Same day weigh ins will get people killed

Lets face facts; wherever you have weight classes, you will have weight cutting. You can have the weigh ins 30 minutes before the fight and people will still be dehydrating themselves to cut weight.

I hear people say we should go to same day weigh ins, like this will suddenly get rid of weight cutting. All this accomplish will be to send guys into the ring dehydrated or not fully replenished. Your brain is surrounded by cerebralspinal fluid which is, like your body, composed of mostly water, so when guys are not fully replenished they are at more risk of brain injury.

So why do people think this is a good idea? Are they niave enough to think it will eliminate weight cutting? I don't understand it.

Oh I totally agree....adding any more restrictions to making weight will only get more people hurt because the athletes will try to bend the rules as best as they can despite what it may mean for their bodies

like you say it will be more dangerous at least when its the day before the fighters can rehydrate.

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Originally Posted by Beanflicker

Lets face facts; wherever you have weight classes, you will have weight cutting. You can have the weigh ins 30 minutes before the fight and people will still be dehydrating themselves to cut weight.

I hear people say we should go to same day weigh ins, like this will suddenly get rid of weight cutting. All this accomplish will be to send guys into the ring dehydrated or not fully replenished. Your brain is surrounded by cerebralspinal fluid which is, like your body, composed of mostly water, so when guys are not fully replenished they are at more risk of brain injury.

So why do people think this is a good idea? Are they niave enough to think it will eliminate weight cutting? I don't understand it.

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Seems to work ok in Amatuer boxing. The intention is to prevent fighters from dehydrating and malnourishing themselves. I have a hard time imagining someone not eating and dehydrating when the fight is coming up in a few hours. Most fighters would have to move up a weight class at least.

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Originally Posted by Beanflicker

Lets face facts; wherever you have weight classes, you will have weight cutting. You can have the weigh ins 30 minutes before the fight and people will still be dehydrating themselves to cut weight.

I hear people say we should go to same day weigh ins, like this will suddenly get rid of weight cutting. All this accomplish will be to send guys into the ring dehydrated or not fully replenished. Your brain is surrounded by cerebralspinal fluid which is, like your body, composed of mostly water, so when guys are not fully replenished they are at more risk of brain injury.

So why do people think this is a good idea? Are they niave enough to think it will eliminate weight cutting? I don't understand it.

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I agree 100%.

Its not perfect but if it helps to reduce Brain injures which I think it does its a god thing overall.

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Originally Posted by porkypara

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Originally Posted by Beanflicker

Lets face facts; wherever you have weight classes, you will have weight cutting. You can have the weigh ins 30 minutes before the fight and people will still be dehydrating themselves to cut weight.

I hear people say we should go to same day weigh ins, like this will suddenly get rid of weight cutting. All this accomplish will be to send guys into the ring dehydrated or not fully replenished. Your brain is surrounded by cerebralspinal fluid which is, like your body, composed of mostly water, so when guys are not fully replenished they are at more risk of brain injury.

So why do people think this is a good idea? Are they niave enough to think it will eliminate weight cutting? I don't understand it.

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I agree 100%.

Its not perfect but if it helps to reduce Brain injures which I think it does its a god thing overall.

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What does God have to do with it? ;)

Anybody who over Dehydrates, and thats most Fighters now interestingly will find it takes four days to rehydrate, its an interesting point. :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by killersheep

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Originally Posted by Beanflicker

Lets face facts; wherever you have weight classes, you will have weight cutting. You can have the weigh ins 30 minutes before the fight and people will still be dehydrating themselves to cut weight.

I hear people say we should go to same day weigh ins, like this will suddenly get rid of weight cutting. All this accomplish will be to send guys into the ring dehydrated or not fully replenished. Your brain is surrounded by cerebralspinal fluid which is, like your body, composed of mostly water, so when guys are not fully replenished they are at more risk of brain injury.

So why do people think this is a good idea? Are they niave enough to think it will eliminate weight cutting? I don't understand it.

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Seems to work ok in Amatuer boxing. The intention is to prevent fighters from dehydrating and malnourishing themselves. I have a hard time imagining someone not eating and dehydrating when the fight is coming up in a few hours. Most fighters would have to move up a weight class at least.

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Andrew did it against Dumas,and look what happened

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Originally Posted by Beanflicker

Lets face facts; wherever you have weight classes, you will have weight cutting. You can have the weigh ins 30 minutes before the fight and people will still be dehydrating themselves to cut weight.

I hear people say we should go to same day weigh ins, like this will suddenly get rid of weight cutting. All this accomplish will be to send guys into the ring dehydrated or not fully replenished. Your brain is surrounded by cerebralspinal fluid which is, like your body, composed of mostly water, so when guys are not fully replenished they are at more risk of brain injury.

So why do people think this is a good idea? Are they niave enough to think it will eliminate weight cutting? I don't understand it.

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I think every one knows that sameday weigh in is dangerous but every org should be limiting the ammount of weight a fighter can gain before a bout. I think limiting the weight to no more than 8 pounds over after weigh in is fair. We have seen fighters gain 10 to 15 pounds after the weigh in and we know that aint right either.

I agree, though I do think the weigh in weight and the pre-fight weight should be mandaded to be within 10 pounds, maybe even 8.

It may encourage fighters to fight at their natural weights. A guy who is 160lbs would in theory fight a guy who is also 160lbs come fight night. It's unlikely there would be big weight differences between the fighters.

It would discourage fighters from cutting too much weight and encourge fighters to fight at a weight in which they are comfortable. Good plan i say.

I fail to see how they will get people killed. Only an idiot would turn up at a weigh in severley dehydrated and gaunt if he was fighting in only a few hours. He would turn up practically in his fighting condition - minus his pre-fight meal. Great plan.

I don't like the idea. I think boxers with their traniers are going to always try to gain an edge, and will always cut to make weight. Lessening the rehydration period I think would cause a lot of fighters to try and do it in the shorter period of time, and put themselves at more risk and be fighting in a more weakened state.

It is good in theory. In that it might force boxers to come in closer to fighting weight, but think it would cause many others to try and manipulate it and end up in harms way.

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Originally Posted by BoomBoom

I agree, though I do think the weigh in weight and the pre-fight weight should be mandaded to be within 10 pounds, maybe even 8.

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Why stop there? It seems strange to me. The way it is now you get welterweights fhowing on fight day approaching mi9ddleweight. It makes for uneven fights weightwise. I would rather see a system whereby when a guy steps into the ring as a welterweight, he really is a welterweight. Not sure how they would do that though.

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Originally Posted by Youngblood

I don't like the idea. I think boxers with their traniers are going to always try to gain an edge, and will always cut to make weight. Lessening the rehydration period I think would cause a lot of fighters to try and do it in the shorter period of time, and put themselves at more risk and be fighting in a more weakened state.

It is good in theory. In that it might force boxers to come in closer to fighting weight, but think it would cause many others to try and manipulate it and end up in harms way.

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But if we can see what danger the fighter would be in from using the current procedure of cutting weight for the new rules of making weight, then surely the fighters and trainer can aswell.

It's surely the trainers job and the fighters job to make sure the fighter is comfortable with the weight so they should be held responsible.

Stevie Wonder can see that there will be no advantage to be gained from dehydrating yourself on the day of a fight.

I would imagine trainers would have to take some form of exam where they can show that they have knowledge of the dangers of using the various weight making procedures.

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Originally Posted by CGM

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Originally Posted by BoomBoom

I agree, though I do think the weigh in weight and the pre-fight weight should be mandaded to be within 10 pounds, maybe even 8.

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Why stop there? It seems strange to me. The way it is now you get welterweights fhowing on fight day approaching mi9ddleweight. It makes for uneven fights weightwise. I would rather see a system whereby when a guy steps into the ring as a welterweight, he really is a welterweight. Not sure how they would do that though.

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I agree. Same day weigh ins are the only way.

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Originally Posted by ono

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Originally Posted by Youngblood

I don't like the idea. I think boxers with their traniers are going to always try to gain an edge, and will always cut to make weight. Lessening the rehydration period I think would cause a lot of fighters to try and do it in the shorter period of time, and put themselves at more risk and be fighting in a more weakened state.

It is good in theory. In that it might force boxers to come in closer to fighting weight, but think it would cause many others to try and manipulate it and end up in harms way.

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But if we can see what danger the fighter would be in from using the current procedure of cutting weight for the new rules of making weight, then surely the fighters and trainer can aswell.

It's surely the trainers job and the fighters job to make sure the fighter is comfortable with the weight so they should be held responsible.

Stevie Wonder can see that there will be no advantage to be gained from dehydrating yourself on the day of a fight.

I would imagine trainers would have to take some form of exam where they can show that they have knowledge of the dangers of using the various weight making procedures.

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Sure they'll know the risk...but it doesn't mean they won't try to exploit it. I mean, c'mon...there is so much on the line between winning a fight and losing in the pros, many I believe would be willing to take the risks. So by allowing a rule to have a more extreme risk associated with it, you are not factoring a neccesary component when rule making imo, that being human nature.

If we had the same day weigh-ins, Sure you might see a few fools try to loose ten pounds and even a few will be able to achieve it and come in competitive. But boxing is better off keeping the playing field even because the practice of fighting at a lower weight will fade away. You wont get guys who are obviously two weight classes over fighting down. We often see those that do dominate a weight class. Paul Williams comes to mind. Guys that have matured their bodies will be forced to move up in class sooner because they can't make weight. If same day weigh-ins were already in place, Hatton / Pacquiao might have happened last year And we probably never would have seen a Dream Match. As far as a guy getting killed, at first I might be inclined to think it's dangeriuos because it's many fighters norm, but it's just too hard to do for most fighters. So I have to disagree....

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Originally Posted by Youngblood

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Originally Posted by ono

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Originally Posted by Youngblood

I don't like the idea. I think boxers with their traniers are going to always try to gain an edge, and will always cut to make weight. Lessening the rehydration period I think would cause a lot of fighters to try and do it in the shorter period of time, and put themselves at more risk and be fighting in a more weakened state.

It is good in theory. In that it might force boxers to come in closer to fighting weight, but think it would cause many others to try and manipulate it and end up in harms way.

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But if we can see what danger the fighter would be in from using the current procedure of cutting weight for the new rules of making weight, then surely the fighters and trainer can aswell.

It's surely the trainers job and the fighters job to make sure the fighter is comfortable with the weight so they should be held responsible.

Stevie Wonder can see that there will be no advantage to be gained from dehydrating yourself on the day of a fight.

I would imagine trainers would have to take some form of exam where they can show that they have knowledge of the dangers of using the various weight making procedures.

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Sure they'll know the risk...but it doesn't mean they won't try to exploit it. I mean, c'mon...there is so much on the line between winning a fight and losing in the pros, many I believe would be willing to take the risks. So by allowing a rule to have a more extreme risk associated with it, you are not factoring a neccesary component when rule making imo, that being human nature.

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I honestly don't think there is much to exploit though. Given the short time frame you're only going to gain a few lbs and dehydrating and draining yourself on the day of the fight for this debatable advantage is pointless.

Whether or not the fighter agrees is a different matter. It's obvious to me that a fighter would have 'the real edge' by coming at his fighting weight and being nutritionally prepared. Like you say though, it's human nature to explore other ways to gain an advantage - even if those ways are dangerous.

Problem is now, with the current weigh-ins some fighters are dehydrating themselves to a point where 1 day isn't long enough to re-hydrate. You're looking at 2-4 days depending on the degree of dehydration. It could be argued that the fighters are dehydrating to this degree because they feel a 24 hour window is plenty of time to re-fuel and rehydrate...which isn't always the case.

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Originally Posted by ono

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Originally Posted by Youngblood

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Originally Posted by ono

But if we can see what danger the fighter would be in from using the current procedure of cutting weight for the new rules of making weight, then surely the fighters and trainer can aswell.

It's surely the trainers job and the fighters job to make sure the fighter is comfortable with the weight so they should be held responsible.

Stevie Wonder can see that there will be no advantage to be gained from dehydrating yourself on the day of a fight.

I would imagine trainers would have to take some form of exam where they can show that they have knowledge of the dangers of using the various weight making procedures.

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Sure they'll know the risk...but it doesn't mean they won't try to exploit it. I mean, c'mon...there is so much on the line between winning a fight and losing in the pros, many I believe would be willing to take the risks. So by allowing a rule to have a more extreme risk associated with it, you are not factoring a neccesary component when rule making imo, that being human nature.

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I honestly don't think there is much to exploit though. Given the short time frame you're only going to gain a few lbs and dehydrating and draining yourself on the day of the fight for this debatable advantage is pointless.

Whether or not the fighter agrees is a different matter. It's obvious to me that a fighter would have 'the real edge' by coming at his fighting weight and being nutritionally prepared. Like you say though, it's human nature to explore other ways to gain an advantage - even if those ways are dangerous.

Problem is now, with the current weigh-ins some fighters are dehydrating themselves to a point where 1 day isn't long enough to re-hydrate. You're looking at 2-4 days depending on the degree of dehydration. It could be argued that the fighters are dehydrating to this degree because they feel a 24 hour window is plenty of time to re-fuel and rehydrate...which isn't always the case.

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I agree. And I think if anything was changed to keep it safer, it should be to lengthen the weigh in/rehydration process, not shorten it.

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Originally Posted by Youngblood

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Originally Posted by ono

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Originally Posted by Youngblood

Sure they'll know the risk...but it doesn't mean they won't try to exploit it. I mean, c'mon...there is so much on the line between winning a fight and losing in the pros, many I believe would be willing to take the risks. So by allowing a rule to have a more extreme risk associated with it, you are not factoring a neccesary component when rule making imo, that being human nature.

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I honestly don't think there is much to exploit though. Given the short time frame you're only going to gain a few lbs and dehydrating and draining yourself on the day of the fight for this debatable advantage is pointless.

Whether or not the fighter agrees is a different matter. It's obvious to me that a fighter would have 'the real edge' by coming at his fighting weight and being nutritionally prepared. Like you say though, it's human nature to explore other ways to gain an advantage - even if those ways are dangerous.

Problem is now, with the current weigh-ins some fighters are dehydrating themselves to a point where 1 day isn't long enough to re-hydrate. You're looking at 2-4 days depending on the degree of dehydration. It could be argued that the fighters are dehydrating to this degree because they feel a 24 hour window is plenty of time to re-fuel and rehydrate...which isn't always the case.

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I agree. And I think if anything was changed to keep it safer, it should be to lengthen the weigh in/rehydration process, not shorten it.

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Yep,9 for 10 the promoter isnt going to pull the show,he's had to fly people in etc etc etc.
He wants his show,so he'll do whatever he can to make sure the fights still sanctioned. But he will pull a bunch of the fighters money for not being at weight,same days will only further encourage fighters to lose an unhealthy amount of weight in a hurry.
We really dont need to encourage going back to the old days of chewing tobacco and a spit cup while wearing a sauna suit.

Day before weigthins, are getting people Killed. More so than before it seems.

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Originally Posted by Scrap

Day before weigthins, are getting people Killed. More so than before it seems.

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This is what i believe aswell. 24 hours isn't long enough to rehydrate somebody effectively enough to compete for 12 hard rounds after a period of severe dehydration.

Go any longer on the window and the weigh in comes pointless.

...boxers taking advantage of the weigh in's to fight little guys will get someone killed. You take the risk to gain the advantage you take a chance...

Do we want to see Better Fighters or look at the work of better Scientist take your pick. ;D

what do folks propose?

How ever you work it people are going to try and work the system to get the most advantage over the other guy. I'm not suggesting we stop trying to improve safety.

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Originally Posted by Scrap

Do we want to see Better Fighters or look at the work of better Scientist take your pick. ;D

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Both.:cool:

Wont Happen :rolleyes:

Heres something to think about, which weight class has the seriuos KOs which weightclass get hit the Hardest. Which weightclass has the least serious injurys, the question is WHY. :rolleyes:

I can see how same day weigh ins might make it more dangerous for guys cutting a load of weight to try and fight in a weight class they are too big for but to be honest I think that's fair enough.

Is it really fair that some of these massive wiry type guys can get be allowed to get down to a weightclass where they will be fighting much smaller men and then having the benefit of rehydrating with a 14 lb fight night weight advantage.

My attititude is that this makes the sport safer for the little guy, or more accurately the guy who is in his natural weight class and is fighting someone who really shouldn't be fighting in the division at all.

My biggest concern with same day weigh ins would not be fighter safety (fight in your own damn weight class you cowards!) but rather the fact that many more fights might get pulled on the morning of the fight becuase one fighter doesn't make the limit :-\