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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JonesJrMayweather
Quote:
Originally Posted by
levi#1BoxingFan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Majesty
3 names on Pacquiao's resume that are better then anyone Mayweather fought?
Sure they are "names" but lets take a closer look at it floyd hater :)
He only beat Morales after Erik moved back down in weight and had already lost to Zahir Raheem. If Pacquiao was the warrior you make him out to be that fought everyone he would have fought Raheem but he fought a second match with an obviously faded Morales for the money and you can make the argument that Erik was past his prime and that the Raheem fight showed that. And there is a lot of people who feel Pacquiao lost both fights against Marquez and he barely won the second one, by one round because of the knockdown.
But on Mayweathers resume, everyone on that list with the exception of the first Castillo fight, Mayweather dominated them. But Pacquiao only dominated one and that was Barerra and it can be said he only beat Morales after Morales was past his prime and also that he didn't beat Marquez or barely squeaked by. So defend that :)
There may be the three "names" on Pacquiao's resume but he only dominated one in their prime. all the names on Mayweather's list he dominated with the exception of the first Castillo fight and even then he came back and won the rematch with ease. Pacquiao on the other hand after "improving" only barely beat Marquez because of the knockdown and there is a lot of argument to say that he lost that rematch too. Meanwhile there is no one on Mayweathers resume with the exception of the first Castillo fight that you could find anyone that says that Mayweather could have lost ;)
Only beat him because of a knockdown?:rolleyes: Thats the goofiest thing i've ever heard! "Thats like saying he only reason he one was because he punched him in the face more!" Yes it was a close fight and yea knockdowns due tend to give you an advantage duh! Even though Pacquiao is in his prime now,
he would easily have taken care of Castillio and Corrales a few years ago with no problems!
First, morrales was not fading, Raheem would have beaten Morrales at any stage of his career. Perhaps it was the onesided schooling he took from raheem that broke his confidence and exposed him as a one dimensional fighter.
Secondly, beat corrales with ease? PACMAN? nah i doubt that at the time when corrales was fighting and could possibly face pacman, pacman didnt have the skills to beat corrales and probably would have been stopped.
that's the biggest load of crap i've ever heard, Morales wasn't one dimesional by any means, he showed various times that he could both slug and box, all you have to see is the 11th round to know that if Morales still had something left he would have stopped Raheem in the earlier rounds, the only round Morales actually attacked and knocks Raheem down, cleanly, and it was ruled a slip :rolleyes:, and the fact that 4 of his losses came back to back, pretty much shows that it's due to the decline of his abilities, don't know what fights you've been watching to actually try to dub Morales a one dimensional fighter
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
levi#1BoxingFan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Majesty
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Julius Rain
:pointsnew: you named 3 fighters way above everyone else on pacs resume and you still think floyd has a better resume. so who on floyds resume is better than mab,em,jmm?
and answer my other question, so is floyd a natural lightweight not a natural welterweight? so shouldn't he fight jmm at 135 then? since jmm is lightweight king. or atleast fight jmm at 140.
floyd is a natural pussy who severly selected his oppenent. im sure if jmm was a welterweight he'd want no piece of him. jmm is a better version of castillo who gave floyd trouble.
3 names on Pacquiao's resume that are better then anyone Mayweather fought?
Sure they are "names" but lets take a closer look at it floyd hater :)
He only beat Morales after Erik moved back down in weight and had already lost to Zahir Raheem. If Pacquiao was the warrior you make him out to be that fought everyone he would have fought Raheem but he fought a second match with an obviously faded Morales for the money and you can make the argument that Erik was past his prime and that the Raheem fight showed that. And there is a lot of people who feel Pacquiao lost both fights against Marquez and he barely won the second one, by one round because of the knockdown.
But on Mayweathers resume, everyone on that list with the exception of the first Castillo fight, Mayweather dominated them. But Pacquiao only dominated one and that was Barerra and it can be said he only beat Morales after Morales was past his prime and also that he didn't beat Marquez or barely squeaked by. So defend that :)
There may be the three "names" on Pacquiao's resume but he only dominated one in their prime. all the names on Mayweather's list he dominated with the exception of the first Castillo fight and even then he came back and won the rematch with ease. Pacquiao on the other hand after "improving" only barely beat Marquez because of the knockdown and there is a lot of argument to say that he lost that rematch too. Meanwhile there is no one on Mayweathers resume with the exception of the first Castillo fight that you could find anyone that says that Mayweather could have lost ;)
Only beat him because of a knockdown?:rolleyes: Thats the goofiest thing i've ever heard! "Thats like saying he only reason he one was because he punched him in the face more!" Yes it was a close fight and yea knockdowns due tend to give you an advantage duh! Even though Pacquiao is in his prime now, he would easily have taken care of Castillio and Corrales a few years ago with no problems!
yea if you knew anything about scoring he means that due to the knockdown he got a 10-8 round, and due to that 10-8 round and that ONE single extra point, Pacquiao "won", so yea learn something before you go out and post and make yourself look like a complete moron ;D
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JonesJrMayweather
Quote:
Originally Posted by
levi#1BoxingFan
Only beat him because of a knockdown?:rolleyes: Thats the goofiest thing i've ever heard! "Thats like saying he only reason he one was because he punched him in the face more!" Yes it was a close fight and yea knockdowns due tend to give you an advantage duh! Even though Pacquiao is in his prime now, he would easily have taken care of Castillio and Corrales a few years ago with no problems!
First, morrales was not fading, Raheem would have beaten Morrales at any stage of his career. Perhaps it was the onesided schooling he took from raheem that broke his confidence and exposed him as a one dimensional fighter.
Secondly, beat corrales with ease? PACMAN? nah i doubt that at the time when corrales was fighting and could possibly face pacman, pacman didnt have the skills to beat corrales and probably would have been stopped.
that's the biggest load of crap i've ever heard, Morales wasn't one dimesional by any means, he showed various times that he could both slug and box, all you have to see is the 11th round to know that if Morales still had something left he would have stopped Raheem in the earlier rounds, the only round Morales actually attacked and knocks Raheem down, cleanly, and it was ruled a slip :rolleyes:, and the fact that 4 of his losses came back to back, pretty much shows that it's due to the decline of his abilities, don't know what fights you've been watching to actually try to dub Morales a one dimensional fighter
None of what you said changes the fact that morrales had never faced a school slick boxer like raheem, and he got schooled handedly...he couldn't adapt and kept waving his hands for raheem to engage. Then after the fight said one the dumbest things a fighter can say
"he didnt want to fight, he just kept hitting me and moving away" ???
Morralles was one dimensional...that's why he lost twice to MAB i think three times ,twice to PAC, and schooled by Raheem...moralle was highly overrated IMO good, but no way on the same level as MAB and JMM
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JonesJrMayweather
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JonesJrMayweather
First, morrales was not fading, Raheem would have beaten Morrales at any stage of his career. Perhaps it was the onesided schooling he took from raheem that broke his confidence and exposed him as a one dimensional fighter.
Secondly, beat corrales with ease? PACMAN? nah i doubt that at the time when corrales was fighting and could possibly face pacman, pacman didnt have the skills to beat corrales and probably would have been stopped.
that's the biggest load of crap i've ever heard, Morales wasn't one dimesional by any means, he showed various times that he could both slug and box, all you have to see is the 11th round to know that if Morales still had something left he would have stopped Raheem in the earlier rounds, the only round Morales actually attacked and knocks Raheem down, cleanly, and it was ruled a slip :rolleyes:, and the fact that 4 of his losses came back to back, pretty much shows that it's due to the decline of his abilities, don't know what fights you've been watching to actually try to dub Morales a one dimensional fighter
None of what you said changes the fact that morrales had never faced a school slick boxer like raheem, and he got schooled handedly...he couldn't adapt and kept waving his hands for raheem to engage. Then after the fight said one the dumbest things a fighter can say
"he didnt want to fight, he just kept hitting me and moving away" ???
Morralles was one dimensional...that's why he lost twice to MAB i think three times ,twice to PAC, and schooled by Raheem...moralle was highly overrated IMO good, but no way on the same level as MAB and JMM
uh but eric is the only 1 who actually won over pac, marco never came close and jmm always comes up short. I dont think his one demensional thats a big harsh :(
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
Elterrible im not sure what goes through your mind on a daily basis, im guessing its kinda like when you've got bunny ears on an old T.V. and your trying to get a signal but theres nothing but snow!:confused: Obviously you didnt read my response little boy so I'm going to repeat myself. I never denied that the Pacquiao vs. JMM fights wern't close, because they were! I'm talking about the comment "the only reason he won was because of the knockdown". Thats jibberish, yea knockdowns are a part of boxing and JMM couldnt stay on his feet and it caused him to lose, no freakin duh Elterrible, so do yourself a favor and try to get a signal! :-\ And why is it that everyone talks about Pacquiao almost losing to JMM (a great fighter) when Mayweather CLEARLY lost to Castillio (a good but not great fighter)?
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Julius Rain
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JonesJrMayweather
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
that's the biggest load of crap i've ever heard, Morales wasn't one dimesional by any means, he showed various times that he could both slug and box, all you have to see is the 11th round to know that if Morales still had something left he would have stopped Raheem in the earlier rounds, the only round Morales actually attacked and knocks Raheem down, cleanly, and it was ruled a slip :rolleyes:, and the fact that 4 of his losses came back to back, pretty much shows that it's due to the decline of his abilities, don't know what fights you've been watching to actually try to dub Morales a one dimensional fighter
None of what you said changes the fact that morrales had never faced a school slick boxer like raheem, and he got schooled handedly...he couldn't adapt and kept waving his hands for raheem to engage. Then after the fight said one the dumbest things a fighter can say
"he didnt want to fight, he just kept hitting me and moving away" ???
Morralles was one dimensional...that's why he lost twice to MAB i think three times ,twice to PAC, and schooled by Raheem...moralle was highly overrated IMO good, but no way on the same level as MAB and JMM
uh but eric is the only 1 who actually won over pac, marco never came close and jmm always comes up short. I dont think his one demensional thats a big harsh :(
uh yeah and he's also the only one that was beaten into submission twice by pacman since thats what you use to gauge his ability against MAB and JMM. Even the clearly past it MAB managed a decision.
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Julius Rain
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JonesJrMayweather
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
that's the biggest load of crap i've ever heard, Morales wasn't one dimesional by any means, he showed various times that he could both slug and box, all you have to see is the 11th round to know that if Morales still had something left he would have stopped Raheem in the earlier rounds, the only round Morales actually attacked and knocks Raheem down, cleanly, and it was ruled a slip :rolleyes:, and the fact that 4 of his losses came back to back, pretty much shows that it's due to the decline of his abilities, don't know what fights you've been watching to actually try to dub Morales a one dimensional fighter
None of what you said changes the fact that morrales had never faced a school slick boxer like raheem, and he got schooled handedly...he couldn't adapt and kept waving his hands for raheem to engage. Then after the fight said one the dumbest things a fighter can say
"he didnt want to fight, he just kept hitting me and moving away" ???
Morralles was one dimensional...that's why he lost twice to MAB i think three times ,twice to PAC, and schooled by Raheem...moralle was highly overrated IMO good, but no way on the same level as MAB and JMM
uh but eric is the only 1 who actually won over pac, marco never came close and jmm always comes up short. I dont think his one demensional thats a big harsh :(
not to mention many believe that Morales won the second fight, which was the most TECHNICAL fight of the 3
Quote:
Originally Posted by
levi#1BoxingFan
Elterrible im not sure what goes through your mind on a daily basis, im guessing its kinda like when you've got bunny ears on an old T.V. and your trying to get a signal but theres nothing but snow!:confused: Obviously you didnt read my response little boy so I'm going to repeat myself. I never denied that the Pacquiao vs. JMM fights wern't close, because they were! I'm talking about the comment "the only reason he won was because of the knockdown". Thats jibberish, yea knockdowns are a part of boxing and JMM couldnt stay on his feet and it caused him to lose, no freakin duh Elterrible, so do yourself a favor and try to get a signal! :-\ And why is it that everyone talks about Pacquiao almost losing to JMM (a great fighter) when Mayweather CLEARLY lost to Castillio (a good but not great fighter)?
first off don't call me little boy cause unlike you i'm no kid, it's no jibberish because even a flash knockdown would have done it, don't kid yourself thinking that Manny was anywhere close in stopping JMM, the thing you don't understand is that Pacquiao ONLY won due to the knockdown, cause if it weren't for that, there is NO way anyone would have been able to have him ahead of JMM
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JonesJrMayweather
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Julius Rain
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JonesJrMayweather
None of what you said changes the fact that morrales had never faced a school slick boxer like raheem, and he got schooled handedly...he couldn't adapt and kept waving his hands for raheem to engage. Then after the fight said one the dumbest things a fighter can say
"he didnt want to fight, he just kept hitting me and moving away" ???
Morralles was one dimensional...that's why he lost twice to MAB i think three times ,twice to PAC, and schooled by Raheem...moralle was highly overrated IMO good, but no way on the same level as MAB and JMM
uh but eric is the only 1 who actually won over pac, marco never came close and jmm always comes up short. I dont think his one demensional thats a big harsh :(
uh yeah and he's also the only one that was beaten into submission twice by pacman since thats what you use to gauge his ability against MAB and JMM. Even the clearly past it MAB managed a decision.
well then going by your way of thinking, Jones Jr must of been pretty one dimensional as well, cause the first time he stepped in the ring against a hard hitting fast southpaw in Tarver he barely got a MD, then got KTFO in 2, with only one shot, brutally KO'd in his next fight against Johnson, and then barely managed to make it out of the 11th to lose by UD against Tarver :rolleyes: funny how that "logic" works out
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Julius Rain
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JonesJrMayweather
None of what you said changes the fact that morrales had never faced a school slick boxer like raheem, and he got schooled handedly...he couldn't adapt and kept waving his hands for raheem to engage. Then after the fight said one the dumbest things a fighter can say
"he didnt want to fight, he just kept hitting me and moving away" ???
Morralles was one dimensional...that's why he lost twice to MAB i think three times ,twice to PAC, and schooled by Raheem...moralle was highly overrated IMO good, but no way on the same level as MAB and JMM
uh but eric is the only 1 who actually won over pac, marco never came close and jmm always comes up short. I dont think his one demensional thats a big harsh :(
not to mention many believe that Morales won the second fight, which was the most TECHNICAL fight of the 3
first off don't call me little boy cause unlike you i'm no kid, it's no jibberish because even a flash knockdown would have done it, don't kid yourself thinking that Manny was anywhere close in stopping JMM, the thing you don't understand is that Pacquiao ONLY won due to the knockdown, cause if it weren't for that, there is NO way anyone would have been able to have him ahead of JMM
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JonesJrMayweather
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Julius Rain
uh but eric is the only 1 who actually won over pac, marco never came close and jmm always comes up short. I dont think his one demensional thats a big harsh :(
uh yeah and he's also the only one that was beaten into submission twice by pacman since thats what you use to gauge his ability against MAB and JMM. Even the clearly past it MAB managed a decision.
well then going by your way of thinking, Jones Jr must of been pretty one dimensional as well, cause the first time he stepped in the ring against a hard hitting fast southpaw in Tarver he barely got a MD, then got KTFO in 2, with only one shot, brutally KO'd in his next fight against Johnson, and then barely managed to make it out of the 11th to lose by UD against Tarver :rolleyes: funny how that "logic" works out
That's your logic not mine, dude i think you should have someone read aloud to you, because it seems that you're processing the information wrong...you used erik's one victory over pacman as leverage to him being better than JMM and MAB, and the fact that he was able to slug with pacquiao instead of box. It's your logic that he's not one dimensional based off what he did against an underschooled pacman, once roach was able to get manny to wait and counter a little bit, morrales was done. An d they learned that after watching raheem beat the hell out of him, only difference was Zahir didnt hit as hard as Manny.
Now just to entertain the silly comments about roy...only an idiot would argue that jones was one dimensional.
BTW don't take it personal, im sure erik morrales doesn't pay you to be his internet guardian
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
blegit
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ross
P4P means you are the best boxer around regardless of size.
Manny has beaten more current linear champs than Floyd has, infact has Floyd beaten any?
Take light welter, Floyd fought Gatti then ran away from Tszyu, he ran up a weight to take longer to beat a fighter that Tszyu had smashed off the canvas.
There is no denying Pacquiao has fought some very dangerous fighters, even dangerous fighters who dont draw crowds, like Marquez, right after he beat Mab, when he could have taken a soft touch, whereas Floyd has avoided all his percieved threats, like Tszyu, Mosely, Cotto, Margarito and Williams.
Lets be fair and get and use the facts straight let not just spew words because you don't like a fighter. Lineal champs mean crap nowadays. The belts are ran by corrupt organizations. And yes, PBF has beaten lineal champs. Remember he got crap for taking on the lineal champ in Baldomir for the most money. And for his debut at 135 he took on the lineal champ in Castillo then did it again. As for Tszyu, PBF wanted Tsyzu and even went to negotiations. Tsyzu's plan was to go at Hatton first. PBF called out Mosley twice when Mosley was a fearsome lightweight knocking everyone out. Both times Mosley flat out refused with excuses. Remember when Mosley went from 135 to 147? Did he do that to avoid Tsyzu? When PBF fought the cash cow DLH he was accused of ducking the real threats. Mosley skipped an entire division to get at DLH and so did Pac. But I think neither ducked anyone. Its called cherrypicking and every fighter does it. Boxing is a business and you must use smart marketing, crafty management, and make intelligent business decisions.
Hell I'd say lineal champ means more than the Belt Champs at this point.
I hope you are not trying to make a case for Mayweather for taking on Baldomir as a lineal champ. That was a horrible fight.
I think it's pointless to say a guy is "scared" by jumping 2 weight divisions.
The fact of the matter.. there just isn't enough time to fight everyone along the way in every weight division, but I legit case against Floyd is not hard to make. He was not the king of ANY of the divisions after Lightweight.
Pac cherrypicks and KOs his opponents. PBF does the same, but makes a mockery of his opponent everytime. He doesn't take care of business, he doesn't take titles away (bar Hatton), and he doesn't give fans anything to be desired.
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JonesJrMayweather
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Julius Rain
uh but eric is the only 1 who actually won over pac, marco never came close and jmm always comes up short. I dont think his one demensional thats a big harsh :(
not to mention many believe that Morales won the second fight, which was the most TECHNICAL fight of the 3
first off don't call me little boy cause unlike you i'm no kid, it's no jibberish because even a flash knockdown would have done it, don't kid yourself thinking that Manny was anywhere close in stopping JMM, the thing you don't understand is that Pacquiao ONLY won due to the knockdown, cause if it weren't for that, there is NO way anyone would have been able to have him ahead of JMM
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JonesJrMayweather
uh yeah and he's also the only one that was beaten into submission twice by pacman since thats what you use to gauge his ability against MAB and JMM. Even the clearly past it MAB managed a decision.
well then going by your way of thinking, Jones Jr must of been pretty one dimensional as well, cause the first time he stepped in the ring against a hard hitting fast southpaw in Tarver he barely got a MD, then got KTFO in 2, with only one shot, brutally KO'd in his next fight against Johnson, and then barely managed to make it out of the 11th to lose by UD against Tarver :rolleyes: funny how that "logic" works out
That's your logic not mine, dude i think you should have someone read aloud to you, because it seems that you're processing the information wrong...
you used erik's one victory over pacman as leverage to him being better than JMM and MAB, and the fact that he was able to slug with pacquiao instead of box. It's your logic that he's not one dimensional based off what he did against an underschooled pacman, once roach was able to get manny to wait and counter a little bit, morrales was done. An d they learned that after watching raheem beat the hell out of him, only difference was Zahir didnt hit as hard as Manny.
Now just to entertain the silly comments about roy...only an idiot would argue that jones was one dimensional.
BTW don't take it personal, im sure erik morales doesn't pay you to be his internet guardian
where the hell did i use it as leverage, learn to read buddy i said that Morales' win over Pacquiao was probably more due to Pacquiao's lack of technical ability at the time, because Morales pretty much showed he was shot in his very next fight, not taking it personal at all, just saying that Morales is one dimensional is incredibly narrowminded, and no i don't think that Jones is one dimensional by any means, but using the same logic THAT YOU USED, of how the first time Morales faced a "slick" fighter, he lost by a lopsided margin, the same can be said about Jones Jr, cause well you know very well how he's been as of since the Tarver KO, both fighters (Morales & Jones) lost so many fights (and badly at that) back to back, due to weight problems and decline in ability
as for you last comment, you're one to talk, this is from the dude who thought Taylor was the future of boxing at one point...:rolleyes:
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
Wow, Six pages! and pretty much unanimous hatred for Floyd! I mean Floyd is a fighter I like but by no means a favorite of mine! My personal favorites are Paul Williams, David Haye and Shane Moseley.
I posted this article because I read it as a unbiased rational 26 year old man; and I must say one thing that is clear, the majority of people including professionals (Max Kellermen, Larry Merchant mostly American press) allow the somewhat unfounded hatred they harbor for Floyd Mayweather to affect their judgments.
I mean a claim I see flying around a lot is Floyd ducked Cotto, However Cotto to my knowledge unlike Margarito, never made any attempt to make a fight with Mayweather, Floyd mentioned Cotto's name as a potential opponent when they were both at 140 and that was the only mention from either fighter! at other times people have asked Cotto about fighting Mayweather and the answer has always been I'll fight whoever they put in front of me.
The other unfounded claim is Mayweather avoiding Shane despite the fact that it's common knowledge that Floyd called Shane out multiple times, any fan who searches on youtube will also be able to find a video clip of Shane saying he thinks Mayweather should fight Margarito instead, and then that he had a toothache and then was going on family holiday! imagine if Floyd used these excuses?
I think that Floyd's large mouth and repeated stupid comments have alienated him to the point that he is now actually correct in feeling discriminated against.
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
piye
Wow, Six pages! and pretty much unanimous hatred for Floyd! I mean Floyd is a fighter I like but by no means a favorite of mine! My personal favorites are Paul Williams, David Haye and Shane Moseley.
I posted this article because I read it as a unbiased rational 26 year old man; and I must say one thing that is clear, the majority of people including professionals (Max Kellermen, Larry Merchant mostly American press) allow the somewhat unfounded hatred they harbor for Floyd Mayweather to affect their judgments.
I mean a claim I see flying around a lot is Floyd ducked Cotto, However Cotto to my knowledge unlike Margarito, never made any attempt to make a fight with Mayweather, Floyd mentioned Cotto's name as a potential opponent when they were both at 140 and that was the only mention from either fighter! at other times people have asked Cotto about fighting Mayweather and the answer has always been I'll fight whoever they put in front of me.
The other unfounded claim is Mayweather avoiding Shane despite the fact that it's common knowledge that Floyd called Shane out multiple times, any fan who searches on youtube will also be able to find a video clip of Shane saying he thinks Mayweather should fight Margarito instead, and then that he had a toothache and then was going on family holiday! imagine if Floyd used these excuses?
I think that Floyd's large mouth and repeated stupid comments have alienated him to the point that he is now actually correct in feeling discriminated against.
I would never make the argument PBF ducked anyone. However, when he fought for a belt at 147, instead of fighting Margarito or others, he fought Baldomir.
After that fight, instead of fighting Cotto, Margarito, or Williams, he fought jr. welterweight, Ricky Hatton, at 147 mind you, and now instead of fighting Cotto, Mosley or Paul Williams (Margarito is suspended), he is fighting Marquez. Moreover, his next fight looks to be Pacquiao.
Will he ever face a prime, elite welterweight?
The criticism against PBF is that with all the potential options at 147 (in which he probably would be favored), he chooses to fight smaller men.
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ross
P4P means you are the best boxer around regardless of size.
Manny has beaten more current linear champs than Floyd has, infact has Floyd beaten any?
Take light welter, Floyd fought Gatti then ran away from Tszyu, he ran up a weight to take longer to beat a fighter that Tszyu had smashed off the canvas.
There is no denying Pacquiao has fought some very dangerous fighters, even dangerous fighters who dont draw crowds, like Marquez, right after he beat Mab, when he could have taken a soft touch, whereas Floyd has avoided all his percieved threats, like Tszyu, Mosely, Cotto, Margarito and Williams.
Tszyu had already lost to Hatton by the time Mayweather beat Gatti, and well Kostya hasn't fought since, Mayweather went on to beat the shit out of Hatton and yet still gets crap for it, if he would have beaten up Tszyu after the Gatti fight he would of gotten "oh he was already past it, and Hatton already "softened" him up", seriously look at Mayweather's record, has plenty of GREAT wins on it over GREAT fighters, many of which went on to become lineal champs of their divisions, or at least give everyone else hell, it's been said time and time again, Mayweather will always get crap and will never get the credit he deserves,
he could beat Marquez, Pacquiao
, Cotto, Mosley, and Williams, by the end of 2010 and people will still say that he "avoided" Berto, Ortiz, Angulo, Kirkland, etc., give the guy a break, and i'm by no means a Mayweather fan
I say this with confidence if Mayweather beat Cotto, Mosley, and Williams, he would silence all of his critics, forever. Indeed, if he beat two out of three, he would silence many of his critics. No one is claiming him to be a junior middleweight or a middleweight, but he fights junior welterweights and blown up lightweights at the welter weight limit. He fought junior middleweight, Ricky Hatton at 147, and now lightweight Marquez at 147/145 (not totally sure).
He may be great, but he isn't a great welterweight and he shouldn't carry himself as one. If he is going to fight the smaller men, at least do it at their weight. But, he is fighting at 147, fight the fighters who fight at 147.
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JonesJrMayweather
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
not to mention many believe that Morales won the second fight, which was the most TECHNICAL fight of the 3
first off don't call me little boy cause unlike you i'm no kid, it's no jibberish because even a flash knockdown would have done it, don't kid yourself thinking that Manny was anywhere close in stopping JMM, the thing you don't understand is that Pacquiao ONLY won due to the knockdown, cause if it weren't for that, there is NO way anyone would have been able to have him ahead of JMM
well then going by your way of thinking, Jones Jr must of been pretty one dimensional as well, cause the first time he stepped in the ring against a hard hitting fast southpaw in Tarver he barely got a MD, then got KTFO in 2, with only one shot, brutally KO'd in his next fight against Johnson, and then barely managed to make it out of the 11th to lose by UD against Tarver :rolleyes: funny how that "logic" works out
That's your logic not mine, dude i think you should have someone read aloud to you, because it seems that you're processing the information wrong...
you used erik's one victory over pacman as leverage to him being better than JMM and MAB, and the fact that he was able to slug with pacquiao instead of box. It's your logic that he's not one dimensional based off what he did against an underschooled pacman, once roach was able to get manny to wait and counter a little bit, morrales was done. An d they learned that after watching raheem beat the hell out of him, only difference was Zahir didnt hit as hard as Manny.
Now just to entertain the silly comments about roy...only an idiot would argue that jones was one dimensional.
BTW don't take it personal, im sure erik morales doesn't pay you to be his internet guardian
where the hell did i use it as leverage, learn to read buddy i said that Morales' win over Pacquiao was probably more due to Pacquiao's lack of technical ability at the time, because Morales pretty much showed he was shot in his very next fight, not taking it personal at all, just saying that Morales is one dimensional is incredibly narrowminded, and no i don't think that Jones is one dimensional by any means, but using the same logic THAT YOU USED, of how the first time Morales faced a "slick" fighter, he lost by a lopsided margin, the same can be said about Jones Jr, cause well you know very well how he's been as of since the Tarver KO, both fighters (Morales & Jones) lost so many fights (and badly at that) back to back, due to weight problems and decline in ability
as for you last comment, you're one to talk, this is from the dude who thought Taylor was the future of boxing at one point...:rolleyes:
Taylor? I think you have me confused with someone else...never backed jermain taylor as the future of the sport...cant remeber even picking taylor for any fight now that i think of it..
and i do apologize for reading too fast, that comment about logic was to the guy that said "uh but erik is the only one to beat pacman out of JMM and MAB"...
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JonesJrMayweather
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JonesJrMayweather
That's your logic not mine, dude i think you should have someone read aloud to you, because it seems that you're processing the information wrong...you used erik's one victory over pacman as leverage to him being better than JMM and MAB, and the fact that he was able to slug with pacquiao instead of box. It's your logic that he's not one dimensional based off what he did against an underschooled pacman, once roach was able to get manny to wait and counter a little bit, morrales was done. An d they learned that after watching raheem beat the hell out of him, only difference was Zahir didnt hit as hard as Manny.
Now just to entertain the silly comments about roy...only an idiot would argue that jones was one dimensional.
BTW don't take it personal, im sure erik morales doesn't pay you to be his internet guardian
where the hell did i use it as leverage, learn to read buddy i said that Morales' win over Pacquiao was probably more due to Pacquiao's lack of technical ability at the time, because Morales pretty much showed he was shot in his very next fight, not taking it personal at all, just saying that Morales is one dimensional is incredibly narrowminded, and no i don't think that Jones is one dimensional by any means, but using the same logic THAT YOU USED, of how the first time Morales faced a "slick" fighter, he lost by a lopsided margin, the same can be said about Jones Jr, cause well you know very well how he's been as of since the Tarver KO, both fighters (Morales & Jones) lost so many fights (and badly at that) back to back, due to weight problems and decline in ability
as for you last comment, you're one to talk, this is from the dude who thought Taylor was the future of boxing at one point...:rolleyes:
Taylor? I think you have me confused with someone else...never backed jermain taylor as the future of the sport...cant remeber even picking taylor for any fight now that i think of it..
and i do apologize for reading too fast, that comment about logic was to the guy that said "uh but erik is the only one to beat pacman out of JMM and MAB"...
no prob, honestly though back to the subject at hand, i think people are reading way too damn much into the whole p4p #1 thing, it's really starting to get ridiculous
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Rantcatrat
Quote:
Originally Posted by
piye
Wow, Six pages! and pretty much unanimous hatred for Floyd! I mean Floyd is a fighter I like but by no means a favorite of mine! My personal favorites are Paul Williams, David Haye and Shane Moseley.
I posted this article because I read it as a unbiased rational 26 year old man; and I must say one thing that is clear, the majority of people including professionals (Max Kellermen, Larry Merchant mostly American press) allow the somewhat unfounded hatred they harbor for Floyd Mayweather to affect their judgments.
I mean a claim I see flying around a lot is Floyd ducked Cotto, However Cotto to my knowledge unlike Margarito, never made any attempt to make a fight with Mayweather, Floyd mentioned Cotto's name as a potential opponent when they were both at 140 and that was the only mention from either fighter! at other times people have asked Cotto about fighting Mayweather and the answer has always been I'll fight whoever they put in front of me.
The other unfounded claim is Mayweather avoiding Shane despite the fact that it's common knowledge that Floyd called Shane out multiple times, any fan who searches on youtube will also be able to find a video clip of Shane saying he thinks Mayweather should fight Margarito instead, and then that he had a toothache and then was going on family holiday! imagine if Floyd used these excuses?
I think that Floyd's large mouth and repeated stupid comments have alienated him to the point that he is now actually correct in feeling discriminated against.
I would never make the argument PBF ducked anyone. However, when he fought for a belt at 147, instead of fighting Margarito or others, he fought Baldomir.
After that fight, instead of fighting Cotto, Margarito, or Williams, he fought jr. welterweight, Ricky Hatton, at 147 mind you, and now instead of fighting Cotto, Mosley or Paul Williams (Margarito is suspended), he is fighting Marquez. Moreover, his next fight looks to be Pacquiao.
Will he ever face a prime, elite welterweight?
The criticism against PBF is that with all the potential options at 147 (in which he probably would be favored), he chooses to fight smaller men.
Take into account Mayweather called out Shane and Cotto, so let's leave them out of the equation; beat Zab (who is now considered a bum but was undisputed welterweight champ) and beat Oscar at 154 no less who else was there for Floyd to fight at Welter at the time?
Paul Williams Although a huge threat, was green and a no name, Berto was unheard of or was and still is very green, so that leaves Margarito as the only option who I agree Floyd could have/ should have fought (Although retrospect makes his choice appear a good one).
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
piye
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Rantcatrat
Quote:
Originally Posted by
piye
Wow, Six pages! and pretty much unanimous hatred for Floyd! I mean Floyd is a fighter I like but by no means a favorite of mine! My personal favorites are Paul Williams, David Haye and Shane Moseley.
I posted this article because I read it as a unbiased rational 26 year old man; and I must say one thing that is clear, the majority of people including professionals (Max Kellermen, Larry Merchant mostly American press) allow the somewhat unfounded hatred they harbor for Floyd Mayweather to affect their judgments.
I mean a claim I see flying around a lot is Floyd ducked Cotto, However Cotto to my knowledge unlike Margarito, never made any attempt to make a fight with Mayweather, Floyd mentioned Cotto's name as a potential opponent when they were both at 140 and that was the only mention from either fighter! at other times people have asked Cotto about fighting Mayweather and the answer has always been I'll fight whoever they put in front of me.
The other unfounded claim is Mayweather avoiding Shane despite the fact that it's common knowledge that Floyd called Shane out multiple times, any fan who searches on youtube will also be able to find a video clip of Shane saying he thinks Mayweather should fight Margarito instead, and then that he had a toothache and then was going on family holiday! imagine if Floyd used these excuses?
I think that Floyd's large mouth and repeated stupid comments have alienated him to the point that he is now actually correct in feeling discriminated against.
I would never make the argument PBF ducked anyone. However, when he fought for a belt at 147, instead of fighting Margarito or others, he fought Baldomir.
After that fight, instead of fighting Cotto, Margarito, or Williams, he fought jr. welterweight, Ricky Hatton, at 147 mind you, and now instead of fighting Cotto, Mosley or Paul Williams (Margarito is suspended), he is fighting Marquez. Moreover, his next fight looks to be Pacquiao.
Will he ever face a prime, elite welterweight?
The criticism against PBF is that with all the potential options at 147 (in which he probably would be favored), he chooses to fight smaller men.
Take into account Mayweather called out Shane and Cotto, so let's leave them out of the equation; beat Zab (who is now considered a bum but was undisputed welterweight champ) and beat Oscar at 154 no less who else was there for Floyd to fight at Welter at the time?
Paul Williams Although a huge threat, was green and a no name, Berto was unheard of or was and still is very green, so that leaves Margarito as the only option who I agree Floyd could have/ should have fought (Although retrospect makes his choice appear a good one).
i dont remember Floyd calling out Cotto just Shane.
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
kingfrnk
Quote:
Originally Posted by
piye
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Rantcatrat
I would never make the argument PBF ducked anyone. However, when he fought for a belt at 147, instead of fighting Margarito or others, he fought Baldomir.
After that fight, instead of fighting Cotto, Margarito, or Williams, he fought jr. welterweight, Ricky Hatton, at 147 mind you, and now instead of fighting Cotto, Mosley or Paul Williams (Margarito is suspended), he is fighting Marquez. Moreover, his next fight looks to be Pacquiao.
Will he ever face a prime, elite welterweight?
The criticism against PBF is that with all the potential options at 147 (in which he probably would be favored), he chooses to fight smaller men.
Take into account Mayweather called out Shane and Cotto, so let's leave them out of the equation; beat Zab (who is now considered a bum but was undisputed welterweight champ) and beat Oscar at 154 no less who else was there for Floyd to fight at Welter at the time?
Paul Williams Although a huge threat, was green and a no name, Berto was unheard of or was and still is very green, so that leaves Margarito as the only option who I agree Floyd could have/ should have fought (Although retrospect makes his choice appear a good one).
i dont remember Floyd calling out Cotto just Shane.
Yeah he definitely did call out Cotto at 140 type it in to google.
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
Take into account Mayweather called out Shane and Cotto, so let's leave them out of the equation; beat Zab (who is now considered a bum but was undisputed welterweight champ) and beat Oscar at 154 no less who else was there for Floyd to fight at Welter at the time?
Paul Williams Although a huge threat, was green and a no name, Berto was unheard of or was and still is very green, so that leaves Margarito as the only option who I agree Floyd could have/ should have fought (Although retrospect makes his choice appear a good one).[/quote]
Zab had got beat by Baldimor so do not know why he had to fight Zab when someone else would have been more challenging. :confused:
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
piye
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Rantcatrat
Quote:
Originally Posted by
piye
Wow, Six pages! and pretty much unanimous hatred for Floyd! I mean Floyd is a fighter I like but by no means a favorite of mine! My personal favorites are Paul Williams, David Haye and Shane Moseley.
I posted this article because I read it as a unbiased rational 26 year old man; and I must say one thing that is clear, the majority of people including professionals (Max Kellermen, Larry Merchant mostly American press) allow the somewhat unfounded hatred they harbor for Floyd Mayweather to affect their judgments.
I mean a claim I see flying around a lot is Floyd ducked Cotto, However Cotto to my knowledge unlike Margarito, never made any attempt to make a fight with Mayweather, Floyd mentioned Cotto's name as a potential opponent when they were both at 140 and that was the only mention from either fighter! at other times people have asked Cotto about fighting Mayweather and the answer has always been I'll fight whoever they put in front of me.
The other unfounded claim is Mayweather avoiding Shane despite the fact that it's common knowledge that Floyd called Shane out multiple times, any fan who searches on youtube will also be able to find a video clip of Shane saying he thinks Mayweather should fight Margarito instead, and then that he had a toothache and then was going on family holiday! imagine if Floyd used these excuses?
I think that Floyd's large mouth and repeated stupid comments have alienated him to the point that he is now actually correct in feeling discriminated against.
I would never make the argument PBF ducked anyone. However, when he fought for a belt at 147, instead of fighting Margarito or others, he fought Baldomir.
After that fight, instead of fighting Cotto, Margarito, or Williams, he fought jr. welterweight, Ricky Hatton, at 147 mind you, and now instead of fighting Cotto, Mosley or Paul Williams (Margarito is suspended), he is fighting Marquez. Moreover, his next fight looks to be Pacquiao.
Will he ever face a prime, elite welterweight?
The criticism against PBF is that with all the potential options at 147 (in which he probably would be favored), he chooses to fight smaller men.
Take into account Mayweather called out Shane and Cotto, so let's leave them out of the equation; beat Zab (who is now considered a bum but was undisputed welterweight champ) and beat Oscar at 154 no less who else was there for Floyd to fight at Welter at the time?
Paul Williams Although a huge threat, was green and a no name, Berto was unheard of or was and still is very green, so that leaves Margarito as the only option who I agree Floyd could have/ should have fought (Although retrospect makes his choice appear a good one).
Leaving aside the argument about what he should have done in the past, his choice for his last fight and for his next fight leave something to be desired. After he beat Hatton, but before he retired, boxing fans everywhere, pbf fans or not, wanted him to fight Mosley, Cotto, or Margarito (Williams wasn't there yet). Then he retired. Now, he unretires. Yet, instead of fighting any of the above-mentioned boxers, he chooses to fight a blown up light weight, at 147. That is disappointing. And who is his next potential opponent? Probably Manny Paquiao, again at 147. Basically, a welterweight ending his career fighting a junior welterweight, a lightweight, and another lightweight (although Manny may naturally be a 140 fighter), and not fighting one legitimate welterweight, of which there are at least 4 that are worthy.
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
The double standard is Mayweather.I mean isnt Bogus that this fight is even being discussed,what is Manny like a featherweight..Thats sure is were he came from..So ive heard all these little little fighters that had to move up to try to beat Mayweathers an when he wins all his fans along wit him trash talk he's the best.Mayweather moves up picks a smaller guy in a higher wieghtclass an then retires immediately afterwards.This is what u call a champion?Well i dont like my champs like that..Lets get to the real names he should be fighting, Margarita offerd floyd A million..We ant seen that fight yet what about Winkey a defensive specialist of that weightclass.An there the young 100 punch a round guy Paul Williams..If Mayweather wants the P4P he should move up like all the fighters he wants to fight have too.There's your double standard.Manny is a real P4P champ he's moved up still won an hasnt retired once.In my book that makes him better than Money may who in my opinion is just another Roy Jones who hasnt met his Magic Man through a series of ducks over priceing fights handpicking opponents an retirements..Peace..MlB Babe....Smoke one...
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
fila907
The double standard is Mayweather.I mean isnt Bogus that this fight is even being discussed,what is Manny like a featherweight..Thats sure is were he came from..So ive heard all these little little fighters that had to move up to try to beat Mayweathers an when he wins all his fans along wit him trash talk he's the best.Mayweather moves up picks a smaller guy in a higher wieghtclass an then retires immediately afterwards.This is what u call a champion?Well i dont like my champs like that..Lets get to the real names he should be fighting, Margarita offerd floyd A million..We ant seen that fight yet what about Winkey a defensive specialist of that weightclass.An there the young 100 punch a round guy Paul Williams..If Mayweather wants the P4P he should move up like all the fighters he wants to fight have too.There's your double standard.Manny is a real P4P champ he's moved up still won an hasnt retired once.In my book that makes him better than Money may who in my opinion is just another Roy Jones who hasnt met his Magic Man through a series of ducks over priceing fights handpicking opponents an retirements..Peace..MlB Babe....Smoke one...
Roy jones beat everybody there was to beat in the states and anyone that was willing to come to the states...he beat all the HOF fighters in his era..and only "roy assassins" would truly use the tarver crap to measure RJJ's legacy..he was 35 and weight drained.
Floyd is also a super feather weight who started at 130....manny at 106..now that manny is a bigger fighter he should held to the same standard as PBF..which is the expectation to fight the best at the division...
Manny didn't clean out light weight... floyd didnt clean out 140.. although he beat the 140 pound champ at 147..but ricky fought collazo at 147 so that give floyd the leverage to say well if you fought him at 147 then fight me at 147 or shut up...
The same argument applies to PACMAN..if he fought the naturally bigger Oscar at 147, then he can fight Shane, PBF, and cotto at 147..otherwise it points to the fact that pac's camp knows asking those guys to come down is all they need, esp with pacman's activity they'd be corpses..
So manny should either settle in at 140, or go back to 135 and clean it out..because unfortunately for him roach is making it seem as if he knows those fight are as carefully picked as floyd's fights...
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Rantcatrat
Quote:
Originally Posted by
piye
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Rantcatrat
I would never make the argument PBF ducked anyone. However, when he fought for a belt at 147, instead of fighting Margarito or others, he fought Baldomir.
After that fight, instead of fighting Cotto, Margarito, or Williams, he fought jr. welterweight, Ricky Hatton, at 147 mind you, and now instead of fighting Cotto, Mosley or Paul Williams (Margarito is suspended), he is fighting Marquez. Moreover, his next fight looks to be Pacquiao.
Will he ever face a prime, elite welterweight?
The criticism against PBF is that with all the potential options at 147 (in which he probably would be favored), he chooses to fight smaller men.
Take into account Mayweather called out Shane and Cotto, so let's leave them out of the equation; beat Zab (who is now considered a bum but was undisputed welterweight champ) and beat Oscar at 154 no less who else was there for Floyd to fight at Welter at the time?
Paul Williams Although a huge threat, was green and a no name, Berto was unheard of or was and still is very green, so that leaves Margarito as the only option who I agree Floyd could have/ should have fought (Although retrospect makes his choice appear a good one).
Leaving aside the argument about what he should have done in the past, his choice for his last fight and for his next fight leave something to be desired. After he beat Hatton, but before he retired, boxing fans everywhere, pbf fans or not, wanted him to fight Mosley, Cotto, or Margarito (Williams wasn't there yet). Then he retired. Now, he unretires. Yet, instead of fighting any of the above-mentioned boxers, he chooses to fight a blown up light weight, at 147. That is disappointing. And who is his next potential opponent? Probably Manny Paquiao, again at 147. Basically, a welterweight ending his career fighting a junior welterweight, a lightweight, and another lightweight (although Manny may naturally be a 140 fighter), and not fighting one legitimate welterweight, of which there are at least 4 that are worthy.
I agree with a lot of what you have said, I want Mayweather to fight Moseley (I think Moseley could win if the fight is soon) but what I do not think is that Mayweather is ducking Moseley, nor has he ever ducked Moseley! Moseley has called out Floyd when it's suitable for him, and Floyd called out Shane when it was suitable for him! it's all money in reality and not ducking!
Am I dissapointed Floyd is not fighting Shane? Yes, Do I think he should fight Paul? No; paul is to big my point is not if he should fight these people or not though it's that all of this ducking and double standard nonsense and stupid claims annoy me.
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
piye
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Rantcatrat
Quote:
Originally Posted by
piye
Take into account Mayweather called out Shane and Cotto, so let's leave them out of the equation; beat Zab (who is now considered a bum but was undisputed welterweight champ) and beat Oscar at 154 no less who else was there for Floyd to fight at Welter at the time?
Paul Williams Although a huge threat, was green and a no name, Berto was unheard of or was and still is very green, so that leaves Margarito as the only option who I agree Floyd could have/ should have fought (Although retrospect makes his choice appear a good one).
Leaving aside the argument about what he should have done in the past, his choice for his last fight and for his next fight leave something to be desired. After he beat Hatton, but before he retired, boxing fans everywhere, pbf fans or not, wanted him to fight Mosley, Cotto, or Margarito (Williams wasn't there yet). Then he retired. Now, he unretires. Yet, instead of fighting any of the above-mentioned boxers, he chooses to fight a blown up light weight, at 147. That is disappointing. And who is his next potential opponent? Probably Manny Paquiao, again at 147. Basically, a welterweight ending his career fighting a junior welterweight, a lightweight, and another lightweight (although Manny may naturally be a 140 fighter), and not fighting one legitimate welterweight, of which there are at least 4 that are worthy.
I agree with a lot of what you have said, I want Mayweather to fight Moseley (I think Moseley could win if the fight is soon) but what I do not think is that Mayweather is ducking Moseley, nor has he ever ducked Moseley! Moseley has called out Floyd when it's suitable for him, and Floyd called out Shane when it was suitable for him! it's all money in reality and not ducking!
Am I dissapointed Floyd is not fighting Shane? Yes, Do I think he should fight Paul? No; paul is to big my point is not if he should fight these people or not though it's that all of this ducking and double standard nonsense and stupid claims annoy me.
Fair enough - the ducking rumors are complete nonsense. It's about money and contract terms.
Floyd needs to fight the natural welterweights. He came out of retirement and again chose to fight a smaller man. I don't dislike Floyd as a fighter, but as a fan, he hasn't taken a challenging fight in a while, and it is wrong to always fight smaller men at your natural weight. He should fight other men who share that natural weight.
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
blegit
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ross
P4P means you are the best boxer around regardless of size.
Manny has beaten more current linear champs than Floyd has, infact has Floyd beaten any?
Take light welter, Floyd fought Gatti then ran away from Tszyu, he ran up a weight to take longer to beat a fighter that Tszyu had smashed off the canvas.
There is no denying Pacquiao has fought some very dangerous fighters, even dangerous fighters who dont draw crowds, like Marquez, right after he beat Mab, when he could have taken a soft touch, whereas Floyd has avoided all his percieved threats, like Tszyu, Mosely, Cotto, Margarito and Williams.
Lets be fair and get and use the facts straight let not just spew words because you don't like a fighter. Lineal champs mean crap nowadays. The belts are ran by corrupt organizations. And yes, PBF has beaten lineal champs. Remember he got crap for taking on the lineal champ in Baldomir for the most money. And for his debut at 135 he took on the lineal champ in Castillo then did it again. As for Tszyu, PBF wanted Tsyzu and even went to negotiations. Tsyzu's plan was to go at Hatton first. PBF called out Mosley twice when Mosley was a fearsome lightweight knocking everyone out. Both times Mosley flat out refused with excuses. Remember when Mosley went from 135 to 147? Did he do that to avoid Tsyzu? When PBF fought the cash cow DLH he was accused of ducking the real threats. Mosley skipped an entire division to get at DLH and so did Pac. But I think neither ducked anyone. Its called cherrypicking and every fighter does it. Boxing is a business and you must use smart marketing, crafty management, and make intelligent business decisions.
Baldomir being Lineal champ shows you just how much that means.
Fensters thread on fighting for money over legacy was bang on and to be honest i don't see the problem with that. Would you rather be a broke 45 year old Tyson or a rich 45 year old Mayweather. Mayweather had already done more than enough to be proclaimed the best fighter of his generation before he took on the Hatton/ODLH fights. Nothing wrong with lining his pockets against very credible opponents. How anybody can think ODLH and Hatton were just gimmes is beyond me.
And the 'why didn't he fight Cotto/Margarito/Williams' argument'
Even though Floyd was classified as a welterweight it's only day before weigh ins that allow Cotto/Margarito and Williams to fight there....probably not Williams anymore.
Cotto and Margarito are probably a weight division above Mayweather come fight night. If they had to weigh in on the day of the fight Mayweather and Cotto/Margarito wouldn't be allowed anywhere near each other. Day before weigh ins are the dumbest thing in the sport of Boxing. It's ok saying Floyd doesn't fight 'real welterweights' when in reality Cotto and Margarito aren't anywhere near real welterweights. They are more like Middleweights come fight night anyway. Like i said if there were same day weigh-ins they would be getting on for 2 divisions apart given that Floyd's optiumun weight would be around 148/150 come fight night wheras Cotto/Margarito would be around 160. The haters forget the weight issues when talking about him 'ducking' Cotto/Margarito but are quick to bring them up when he fights somebody who is probably much closer to his natural weight come fight night.
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ono
Quote:
Originally Posted by
blegit
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ross
P4P means you are the best boxer around regardless of size.
Manny has beaten more current linear champs than Floyd has, infact has Floyd beaten any?
Take light welter, Floyd fought Gatti then ran away from Tszyu, he ran up a weight to take longer to beat a fighter that Tszyu had smashed off the canvas.
There is no denying Pacquiao has fought some very dangerous fighters, even dangerous fighters who dont draw crowds, like Marquez, right after he beat Mab, when he could have taken a soft touch, whereas Floyd has avoided all his percieved threats, like Tszyu, Mosely, Cotto, Margarito and Williams.
Lets be fair and get and use the facts straight let not just spew words because you don't like a fighter. Lineal champs mean crap nowadays. The belts are ran by corrupt organizations. And yes, PBF has beaten lineal champs. Remember he got crap for taking on the lineal champ in Baldomir for the most money. And for his debut at 135 he took on the lineal champ in Castillo then did it again. As for Tszyu, PBF wanted Tsyzu and even went to negotiations. Tsyzu's plan was to go at Hatton first. PBF called out Mosley twice when Mosley was a fearsome lightweight knocking everyone out. Both times Mosley flat out refused with excuses. Remember when Mosley went from 135 to 147? Did he do that to avoid Tsyzu? When PBF fought the cash cow DLH he was accused of ducking the real threats. Mosley skipped an entire division to get at DLH and so did Pac. But I think neither ducked anyone. Its called cherrypicking and every fighter does it. Boxing is a business and you must use smart marketing, crafty management, and make intelligent business decisions.
Baldomir being Lineal champ shows you just how much that means.
Fensters thread on fighting for money over legacy was bang on and to be honest i don't see the problem with that. Would you rather be a broke 45 year old Tyson or a rich 45 year old Mayweather. Mayweather had already done more than enough to be proclaimed the best fighter of his generation before he took on the Hatton/ODLH fights. Nothing wrong with lining his pockets against very credible opponents. How anybody can think ODLH and Hatton were just gimmes is beyond me.
And the 'why didn't he fight Cotto/Margarito/Williams' argument'
Even though Floyd was classified as a welterweight it's only day before weigh ins that allow Cotto/Margarito and Williams to fight there....probably not Williams anymore.
Cotto and Margarito are probably a weight division above Mayweather come fight night. If they had to weigh in on the day of the fight Mayweather and Cotto/Margarito wouldn't be allowed anywhere near each other. Day before weigh ins are the dumbest thing in the sport of Boxing. It's ok saying Floyd doesn't fight 'real welterweights' when in reality Cotto and Margarito aren't anywhere near real welterweights. They are more like Middleweights come fight night anyway. Like i said if there were same day weigh-ins they would be getting on for 2 divisions apart given that Floyd's optiumun weight would be around 148/150 come fight night wheras Cotto/Margarito would be around 160. The haters forget the weight issues when talking about him 'ducking' Cotto/Margarito but are quick to bring them up when he fights somebody who is probably much closer to his natural weight come fight night.
Yes, good post. But that is systemic to boxing. Given the rules as is, you have to work within them. If Floyd isn't a natural welter within the rules, he should fight at 140 and jump the next day like everyone else. He shouldn't call himself a welterweight, however, if he is only fighting smaller men.
Floyd should fight at 140 and jump up in weight if he wants the size advantage that Margarito and Williams have, but if he is going to stay at 147, fight the guys at 147. Play the sport by the rules.
Manny fought Hatton at 140. Hatton's natural weight. Hatton walked into the fight with five or six pounds on Manny.
Floyd fought Hatton at 147. He is fighting Marquez at 145 - Marquez hasn't ever fought a fight above 135!
Also, Cotto fought at 140 pretty recently, it is even arguable that he is a small welterweight.
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
Double standard is when PBF fans say its legit and OK for a natural 135 pounder to be fighting a "natural welterweight" at 147, yet makes up excuses why that certain "natural welterweight" doesn't have to fight the other real welters at 147 because they are "Big Welterweights" ;D;D;D
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
The_Infinite
Double standard is when PBF fans say its legit and OK for a natural 135 pounder to be fighting a "natural welterweight" at 147, yet makes up excuses why that certain "natural welterweight" doesn't have to fight the other real welters at 147 because they are "Big Welterweights" ;D;D;D
We only say Mayweather is a natural welterweight because he took the step up to fight at 147.
We don't know what the case is with Marquez. Body-wise he's quite thick set. Rather than use weight categories to identify a fighter's 'true weight' i think it's definitely fairer to go by what they weigh come fight night. It gives a fair more accurate reflection of what their fighting weight is. This is where my argument of same day weigh-ins comes in (different topic i know).
My argument is come fight night Mayweather and Marquez will roughly weigh the same. I don't see how it can be any more clearer. It clearly wouldn't be the case if Mayweather was fighting Cotto or Margarito. There would be about a 10-12lbs difference. Not saying that that makes in a totally unfair match-up but you have to throw in the fact that Marquez is p4p#2 and in some peoples eyes number 1 because he 'beat' Pac twice. It's a very appealing fight. Probably more appealing than a fight against Cotto who has just come off an ass-whooping by Margarito and a win over Michael fucking Jennings.....plus he has a date with Clottey anyway. Margarito has a ban, so who else do you expect him to fight?
He probably will fight Cotto somewhere down the line (if he can avoid defeat along the way)anyway so it's not really a big deal. I'm not making excuses for Mayweather not fighting the bigger welters, i'm just saying it's not a double standard just because he's fighting Marquez. It's a perfectly reasonable match-up coming off an 18 month sabitical....given that Margarito is banned and Cotto is fighing Clottey.
I just don't see how Mayweather can be accused of not taking challenging fights when his last 3 fights have been against fighters who rule the divisions between 135 - 154. Where the hell do you want him to fight? Do you all expect him to make lightweight to fight Marquez? Given that Margarito is banned, Cotto and Clottey have a date, Hatton has just been battered, Oscar has retired, Pac has just had a fight, who would you be happy with him fighting? Next you'll be saying how convenient it is for Mayweather to come out of retirement at a time where all of the above cannot fight him.
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
Let me think erm Williams or Shane Mosley :rolleyes:
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
Double standard is when PBF fans say Belts and Lineal Champs mean crap nowadays as an excuse to avoid certain fights, but defends PBF when he took on Baldomir over certain better fighters that could have made better purse, saying that Baldomir was the logical option because he was the champ and holds a belt ;D;D;D
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
The_Infinite
Double standard is when PBF fans say Belts and Lineal Champs mean crap nowadays as an excuse to avoid certain fights, but defends PBF when he took on Baldomir over certain better fighters that could have made better purse, saying that Baldomir was the logical option because he was the champ and holds a belt ;D;D;D
same thing could apply to Manny for taking on David Diaz instead of Casamayor or Campbell ;D;D;D;D;D;D;D
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
Hahaha im not arguing that mate ;D But seriously, fans will be fans. There will always be double standards in favor or against your boxer. Not fair to complain when the double standard goes against your fighter when you are doing your own double standard in favor of your fighter IMO.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
The_Infinite
Double standard is when PBF fans say Belts and Lineal Champs mean crap nowadays as an excuse to avoid certain fights, but defends PBF when he took on Baldomir over certain better fighters that could have made better purse, saying that Baldomir was the logical option because he was the champ and holds a belt ;D;D;D
same thing could apply to Manny for taking on David Diaz instead of Casamayor or Campbell ;D;D;D;D;D;D;D
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
I promise this is the last ;D
Double standard is when PBF fans takes the punch stat numbers from the DLH fight to point out that it wasn't a close fight and should have been a UD for PBF, but when presented with punch stat numbers from the 1st Castillo fight, says that its a whole different story and should be looked at differently ;D;D;D
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
The_Infinite
I promise this is the last ;D
Double standard is when PBF fans takes the punch stat numbers from the DLH fight to point out that it wasn't a close fight and should have been a UD for PBF, but when presented with punch stat numbers from the 1st Castillo fight, says that its a whole different story and should be looked at differently ;D;D;D
lol just for the record i'm not a Mayweather fan, just don't see why he's getting attacked by most people for things that Pacquiao is doing himself, albeit in a more discreet way, with all the catchweight bullshit
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
My honest answer to that is ... because Pac is a likeable guy who engages in exciting fights. While Mayweather is a loud mouth, arrogant, self promoting dude who usually is in boring fights ;D
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
The_Infinite
I promise this is the last ;D
Double standard is when PBF fans takes the punch stat numbers from the DLH fight to point out that it wasn't a close fight and should have been a UD for PBF, but when presented with punch stat numbers from the 1st Castillo fight, says that its a whole different story and should be looked at differently ;D;D;D
lol just for the record i'm not a Mayweather fan, just don't see why he's getting attacked by most people for things that Pacquiao is doing himself, albeit in a more discreet way, with all the catchweight bullshit
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
:goodpost:
oh the infinite wisdom. lol
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
The_Infinite
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
The_Infinite
I promise this is the last ;D
Double standard is when PBF fans takes the punch stat numbers from the DLH fight to point out that it wasn't a close fight and should have been a UD for PBF, but when presented with punch stat numbers from the 1st Castillo fight, says that its a whole different story and should be looked at differently ;D;D;D
lol just for the record i'm not a Mayweather fan, just don't see why he's getting attacked by most people for things that Pacquiao is doing himself, albeit in a more discreet way, with all the catchweight bullshit
My honest answer to that is ... because Pac is a likeable guy who engages in exciting fights. While Mayweather is a loud mouth, arrogant, self promoting dude who usually is in boring fights ;D
I second that...;D
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Re: The Mayweather double standard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
blegit
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Quinito
Quote:
Originally Posted by
blegit
Mayweather dominated 2 weight classes. And lets be real nobody is dominating 147! Even Pac chose to cherrypick DLH out of that division and you'll never see him there again. Regardless of who you think is better. Can you be honest and say that there is definitely a Mayweather double standard?
First of all, DLH called out Pac, you have it the other way around. And second, nobody knew DLH was gonna be weight drain the night he fought Pac. FYI, Pac was the heavy underdog. 28 out of 30 of so called "boxing experts" picked DLH to win. Stop making shit up.
Making what up? Back it up with facts. DLH hadn't fought at 147 in how many years? So he called Pac out? How about when Mosley called Pac out? How about Margarito calling Pac out? And I call Pac's move a cherrypick because he only took DLH call up offer. No real threat at 147 even got looked at. That is cherrypicking. You don't have to call the person out to cherrypick. How about Pac cherrypicking David Diaz at 135? I don't blame Pac for taking the cash cow DLH but don't overly credit him(drool on his balls) for fighting someone who was not a top 147 pounder. He wasn't even a 147 pounder. At 154 would have been credible. And lets keep your mouth clean and your facts also.
DLH wants the money fight with Pac. So the fight was fought at a catchweight. They agreed with it. But still fans like you still thinks DLH will win easily.
Roach wants Mosley now. Pac said He knows how to beat Margacheato but Mosley got cheato 1st.
Diaz was picked because they belong to the same Toprank stable. Besides everybody knows Sta Cruz beat Casamayor. Diaz has a KO win over Sta Cruz?? After Diaz Pac challenges DLH. Did Pac need to prove anything at 135 after what he did to DLH?
You judge Pac & PBF differently coz they are different size. Pac just fought once at 147 by jumping 2 weight Class. PBF move up Gradually to 147. Floyd fought some easy fights at 140 & 147 before he fought the Top guys. Pac goes straight at DLH & hatton in his 1st fight at those weight classes. Pac also beat up DLH & Hatton a lot easier that what Floyd did. It Just Proves that Pac is the better fighter.
