Re: Duran : In My Era, Mayweather Would Have Been Ordinary
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Originally Posted by
Onetime
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Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
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Originally Posted by
Onetime
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Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
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Originally Posted by
Onetime
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Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
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Originally Posted by
Onetime
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Originally Posted by
El Kabong
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Originally Posted by
Onetime
If I said the same think about the Klits and ATG heavyweights would you agree?
Say what you want about them, doesn't bother me, nor does it affect their legacies. In fact what Duran said about Floyd doesn't affect HIS legacy so why get all emotional and defensive like a little girl?
What Roberto Duran said is true...however nobody has said Floyd isn't a great fighter, nobody is taking away what he's done in the ring, but you get all upset just because an old timer doesn't kiss the ass of a current fighter and a few fans happen to agree.....that's fucking sad man
Actually I compared to similar situations and you got emotional, Wlad's latest opponents having been pretty bad.
There's a huge difference. There's a good amount of fighters Mayweather didn't fight and should of fought. I'm trying to find one fighter Wlad should of fought and didn't
Fair point but I'll never be convinced that this guy from Syria was the best Wlad could face.
Who deserves a shot and hasn't gotten it? Weak division or not Wlad runs it. And he runs it with a iron fist. Cuz I see nobody taking him any time soon. Wlad's actually doing something people want champions to do but very rarely do. He's beaten all the worthy contenders. Now he's beating all the unworthy contenders. That's how you clean out a division.
Do you consider him an ATG
Not yet. But he's on his way. Once he's done he will be ATG
I really don't know what to say about a heavyweight who reigns over a dead because he can't move up he can only face whose there but the Lewis fight tells me he's not great and it's the era. One thing about
Floyd he is a small welter and people act like he needs to go to middleweight to be great day before weigh ins have really made what he has done even more impressive.
He is. But he was a big Junior Lightweight. A natural Lightweight. And a strong Junior Welterweight. And a lot fights with good fighters didn't get made. Is it all his fault? No. But bottom line is the fights still didn't get made. I got no problem with Mayweather. I like watching him fight. But there's a good amount of his fights I could of done with out. Justin Juuko, Carlos Gerena, Victoriano Sosa, Henry Bruseles, Sharmba Mitchell, Shane Mosley. And I'm sure there's more.
Re: Duran : In My Era, Mayweather Would Have Been Ordinary
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Originally Posted by
g3org3
i always thought duran was way overrated, Hagler Leonard and Hearns were all way better and floyd would toy with duran to a shut out UD or later ko or maybe he pussys out at just quits again lol
You're either a troll or don't know very much about the sport of boxing.
I'm guessing both. :cool:
Re: Duran : In My Era, Mayweather Would Have Been Ordinary
This is one of the reasons why I like talking about old school fighters. In threads like this, posters get exposed and we are able to distinguish the true boxing fans from a noobs haha
Re: Duran : In My Era, Mayweather Would Have Been Ordinary
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Originally Posted by
FinitoElDinamita
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Originally Posted by
justaguy
Fact is, we don't know.
Training looks a lot different now... different techniques, different philosophies, and different science to the sport. It is close to impossible to say who would have done what in what era.
When we look at boxing IQ and beating the man in front of you - which is all that a boxer can be asked to do - fighters today would have done just fine against fighters back in the day. The Klits would have held their own - they are HUGE compared to many of the ATG heavyweight champs. Those guys would have never seen the likes of them. But does that mean the innate skills are the same? No.
Fighters in Duran's day fought at least two to three times a year - most fought more. That's not the case anymore... if all of these guys fought more often and TRULY had to clear out a division, would they be undefeated? Doubtful. But I have no doubt that they would hold their own.
lol U make it sound like Duran fought in the 30s or something. All the methods you mentioned hasn't evolved all that much since Duran's era.. If anything, it has regressed..
You want to talk about conditioning? Fighters back then were conditioned to go 15 hard rounds and Duran certainly had no problems with it..
Technique did u say? We can argue that fighters back were superior in that area as well.. They were more skilled in terms of Inside-fighting, body punching and combination punching ..
Some of these techniques are a lost art in today's boxing.
Boxing and Baseball are two sports that hasn't evolved much..
I didn't mention methods... I mentioned that there are techniques that were not evident then and philosophies that were not common then. For the most part, I would agree that the contenders are not what they were... but I would not say that the REAL champs in the weight classes are still pretty darned good and tough to compare to previous champs from previous eras. They are faster, stronger, and have the older guys to look at for ideas of how to do what they do.
Duran wasn't from the 30's, but I would say that fighters are stronger and faster now than in the 80's - wouldn't you? Nutrition programs, supplements, and weight lifting techniques/philosophies have definitely changed. I would absolutely say that there are less fighters that could go 15 now than before, but they are not expected to. I would argue that if there were still 15 round fights, you would have more fighters that could go 15.
Duran's hands were fast and he hit hard... harder than Shane Mosley? Harder than Manny? I don't know and there's no way for me to know. Larry Holmes was skilled and could beat a lot of heavies in his day... could he beat Lennox Lewis (basically one or maybe two generations of fighters later)? Wlad? Vitali? I honestly don't know. He never saw fighters that had hands as fast as those guys at that size.
My point is only that fighters adapt to the age that they are in. Every so often, you get guys that stand out. At the lower weights, you have a ton of guys who have skills that are not champions - and then you have your guys who are great for every era.
I think Floyd is much better than an ordinary fighter in the 70's and 80's - he is very smart and adaptable in the ring. The title of the article is ridiculous. If he said that Floyd wouldn't have been undefeated, I can go with that.
Re: Duran : In My Era, Mayweather Would Have Been Ordinary
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Originally Posted by
justaguy
I think Floyd is much better than an ordinary fighter in the 70's and 80's - he is very smart and adaptable in the ring. The title of the article is ridiculous. If he said that Floyd wouldn't have been undefeated, I can go with that.
Exactly and that will probably be the one thing other then the phantom fight that historians will hold against him. His inactivity levels. However I suppose one has to take into account that he made on average 20 million dollars a fight while guys like Montiel never got a 7 figure payday until he fought Donaire. People keep accusing him of ducking but it simply cant be shown. Would other fighters have fought as much as they did earning that kind of money? No way to show that w/o a time machine. Had he been in the era of the fab 4 or 5 he most likely would have fought all of them or most of them.
I don't think he'd fare all that well against Duran at 135 but when you see how Duran struggled against Benitez its certainly not far fetched that he would struggle with Floyd at 147 or 154.
Re: Duran : In My Era, Mayweather Would Have Been Ordinary
Okay, this is pretty simple. You can't say Duran belonged in that group and then excuse his losing by saying he was too small for them. Was Duran too small for Leonard, Hearns, Hagler, and Benitez? If so, then he doesn't belong in that group because he was too small. We'll all just agree that he kept losing to them because he gave up too much size. Fine no problem. We'll keep Duran in the lightweight discussions. But for those who want to include him in that group or say that it doesn't matter if you sign up to fight then you can't use size as an excuse afterwards then lets look at that. So we then include Duran in that group and see that he was 1-5 against them. That's below ordinary. Did he really belong in that group? If so, then explain that record. And to be fair to Duran the article headline fudged what he said. Writers do that a lot. That's how they get you to view. There is no accountability. Duran basically was stating that Floyd would be just another guy amongst that group and not a standout. He didn't say Floyd would just be an ordinary fighter in his era.
Re: Duran : In My Era, Mayweather Would Have Been Ordinary
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Originally Posted by
IamInuit
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Originally Posted by
justaguy
I think Floyd is much better than an ordinary fighter in the 70's and 80's - he is very smart and adaptable in the ring. The title of the article is ridiculous. If he said that Floyd wouldn't have been undefeated, I can go with that.
Exactly and that will probably be the one thing other then the phantom fight that historians will hold against him. His inactivity levels. However I suppose one has to take into account that he made on average 20 million dollars a fight while guys like
Montiel never got a 7 figure payday until he fought Donaire. People keep accusing him of ducking but it simply cant be shown. Would other fighters have fought as much as they did earning that kind of money? No way to show that w/o a time machine. Had he been in the era of the fab 4 or 5 he most likely would have fought all of them or most of them.
I don't think he'd fare all that well against Duran at 135 but when you see how Duran struggled against Benitez its certainly not far fetched that he would struggle with Floyd at 147 or 154.
He didn't make 7 figures for the Donaire fight
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Originally Posted by
imp
Everyone is entitled to their own opinion.
We will never know how duran would fair in this era and floyd in durans era.
Lets also not discredit other current fighters as duran is not everyones ATG.
Floyd has the advantage over duran and obviously duran is jealous to be making those comments.
Theres no escaping the fact duran was a great lightweight and he would be a problem in any era but i just feel he wouldnt beat floyd.
Just like a prime vlad wouldnt beat a prime larry holmes..it works both ways.
Wlad would be a bad styles match up for Holmes.
Re: Duran : In My Era, Mayweather Would Have Been Ordinary
You know the Floyd fans are on the ropes when they're trying to defend Floyd by trying to make the discussion about Wlad. And the stupidity of it is that NOBODY is trying to make the case that Floyd sucks or isn't great.....such delicate feelings you have
Re: Duran : In My Era, Mayweather Would Have Been Ordinary
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Originally Posted by
imp
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Originally Posted by
El Kabong
You know the Floyd fans are on the ropes when they're trying to defend Floyd by trying to make the discussion about Wlad. And the stupidity of it is that NOBODY is trying to make the case that Floyd sucks or isn't great.....such delicate feelings you have
Lol.
It has been said many times already that floyd owns whatever type of duran.
Wlad wont be missed after retirement but floyd will
Its OK....just cry it out
Re: Duran : In My Era, Mayweather Would Have Been Ordinary
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Originally Posted by
jehoshaphat
First off, once you get past the article headline being a lie then you'll see a more reasonable Duran approach. Duran never said Mayweather would have been ordinary. What he said and was making it out to be is that Mayweather wouldn't have stood out from that elite hall of fame group he mixed it up with. He basically said Mayweather would have belonged in that group but wouldn't have stood out from them like they were second tier like he is doing to today's era. And with that point I don't necessarily disagree although I find it funny that Mayweather probably would have had the easiest time with Duran's style and maybe have knocked him from that group. Duran was 1-4 in that group and squeaked by for the lone victory at that. Every opponent in that group beat him. He might want to realize he actually was the low man on that totem pole. Adding Mayweather may have taken his name from belonging.
Duran had possibly the biggest win though out of all of them, the man was the smallest of the bunch yet gave Leonard and Hagler hell, IMO despite being brutally KO'd by Hearns he gave Hagler a better fight than Hearns did, Leonard danced and mocked Duran in the rematch more than actually beat him up or even outboxed him, that's why it baffles me that people regard "No Mas" as if Duran was taking an ass whooping when he really wasn't, the man isn't regarded THE GREATEST LIGHTWEIGHT of ALL TIME for no reason, and IMO he'd be on a more even playing field against Floyd than he was with ANY of the other 3 mentioned, hence why he can say he would have handled him, funny how people only look at what's shiny and new and try to cast out great fighters from the past as overrated
Re: Duran : In My Era, Mayweather Would Have Been Ordinary
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Originally Posted by
imp
Lets flip the script.
Dont be surprised if a prime cotto gets him out by 8 via bodyshots.
A prime roid mosley destroys duran in 6.
:o
LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL!!!!! ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
Oh my ******* God! I'm lost for words.... I'm just so lost for words right now!
