Re: When Pacquiao beats Cotto
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Originally Posted by
Lyle
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Originally Posted by
Fenster
If THE MAN don't want to fight you it means he can earn more money elsewhere ;D
He wouldn't fight Paul Williams either....I mean Floyd is as talented of a fighter as I have EVER seen, but MY GOD it's frustrating seeing how he does business.
ARE YOU FUKIN SHITTING ME LYLE!!!!
Who was Paul Williams when Floyd was fighting? Why didnt Floyd fight him? Oh yea huge money fights with Hatton and Delahoya thats why !!! Now your saying its frustrating how he does business?? How much friggin more money and better business position could he have created for himself? Damn your a fool sometimes:rolleyes:
Look at the time frames Einstein, Williams was a prospect when Floyd won the title and then went on to make a bizillion dollars back to back fighting 2 of the biggest names and supported fighters of this era.
Williams meanwhile beat Margarito, who everyone thought was overrated and then lost to a mediocre Quintana. Seriously do you read half the shat you type. It wasnt till Floyd retired Williams rebounded and forged this incredible foothold in 3 divisions..
Class dismissed:rolleyes:
Re: When Pacquiao beats Cotto
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Lyle
Floyd could also have earned money (and respect) by unifying titles....but he never even tried that which means in each weight class he has fought in he hasn't beaten all of the best guys out there.
You can say that certainly about Light-Welterweight & in most eyes about Welterweight (although he is a lineal champ there), but not about his time at Super-Featherweight & Lightweight. Light-Welter is the only weight at which he has not fought the top guy at the weight. I admit I would have liked for him to fight the best welters, but he hasn't yet. Who cares about unifying a load of trinkets, it usually becomes a racket & one of the fighters drops their belt as in the Cotto-Clottey fight. Lineal championships matter more than defending some alphabet in Sven Ottke style.
Re: When Pacquiao beats Cotto
The title holders who Floyd Mayweather Jr. DID NOT fight:
Welterweight: Miguel Cotto, Paul Williams, Antonio Margarito, Shane Mosley, Luis Collazo, Carlos Quintana
Light Welterweight: Miguel Cotto, Vivian Harris, Kostya Tszyu
Lightweight: Paul Spadafora, Leonard Dorin, Artur Grigorian
SuperFeather: Joel Casamayor, Acelino Freitas
...I think a couple of those guys would have done OK with Floyd, guess we'll never know, infact I KNOW I will catch hell for even posting such a blasphem against the All Great Floyd Mayweather Jr. the fighter who is great not because of WHO he fights but only because of the skill he has
Re: When Pacquiao beats Cotto
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Lyle
The title holders who Floyd Mayweather Jr. DID NOT fight:
Welterweight: Miguel Cotto, Paul Williams, Antonio Margarito, Shane Mosley, Luis Collazo, Carlos Quintana
There was a chance for him to fight Mosley after the Oscar fight, but Mosley chose to fight Cotto instead after pulling out with a toothache. I'm not trying to aim at Mosley, because I don't believe he ducks guys, but it's not like the opportunity wasn't there for him. Collazo & Quintana were never legitimate contenders & had he fought them he would of caught hell for it. I would of liked to see him fight Margarito if only so that cheating bastard never had anything to bitch about. Williams gets ducked by EVERYBODY after he beat Margarito, even Shane Mosley said he's high-risk, low-reward. A Cotto fight would have been good, & the Cotto who fought Mosley & Judah was a guy who looked like he would have been very difficult to beat. However, the 'Cotto-Mayweather' bandwagon didn't really heat up until after Cotto beat Judah, at which point a Hatton fight was already signed. But it would have been good to have seen him fight any one of Mosley, Margacheato or Cotto.
Light Welterweight: Miguel Cotto, Vivian Harris, Kostya Tszyu
He should of fought Tszyu instead of Gatti & possibly Cotto. Harris was getting KO'd before Floyd even had a belt though. I do think after he won the WBC belt he should've gone for a unification with either Cotto or Hatton though.
Lightweight: Paul Spadafora, Leonard Dorin, Artur Grigorian
You can't be serious with any of these. Mayweather used Spadafora for sparring, no-one was clamouring to see any of these fights, bar Mayweather they were all seen as weak alphabet holders. The 2 best guys in the division, Castillo & Corrales, he had already beaten.
SuperFeather: Joel Casamayor, Acelino Freitas
Both these guys were fighting weak opposition & were not seeking to fight anyone of note until they actually fought each other AFTER PBF had gone up to LW. Casamayor fought guys who quite frankly weren't fit to tie his shoes & the only guy Freitas fought of any note was a faded Jauregui.
...I think a couple of those guys would have done OK with Floyd, guess we'll never know, infact I KNOW I will catch hell for even posting such a blasphem against the All Great Floyd Mayweather Jr. the fighter who is great not because of WHO he fights but only because of the skill he has
Replies to your list above. I get the impression you googled & saw who were the champs at the same time he was in the division there regardless of what they were doing at the time :rolleyes:
You have legitimate complaints about at least 1 of the divisions, but not SFW or LW.
Re: When Pacquiao beats Cotto
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Originally Posted by
JazMerkin
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Lyle
The title holders who Floyd Mayweather Jr. DID NOT fight:
Welterweight: Miguel Cotto, Paul Williams, Antonio Margarito, Shane Mosley, Luis Collazo, Carlos Quintana
There was a chance for him to fight Mosley after the Oscar fight, but Mosley chose to fight Cotto instead after pulling out with a toothache. I'm not trying to aim at Mosley, because I don't believe he ducks guys, but it's not like the opportunity wasn't there for him. Collazo & Quintana were never legitimate contenders & had he fought them he would of caught hell for it. I would of liked to see him fight Margarito if only so that cheating bastard never had anything to bitch about. Williams gets ducked by EVERYBODY after he beat Margarito, even Shane Mosley said he's high-risk, low-reward. A Cotto fight would have been good, & the Cotto who fought Mosley & Judah was a guy who looked like he would have been very difficult to beat. However, the 'Cotto-Mayweather' bandwagon didn't really heat up until after Cotto beat Judah, at which point a Hatton fight was already signed. But it would have been good to have seen him fight any one of Mosley, Margacheato or Cotto.
Light Welterweight: Miguel Cotto, Vivian Harris, Kostya Tszyu
He should of fought Tszyu instead of Gatti & possibly Cotto. Harris was getting KO'd before Floyd even had a belt though. I do think after he won the WBC belt he should've gone for a unification with either Cotto or Hatton though.
Lightweight: Paul Spadafora, Leonard Dorin, Artur Grigorian
You can't be serious with any of these. Mayweather used Spadafora for sparring, no-one was clamouring to see any of these fights, bar Mayweather they were all seen as weak alphabet holders. The 2 best guys in the division, Castillo & Corrales, he had already beaten.
SuperFeather: Joel Casamayor, Acelino Freitas
Both these guys were fighting weak opposition & were not seeking to fight anyone of note until they actually fought each other AFTER PBF had gone up to LW. Casamayor fought guys who quite frankly weren't fit to tie his shoes & the only guy Freitas fought of any note was a faded Jauregui.
...I think a couple of those guys would have done OK with Floyd, guess we'll never know, infact I KNOW I will catch hell for even posting such a blasphem against the All Great Floyd Mayweather Jr. the fighter who is great not because of WHO he fights but only because of the skill he has
Replies to your list above. I get the impression you googled & saw who were the champs at the same time he was in the division there regardless of what they were doing at the time :rolleyes:
You have legitimate complaints about at least 1 of the divisions, but not SFW or LW.
agree with most of what you said, but Collazo was WBA CHAMPION, and afterwards Quintana WBO CHAMPION, it's true Quintana lost it the first defense in a rematch against the guy he beat, but to say neither of the two were real contenders is kinda a joke
Re: When Pacquiao beats Cotto
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Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JazMerkin
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Originally Posted by
Lyle
The title holders who Floyd Mayweather Jr. DID NOT fight:
Welterweight: Miguel Cotto, Paul Williams, Antonio Margarito, Shane Mosley, Luis Collazo, Carlos Quintana
There was a chance for him to fight Mosley after the Oscar fight, but Mosley chose to fight Cotto instead after pulling out with a toothache. I'm not trying to aim at Mosley, because I don't believe he ducks guys, but it's not like the opportunity wasn't there for him. Collazo & Quintana were never legitimate contenders & had he fought them he would of caught hell for it. I would of liked to see him fight Margarito if only so that cheating bastard never had anything to bitch about. Williams gets ducked by EVERYBODY after he beat Margarito, even Shane Mosley said he's high-risk, low-reward. A Cotto fight would have been good, & the Cotto who fought Mosley & Judah was a guy who looked like he would have been very difficult to beat. However, the 'Cotto-Mayweather' bandwagon didn't really heat up until after Cotto beat Judah, at which point a Hatton fight was already signed. But it would have been good to have seen him fight any one of Mosley, Margacheato or Cotto.
Light Welterweight: Miguel Cotto, Vivian Harris, Kostya Tszyu
He should of fought Tszyu instead of Gatti & possibly Cotto. Harris was getting KO'd before Floyd even had a belt though. I do think after he won the WBC belt he should've gone for a unification with either Cotto or Hatton though.
Lightweight: Paul Spadafora, Leonard Dorin, Artur Grigorian
You can't be serious with any of these. Mayweather used Spadafora for sparring, no-one was clamouring to see any of these fights, bar Mayweather they were all seen as weak alphabet holders. The 2 best guys in the division, Castillo & Corrales, he had already beaten.
SuperFeather: Joel Casamayor, Acelino Freitas
Both these guys were fighting weak opposition & were not seeking to fight anyone of note until they actually fought each other AFTER PBF had gone up to LW. Casamayor fought guys who quite frankly weren't fit to tie his shoes & the only guy Freitas fought of any note was a faded Jauregui.
...I think a couple of those guys would have done OK with Floyd, guess we'll never know, infact I KNOW I will catch hell for even posting such a blasphem against the All Great Floyd Mayweather Jr. the fighter who is great not because of WHO he fights but only because of the skill he has
Replies to your list above. I get the impression you googled & saw who were the champs at the same time he was in the division there regardless of what they were doing at the time :rolleyes:
You have legitimate complaints about at least 1 of the divisions, but not SFW or LW.
agree with most of what you said, but Collazo was WBA CHAMPION, and afterwards Quintana WBO CHAMPION, it's true Quintana lost it the first defense in a rematch against the guy he beat, but to say neither of the two were real contenders is kinda a joke
What I mean is neither of them were guys who people were clamouring to see fight for the lineal championships, they weren't in the Top 3 of the division at those times. I mean Quintana even when he beat Williams was still behind Cotto & Mosley IMO. Having a paper belt doesn't mean you deserve to fight for the best in the division as you yourself have said numerous times about Berto.
Re: When Pacquiao beats Cotto
#1 If it was so easy to beat these guys then why not unify?
#2 I was just stating who he didn't fight....the only guys I really think he should have fought were Cotto, Mosley, Williams, and maybe Margarito and MAYBE Freitas
Re: When Pacquiao beats Cotto
Why noy UNIFY?
How can THE MAN unify? Unify what?
Re: When Pacquiao beats Cotto
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Lyle
#1 If it was so easy to beat these guys then why not unify?
#2 I was just stating who he didn't fight....the only guys I really think he should have fought were Cotto, Mosley, Williams, and maybe Margarito and MAYBE Freitas
#1 Lyle, you're not a stupid guy, you know it's not as simple as that. I think below 140 most of those guys, or at least their promoters weren't keen on the fights when they could defend alphabets. I believe Casamayor & Freitas' respective promoters Luis DeCubas & Arty Pelullo were not keen on risking them against guys who might beat them until the contracts were close to expiring when they fought one another. I personally don't see the point in unifying if those guys were not the best & in the lower divisions they were just little Valuevs. Becoming lineal champ is far more impressive in my eyes. I mean to use your favourite punching bag, do you rate David Haye's acheivements in unifying a weak CW division? I give him credit for the becoming the lineal champ more.
#2 I don't agree with Freitas for the reasons above. Mosley there's also the fact that he had the chance to make the fight with Mayweather but fought Cotto instead (not that I blame him, I understand he was getting a slightly better purse split in that fight). Now, I don't think Margarito deserves any fight being the cheating turd he is, but I think it was a fight that had he beaten him would of been another Baldomir. Williams & Cotto at 147 were legitimate challenges, as is Mosley now, so hopefully he fights at least 1 of them before retiring.
Re: When Pacquiao beats Cotto
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Originally Posted by
Fenster
Why noy UNIFY?
How can THE MAN unify? Unify what?
The titles...Floyd has only ever had the WBC title in each and every weight class he's ever been in
Re: When Pacquiao beats Cotto
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Lyle
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
Why noy UNIFY?
How can THE MAN unify? Unify what?
The titles...Floyd has only ever had the WBC title in each and every weight class he's ever been in
He also had the IBF at 147, but dumped it as soon as they wanted a sanctioning fee
Re: When Pacquiao beats Cotto
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Originally Posted by
JazMerkin
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JazMerkin
Replies to your list above. I get the impression you googled & saw who were the champs at the same time he was in the division there regardless of what they were doing at the time :rolleyes:
You have legitimate complaints about at least 1 of the divisions, but not SFW or LW.
agree with most of what you said, but Collazo was WBA CHAMPION, and afterwards Quintana WBO CHAMPION, it's true Quintana lost it the first defense in a rematch against the guy he beat, but to say neither of the two were real contenders is kinda a joke
What I mean is neither of them were guys who people were clamouring to see fight for the lineal championships, they weren't in the Top 3 of the division at those times. I mean Quintana even when he beat Williams was still behind Cotto & Mosley IMO. Having a paper belt doesn't mean you deserve to fight for the best in the division as you yourself have said numerous times about Berto.
i agree with you on that
Re: When Pacquiao beats Cotto
In hindsight, YES Margarito is a cheating turd, but at the time he was very scary challenge for Mayweather.
Think if FLOYD and not Shane had KO'd Margarito like that....not that it would happen, but I sure as hell would have been impressed. And if he had outboxed someone like Cotto or Paul Williams, that would have been spectacular....much more so than beating Ricky Hatton outside of Hatton's natural weight class.
Re: When Pacquiao beats Cotto
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Lyle
In hindsight, YES Margarito is a cheating turd, but at the time he was very scary challenge for Mayweather.
Think if FLOYD and not Shane had KO'd Margarito like that....not that it would happen, but I sure as hell would have been impressed. And if he had outboxed someone like Cotto or Paul Williams, that would have been spectacular....much more so than beating Ricky Hatton outside of Hatton's natural weight class.
I agree on all of that except for Hatton being outside of his weight-class. Hatton was further from where he started then Floyd, I think the same thing happens at 140, it was only an issue post-fight brought about by a British media desperate to find excuses for 'our Ricky'. Remember, Mayweather was coming down from LMW & Hatton had already won a belt at the weight, it was not seen as a problem by anybody pre-fight. I don't think Margarito was a scary challenge, but he was a high-risk, low-reward fight especially when compared with the similar risk for facing Oscar, but 5x the payday.
Re: When Pacquiao beats Cotto
...Don't know how you can not make that excuse (about weight) after seeing Ricky struggle with Luis Collazo, I thought the PBF fight was pointless after that display.
Sure De la Hoya was a MUST HAVE...I don't understand why Shane Mosley isn't, but I digress. Margarito was very high risk, he was dangerous for Floyd as I am not sure how Floyd would handle someone that big...I mean De la Hoya was well past his best, but Margarito was in his prime and very rugged and very active.
I mean sure Floyd could have beaten any of those guys but we'll never know as he never fought them....nobody would have thought Buster Douglas would be the guy to KO Tyson or that Ali would be the guy to beat Sonny Liston, but stuff like that happens, styles make fights, and sometimes you don't have your A game.
I see Floyd a lot like Roy Jones Jr. extremely talented, almost unbeatable, wins damn near every round, but never took chances with his career...compare it to what Miguel Cotto has done and you have to appreciate the warrior that is Miguel Cotto
