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Not much to discuss. More typical muslim bullshit, from what I've heard.
bullshit was the word that I would use... It's disgusting that almost an entire society is brought up with such beliefs that condone and encourage such violence... It's horrible and warped and from an outside perspective is completely ridiculous... As compassionate as I am for others, I would not be upset if Bush did one final "stupid" think with his presidency, and launched a bunch of atom bombs and warped all those Islamic extremists off the map.. They have been fighting like that in the name of god for 100's and 100's of years, and probably will for 100's more...
Ive been watching a little bit of the coverage on the BBC. I just dont understand these militants. They have killed a lot of innocent people. Remarkable job, nice one guys! Im now extremely sympathetic to your cause!
Bloody fools, the lot of them. :rolleyes:
They don't even know what they're fighting for. Just brainwashed garbage.
Interesting if when they prove they are pakisanis. Will give India a good excuse to launch a couple of serious ones at them.Their armies hate each other border tensions and shootings across them are common.
Latest reports I heard is that some of them are British Born PakistanisQuote:
Originally Posted by Andre
They are just brought up to believe simply that it is of the highest possible honor and appreciation that they give the ultimate consequence (death) to anyone that is not of the Islamic religion.... If that is not the most fucked up belief that they think will lead them to any sort of enlightenment or higher being/respectability of consciousness, then I will personally convert to Islam and bomb my own country..... There is no words to explain just what a stain on humanity that the Islamic society is.. Not that the general western society is a pillar of perfection to be followed, but Islam extremists ignore absolutely everything that is good and compassionate in the world.... I cannot think of a great sin or waste of life....
And the leaders who continue to breed these beliefs will surely meet a fate that no one could possibly imagine..
I pity them.
* just checking to see if my signature works as I changed it but it is not showing above *
I betcha Bush is happy to be getting out of office. Obama, you better be ready to take the heat.
That indian army is no pushover, they will wipe the fucking floor with the pakistans and a lot of other armys. They wont have the put up with all the fucking bullshit about those cry baby little fucks crying over the war either like the uk and us has had to deal with all the negetive yellow bastards.Quote:
Originally Posted by BoxingGorilla
Fuck me they are really taking these Murder mystery weekends to the limit these days
Al Quaida has said that they go after civilians because they pay the taxes that fund the armies that oppose them. The goal seems to be to cause political destabilization, they are nowhere near powerful enough to take on countries directly. No government in any country openly supports shit like we have seen in Mumbai, but behind the scenes I really wonder.
I'm sure I don't understand this situation to any great depth so don't take this too seriously.
If i was to hypothesize though i wonder how much money actually has to do with it.
I mean I know a lot of it is about religion but Western countries are also generally wealthier than non-western countries.
Even when they attack places like Bali they pick tourism places frequented by western people.
I have been told that worldwide people are considered below the poverty line if they live in a house without a fridge.
In reality a very small proportion of the world's population actually finds itself above that poverty line.
If your background was relatively poor i can imagine that you could be easily manipulated to use religion as an excuse to vent your anger at a wealthier culture.
You might feel that in being immoral they are able to create this wealth and are somehow to blame for your own poverty.
Of course that really doesn't explain the people born in Western countries who become terrorists.
I guess there is just no way to rationalize these people and looking for some sort of logic to their actions is futile.
We had a seminar from a psychologist at uni the other day. She said one mistake people make is to assume people should be reasonable.
Some people just aren't and you just have to make rules and enforce them and changing the opinion leading to their irrational behaviour is not likely to happen.
That last bit. Therein lies the rub. And the numbers continue to grow.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharla
India should neuc England then really.:-\Quote:
Originally Posted by sonny78Latest reports I heard is that some of them are British Born PakistanisQuote:
Originally Posted by Andre
But then innocent people like me will die Mr Andre Bush, why do you not just go for a simpler regime change. :)
This is what Al Qaedia said they were gonna do the U.S. guess they couldn't get enough visa's....
Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
Seriously I think the mixture of religious sexual suppression the rag top and all the curry must cook some of their brains,somethings definatley amiss with them isnt it.
These guys do get education, but it's religious education by really hardline fundamentalist nutjobs. And the money for that nutjob education comes from our good friends Saudi Arabia. It's really a complex problem but getting some kind of India-Pakistan peace deal over Kashmir would stop this kind of India-Pakistan thing happening. And terrorism isn't restricted to any particular religion, and people from a specific religion are any more or less likely to resort to terrorism than any other religion. If you had Christian parts of the world being repressed by other religions you'd have Christian nutjob terrorists too.
Maybe, but it wouldn't be the same. Concepts of Jihad, glory of martyrdom, and other stuff seem to be a little more endemic in the Islamic side of things, though I wouldn't go as far as equating Islam with these things. I really don't think we'd see much in the way of Christian suicide bombers, though I imagine you could argue we would.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
Oh I have no doubt we would.Quote:
Originally Posted by CGMMaybe, but it wouldn't be the same. Concepts of Jihad, glory of martyrdom, and other stuff seem to be a little more endemic in the Islamic side of things, though I wouldn't go as far as equating Islam with these things. I really don't think we'd see much in the way of Christian suicide bombers, though I imagine you could argue we would.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
CGM, did you here about the Jewish Kami Kasi Pilot, crashed His Plane in His Brothers scrap yard ;D
I guess we can define a terrorist as one who specifically targets civilians. Yeah, we'd probably see Christian terrorists, just not as many, and certainly a lot fewer who'd be willing to die in the process.Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterOh I have no doubt we would.Quote:
Originally Posted by CGMMaybe, but it wouldn't be the same. Concepts of Jihad, glory of martyrdom, and other stuff seem to be a little more endemic in the Islamic side of things, though I wouldn't go as far as equating Islam with these things. I really don't think we'd see much in the way of Christian suicide bombers, though I imagine you could argue we would.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
Scrap, that's not a bad joke, I'll probably use it some time. My immediate reaction was to Google Jewish jokes, and I came up with Jokes, which I was not expecting. I guess the world has not gone completely politically correct yet. :)
You win the award for giving the most logical, reasonable, and educated post of the thread. Congratulations, you will receive ridicule, derision, and mockery from all the idiots. Enjoy.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
The first thing that came to my mind when I read that was the Christians who have bombed abortion clinics.Quote:
Originally Posted by CGMI guess we can define a terrorist as one who specifically targets civilians. Yeah, we'd probably see Christian terrorists, just not as many, and certainly a lot fewer who'd be willing to die in the process.Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterOh I have no doubt we would.Quote:
Originally Posted by CGM
Scrap, that's not a bad joke, I'll probably use it some time. My immediate reaction was to Google Jewish jokes, and I came up with Jokes, which I was not expecting. I guess the world has not gone completely politically correct yet. :)
The Atlanta Olympic bombings,Oklahoma City,numerous attacks on abortion clinics,The Sabbra Shattilla massacresQuote:
Originally Posted by CGMMaybe, but it wouldn't be the same. Concepts of Jihad, glory of martyrdom, and other stuff seem to be a little more endemic in the Islamic side of things, though I wouldn't go as far as equating Islam with these things. I really don't think we'd see much in the way of Christian suicide bombers, though I imagine you could argue we would.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
All christians
Religion - doing it's part for population control since the beginning of mankind.
Not quite the same as a stated desire to kill as many of the infidel civilians as possible, is it?Quote:
Originally Posted by CFHThe first thing that came to my mind when I read that was the Christians who have bombed abortion clinics.Quote:
Originally Posted by CGMI guess we can define a terrorist as one who specifically targets civilians. Yeah, we'd probably see Christian terrorists, just not as many, and certainly a lot fewer who'd be willing to die in the process.Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
Scrap, that's not a bad joke, I'll probably use it some time. My immediate reaction was to Google Jewish jokes, and I came up with Jokes, which I was not expecting. I guess the world has not gone completely politically correct yet. :)
Isn't it? It's not that different. You feel that people (IE people at abortion clinics or at gay bars) are doing something morally wrong which is an affront to your religion/God, so you kill them for it.Quote:
Originally Posted by CGMNot quite the same as a stated desire to kill as many of the infidel civilians as possible, is it?Quote:
Originally Posted by CFHThe first thing that came to my mind when I read that was the Christians who have bombed abortion clinics.Quote:
Originally Posted by CGM
It's not 100% the same, but it's not all the different.
ok, your point is taken. Not 100% taken, but somewhat taken. :) I would say that far fewer christians are prepared to kill to support their beliefs. And they would tend to target their victims more carefully. Note the use of the word tend.Quote:
Originally Posted by CFHIsn't it? It's not that different. You feel that people (IE people at abortion clinics or at gay bars) are doing something morally wrong which is an affront to your religion/God, so you kill them for it.Quote:
Originally Posted by CGMNot quite the same as a stated desire to kill as many of the infidel civilians as possible, is it?Quote:
Originally Posted by CFH
It's not 100% the same, but it's not all the different.
There is still the issue of concepts of jihad and martyrdom in modern society and religion. I've made my point there.
You mean like the crusades or the martyrdom of St Peter?Quote:
Originally Posted by CGMok, your point is taken. Not 100% taken, but somewhat taken. :) I would say that far fewer christians are prepared to kill to support their beliefs. And they would tend to target their victims more carefully. Note the use of the word tend.Quote:
Originally Posted by CFHIsn't it? It's not that different. You feel that people (IE people at abortion clinics or at gay bars) are doing something morally wrong which is an affront to your religion/God, so you kill them for it.Quote:
Originally Posted by CGM
It's not 100% the same, but it's not all the different.
There is still the issue of concepts of jihad and martyrdom in modern society and religion. I've made my point there.
For the record,there are rules to Jihad,they get broken,but show me where christ said to take out a federal building.Quote:
Originally Posted by CGMNot quite the same as a stated desire to kill as many of the infidel civilians as possible, is it?Quote:
Originally Posted by CFHThe first thing that came to my mind when I read that was the Christians who have bombed abortion clinics.Quote:
Originally Posted by CGM
But according to the rules of Jihad your supposed to leave the civillians and buildings alone
That's hardly modern society is it? We've learned a few things since then. I would say that going to war in the name of religion has long since stopped being a characteristic of "Western Society". Besides, the Crusades could hardly be described as deliberate and widespread attacks on civilians. For the most part it was between opposing armies.Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainer MonkeyYou mean like the crusades or the martyrdom of St Peter?Quote:
Originally Posted by CGMok, your point is taken. Not 100% taken, but somewhat taken. :) I would say that far fewer christians are prepared to kill to support their beliefs. And they would tend to target their victims more carefully. Note the use of the word tend.Quote:
Originally Posted by CFH
There is still the issue of concepts of jihad and martyrdom in modern society and religion. I've made my point there.
Sabbra and Shatilla happened in the early eighties,the Jewish brigades surrounded the refugee camps,and the Lebanese CHRISTIAN MILITIA walked in and shot every woman child and elderly person they could find.Quote:
Originally Posted by CGMThat's hardly modern society is it? We've learned a few things since then. I would say that going to war in the name of religion has long since stopped being a characteristic of "Western Society". Besides, the Crusades could hardly be described as deliberate and widespread attacks on civilians. For the most part it was between opposing armies.Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainer MonkeyYou mean like the crusades or the martyrdom of St Peter?Quote:
Originally Posted by CGM
Oklahoma City and Atlanta happened in the 90's
McVeigh was an exception. There are always exceptions. He was specifically ttargeting the government, because of what happened in Waco.Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainer MonkeyFor the record,there are rules to Jihad,they get broken,but show me where christ said to take out a federal building.Quote:
Originally Posted by CGMNot quite the same as a stated desire to kill as many of the infidel civilians as possible, is it?Quote:
Originally Posted by CFH
But according to the rules of Jihad your supposed to leave the civillians and buildings alone
As for rules of jihad, well true enough. I mentioned earlier about not equating Islam with terrorism, but it's worth mentioning again. That doesn't negate my points. Because the type of terrorism I am talking about gets done in the name of Islam, whether it's by the rules or not.
Yes, I remember the massacres in the Palestine camps in the 80s. Wrong yes. But I wouldn't say they were done in the name of christianity. Rather they were an extreme and over the top reaction to terrorism, because a lot of the terrorists were supoosedly based in the camps. And things got out of hand. There was also a civil war going on at the time.Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainer MonkeySabbra and Shatilla happened in the early eighties,the Jewish brigades surrounded the refugee camps,and the Lebanese CHRISTIAN MILITIA walked in and shot every woman child and elderly person they could find.Quote:
Originally Posted by CGMThat's hardly modern society is it? We've learned a few things since then. I would say that going to war in the name of religion has long since stopped being a characteristic of "Western Society". Besides, the Crusades could hardly be described as deliberate and widespread attacks on civilians. For the most part it was between opposing armies.Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainer Monkey
Oklahoma City and Atlanta happened in the 90's
He wasn't a Christian anyways, and as you mentioned his religious beliefs had nothing to do with the reasons behind what he did.Quote:
Originally Posted by CGMMcVeigh was an exception. There are always exceptions. He was specifically ttargeting the government, because of what happened in Waco.Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainer MonkeyFor the record,there are rules to Jihad,they get broken,but show me where christ said to take out a federal building.Quote:
Originally Posted by CGM
But according to the rules of Jihad your supposed to leave the civillians and buildings alone
As for rules of jihad, well true enough. I mentioned earlier about not equating Islam with terrorism, but it's worth mentioning again. That doesn't negate my points. Because the type of terrorism I am talking about gets done in the name of Islam, whether it's by the rules or not.
Oh come now,Atlanta during the Olympics got bombed in the name of Christ.Quote:
Originally Posted by CGMMcVeigh was an exception. There are always exceptions. He was specifically ttargeting the government, because of what happened in Waco.Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainer MonkeyFor the record,there are rules to Jihad,they get broken,but show me where christ said to take out a federal building.Quote:
Originally Posted by CGM
But according to the rules of Jihad your supposed to leave the civillians and buildings alone
As for rules of jihad, well true enough. I mentioned earlier about not equating Islam with terrorism, but it's worth mentioning again. That doesn't negate my points. Because the type of terrorism I am talking about gets done in the name of Islam, whether it's by the rules or not.
Not to mention financial terrorism
Like Jerry Falwell supporting South Africa in the middle of Apartheid saying it was gods will that his flock bought Kuggerands to support the Apartheid Goverment.
Or the wack jobs who support Israel,because they believe that Israel has to be in the hands of the Jews for the Rapture to happen,and it doesnt matter what attrocities the Jewish Goverment does as state sanctioned terrorism.
Most of its political anyway,Pakistan and India have hated each others guts for years now.
What really set Bin Laden off was just as much that he was ticked off about the basing rights the Saudi's gave us as it was religous.
You dont Christians can be terrorists?
Ask the victims of the London Disco bombing if Christians can be terrorists, or any catholic child trying to go to school
When we do it,its unfortunate,when they do it,its their evil religion
Actually yes it did,he was mad at the goverment because of their intolerance of the Waco lunatics religous beliefs,which while weird, were Christian, just a very screwed up version of it.Quote:
Originally Posted by CFHHe wasn't a Christian anyways, more of an agnostic, and as you mentioned his religious beliefs had nothing to do with the reasons behind what he did.Quote:
Originally Posted by CGMMcVeigh was an exception. There are always exceptions. He was specifically ttargeting the government, because of what happened in Waco.Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainer Monkey
As for rules of jihad, well true enough. I mentioned earlier about not equating Islam with terrorism, but it's worth mentioning again. That doesn't negate my points. Because the type of terrorism I am talking about gets done in the name of Islam, whether it's by the rules or not.
Hey whaddya know about that,Christianity can have sects that are totally screwed up as well.
Unless you can find me find the part where Christ said,"And ye shall stockpile Automatic weapons,and let your daughters lay with the really crappy guitarist,and defy your goverment when its laws dont meet your desire to have illegal weapons"