What will Clinch-ko's legacy be?

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Originally Posted by denilson200

His legacy ?

Let’s face facts WK wins have been basically the guys Rocky Balboa beat between the rematch with Apollo Creed and the first Clubber Lang fight. As Mickey said, “They was good fighters, but….…”

It was hard to not laugh when I watched the documentary titled “Klitschko,” and they acted as if the Byrd fight was like the "Thrilla in Manila"

None WK of victims have been titans.

There are no gems on his record. This is a guy who (In his prime) lost inside the distance. Ross Puritty, Corrie Sanders, and Lamon Brewster so if your talking about a top-five (hell, top ten) placement on the all-time list of heavyweight champions, forget it.

Yes he was dominant but he’sawkward and oafish when compared to past greats.

The AJ fight is a total mismatch and I'm talking Tyson - Peter McNeely standard.

Klitschko won't go beyond 3 rounds with AJ and who wants to wager with me ?

Any takers

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What do you think the great black champs of the past would think about Wladimir Clinch-ko?

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Originally Posted by El Kabong

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Originally Posted by erics44

Every promoter / promotion favours their fighters, hundreds of fights have swung the promoted fighters way because they are the promoted fighter

The promoters have a business to run, if their money earners lose they could be massively out of pocket, could even end their business if their prize asset is on the wrong end of a decision

So it happens much more often that they are on the right end of a decision

Some fights are close that perhaps should of gone one way but go the other, others are blatantly bad decisions

Now fighters can be more protected depending on their standing and earning potential

The kilts with wlad took this to the extreme , wlad would generally win a decision / get a knock out and all they had to do was let him hold and lean, both of which are against the rules , and they didn't mind that it was extremely blatant and regular because the German public would still pay

The fights were never pre planned but the ref and officials were well aware of the job they needed to do to earn they type of money they were earning

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I didn't see Sam peter get warned for punching Wlad in the back of the head....at that point in time wasn't Peter a much more likely money maker considering the losses Wlad had suffered to Sanders and Brewster?

And the extreme blatant "against the rules" tactics of other fighters whom you never bring up?

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common, do you really think that they were unaware of the potential fan base that wlad had at the time

and punching to the back of the head? wlad ran scared for 12 rounds in that first fight, his head was down or turned more than he was looking forward

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Originally Posted by El Kabong

A lot of greats have lost in their primes inside the distance....I mean A LOT. Joe Frazier got blasted out, Foreman lost in his primehttp://cdncache-a.akamaihd.net/items...rrow-10x10.png, Ali lost in his prime (if not for the draft dodging) albeit he wasn't KO'd until later on....still that Henry Cooper fight was dodgy as fuck Wlad never pulled any of that kind of shit. Lennox Lewis got stopped twice in his prime, Mike Tyson got stopped by Buster Douglas and that was at a time when people thought Tyson was unbeatable (but it's totally not his prime because his prime was with Cus and/or Rooney :rolleyes: ), Jack Dempsey got stopped in his primehttp://cdncache-a.akamaihd.net/items...rrow-10x10.png (Ko'd by Fireman Jim Flynn in 1)......even Joe Louis lost by KO right in the contender part of his career. It happens, Marciano, Johnson, Tunney, Holmes, those guys didn't get KO'd in their primes (though some of those guys were KO'd earlier or later but they got KO'd, except for Rocky and Gene The Fighting Marine).....those your all-time greats?

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To be honest I can't really put in any better than titofan and if I did I'd be pretty much repeating what he has said.

But to add a few things. Frazier only to Ali and Foreman. Which like someone saying they only ever lost a 1 on 1 to M.Jordan and Magic Johnson or Lebron and Steph Curry (For the younger cats out there)

Also the Tyson - Douglas fight, read his book, Tyson spent the night with Japanese hookers, the day b4 the fight and even in that fight he still should have got the win as he knocked down Douglas 4 the count of 14. Tyson fell out of love for boxing long b4 the Douglas fight. Yeah Dempsey and Louis lost. But you can't seriously put WK in the same league as those guys

Lennox Lewis defeats were one punch KO's, that can happen in heavyweight boxing. WK defeats were systematic beat-downs. Big difference.

Did Ali lose in his prime ? I'd argue that Ali never fought in his prime due to his three year exile. The Cooper fight. Yup. Ali (Or Clay then) got lucky. Had that been a minute early, Cooper would have 100% finished him and who knows ? We may well never have heard of Ali if that would have happened. Crazy to think how sporting history may well have rested on such thin margins. Comes back to Al Pacino Speech in Any Given Sunday

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Originally Posted by TitoFan

I know you don't like to read anti-Wlad stuff from me particularly, but tough shit.

Joe Frazier got "blasted out" by none other than George Foreman, an ATG. After that fight he didn't change his fighting style.
Had the "Thrilla in Manila" with Ali later on.

Foreman lost in his prime to none other than Ali. He then lost to Jimmy Young and retired, only to come back years later for his storied 2nd career. He was still a big puncher... he was still aggressive, albeit a bit rounder and bit slower.

Lennox got knocked out twice, and came back to avenge both those knockouts with stoppages of his own.
Lewis did not change his fighting style 'cause he had gotten knocked out.

Mike Tyson got stopped by Buster Douglas and damn if people don't give Douglas enough credit for fighting the fight of his life. It was toe-to-toe for 10 rounds.
Mike didn't change his fighting style after that.

Jack Dempsey, Joe Louis, Marciano..... ALL those guys you mentioned maintained their aggressive, effective fighting style throughout their entire, illustrious, HOF careers.


Wladimir Klitschko got KO'ed early in his career by virtual bums. That experience, coupled with some coaching from Emanuel, turned Wlad into a timid little rabbit. Those fighters who were later knocked out by him were scared shitless themselves (ie: Ray Austin), or were downright bums (ie: Leapai, Pianeta). On other occasions the yellow streak was mutual (ie: Sultan, Haye), resulting in horrible fights. Finally, on the rare occasions the opponent was up to the task, Wlad would shamelessly foul, clinch, and maul to his heart's content (ie: Povetkin).

Wlad did change his fighting style to one of survival over aggression.



Every HW champion has had their share of bums on their resumes. But not until Wladimir has there been a HW champion so hated for what I've stated above. Sure, he's beloved in Germany. Who doesn't support their native (or adopted) son in the most prestigious title in all of sports? But outside of that, people abhor him. Why do you think the popularity of the HW division has plummeted since Wlad began his reign? A lot of people (myself included) were ecstatic when Wlad lost to Fury (I wanted a KO, but I'll wait for Joshua to do that). And where is Fury now? It doesn't matter. In fact, it's even MORE damning for Wlad to have lost to such a loser, in what was probably the WORST FUCKING FIGHT IN THE HISTORY OF THE HEAVYWEIGHT DIVISION.... breaking all sorts of records for inactivity? WHY? Because as usual, Wlad was scared shitless. THAT is why he only managed to land a punch every full moon or so.

I'm sure your answers to me will not be as measured as they've been for the others, but again... FUCK IT.
Those are the facts, take them or leave them.

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Originally Posted by TitoFan

I know you don't like to read anti-Wlad stuff from me particularly, but tough shit.

Joe Frazier got "blasted out" by none other than George Foreman, an ATG. After that fight he didn't change his fighting style.
Had the "Thrilla in Manila" with Ali later on.

Foreman lost in his prime to none other than Ali. He then lost to Jimmy Young and retired, only to come back years later for his storied 2nd career. He was still a big puncher... he was still aggressive, albeit a bit rounder and bit slower.

Lennox got knocked out twice, and came back to avenge both those knockouts with stoppages of his own.
Lewis did not change his fighting style 'cause he had gotten knocked out.

Mike Tyson got stopped by Buster Douglas and damn if people don't give Douglas enough credit for fighting the fight of his life. It was toe-to-toe for 10 rounds.
Mike didn't change his fighting style after that.

Jack Dempsey, Joe Louis, Marciano..... ALL those guys you mentioned maintained their aggressive, effective fighting style throughout their entire, illustrious, HOF careers.


Wladimir Klitschko got KO'ed early in his career by virtual bums. That experience, coupled with some coaching from Emanuel, turned Wlad into a timid little rabbit. Those fighters who were later knocked out by him were scared shitless themselves (ie: Ray Austin), or were downright bums (ie: Leapai, Pianeta). On other occasions the yellow streak was mutual (ie: Sultan, Haye), resulting in horrible fights. Finally, on the rare occasions the opponent was up to the task, Wlad would shamelessly foul, clinch, and maul to his heart's content (ie: Povetkin).

Wlad did change his fighting style to one of survival over aggression.



Every HW champion has had their share of bums on their resumes. But not until Wladimir has there been a HW champion so hated for what I've stated above. Sure, he's beloved in Germany. Who doesn't support their native (or adopted) son in the most prestigious title in all of sports? But outside of that, people abhor him. Why do you think the popularity of the HW division has plummeted since Wlad began his reign? A lot of people (myself included) were ecstatic when Wlad lost to Fury (I wanted a KO, but I'll wait for Joshua to do that). And where is Fury now? It doesn't matter. In fact, it's even MORE damning for Wlad to have lost to such a loser, in what was probably the WORST FUCKING FIGHT IN THE HISTORY OF THE HEAVYWEIGHT DIVISION.... breaking all sorts of records for inactivity? WHY? Because as usual, Wlad was scared shitless. THAT is why he only managed to land a punch every full moon or so.

I'm sure your answers to me will not be as measured as they've been for the others, but again... FUCK IT.
Those are the facts, take them or leave them.

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Oooh look at TitoFan trying to be sassy ;)

No Joe Frazier didn't change his style, he was 29 years old and a pressure fighter....he wasn't going to be able to change his style. Ali changed HIS style in order to what was that you said "to one of survival over aggression" but that's no biggie, it's Ali and not 1 bad word will be said about HIM. Sure you see Ali vs Williams and see your float like a butterfly sting like a bee, then you see Ali-Foreman and it's lay on the ropes like you're tired and arm punch like a bee....but oh Ali was the greatest and totally not because he just said that shit himself ;D

Foreman's style changed completely from the Ali loss to his comeback, in part due to age and in part due to him fighting smarter using height and reach

This caveat of "b-b-b-but he didn't change his style" is ridiculous and secondary to the whole "got knocked out in his prime" main issue, but good try. You want to hate the guy hate the guy go ahead, but don't get mad if I come along and correct a few things here and there about what you say because you get a bit happy with your words and sometimes you lay it on a little thick as to how things happen.

"Lennox Lewis avenged his defeats".....Wlad beat Lamon Brewster and what? Nothing he gets nothing for that? No "Atta boy" no "Way to be champ" Haha, only Wlad can do that avenge a defeat and then STILL have you bring up "Well Lennox avenged his defeats" like Wlad has done absolutely nothing....Wlad got up off the canvas to win a fight, Lennox ever do that? But naaah, that's no big deal no need to be handing Wlad any credit because you thoroughly dislike the guy.....fine, dislike away, enjoy your disliking.

Tyson didn't change his style.....oh really? Well then you must be the fucking first person to ever admit that because if you ask a Tyson fan about him there's no better Tyson than Tyson with Cus or Rooney and anything else is not Tyson in his prime.


I get it you don't like Wlad....please oh please tell me MORE about it oooooh and could you do it in a way where you're condescending and patronizing to me at the same time? OOOOH I just can't WAIT for that post :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by erics44

common, do you really think that they were unaware of the potential fan base that wlad had at the time

and punching to the back of the head? wlad ran scared for 12 rounds in that first fight, his head was down or turned more than he was looking forward

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Potential fan base?!?! Right before that fight even VITALI was telling Wlad "Hey, maybe you should retire". Sam Peter was THE NEXT BIG THING he didn't pan out in the end but come on man, Wlad was at the deepest depth of his career right there.

After the bell rang for round one it was in the air but sitting ringside I was surprised that no one said of this terror Duran, "Who left the cage unlocked." Things change! I liked Kenny by decision and Duran looked like a hungry lion instead. Rules are something not supported in the jungle where Roberto made his home. Would Roberto have won today? I suppose so if Clinch-Co was coddled Roberto would scare the piss out of the referee. I used to hear stories that heavyweights wouldn't spar with him in training.

One of the best jab in the business of his time, great physical shape and technique, perhaps he was not the most exciting but he came in to break people and that's just what he did. Top 10 is pretty pretty realistic.

I agree that Wlad had a tremendous jab, straight right and left hook. And he had good power!

He had a ton of assets, which makes me more critical of his style!

In boxing, guys like Paulie Malignaggi have to run and stick n move because they can't bust a grape. And here Wlad spent a career running and he could knock anyone out with either hand! Made no fucking sense to me. Such a waste of talent and physical gifts.

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Originally Posted by El Kabong

No Joe Frazier didn't change his style, he was 29 years old and a pressure fighter....he wasn't going to be able to change his style.

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Yes, he was 29 when he got KTFO'ed by Foreman. Wlad was 28 when he got KTFO'ed by Brewster. I don't get your fucking point but ok... you're Lyle, so obviously you're right. :vd: Frazier wasn't going to be able to change his style because........ oh...... because he was a "pressure fighter"? Good reason. :rolleyes:

Frazier continued his storied career, and even had the aforementioned Thrilla in Manila later on. Wlad turned into Bambi from there on out. Nothing you said explains away this disparity.

Objection OVERRULED.

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Originally Posted by El Kabong

Ali changed HIS style in order to what was that you said "to one of survival over aggression" but that's no biggie, it's Ali and not 1 bad word will be said about HIM. Sure you see Ali vs Williams and see your float like a butterfly sting like a bee, then you see Ali-Foreman and it's lay on the ropes like you're tired and arm punch like a bee....but oh Ali was the greatest and totally not because he just said that shit himself ;D

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Yes.... (sigh)..... Ali changed his style, Lyle. You get a happy face for your notebook. (patiently)..... Ali changed his style, but he remained an effective, aggressive fighter. The rope-a-dope against Foreman? He was facing the most feared puncher probably in HW history, the one who had pulverized Frazier previously. Ali didn't throw himself shamelessly on top of Foreman the way Wlad did with Povetkin. Ali employed a strategy whereby he waited till Foreman tired himself out, then knocked him out.

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Originally Posted by El Kabong

"Lennox Lewis avenged his defeats".....Wlad beat Lamon Brewster and what? Nothing he gets nothing for that? No "Atta boy" no "Way to be champ" Haha, only Wlad can do that avenge a defeat and then STILL have you bring up "Well Lennox avenged his defeats" like Wlad has done absolutely nothing....Wlad got up off the canvas to win a fight, Lennox ever do that? But naaah, that's no big deal no need to be handing Wlad any credit because you thoroughly dislike the guy.....fine, dislike away, enjoy your disliking.

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Atta boy.

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Originally Posted by El Kabong

Tyson didn't change his style.....oh really? Well then you must be the fucking first person to ever admit that because if you ask a Tyson fan about him there's no better Tyson than Tyson with Cus or Rooney and anything else is not Tyson in his prime.

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This was your most hilarious response.
I speak of Tyson not changing his style and you respond that people say that Tyson with Cus was better and anything else is not Tyson in his prime?!?

Hello? Habla español?? Sprichst du Deutsch??

I like it better when we debate something and you actually make sense, TBH.


I hate to put it this way, because it IS going to sound patronizing and condescending, but I'll try to be gentle.

Changing one's style has fuck all to do with how good you happen to be at whatever point in time, or not. They're two separate issues.

Comprende?

Tito, pressure fighters don't change their stripes. Now with Wlad you had a big guy, a big puncher, what did he lack? A chin, some defense, you patch together a style that works for him and boom you can change him. What was Frazier going to do? Was Joe Frazier going to use his height on Foreman? Was Joe going to use a different defense against Foreman? I mean you tell me, I've not really ever seen a pressure fighter be anything other than a pressure fighter. If a fighter's mentality is to move the hands, attack attack attack, then it's going to take some time to slow them down, have them think defense first at times. Imagine this, imagine Mike Tyson had to change his style, what would you end up with? It wouldn't be Pernell Whittaker, it wouldn't be Lennox Lewis, MAYBE you could get him to fight more like Holyfield, but at the end of the day 100% of Pressure fighters who can punch with power end up like David Tua and the Pressure fighters without power.....well they don't last very long. Joe Frazier never won another meaningful fight, oooh he and Ali beat the piss out of each other in Manilla, whoopty do...Frazier lost yet again to Foreman right after that as well....didn't make any progress did he? Meanwhile Wlad, looking like the career is over at 28 gets back in the saddle and runs off a streak of wins which is HISTORIC...but ok, I get it, you don't like him, don't like his style....and here I was thinking that the objective was to win fights.


Ali was yes EFFECTIVE, yes maybe even AGGRESSIVE....fun to watch???? For you maybe, but not for me. Leaning on the ropes, holding the head of his opponent down with both arms....illegal or do we just notice that when Wlad has a clinch? Wlad never held an opponent down like Ali did, Wlad would tie up and walk back, but that's about it.


Take your atta boy and fuck off it's like 10 years too late for that shit


See again my point about pressure fighters not changing their styles...Tyson was what he was, the was nothing else you were going to do to better the guy. Manny Steward made Wlad a smarter and therefore BETTER fighter. Wlad could have fought his career the way he fought early on as a pro, but had he done so he wouldn't have been as dominant because there's no guarantee that he'd be able to KO everyone he fought, plus he'd be giving up his most useful advantages in his height and reach....he won belts with the previous style, he became GREAT after Steward coached him up. Could he have been better? As in better for the fans to watch? Yeah, he probably could have...but could the results have been better? You'd be very hard pressed to answer in the affirmative there.



You don't appreciate Wlad, I get it, I think we ALL get it....totally fine....but he's still an All-Time great fighter, you don't get his record without being great, you don't win as many title fights, you don't get as many title fights, you don't reign for that long without being a GREAT fighter....doesn't matter who you face either. Larry Holmes got beat by a light heavyweight for fucks sake and he's a great fighter.

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Originally Posted by El Kabong

Tito, pressure fighters don't change their stripes. Now with Wlad you had a big guy, a big puncher, what did he lack? A chin, some defense, you patch together a style that works for him and boom you can change him. What was Frazier going to do? Was Joe Frazier going to use his height on Foreman? Was Joe going to use a different defense against Foreman? I mean you tell me, I've not really ever seen a pressure fighter be anything other than a pressure fighter. If a fighter's mentality is to move the hands, attack attack attack, then it's going to take some time to slow them down, have them think defense first at times. Imagine this, imagine Mike Tyson had to change his style, what would you end up with? It wouldn't be Pernell Whittaker, it wouldn't be Lennox Lewis, MAYBE you could get him to fight more like Holyfield, but at the end of the day 100% of Pressure fighters who can punch with power end up like David Tua and the Pressure fighters without power.....well they don't last very long. Joe Frazier never won another meaningful fight, oooh he and Ali beat the piss out of each other in Manilla, whoopty do...Frazier lost yet again to Foreman right after that as well....didn't make any progress did he? Meanwhile Wlad, looking like the career is over at 28 gets back in the saddle and runs off a streak of wins which is HISTORIC...but ok, I get it, you don't like him, don't like his style....and here I was thinking that the objective was to win fights.

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Of all those mentioned, I'll give you Frazier as a no-way-no-how he could've ever changed his style no matter what. He only had the one gear... forward... throwing hooks and punches in bunches. The others are not good examples to try to make a case for Wlad. Ali changed his style to adapt to his changing body and to age. But he never fought scared of getting hit. He merely used different tactics to minimize whatever blows he did take. Lennox got KTFO'ed just as bad as Wlad did. Now Lennox was not a pressure fighter, was he. He was more comparable to Wlad than either Frazier or Tyson. So how did Lennox react to getting KTFO'ed? Did he crawl into a defensive shell, caring only about protecting his chin and if the knockout victory happened to come he'd welcome it? NO. He made whatever adjustments he felt were necessary, and continued his long and successful career. Your smug last comment notwithstanding, yes... the objective is to win fights. But boxing also aspires to attract fans, does it not? Quit saying "YOU don't like him." It almost sounds like I'm the lonely voice in the planet criticizing Wlad, when you know full well even most of the forum totally dislikes his style. So news flash: It's not just TitoFan.

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Originally Posted by El Kabong

Ali was yes EFFECTIVE, yes maybe even AGGRESSIVE....fun to watch???? For you maybe, but not for me. Leaning on the ropes, holding the head of his opponent down with both arms....illegal or do we just notice that when Wlad has a clinch? Wlad never held an opponent down like Ali did, Wlad would tie up and walk back, but that's about it.

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"Fun to watch"..... ahhh, yes. Yes or no answers, please: Was Wlad-Povetkin fun to watch? Was Wlad-Sultan? Was Wlad-Fury? Was Wlad-Haye?
No further questions, your Honor.

"Wlad never held an opponent down like Ali did"??!?? I had to reread that several times, cause I refused to believe I was reading correctly.
I went back and rewatched lowlights of the Wlad-Povetkin fight not long ago.
From the very get-go Wlad launches himself shamelessly onto Povetkin's back.
He proceeds to this over and over and over and over and over again.
What was it? Over 180 times, to be exact?
I'm talking LAUNCHES himself. Reaching out with both hands, grabbing Povetkin around the back of the neck, and putting his entire body weight on Povetkin's back.
NOW.... before you regurgitate the line of "well the ref didn't call it"...... does the ref not calling it make it more fun to watch??
No further questions, your Honor.

We'll just make believe you never said that.

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Originally Posted by El Kabong

Take your atta boy and fuck off it's like 10 years too late for that shit

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C'mon Lyle..... didn't my sincerity just ooze out of that "atta boy"? :D

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Originally Posted by El Kabong

See again my point about pressure fighters not changing their styles...Tyson was what he was, the was nothing else you were going to do to better the guy. Manny Steward made Wlad a smarter and therefore BETTER fighter. Wlad could have fought his career the way he fought early on as a pro, but had he done so he wouldn't have been as dominant because there's no guarantee that he'd be able to KO everyone he fought, plus he'd be giving up his most useful advantages in his height and reach....he won belts with the previous style, he became GREAT after Steward coached him up. Could he have been better? As in better for the fans to watch? Yeah, he probably could have...but could the results have been better? You'd be very hard pressed to answer in the affirmative there.

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Most people say Tyson was better when Cus D'Amato was in his life and career. So theoretically if another Cus had shown up in Tyson's life and career after the original Cus died and Tyson picked up all sorts of nasty habits..... no, I don't agree there "was nothing else you could do to better the guy." Furthermore, you're making the HUGE assumption that the only way Wlad could've improved was by adopting the style he adopted. You're for some reason shutting the door on the slight possibility that Wlad could've been coached to correct his deficiencies WITHOUT giving up his height and reach advantages. That's an assumption that you're free to make, but nobody is forced to agree with.

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Originally Posted by El Kabong

You don't appreciate Wlad, I get it, I think we ALL get it....totally fine....but he's still an All-Time great fighter, you don't get his record without being great, you don't win as many title fights, you don't get as many title fights, you don't reign for that long without being a GREAT fighter....doesn't matter who you face either. Larry Holmes got beat by a light heavyweight for fucks sake and he's a great fighter.

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Know what? I'm not arguing that Wlad isn't a great fighter. Stunned?

What I've been arguing since Day One is that by Wlad adopting the style he did for the rest of his career, he cheated boxing fans of watching a great HW champion ply his skills in the way all HW heavyweight champions have done so in the past..... with honor and dignity. Not by cheating his way through a lot of his fights. Not by fighting Fury like Bambi up against a big bad logger with a chainsaw. Only in this case the chainsaw was turned off... and Bambi and the logger did a 12-round contest of who can throw the least amount of punches.



So remain on your immense soapbox... and continue thinking that it's just TitoFan who hates Wlad.
Meanwhile I'll continue pointing out all kinds of facts to you.

Hmm... maybe I'm just meaner in the way I do it.

I don't think there's anything wrong with saying Wlad fought like a big sissy!

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Originally Posted by vidgil

I don't think there's anything wrong with saying Wlad fought like a big sissy!

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If Wlad beats AJ, his legacy will be greatly enhanced as he has come back from a loss and beat a young, undefeated and hungry champion who has stopped all his opponents within 7 rounds. Easily top 10 on the list of heavyweight champions.

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Originally Posted by Master

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Originally Posted by vidgil

I don't think there's anything wrong with saying Wlad fought like a big sissy!

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If Wlad beats AJ, his legacy will be greatly enhanced as he has come back from a loss and beat a young, undefeated and hungry champion who has stopped all his opponents within 7 rounds. Easily top 10 on the list of heavyweight champions.

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Welllllll..... if he beats AJ by clinching, mauling, wrestling, fouling, and all the other stuff he's prone to do... he'll enhance his reputation as one of the sneakiest, craftiest HW's in history, and will retire without ever having that epic fight that should define great champions.

I agree with Tito. If Wlad can come back and win not by wrestling but by BOXING, then we will have to tip our hats to the man.

But I suspect with GREAT certainty that AJ will knock out Wlad.

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Originally Posted by TitoFan

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Originally Posted by Master

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Originally Posted by vidgil

I don't think there's anything wrong with saying Wlad fought like a big sissy!

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If Wlad beats AJ, his legacy will be greatly enhanced as he has come back from a loss and beat a young, undefeated and hungry champion who has stopped all his opponents within 7 rounds. Easily top 10 on the list of heavyweight champions.

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Welllllll..... if he beats AJ by clinching, mauling, wrestling, fouling, and all the other stuff he's prone to do... he'll enhance his reputation as one of the sneakiest, craftiest HW's in history, and will retire without ever having that epic fight that should define great champions.

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No well about it. If he wins then he should be recognised. Beating 6ft 6 inch Olympic and world champ is an accomplishment.