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Who beats Chad Dawson?
Barring him facing Glen Johnson again, who beats him? I think Glen would be a stupid fight for him to take because of the lack of marketability, and the fact Glen Johnson style wise is the worst fight for him out there, a guy who can walk through anything and has very sharp accurate punches is hard for anyone. I think he has speed that the LHW division hasn't seen since Roy Jones Jr left for the heavyweight division. I don't think he throws combinations like Roy, but they are still very solid combinations, and he does have good defense. I wish he moved better, but he is one of the best outside body punchers I have every seen because like Pacquaio and Roy JOnes Jr he has the speed to get to the body without being countered.
I also think there are a lot of people who will be asking, why do you say his hands are fast? They don't look that fast, but trust me he does have incredible speed on those punches, especially the left hand. He doesn't throw his jab super quick, but its mainly used to set up his left cross or right hook/uppercut.
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Taeth
Barring him facing Glen Johnson again, who beats him? I think Glen would be a stupid fight for him to take because of the lack of marketability, and the fact Glen Johnson style wise is the worst fight for him out there, a guy who can walk through anything and has very sharp accurate punches is hard for anyone. I think he has speed that the LHW division hasn't seen since Roy Jones Jr left for the heavyweight division. I don't think he throws combinations like Roy, but they are still very solid combinations, and he does have good defense. I wish he moved better, but he is one of the best outside body punchers I have every seen because like Pacquaio and Roy JOnes Jr he has the speed to get to the body without being countered.
I also think there are a lot of people who will be asking, why do you say his hands are fast? They don't look that fast, but trust me he does have incredible speed on those punches, especially the left hand. He doesn't throw his jab super quick, but its mainly used to set up his left cross or right hook/uppercut.
In all honesty i can't see anyone beating him at LHW, RJJ, BH, JC, KP, i think they all lose IMO. And i think he would beat Glen Johnson more convincing in a rematch. I think Chad Dawson will reign along time at LHW.
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
Yeah, I didn't expect what he did to Tarver, I know Tarver wasn't punching with any power, but I think in part that was because Chad didn't let him get off, and he racked that body. I honestly think he is one of the top 5 fighters right now when it comes to body work.
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
i think when kelly finishes his business at MW he might fight chad which will be a great fight for both. and i dont care who wins both are my favorite fighter at the moment
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
He has the skills to beat anyone from 160 to 175 but he's also one punch away from getting hurt and possibly stopped. But to his credit he recovers very quickly. I think he'll reign as champ for a long time.
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
My boy BCDs the truefff...
Suddenly now people are starting to believe.
But when I said he'd reign supreme people always told me his suspect chin wouldn't hold up vs. the top guys. Yet here we are 3 yrs. later and 2 belts later and he's argueably the #2 LHW in the world.
Man it feels good to type that...
A Calzaghe fight would be ideal IMO... I would def. favor BCD.
I think BCD beats RJJ similarly to how he beat Tarver except I think RJJ wins more then 2 rounds.
I think his toughest fight and one I think he has the highest risk of loosing would be vs. Pavlik.
Here's why, I still see BCD as young kid who's quickly made it to the top.
He's only 26 and he's already fought Adamek, Glen & Tarver. Yes he's won. Yes he's undefeated but in those wins he's showed time and time again 2 things that really stick out to me.
1. Rookie mistakes - By this I mean he tends to give rounds away by staying on the ropes and goes on the defensive sometimes he'll throw 3-5 punches in these rounds. He did it vs. Harding, vs. Adamek, vs. Glen and vs. Tarver. Someone like Pavlik who does his best work when he has his opponents against the ropes will put him down and out for the count. Going to the ropes would be a big mistake vs. Pavlik and also giving rounds away.
2. Lack of focus - The kids shown tremendous talent but he loses focus. If you look up any of my posts in regards to BCD you'll see me mention this. Mustafas done a terrific job thus far keeping him focused but he's known to loose it. Why I'm still not sure, could it be that he just feels like he's wining the fight with ease that he can let off and cruise by? Maybe.
Mustafa himself was known for loosing focus so maybe he knows how to keep him focused.
and Hopkins honestly I like the guy. His legacy is set in stone, I just don't care much for his fights now' a days.
Ever since the JT fights and the Winky fight he lost me... ???
Plus the last thing BCD needs to be doing is fighting Hopkins cause even when you win you still don't look good.
For those who haven't visited my blog and missed this here's my BCD signed poster when he was 16-0. 8)
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o...-Autograph.jpg
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
boozeboxer
What about Kessler?
Damn! booze you hit me where it hurts..
2 of my fav. current boxers... :-\
I'd probably flip a coin. ???
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
CutMeMick
Quote:
Originally Posted by
boozeboxer
What about Kessler?
Damn! booze you hit me where it hurts..
2 of my fav. current boxers... :-\
I'd probably flip a coin. ???
Yeah I don't know. It would be interesting. Kessler is really strong. I don't think the Calzaghe fight did him justice honestly......I would like to see him in another top tier fight to really gauge him.
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
Dawson can get lazy in there, which could be his undoing, but I would personally favor him against any fighter between 160-175 right now.
His laying against the ropes would be very dangerous against someone like Pavlik, but I think he would keep on his bicycle against Pavlik.
I want to see him against another aggressive fighter to really see where he stands though. Johnson did make him look very vulnerable.
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
I think both kessler and pavlik are fights that could/will happen and both would give him serious serious trouble. Real tough fights, he struggled with johnson who is nothing more than a journey man. I'll give him leway on the fact that maybe he let his game dip because he was fighting a journeyman.
He done superb against Tarver. nothing really wrong, but when you are fighting a guy who just stood there and covered up every fucking punch you throw it is EASY to look good! Yes you have to give a lot of credit to Dawson for forcing Tarver on the back foot and out working him. But after a few rounds it was clear that every single punch Chad threw Tarver was going to try and block it and nothing more. No counters, no trying to slip anythign and make him miss. Simple hands up take half the punches then move. Fucking useless.
With all this said and done tho, this wasn't as impressive or as good as the beat down Hopkins give Tarver either. I think people are forgeting that and are getting to carried away like usual when someone puts on a good show.
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
A Johnson rematch would be Dawson's toughest fight out there at the moment IMO & although I think Glen deserves it I don't see it happening!
Hey Mick I know it may be a bit soon but but I'd like to know your thoughts on a potential Dawson/ Cloud fight? Because I think Cloud is a huge talent & may have the tools to give Chad problems!
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
After watching the fight this weekend, I'm starting to believe that Dawson's "weak defense" has been more about lack of focus. He showed great defense against Tarver. All in all, Tarver fought a pretty good fight, and Dawson manages to avoid getting hit by any big. Dawson did miss a lot, but enough got through, especially the bodywork. He's the only guy that can match Calzaghe for handspeed at that size and his punches have more mustard on them at this point.
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
Two fighters I think could beat Chad: Diaconu and Erdei. I think Diaconu would be a tough fight for BCD. Diaconu punches like a beast and I still think BCD's weakness is his chin. If Diaconu popped Chad, it would be over fast - but, would he even get the chance if Chad was throwing punches a mile-per-minute? Maybe not. Erdei possesses enough speed, boxing know-how, and experience to beat Chad, but Erdei wouldn't leave Germany for $100 million and a lifetime giftcard at Spearmint Rhino.
Calzaghe won't fight Chad. The only fight he'd potentially take after RJJ is Pavlik because of the coin involved.
Hopkins is retiring after the Pavlik fight. In my opinion, even if he wins.
If RJJ beats Calzaghe, he would fight Chad. Chad would ride on RJJ.
Kessler will be content to stay at supermiddleweights.
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Preme
I think both kessler and pavlik are fights that could/will happen and both would give him serious serious trouble. Real tough fights, he struggled with johnson who is nothing more than a journey man. I'll give him leway on the fact that maybe he let his game dip because he was fighting a journeyman.
He done superb against Tarver. nothing really wrong, but when you are fighting a guy who just stood there and covered up every fucking punch you throw it is EASY to look good! Yes you have to give a lot of credit to Dawson for forcing Tarver on the back foot and out working him. But after a few rounds it was clear that every single punch Chad threw Tarver was going to try and block it and nothing more. No counters, no trying to slip anythign and make him miss. Simple hands up take half the punches then move. Fucking useless.
With all this said and done tho, this wasn't as impressive or as good as the beat down Hopkins give Tarver either. I think people are forgeting that and are getting to carried away like usual when someone puts on a good show.
I think its disrespectful to Glen Johnson to call him a journeyman, he has only ever really been beat convincingly by Antonio Tarver in there 2nd fight. And Bernard Hopkins, every other fight he had is debatable. I think just he has been unlucky with the judges, his record should look luck much better than it really is.
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Galaxy
Hey Mick I know it may be a bit soon but but I'd like to know your thoughts on a potential Dawson/ Cloud fight? Because I think Cloud is a huge talent & may have the tools to give Chad problems!
Too early to give Cloud a equal assesment.
If I had to call it now you have to back BCD just because he's done more thus far.
But I can't wait until Cloud starts developing. Can he brush up in the skills dept? Or will he remain a puncher?
Yet to be seen but it will def. be interesting if they ever meet.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Rantcatrat
Two fighters I think could beat Chad: Diaconu and Erdei. I think Diaconu would be a tough fight for BCD. Diaconu punches like a beast and I still think BCD's weakness is his chin. If Diaconu popped Chad, it would be over fast - but, would he even get the chance if Chad was throwing punches a mile-per-minute? Maybe not. Erdei possesses enough speed, boxing know-how, and experience to beat Chad, but Erdei wouldn't leave Germany for $100 million and a lifetime giftcard at Spearmint Rhino.
Completely disagree with the Diaconu assesment.
BCDs workrate would not allow the smaller, shorter and less busier Diaconu to work his game plan. Henry at times was able to outbox Diaconu in their fight with ease but did not have the workrate and stamina to hold off Diaconu. For a good part of the fight, late in the fight it looked like Henry was turning it and or was gonna turn the fight around.
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
Dawson is definitely a talent but to be fair there is nobody at lightheavyeight these days.
He's come in as and taken control of what biologically was probably the oldest division in boxing, Tarver and Johnson are both 40, Jones Jr is almost 40, Hopkins is 43, Calzaghe is 36 and the 'young threat'.
I think Dawson definitely has potential but he certainly got into the division at the right time.
Whether Pavlik could carry his punch that far I don't know.
Pavlik and Joe are obviously the fights he would want but I highly doubt Calzaghe would pit his perfect record against a young, talented, naturally bigger kid like Dawson, let's face it that fight will never ever happen.
Pavlik though if he gets past Hopkins will likely step up and try and chase the big fights.
This isn't a criticism of Calzaghe, he's just 10 years further on than Pavlik and wants to mega fights against the established names rather than a young lion on the up for less money and more risk. For Pavlik though its all about the glory right now so if he beats Hopkins then I guess Dawson might be on his radar for the future.
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bilbo
Dawson is definitely a talent but to be fair there is nobody at lightheavyeight these days.
He's come in as and taken control of what biologically was probably the oldest division in boxing, Tarver and Johnson are both 40, Jones Jr is almost 40, Hopkins is 43, Calzaghe is 36 and the 'young threat'.
I think Dawson definitely has potential but he certainly got into the division at the right time.
Whether Pavlik could carry his punch that far I don't know.
Pavlik and Joe are obviously the fights he would want but I highly doubt Calzaghe would pit his perfect record against a young, talented, naturally bigger kid like Dawson, let's face it that fight will never ever happen.
Pavlik though if he gets past Hopkins will likely step up and try and chase the big fights.
This isn't a criticism of Calzaghe, he's just 10 years further on than Pavlik and wants to mega fights against the established names rather than a young lion on the up for less money and more risk. For Pavlik though its all about the glory right now so if he beats Hopkins then I guess Dawson might be on his radar for the future.
Your assesment is true but to be fair to the kid these "older" fighters still got some fight in them. As we've seen in Hop vs. Joe and Hop vs. Tarver and RJJ vs. Tito.
BCD wont win a fight vs. them just by showing up. He still has to fight.
Also there's a lot of talent coming up; Erdeis been around for sometime but it's become apparent he wont leave his country anytime soon.
Diaconu, Cloud, Garay, Brahamer and Francis have been established as top LHW for sometime now.
But the Div. is def. in transission right now. But things don't get handed to you, you still have to fight... :)
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Preme
I think both kessler and pavlik are fights that could/will happen and both would give him serious serious trouble. Real tough fights, he struggled with johnson who is nothing more than a journey man. I'll give him leway on the fact that maybe he let his game dip because he was fighting a journeyman.
He done superb against Tarver. nothing really wrong, but when you are fighting a guy who just stood there and covered up every fucking punch you throw it is EASY to look good! Yes you have to give a lot of credit to Dawson for forcing Tarver on the back foot and out working him. But after a few rounds it was clear that every single punch Chad threw Tarver was going to try and block it and nothing more. No counters, no trying to slip anythign and make him miss. Simple hands up take half the punches then move. Fucking useless.
With all this said and done tho, this wasn't as impressive or as good as the beat down Hopkins give Tarver either. I think people are forgeting that and are getting to carried away like usual when someone puts on a good show.
Johnson may be a journeyman, but to describe him as just a journeyman doesn't do him justice. He's probably the toughest journeyman there is. And to Dawson's favor, perhaps the only thing Tarver did was cover up because Dawson's punches put him in a shell. They had a gameplan for Antonio and it worked. Tarver already has stamina problems and when youhave a consistent body puncher going downstairs it makes a guy a little punch shy.
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
CutMeMick
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Galaxy
Hey Mick I know it may be a bit soon but but I'd like to know your thoughts on a potential Dawson/ Cloud fight? Because I think Cloud is a huge talent & may have the tools to give Chad problems!
Too early to give Cloud a equal assesment.
If I had to call it now you have to back BCD just because he's done more thus far.
But I can't wait until Cloud starts developing. Can he brush up in the skills dept? Or will he remain a puncher?
Yet to be seen but it will def. be interesting if they ever meet.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Rantcatrat
Two fighters I think could beat Chad: Diaconu and Erdei. I think Diaconu would be a tough fight for BCD. Diaconu punches like a beast and I still think BCD's weakness is his chin. If Diaconu popped Chad, it would be over fast - but, would he even get the chance if Chad was throwing punches a mile-per-minute? Maybe not. Erdei possesses enough speed, boxing know-how, and experience to beat Chad, but Erdei wouldn't leave Germany for $100 million and a lifetime giftcard at Spearmint Rhino.
Completely disagree with the Diaconu assesment.
BCDs workrate would not allow the smaller, shorter and less busier Diaconu to work his game plan. Henry at times was able to outbox Diaconu in their fight with ease but did not have the workrate and stamina to hold off Diaconu. For a good part of the fight, late in the fight it looked like Henry was turning it and or was gonna turn the fight around.
I italicized the word "could" because I don't know if Diaconu or Erdei "would" beat BCD. I actually favor Chad in either fight. It was disappointing that Chad chose not to fight Diaconu when he had the chance (I understand that Diaconu hurt his hand and the rest etc). My point was that Diaconu possesses the punch to hurt Dawson. Dawson's only liability, if it is one, is his chin. Diaconu's strength is his punch. Put two-and-two together. My bet would be that Dawson wins by workrate and due to Dawson's speed Diaconu wouldn't get the chance to unload any bombs.
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
kingfrnk
i think when kelly finishes his business at MW he might fight chad which will be a great fight for both. and i dont care who wins both are my favorite fighter at the moment
I think Dawson has a quite easy time with Pavlik at 175, Pavlik loses all his advantages against Dawson. Easy ud for BCD.
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
skel1983
Quote:
Originally Posted by
kingfrnk
i think when kelly finishes his business at MW he might fight chad which will be a great fight for both. and i dont care who wins both are my favorite fighter at the moment
I think Dawson has a quite easy time with Pavlik at 175, Pavlik loses all his advantages against Dawson. Easy ud for BCD.
nothing is easy with kelly in the ring u ass. he is young and strong just like chad.:mad:
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
I don't know what the hell your talking about Preme. Dawson speed made Tarver cover up because he couldn't deal with it, I think Roy's biggest flaw was that he was too gunshy against Tarver or he would have destroyed Antonio. That being said Johnson is a great fighter, he went undefeated for a long part of his career, then he lost to Bernard(in his prime) which there is no shame in, then he lost bad decisions and fights he didn't really try in, and after that he started winning again and became what he is now. He's quicker than Pavlik, and he has a much better chin then Pavlik, and he is just as relentless.
While Johnson surivived what Dawson threw at him those first two rounds, how can Pavlik? Dawson hits harder hten anyone besides Miranda that he fought, but Dawson would be landing flush punches, and it wouldn't be like Taylor, Dawson hits much harder then Taylor, He is quite a bit faster then Taylor, and he puts punches together.
Like I said Johnson isn't just a journeyman with a good chin, he has good quickness, he is one of the most accurate inside punchers, he is a lot harder to hit then people give him credit for.
Johnson would knock Pavlik out.
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
I have to tell you,Call it jumping on a band wagon or call it finally recognizing a good thing when you see it But I'm sold and quite the convert.Up until Sat. Night,I had some reservations concerning Dawson.....Mainly his habit of easing off and coasting when things are going his way.Prior to the Tarver fight he came off abit dismissive and a little to Aloof Imo.Once it began he displayed his true potential and maturing skillset against a still capable and experienced Tarver....The hand speed and clear game plan was obvious right off the bat.He repeatedly dictated pace with top notch punch selection,beating Tarver to the punch and moving as he wished to again reset.By the midway point,Tarver was reduced to almost flailing in hopes of a KO punch and looked discouraged & tired.Dawson controlled the ring and made a huge jump into the big time.
The flaw I see is as mentioned,The coasting....ecspecially late.A small part of me expects him to get badly clipped for a count if he does not tighten this up and he seems to be making major improvements.Adameck touched him,Johnson,even Tarver had a brief last surge in the 12th.Non the less,what impressed me the most over his last few was that he answered a key question that any young gun coming up fast has to be asked that set's them apart from the also rans in they're respected division.He went through a serious acid test against Johnson and had some hellacious adversity.He made adjustments and dug down....ugly in spots but he did not fold up.The decision frankly can be hotly contested,Johnson did what he always has done against the odds......he fought his ass off!!!I know I'm going back wards here but that fight might just prove to be one of the most,if not the most valuable fights in his current and future career.I think he righted the ship against Tarver....I realize Tarver is pushing 40 but Dawson looked sharp and is a major player.I have no idea he will face next,Calzaghe is booked with Jones,I dont know why an inactive Taylor keeps popping up lately,but maybe off a spectacular (??) win vs.Lacy he jumps up & would like a go,nice style clash Imo.A Johnson rematch would speak volumes.I'm watching!!
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
Teath think you overrating Chad just as much as people overrate Pavlik to tell you the truth you say Pavlik is lucky in his divsion well so is Chad. Say things about Pavliks chin but besides that one time with Taylor it has not happen again in the rematch he did not hurt Pavlik did he. As for Chad he has showed to be chinny in more fights then Pavlik he lost to Johnson he is like what 40 years of age and then beats Taver at 39 and people are surprised i think you give Chad to much credit for a win when old Bernard did a way worse job on Taver then Chad did and thats the Bernard that was beat by Taylor so it is not like he was in prime or anything. Lets not forget all the time Chad has been rocked which is alot more then Pavlik. Chad has bad habit of going to the ropes and taking rounds off and if he does that gives Pavlik a great chance of hurting him and Chad loses focas alot which is not that great of thing to be doing at this level. As for what you been saying about Kessler on other threads he was hurt by Calzaghe enough said he is lucky the ref held Calzaghe back or he would been down and who knows maybe even stoped not to mention the competion he has been facing latly which is just a joke if you ask me not even jourymen. If Kessler fights Pavlik and Pavlik goes to the body he while knock Kessler out i dont think much of him not saying Pavlik a god but neither is Chad or Kessler so i dont think there while be any out classing as you say.
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
fight with tavoris cloud would be great but there are the big guys
but there are some others maybe lucian bute, adrian diaconu, mikkel kessler
if jermain taylor or arthur abraham ever make up to 175 imo they all those fight will be enertaing
but the way he look against tarver he beat most of them
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mr140
Teath think you overrating Chad just as much as people overrate Pavlik to tell you the truth you say Pavlik is lucky in his divsion well so is Chad. Say things about Pavliks chin but besides that one time with Taylor it has not happen again in the rematch he did not hurt Pavlik did he. As for Chad he has showed to be chinny in more fights then Pavlik he lost to Johnson he is like what 40 years of age and then beats Taver at 39 and people are surprised i think you give Chad to much credit for a win when old Bernard did a way worse job on Taver then Chad did and thats the Bernard that was beat by Taylor so it is not like he was in prime or anything. Lets not forget all the time Chad has been rocked which is alot more then Pavlik. Chad has bad habit of going to the ropes and taking rounds off and if he does that gives Pavlik a great chance of hurting him and Chad loses focas alot which is not that great of thing to be doing at this level. As for what you been saying about Kessler on other threads he was hurt by Calzaghe enough said he is lucky the ref held Calzaghe back or he would been down and who knows maybe even stoped not to mention the competion he has been facing latly which is just a joke if you ask me not even jourymen. If Kessler fights Pavlik and Pavlik goes to the body he while knock Kessler out i dont think much of him not saying Pavlik a god but neither is Chad or Kessler so i dont think there while be any out classing as you say.
I am not saying Chad is the best fighter in the world, I agree that I think he is a weak division hence the reason why I don't think anyone would beat him, this isn't the same scenario as why I don't think any welterweight would be Floyd Mayweather, this is Chad is a very good fighter, but in a situation where there are very many fighters of top caliber left.
I don't know what you are trying to prove here about Pavlik, Calzaghe was way faster then Pavlik and a way better boxer, if he, Kelly, tried to box with Kessler he would be picked apart, and because of his lack of speed he wouldn't be able to land anything, if he tried to push Kessler back, he would eat heavy jabs and counters all night long. Pavlik's chin is as questionable as Dawson's who has been dropped, but only really hurt by Glen Johnson 15 pounds north of the middleweight division. Once again just like in the Adamek fight Dawson would overwhelm Pavlik with speed, he wear Pavlik down with his body attack.
Also Dawson's performance against Tarver was as impressive as Bernard's, he won as many rounds, he put on a better offensive show, but not quite as impressive of a defensive show.
It would be like Barrera or JMM against Juarez who is a skilled fighter coming forwad, but when you face somebody with movement and great technique everything falls to shit unless you have speed or a more physical style.
The only credible opponent Pavlik has beaten impressively is Taylor, and thats becuase Taylor exhausted himself when he had Pavlik badly compromised. Their second fight was pretty even, I thought Bernard beat Taylor more impressive in their first fight, I thought Winky beat Taylor by a larger margin in their fight. Taylor was a the perfect opponent for PAvlik, a guy without a good snap in his punches, a guy who had absolutely horrible defensive skills going backwards.
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Taeth
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mr140
Teath think you overrating Chad just as much as people overrate Pavlik to tell you the truth you say Pavlik is lucky in his divsion well so is Chad. Say things about Pavliks chin but besides that one time with Taylor it has not happen again in the rematch he did not hurt Pavlik did he. As for Chad he has showed to be chinny in more fights then Pavlik he lost to Johnson he is like what 40 years of age and then beats Taver at 39 and people are surprised i think you give Chad to much credit for a win when old Bernard did a way worse job on Taver then Chad did and thats the Bernard that was beat by Taylor so it is not like he was in prime or anything. Lets not forget all the time Chad has been rocked which is alot more then Pavlik. Chad has bad habit of going to the ropes and taking rounds off and if he does that gives Pavlik a great chance of hurting him and Chad loses focas alot which is not that great of thing to be doing at this level. As for what you been saying about Kessler on other threads he was hurt by Calzaghe enough said he is lucky the ref held Calzaghe back or he would been down and who knows maybe even stoped not to mention the competion he has been facing latly which is just a joke if you ask me not even jourymen. If Kessler fights Pavlik and Pavlik goes to the body he while knock Kessler out i dont think much of him not saying Pavlik a god but neither is Chad or Kessler so i dont think there while be any out classing as you say.
I am not saying Chad is the best fighter in the world, I agree that I think he is a weak division hence the reason why I don't think anyone would beat him, this isn't the same scenario as why I don't think any welterweight would be Floyd Mayweather, this is Chad is a very good fighter, but in a situation where there are very many fighters of top caliber left.
I don't know what you are trying to prove here about Pavlik, Calzaghe was way faster then Pavlik and a way better boxer, if he, Kelly, tried to box with Kessler he would be picked apart, and because of his lack of speed he wouldn't be able to land anything, if he tried to push Kessler back, he would eat heavy jabs and counters all night long. Pavlik's chin is as questionable as Dawson's who has been dropped, but only really hurt by Glen Johnson 15 pounds north of the middleweight division. Once again just like in the Adamek fight Dawson would overwhelm Pavlik with speed, he wear Pavlik down with his body attack.
Also Dawson's performance against Tarver was as impressive as Bernard's, he won as many rounds, he put on a better offensive show, but not quite as impressive of a defensive show.
It would be like Barrera or JMM against Juarez who is a skilled fighter coming forwad, but when you face somebody with movement and great technique everything falls to shit unless you have speed or a more physical style.
The only credible opponent Pavlik has beaten impressively is Taylor, and thats becuase Taylor exhausted himself when he had Pavlik badly compromised. Their second fight was pretty even, I thought Bernard beat Taylor more impressive in their first fight, I thought Winky beat Taylor by a larger margin in their fight. Taylor was a the perfect opponent for PAvlik, a guy without a good snap in his punches, a guy who had absolutely horrible defensive skills going backwards.
taeth u are stupid if u think bernard lost to taylor the first time was better than kellys victory over taylor the second time. idiot:nono:
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
CutMeMick
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bilbo
Dawson is definitely a talent but to be fair there is nobody at lightheavyeight these days.
He's come in as and taken control of what biologically was probably the oldest division in boxing, Tarver and Johnson are both 40, Jones Jr is almost 40, Hopkins is 43, Calzaghe is 36 and the 'young threat'.
I think Dawson definitely has potential but he certainly got into the division at the right time.
Whether Pavlik could carry his punch that far I don't know.
Pavlik and Joe are obviously the fights he would want but I highly doubt Calzaghe would pit his perfect record against a young, talented, naturally bigger kid like Dawson, let's face it that fight will never ever happen.
Pavlik though if he gets past Hopkins will likely step up and try and chase the big fights.
This isn't a criticism of Calzaghe, he's just 10 years further on than Pavlik and wants to mega fights against the established names rather than a young lion on the up for less money and more risk. For Pavlik though its all about the glory right now so if he beats Hopkins then I guess Dawson might be on his radar for the future.
Your assesment is true but to be fair to the kid these "older" fighters still got some fight in them. As we've seen in Hop vs. Joe and Hop vs. Tarver and RJJ vs. Tito.
BCD wont win a fight vs. them just by showing up. He still has to fight.
Also there's a lot of talent coming up; Erdeis been around for sometime but it's become apparent he wont leave his country anytime soon.
Diaconu, Cloud, Garay, Brahamer and Francis have been established as top LHW for sometime now.
But the Div. is def. in transission right now. But things don't get handed to you, you still have to fight... :)
Yeah I definitely agree with you, you have to be talented to rise to the top of any division and in winning fights over Adamek, Johnson and Tarver Dawson has proven he is the best lightheavyweight in the world right now.
The old guys he has beaten however arn't the best old guys though. I'd certainly love to see how he handled B Hop, I think he would make things a lot harder for Chad than Dawson.
He also lost the war with Johnson imo even though I agree on a round by round basis he probably deserved to win the fight.
I think he's capable of beating every challenger and fellow champ out there, but I also think Calzaghe, Hopkins, and maybe Pavlik could beat him as well.
It's certainly not like when Jones Jr was in his prime at light heavy, or Pavlik at middleweight now where you would be really suprised if they got beat in their respective divisions. He has shown vulnurabilities, against Dawson and Adamek in particular but there's no doubting the kid can really box.
I'd have him pretty close to the p4p now, probably top 15 at least. Consecutive wins over Adamek, Johnson and Tarver are impressive.
He still hasn't had what I'd call a defining fight yet though. Hopefully the winner of Pavlik Hopkins will give it to him.
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
kingfrnk
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Taeth
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mr140
Teath think you overrating Chad just as much as people overrate Pavlik to tell you the truth you say Pavlik is lucky in his divsion well so is Chad. Say things about Pavliks chin but besides that one time with Taylor it has not happen again in the rematch he did not hurt Pavlik did he. As for Chad he has showed to be chinny in more fights then Pavlik he lost to Johnson he is like what 40 years of age and then beats Taver at 39 and people are surprised i think you give Chad to much credit for a win when old Bernard did a way worse job on Taver then Chad did and thats the Bernard that was beat by Taylor so it is not like he was in prime or anything. Lets not forget all the time Chad has been rocked which is alot more then Pavlik. Chad has bad habit of going to the ropes and taking rounds off and if he does that gives Pavlik a great chance of hurting him and Chad loses focas alot which is not that great of thing to be doing at this level. As for what you been saying about Kessler on other threads he was hurt by Calzaghe enough said he is lucky the ref held Calzaghe back or he would been down and who knows maybe even stoped not to mention the competion he has been facing latly which is just a joke if you ask me not even jourymen. If Kessler fights Pavlik and Pavlik goes to the body he while knock Kessler out i dont think much of him not saying Pavlik a god but neither is Chad or Kessler so i dont think there while be any out classing as you say.
I am not saying Chad is the best fighter in the world, I agree that I think he is a weak division hence the reason why I don't think anyone would beat him, this isn't the same scenario as why I don't think any welterweight would be Floyd Mayweather, this is Chad is a very good fighter, but in a situation where there are very many fighters of top caliber left.
I don't know what you are trying to prove here about Pavlik, Calzaghe was way faster then Pavlik and a way better boxer, if he, Kelly, tried to box with Kessler he would be picked apart, and because of his lack of speed he wouldn't be able to land anything, if he tried to push Kessler back, he would eat heavy jabs and counters all night long. Pavlik's chin is as questionable as Dawson's who has been dropped, but only really hurt by Glen Johnson 15 pounds north of the middleweight division. Once again just like in the Adamek fight Dawson would overwhelm Pavlik with speed, he wear Pavlik down with his body attack.
Also Dawson's performance against Tarver was as impressive as Bernard's, he won as many rounds, he put on a better offensive show, but not quite as impressive of a defensive show.
It would be like Barrera or JMM against Juarez who is a skilled fighter coming forwad, but when you face somebody with movement and great technique everything falls to shit unless you have speed or a more physical style.
The only credible opponent Pavlik has beaten impressively is Taylor, and thats becuase Taylor exhausted himself when he had Pavlik badly compromised. Their second fight was pretty even, I thought Bernard beat Taylor more impressive in their first fight, I thought Winky beat Taylor by a larger margin in their fight. Taylor was a the perfect opponent for PAvlik, a guy without a good snap in his punches, a guy who had absolutely horrible defensive skills going backwards.
taeth u are stupid if u think bernard lost to taylor the first time was better than kellys victory over taylor the second time. idiot:nono:
Your the idiot, Hopkins was coutnering effectively, he hurt Taylor more near the end then Kelly ever did in their second fight. Taylor wasn't able to use the jab, Bernard put on a defensive show along with showcasing the right hand. Pavlik got hit a lot, he landed alot, but I liked what Hopkins did more. All in all they both won close fights IMO against Taylor, but Cory Spinks and Winky Wright beat Taylor emphatically IMO.
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Taeth
Quote:
Originally Posted by
kingfrnk
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Taeth
I am not saying Chad is the best fighter in the world, I agree that I think he is a weak division hence the reason why I don't think anyone would beat him, this isn't the same scenario as why I don't think any welterweight would be Floyd Mayweather, this is Chad is a very good fighter, but in a situation where there are very many fighters of top caliber left.
I don't know what you are trying to prove here about Pavlik, Calzaghe was way faster then Pavlik and a way better boxer, if he, Kelly, tried to box with Kessler he would be picked apart, and because of his lack of speed he wouldn't be able to land anything, if he tried to push Kessler back, he would eat heavy jabs and counters all night long. Pavlik's chin is as questionable as Dawson's who has been dropped, but only really hurt by Glen Johnson 15 pounds north of the middleweight division. Once again just like in the Adamek fight Dawson would overwhelm Pavlik with speed, he wear Pavlik down with his body attack.
Also Dawson's performance against Tarver was as impressive as Bernard's, he won as many rounds, he put on a better offensive show, but not quite as impressive of a defensive show.
It would be like Barrera or JMM against Juarez who is a skilled fighter coming forwad, but when you face somebody with movement and great technique everything falls to shit unless you have speed or a more physical style.
The only credible opponent Pavlik has beaten impressively is Taylor, and thats becuase Taylor exhausted himself when he had Pavlik badly compromised. Their second fight was pretty even, I thought Bernard beat Taylor more impressive in their first fight, I thought Winky beat Taylor by a larger margin in their fight. Taylor was a the perfect opponent for PAvlik, a guy without a good snap in his punches, a guy who had absolutely horrible defensive skills going backwards.
taeth u are stupid if u think bernard lost to taylor the first time was better than kellys victory over taylor the second time. idiot:nono:
Your the idiot, Hopkins was coutnering effectively, he hurt Taylor more near the end then Kelly ever did in their second fight. Taylor wasn't able to use the jab, Bernard put on a defensive show along with showcasing the right hand. Pavlik got hit a lot, he landed alot, but I liked what Hopkins did more. All in all they both won close fights IMO against Taylor, but Cory Spinks and Winky Wright beat Taylor emphatically IMO.
your the dumbass if u think hopkins only fighting 4-5 rounds was better than kelly fighting all 12 rounds in the rematch. i think u only watch one fighter instead of both when u watch fights. :-\
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Taeth
Quote:
Originally Posted by
kingfrnk
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Taeth
I am not saying Chad is the best fighter in the world, I agree that I think he is a weak division hence the reason why I don't think anyone would beat him, this isn't the same scenario as why I don't think any welterweight would be Floyd Mayweather, this is Chad is a very good fighter, but in a situation where there are very many fighters of top caliber left.
I don't know what you are trying to prove here about Pavlik, Calzaghe was way faster then Pavlik and a way better boxer, if he, Kelly, tried to box with Kessler he would be picked apart, and because of his lack of speed he wouldn't be able to land anything, if he tried to push Kessler back, he would eat heavy jabs and counters all night long. Pavlik's chin is as questionable as Dawson's who has been dropped, but only really hurt by Glen Johnson 15 pounds north of the middleweight division. Once again just like in the Adamek fight Dawson would overwhelm Pavlik with speed, he wear Pavlik down with his body attack.
Also Dawson's performance against Tarver was as impressive as Bernard's, he won as many rounds, he put on a better offensive show, but not quite as impressive of a defensive show.
It would be like Barrera or JMM against Juarez who is a skilled fighter coming forwad, but when you face somebody with movement and great technique everything falls to shit unless you have speed or a more physical style.
The only credible opponent Pavlik has beaten impressively is Taylor, and thats becuase Taylor exhausted himself when he had Pavlik badly compromised. Their second fight was pretty even, I thought Bernard beat Taylor more impressive in their first fight, I thought Winky beat Taylor by a larger margin in their fight. Taylor was a the perfect opponent for PAvlik, a guy without a good snap in his punches, a guy who had absolutely horrible defensive skills going backwards.
taeth u are stupid if u think bernard lost to taylor the first time was better than kellys victory over taylor the second time. idiot:nono:
Your the idiot, Hopkins was coutnering effectively, he hurt Taylor more near the end then Kelly ever did in their second fight. Taylor wasn't able to use the jab, Bernard put on a defensive show along with showcasing the right hand. Pavlik got hit a lot, he landed alot, but I liked what Hopkins did more. All in all they both won close fights IMO against Taylor, but
Cory Spinks and Winky Wright
beat Taylor emphatically IMO.
Yeah he really laid a smackdown on him :rolleyes:
You're postings and fight analysis are truly awful Taeth, truly truly awful :-\
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
^^^Rewatch the spinks fight, imo.
He beat Taylor decisvely. It was the closest thing to a clinic as you can get and judges just continued to rob Cory of rounds.
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
kingfrnk
Quote:
Originally Posted by
skel1983
Quote:
Originally Posted by
kingfrnk
i think when kelly finishes his business at MW he might fight chad which will be a great fight for both. and i dont care who wins both are my favorite fighter at the moment
I think Dawson has a quite easy time with Pavlik at 175, Pavlik loses all his advantages against Dawson. Easy ud for BCD.
nothing is easy with kelly in the ring u ass. he is young and strong just like chad.:mad:
I think you should get ur dick out of Pavliks arse, mate please dont come back with insults, when people have an opinion, shows how immature you are.
My argument was Dawsom takes away all Pavliks advantages he has at middleweight, his reach his power. Pavlik walks around at around 175, if this fight happened Dawson would be to quick to slick for Pavlik. Big ud.
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
skel1983
Quote:
Originally Posted by
kingfrnk
Quote:
Originally Posted by
skel1983
I think Dawson has a quite easy time with Pavlik at 175, Pavlik loses all his advantages against Dawson. Easy ud for BCD.
nothing is easy with kelly in the ring u ass. he is young and strong just like chad.:mad:
I think you should get ur dick out of Pavliks arse, mate please dont come back with insults, when people have an opinion, shows how immature you are.
My argument was Dawsom takes away all Pavliks advantages he has at middleweight, his reach his power. Pavlik walks around at around 175, if this fight happened Dawson would be to quick to slick for Pavlik. Big ud.
I agree that BCD would school Pavlik, but the discussion is a moot. BCD is a lhw and Pavlik is a mw. So, WHO CARES?
One quick question, what is the problem Brits have with Pavlik? I may be wrong but it appears a lot of Brits dislike him.
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Rantcatrat
Quote:
Originally Posted by
skel1983
Quote:
Originally Posted by
kingfrnk
nothing is easy with kelly in the ring u ass. he is young and strong just like chad.:mad:
I think you should get ur dick out of Pavliks arse, mate please dont come back with insults, when people have an opinion, shows how immature you are.
My argument was Dawsom takes away all Pavliks advantages he has at middleweight, his reach his power. Pavlik walks around at around 175, if this fight happened Dawson would be to quick to slick for Pavlik. Big ud.
I agree that BCD would school Pavlik, but the discussion is a moot. BCD is a lhw and Pavlik is a mw. So, WHO CARES?
One quick question, what is the problem Brits have with Pavlik? I may be wrong but it appears a lot of Brits dislike him.
I dont dislike him at all, hes a nice guy great entertaining fighter, but i suppose the way all the americans say how over rated Calzaghe is, its sort of the same for us, well me anyway, i still think Pavlik has alot to prove i just think he is not as good as people seem to think he is.
You say Pavlik is a middleweight, well not entirely true at this moment in time hes fighting at Light Heavyweight on saturday, so i guess it is quite relevent to discuss a fight between Dawson and Pavlik wouldnt yopu agree? The question was who would beat Dawson someone said Pavlik i gave my opinion. He wouldnt.
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bilbo
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Taeth
Quote:
Originally Posted by
kingfrnk
taeth u are stupid if u think bernard lost to taylor the first time was better than kellys victory over taylor the second time. idiot:nono:
Your the idiot, Hopkins was coutnering effectively, he hurt Taylor more near the end then Kelly ever did in their second fight. Taylor wasn't able to use the jab, Bernard put on a defensive show along with showcasing the right hand. Pavlik got hit a lot, he landed alot, but I liked what Hopkins did more. All in all they both won close fights IMO against Taylor, but
Cory Spinks and Winky Wright
beat Taylor emphatically IMO.
Yeah he really laid a smackdown on him :rolleyes:
You're postings and fight analysis are truly awful Taeth, truly truly awful :-\
Bernard Hopkins done nothing in the first 8 rounds i think his average punch output. For the first 8 rounds was only 14 punches thrown a round, Jermain Taylor got tired because he was doing all the work.
And i think Jermain Taylor fought a much better fight against Kelly Pavlik, i thought he looked sharp and quick. But the body shot from Kelly Pavlik in the 11th turned the fight around, and it was all Kelly Pavlik from there.
Taeth i have no idea how you think Bernard Hopkins done more damage on Taylor or won more convincingly, in there first fight than Kelly Pavlik did against Jermain Taylor in there rematch. First off Bernard Hopkins only landed about 90+ punches on Jermain Taylor, in the entire fight.
And most of those punches came in the last 3 or 4 rounds when Bernard Hopkins, actually decided to go to work. Where as Kelly Pavlik landed 260+ punches. And most of those punches were solid jabs and right hands, and they were consistent throughout the fight.
Im sure if you asked Jermain Taylor who hurt him more or who beat him more convincingly. Im sure he would even admit Kelly Pavlik did, Bernard Hopkins at the most only won 2 out of the first 9 rounds against Jermain Taylor because he done virtually nothing, where as Kelly Pavlik was even with Jermain Taylor all the way, until he pulled it out in the championship rounds winning 7-5.
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
I like Dawson, very talented, seems to have a fighters mentality.
Still strikes me as a guy who could have a come out of nowhere type knockout happen to him though. Maybe I'll stop thinking that after a while but I still get that sense about him.
BTW this "you're the idiot, no you're the idiot" posting is just superb.
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
OumaFan
I like Dawson, very talented, seems to have a fighters mentality.
Still strikes me as a guy who could have a come out of nowhere type knockout happen to him though. Maybe I'll stop thinking that after a while but I still get that sense about him.
BTW this "you're the idiot, no you're the idiot" posting is just superb.
I agree that Dawson's chin seems fallible. But what he's unable to recover immediately he covers with being able to slink away from an opponent until he gets the rest of his marbles back.
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Re: Who beats Chad Dawson?
If Hopkin's somehow get's out of the fight with Pavlik ok. He will probably challenge Dawson. NOt really but it always seems that old man get's all the young bucs. From the Tarver fight it seems Dawson is the real deal I don't really think he will be tested unless he moves up to Cruiserweight and tries to get a rematch with Adamek. That would be a worthy rematch being as Adamek seems to be on a roll again.
