan army collapse. But it would've saved some lives and done a better job at preserving public opinion on the administration's handling of the matter.
Starting to evacuate people at an earlier date would have precipitated an even faster collapse. It may have ended up killing more people than will end up being killed in the current situation. There's no way of knowing what would have been the best way to do this even with the benefit of hindsight. Just like Britney Spears this was not the way they planned it, they would have been aware of the possibility of the Afghan army collapsing overnight but the various other factors in play made them decide to do what they're doing.
There was no great option here. It was just a case of picking the least worst option. We'll never know if they managed to do that or not.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
And asking the American people anything, come on. Ninety odd percent of them couldn't find Afghanistan on a map or answer a couple of simple questions about the place. There have been polls showing majorities in favour of staying and majorities in favour of leaving. All of these people have watched tv showing chaos and it certainly looks like it could have been planned better so that's the answer they're going to give but in truth we'll never know whether the US did in fact manage to pursue the least worst option.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland LaingQuote:
Originally Posted by TitoFanQuote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland LaingAll the planning in the world isn't going to help you if the Afghan army collapses overnight. You're left having to choose which turd you'd most like to step in.Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFanQuote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland LaingQuote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
If they'd started evacuating earlier the Afghan army would have collapsed even faster and Biden would be getting the blame for the collapse of the army. There's no good way this could have worked out.
With the benefit of hindsight once the provincial capitals stated falling the military should have told Biden to surge thousands of troops into the country but then you'd have the US military eventually retrating and leaving the country chased out by the Taliban and thousands of Americans who were out in the provinces taken hostage etc etc. It's a horrific situation any way you look at it. This is probably the least worst scenario once the Afghan army had folded up overnight. Still really bad though. Lots of blame to go round.
I wasn't advocating evacuating earlier. I was advocating better planning.
Better planning would've saved some lives, many of whom might still be in danger because of the poor planning. The Afghan army collapse was inevitable given the U.S. exit. It was gonna happen anyway. Better planning and communication wouldn't have prevented the Afghan army collapse. But it would've saved some lives and done a better job at preserving public opinion on the administration's handling of the matter.
Starting to evacuate people at an earlier date would have precipitated an even faster collapse. It may have ended up killing more people than will end up being killed in the current situation. There's no way of knowing what would have been the best way to do this even with the benefit of hindsight. Just like Britney Spears this was not the way they planned it, they would have been aware of the possibility of the Afghan army collapsing overnight but the various other factors in play made them decide to do what they're doing.
There was no great option here. It was just a case of picking the least worst option. We'll never know if they managed to do that or not.
You went "earlier" again. I didn't say "earlier." I said better planning. In fact, it could've been done later, if that's what it would take to make sure the planning was as good as it could be. The U.S. had been there for two decades. A few more weeks wouldn't have mattered much in the grand scheme of things.
BTW... public opinion may be flawed due to lack of knowledge of some people... but it remains a measuring stick against which all Presidents have and will continue to be measured. If the public at least had the perception that a withdrawal was being meticulously and carefully planned... even the inevitable messes would be more excused.
Biden's not Trump. For that we're both glad. But I'm not gonna defend every single decision Biden makes... just like I never condemned every single move Trump made. I like to think that makes me objective.
I don't know you could plan it any better. If you mean by better planning that everybody gets out without a scratch then that would be great but that's not real life. Deciding what to do in the various possible scenarios is probabilistic. Any option you pick has a chance of going wrong in different ways to the option you eventually pick.Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
‘This Case Was Never About Fraud’: Federal Judge Refers ‘Kraken’ Attorneys, Including Lin Wood and Sidney Powell, for ‘Possible Suspension or Disbarment’
A federal judge sent a strong message to each of the so-called “Kraken” lawyers behind litigation to upend the 2020 election, ordering that they be referred for a professional conduct investigation and “possible suspension or disbarment.” The attorneys include pro-Trump lawyers Lin Wood and Sidney Powell.
“A Historic and Profound Abuse of the Judicial Process”
Full of indignation and spanning 110 pages, U.S. District Judge Linda Parker‘s ruling reads like a treatise on the judiciary’s role in protecting the democratic process.
“This lawsuit represents a historic and profound abuse of the judicial process,” Judge Parker wrote in her opinion and order. “It is one thing to take on the charge of vindicating rights associated with an allegedly fraudulent election. It is another to take on the charge of deceiving a federal court and the American people into believing that rights were infringed, without regard to whether any laws or rights were in fact violated. This is what happened here.”
[...]
Parker’s pronouncement was similarly unequivocal that “this case was never about fraud,” a phrase she emphasized in italics.
“t was about undermining the People’s faith in our democracy and debasing the judicial process to do so,” she added, in her own emphasis.
“While there are many arenas—including print, television, and social media—where protestations, conjecture, and speculation may be advanced, such expressions are neither permitted nor welcomed in a court of law,” she added in her ruling.
https://lawandcrime.com/2020-electio...or-disbarment/
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-58349010
Nasty stuff at kabul airport, many dead, probably inevitable given the way things turned out... Maybe there was always going to be a mass crowd at the airport whenever the westerners decided to remove their armies, maybe it could have been done better, keeping more soldiers at bagram airfield during this evacuation time?
20 years in long enough, sick and tire of war.
Quote:
Originally Posted by palmerq
It turns out Bagram is a one and a half hour drive from Kabul on roads that offer endless opportunities to ambush or bomb vehicles. You would need many thousands of troops to prevent it being a shooting/bombing gallery for whoever wanted to have a go at Americans and many thousands more to protect those thousands, then many thousands more (at least seven thousand) just to protect the airbase. So overnight you have to go from two thousand troops to tens of thousands and they're straight in the middle of a shooting war, busloads of American civilians being bombed and so on.
The military advised getting people out from Kabul airport was the least worst option so that's what they did.
There's a whole bunch of other stuff that I'm forgetting but I can't remember where I read this now. Anyway it wasn't a good idea.
Never mind, the Taliban have things under control:
https://twitter.com/biannagolodryga/...12686475972614
Provided the fucker can count he'll tell the rest of their brains trust that they need to do what America wants or they're absolutely fucked. That'll get the remaining few hundred people out at some point.
I think Biden should appoint a Fed chair who promises to run US monetary policy according to literal interpretation of the Bible.