Re: Froch opponent announced: Yusef Mack
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Originally Posted by
AdamGB
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Originally Posted by
superheavyrhun
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Originally Posted by
Dropanuke
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Originally Posted by
erics44
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Originally Posted by
Dropanuke
No chance! Froch has no business at that weight. He is a natural super mid weight. Cleverly should fight Hopkins etc but he wont because he won't travel like froch. Froch has nothing to prove at domestic level. Cleverly hasn't proved yet and fighting froch isn't the answer but granted would be a big scalp.
Calzaghe didn't give froch a chance so why should froch give cleverly a chance
ha, is this some kind of england v wales thing?
i dont see the two as being related
if froch was offered enough money i am sure he would consider it
You are right as id get in the ring with prime Tyson bare fist if you gave me enough money. England vs Wales? What an odd thing to think.
Maybe cleverly should come down to 168? Oh I forgot he can't do it even though a 42 year old glen Johnson can?? That's what's odd
I wouldn't find that particularly odd, mainly because Cleverly is five inches taller than Johnson and has a larger build. He was 19 when he last fought at SMW, and he was little more than a skinny kid who was still growing back then.
If it's not to do with England v Wales, why make the Calzaghe / Cleverly comparison?
Because back then Froch was seen as green at world level (like cleverly is now) and calzaghe had had a string of high profile title bouts (like froch now)?...
You don't see the simularities in level? Calzaghe's excuse for avoiding Froch was that he was not on his level... Froch is obviously levels above cleverly who was handed his belt and hasn't really fought anybody yet.
They're in different weight classes, and that aspect of it isn't going to get resolved. Cleverly won't be able to burn back down to 168, and Froch's not leaving that division unless he gets beat and loses his title.
Also, Froch spent much of his time earlier on calling out Calzaghe after almost every win. Cleverly hasn't really done that for the reasons mentioned above. In terms of the respective stages of their careers then it is similar, but the obstacles between Froch v Calzaghe were very different to the obstacles between Froch v Cleverly.
The original point made was that Froch would be giving Cleverly a chance...there's no chance there for Cleverly beyond maybe picking up a vacant belt at LH, whereas Calzaghe was unified champion holding the belts in the division in which the fights would take place.
Re: Froch opponent announced: Yusef Mack
If Froch were to go up to LH, a fight with Cloud is the one I would most want to see. I think that would be a GREAT fight. Cleverly is a nobody and always will be. He's just not very good.
Re: Froch opponent announced: Yusef Mack
Quote:
Originally Posted by
shza
If Froch were to go up to LH, a fight with Cloud is the one I would most want to see. I think that would be a GREAT fight. Cleverly is a nobody and always will be. He's just not very good.
cleverly is fighting this guy next apparently...Denis Simcic - Boxer
wonder when cleverly will fight somebody good?
Re: Froch opponent announced: Yusef Mack
Quote:
Originally Posted by
AdamGB
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Originally Posted by
superheavyrhun
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Originally Posted by
Dropanuke
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Originally Posted by
erics44
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Originally Posted by
Dropanuke
No chance! Froch has no business at that weight. He is a natural super mid weight. Cleverly should fight Hopkins etc but he wont because he won't travel like froch. Froch has nothing to prove at domestic level. Cleverly hasn't proved yet and fighting froch isn't the answer but granted would be a big scalp.
Calzaghe didn't give froch a chance so why should froch give cleverly a chance
ha, is this some kind of england v wales thing?
i dont see the two as being related
if froch was offered enough money i am sure he would consider it
You are right as id get in the ring with prime Tyson bare fist if you gave me enough money. England vs Wales? What an odd thing to think.
Maybe cleverly should come down to 168? Oh I forgot he can't do it even though a 42 year old glen Johnson can?? That's what's odd
I wouldn't find that particularly odd, mainly because Cleverly is five inches taller than Johnson and has a larger build. He was 19 when he last fought at SMW, and he was little more than a skinny kid who was still growing back then.
If it's not to do with England v Wales, why make the Calzaghe / Cleverly comparison?
Because back then Froch was seen as green at world level (like cleverly is now) and calzaghe had had a string of high profile title bouts (like froch now)?...
You don't see the simularities in level? Calzaghe's excuse for avoiding Froch was that he was not on his level... Froch is obviously levels above cleverly who was handed his belt and hasn't really fought anybody yet.
all that is true, its still a strange comparrison to make
Eddie Hearn: Carl do you want to fight Cleverly for loads of money?
Carl Froch: Er hang on a minute Eddie, did Joe Calzaghe fight me when I asked him for one?
Eddie Hearn: No Carl
Carl Froch: Well I'm not fighting Cleverly then
Eddie Hearn: What about a Tony Bellew fight for loads of money then
Carl Froch: Er hang on a minute Eddie, did Joe Calzaghe fight me when I asked him for one?
Eddie Hearn: No Carl
Carl Froch: Well I'm not fighting Bellew either then
yeah i can see what you mean, quite a good comparrison after all :)
Re: Froch opponent announced: Yusef Mack
:vd:
The point isn't that Calzaghe is directly involved in Froch's desicion making... Just that the situation of a well established champion not wanting to fight guys who are no where near as established is one that can be compared to calzaghe not fighting froch.
I doubt Froch worries about Calzaghe when chosing fights, I think Froch has done OK without Calzaghe, don't you?
Re: Froch opponent announced: Yusef Mack
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Originally Posted by
Tam Seddon
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Originally Posted by
shza
If Froch were to go up to LH, a fight with Cloud is the one I would most want to see. I think that would be a GREAT fight. Cleverly is a nobody and always will be. He's just not very good.
cleverly is fighting this guy next apparently...
Denis Simcic - Boxer
wonder when cleverly will fight somebody good?
Cleverly is still young and needs to develop. He had a very hard fight against Bellow and needs some easier fights otherwise his career would be over too soon if he fought wars like he did with Bellow. Froch has to fight the best as he has less time on his hands and does not need to develop.
Re: Froch opponent announced: Yusef Mack
Froch has done well for himself since Calzaghe but if we remember back to when Calzaghe had dominated the division for 11 years and was a massive name world wide after ruining Lacy and Kessler and unifying the division, Carl was yet to even fight a former world title holder or challenger. His first was Reid, yes Robin Reid who was on the comeback after retirement. That was Frochs first opponent that had been anywhere near the wrold stage!
Back then Froch was an absolute nobody amd he was in fact offered a fight with Calzaghe in early 2007 but Hennesy wouldnt let Froch anywhere near Calzaghe because apparently Warren wanted options on Frochs future fights. I think it had a little to do with that but also he probably wasnt offered alot as Froch was litterally a nobody at that point and Hennesy would be realistic enough to realise that Froch would have a loss on his record before hes even established.
Re: Froch opponent announced: Yusef Mack
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Originally Posted by
Master
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Originally Posted by
Tam Seddon
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Originally Posted by
shza
If Froch were to go up to LH, a fight with Cloud is the one I would most want to see. I think that would be a GREAT fight. Cleverly is a nobody and always will be. He's just not very good.
cleverly is fighting this guy next apparently...
Denis Simcic - Boxer
wonder when cleverly will fight somebody good?
Cleverly is still young and needs to develop. He had a very hard fight against Bellow and needs some easier fights otherwise his career would be over too soon if he fought wars like he did with Bellow. Froch has to fight the best as he has less time on his hands and does not need to develop.
He's "world" champion (lol). He's ranked no.4 by The Ring. All he ever does is fight guys, with decent looking records but no substance to them, that no-one in the world has ever heard of. That's fine for a prospect but he is not.
There are dozens of fighters younger than him that get matched against the best.
Re: Froch opponent announced: Yusef Mack
Froch is with Matchroom and Sky.
Cleverly is with FW and Boxnation.
You will never see that fight in a million years... well unless Cleverly gave Warren the spanish archer
Re: Froch opponent announced: Yusef Mack
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Originally Posted by
Fenster
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Originally Posted by
Master
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Originally Posted by
Tam Seddon
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Originally Posted by
shza
If Froch were to go up to LH, a fight with Cloud is the one I would most want to see. I think that would be a GREAT fight. Cleverly is a nobody and always will be. He's just not very good.
cleverly is fighting this guy next apparently...
Denis Simcic - Boxer
wonder when cleverly will fight somebody good?
Cleverly is still young and needs to develop. He had a very hard fight against Bellow and needs some easier fights otherwise his career would be over too soon if he fought wars like he did with Bellow. Froch has to fight the best as he has less time on his hands and does not need to develop.
He's "world" champion (lol). He's ranked no.4 by The Ring. All he ever does is fight guys, with decent looking records but no substance to them, that no-one in the world has ever heard of. That's fine for a prospect but he is not.
There are dozens of fighters younger than him that get matched against the best.
You know the title means nothing in real terms, Dawson is the best then you have Cloud, Pascal and Hopkins et al. Nathan is not in that league yet.
Re: Froch opponent announced: Yusef Mack
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Originally Posted by
Dropanuke
Basically Calzaghe hardly fought anyone, and if froch did the same he would be 80-0 undefeated!
The way I see it and yes I am pro froch. Frochs 2 losses are the equivalent of calzaghes undefeated record!!
Smoke that! Dig it!
One of Frochs losses came to someone who Calzaghe totally dominated;D
Re: Froch opponent announced: Yusef Mack
He also stopped Robin Reid, a guy who many feel beat Calzaghe. So what?
Not that it matters... But my point is that styles and contrxt make fights... To over simplify boxing is just stupid.
Re: Froch opponent announced: Yusef Mack
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Originally Posted by
AdamGB
He also stopped Robin Reid, a guy who many feel beat Calzaghe. So what?
Not that it matters... But my point is that styles and contrxt make fights... To over simplify boxing is just stupid.
Thats a myth, even reid admitted he lost:
Reid said: "I can't argue with the decision. Joe was the better boxer on the night and I knew I could not catch him for speed."
When carl fought reid, reid was done! He was 37 and two years prior was beatdown by lacy! Reid did badly hurt froch in that fight at some point however and to this day carl say's reid is the hardest puncher he ever fought! So calzaghe winning a close fight over prime reid proves nothing really, and besides calzaghe was basically operating one handed and supposedly suffering from a dose of food poisoning too! Calzaghe at his worst still beat reid!
Reis is underrated though. Reid was rated in the ring mag top 10 for 7 years. He only got knocked down and out by Jeff Lacy and froch when he was shot, Lacy would never have put Reid down in his prime and in fact I reckon Reid would have done him. Froch v PRIME reid would have been a close scrap too...
If Reid was not deducted and faced such a poor bias ref he would have beat Sven.
Had Reid have won he would have been a two time, three belt winning world champion..
Reid was honestly just outside the 10 ten best 168 fighters ever. Go watch benn and eubanks very close fights with the talented henry wharton then go watch reid do a number on him and then tell me reid wasn't on there level! Inconsistant at times but on his day a top 168lb fighter!
