Berto is dissapointing me

I really was expecting a Pacquiao-Diaz type fight, it should be like that, and he's landing a lot, but he isn't dominating like I expected, with his power and speed he should have Urango totally clueless. Also wtf is with the holding, he should be countering so much Urango shouldn't want to come forward, or because Urango is so slow he should be confident with his defense than Juan won't land anything. IMO Berto needs a new trainer, I am not saying that fixes everything, but this guy is teaching him the wrong things, IMO FMSR is perfect for him.

He is appalling, dancing around the ring right now and barely throwing anything. What a clown. :rolleyes:

I don't mind dancing around, what I do mind is that he isn't using his abilities properly. People say I love speed, and I do, but only when that speed is tied in with a great work ethic, and coordination. He didn't show me effortless movement, or as great of boxing skills I expected, I thought if Berto tried to truly box he would look awsome, and he didn't.

:looroll:

I don't know how else to say this but there just seems to be no flow/fluidity to bertos game. As fast as he is, he seems rigid and straight up sort of. He throws a couple punches and stops there is no continuation, and if he fights like this against shane or cotto he's fooked.

I respect Berto for climbing through the ropes....he is a nice enough guy and does his best.

But I do believe he is the clinical definition of a paper Champion on the brink of exposure.After the Estrada fight, he was fast tracked to the top and just has not developed properly.

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Originally Posted by Taeth

I don't mind dancing around, what I do mind is that he isn't using his abilities properly. People say I love speed, and I do, but only when that speed is tied in with a great work ethic, and coordination. He didn't show me effortless movement, or as great of boxing skills I expected, I thought if Berto tried to truly box he would look awsome, and he didn't.

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I think I was just getting annoyed because I wanted to see a fight. :mad:

Berto looked a very flawed fighter out there. Urango was always going to be too one dimensional to cause any major problems. But on that showing I struggle to see Berto getting away with it against any of the elite at WW.

He needs to rematch Collazo IMO and then move from there.

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Originally Posted by armin

I don't know how else to say this but there just seems to be no flow/fluidity to bertos game. As fast as he is, he seems rigid and straight up sort of. He throws a couple punches and stops there is no continuation, and if he fights like this against shane or cotto he's fooked.

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Definitely, no fluidity at all.

:throwup:

I think PAC can defeat Berto at 147... Berto sucks...
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Mosley has made a career of having no fluidity.

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Originally Posted by LEGION

:looroll:

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WTF is that about?

I think everyone is bein too critical on Berto's performance in this fight. He was in there with an awkard guy and a fucking ROCK. Urango is a beast.

He is slow, yes, but he is also powerful, determined and dangerous.

It was an ugly fight cus of all the holding, headbutting and tripping, but Berto looked alright. He won all but 2 rounds.

I think Cotto woulda stopped Urango, but thats Cotto. Berto is a good fighter, but he's just in a weight class with great fighters.

I still think Berto would be extremely dangerous for any of the top guys except maybe Mayweather, but he isn't what I was expecting, I thought he could transition better into a pure boxer. I hope he proves me wrong, but now that I have Rigondeaux, I don't need him to be the next great thing.

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Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer

I think PAC can defeat Berto at 147... Berto sucks...
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Berto not the worthy for a pac opponent!!! Pac doesn't need to waste time. I think Ortiz will give him his 1st loss.

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Originally Posted by Pacdbest2

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Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer

I think PAC can defeat Berto at 147... Berto sucks...
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Berto not the worthy for a pac opponent!!! Pac doesn't need to waste time. I think Ortiz will give him his 1st loss.

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Berto is just for PAC's 7th division title...;) I agree, many will protest if PAC fights Berto at 147 and not Mosley, Cotto or Clottey...;D
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What upset me about Berto's performance was everytime he landed a significant blow he didn't really follow it up. It was like he said to himself, "nice shot, now let's dance around a bit."

The holding bothered me as well. But on the other hand, Berto's handspeed is SERIOUS! He threw that lead left hook with his hands down faster than anyone I've ever seen.

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Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer

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Originally Posted by Pacdbest2

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Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer

I think PAC can defeat Berto at 147... Berto sucks...
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Berto not the worthy for a pac opponent!!! Pac doesn't need to waste time. I think Ortiz will give him his 1st loss.

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Berto is just for PAC's 7th division title...;) I agree, many will protest if PAC fights Berto at 147 and not Mosley, Cotto or Clottey...;D
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How the hell did Pacquiao get involved in this thread?!

Berto is probably playing it safe, his last fight with Collazo a fighter with 50 percent kayo ratio had him hurt when he traded. He shouldnt have done that against a naturally smaller fighter in Iron Twin though:-\

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Originally Posted by C-Lo

What upset me about Berto's performance was everytime he landed a significant blow he didn't really follow it up. It was like he said to himself, "nice shot, now let's dance around a bit."

The holding bothered me as well. But on the other hand, Berto's handspeed is SERIOUS! He threw that lead left hook with his hands down faster than anyone I've ever seen.

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Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer

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Originally Posted by Pacdbest2

Berto not the worthy for a pac opponent!!! Pac doesn't need to waste time. I think Ortiz will give him his 1st loss.

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Berto is just for PAC's 7th division title...;) I agree, many will protest if PAC fights Berto at 147 and not Mosley, Cotto or Clottey...;D
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How the hell did Pacquiao get involved in this thread?!

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My bad... Just exploring the possibility of PAC-Berto fight at 147 if PAC wants to get his 7th weight division title from Berto... Actually there's another thread about that...

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Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer

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Originally Posted by Pacdbest2

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Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer

I think PAC can defeat Berto at 147... Berto sucks...
.

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Berto not the worthy for a pac opponent!!! Pac doesn't need to waste time. I think Ortiz will give him his 1st loss.

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Berto is just for PAC's 7th division title...;) I agree, many will protest if PAC fights Berto at 147 and not Mosley, Cotto or Clottey...;D
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Pac need to fight only HOFamers!! Berto will be a forgotten name. 20 years from now, if u ask any casual boxing fans if they knew about Berto, You'll probably get answer like "Berto the Beef Jerky Brand???"

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Originally Posted by Pavlik

Berto is probably playing it safe, his last fight with Collazo a fighter with 50 percent kayo ratio had him hurt when he traded. He shouldnt have done that against a naturally smaller fighter in Iron Twin though:-\

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I think Berto needs more fights before he steps it up to the elite. He easily won the fight with Forbes but it was somewhat competitive. He fought life and death against Collazo who is basically a class under the Mosleys, Cottos, and Mayweathers. His speed will give anyone he fights the fits but he needs more experience. His skills and his heart have already been tested and he's passed, he just not ready yet.

I think people are hoping Berto turns elite overnight, but it won't happen. Him and his promoter are being smart, nothing more.

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Originally Posted by Pacdbest2

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Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer

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Originally Posted by Pacdbest2

Berto not the worthy for a pac opponent!!! Pac doesn't need to waste time. I think Ortiz will give him his 1st loss.

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Berto is just for PAC's 7th division title...;) I agree, many will protest if PAC fights Berto at 147 and not Mosley, Cotto or Clottey...;D
.

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Pac need to fight only HOFamers!! Berto will be a forgotten name. 20 years from now, if u ask any casual boxing fans if they knew about Berto, You'll probably get answer like "Berto the Beef Jerky Brand???"

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Just in case there's nothing fruitful will come out from the HOFamers, Berto is an option for PAC... Having attained a 7th division title is also nice for PAC's boxing history... If ever, PAC will become the only boxer in history to get titles in 7 different weight divisions... A record that's very difficult to break...
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Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer

I think PAC can defeat Berto at 147... Berto sucks...
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Is there any thread where you don't mention Pac? Just wondering :rolleyes:.

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Originally Posted by Chino

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Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer

I think PAC can defeat Berto at 147... Berto sucks...
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Is there any thread where you don't mention Pac? Just wondering :rolleyes:.

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I already apologized earlier... You're late... Any comment for the "Berto sucks" part?? ;D
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I think he's too damn short for 147 and needs to drop to 140 if possible. He almost looks like he lifts weights. If he does, then he should stop immediately. His fights at 140 are only going to become less and less dominant as time goes on IMO.

Berto fights with alot of nervous energy. He needs to calm down a bit in the ring. He could have stopped Juan easy if he held his ground and let his hands go.

He's got all the tools to be a great champ, but there are some questions in places. Something I noticed that was off was Berto's balance, he doesn't seem have solid footing when he throws his shots, and if he takes on a good counter puncher he would have some serious problems, but if he can work this out he can hang with just about anyone.

Berto is the fight that Cotto needed at this moment to fully regain his confidence, and unify tittles. Cotto would destroy him... I believe that Clottey is a more dangerous fighter today for Cotto compared to Berto.

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Originally Posted by Taeth

I really was expecting a Pacquiao-Diaz type fight, it should be like that, and he's landing a lot, but he isn't dominating like I expected, with his power and speed he should have Urango totally clueless. Also wtf is with the holding, he should be countering so much Urango shouldn't want to come forward, or because Urango is so slow he should be confident with his defense than Juan won't land anything. IMO Berto needs a new trainer, I am not saying that fixes everything, but this guy is teaching him the wrong things, IMO FMSR is perfect for him.

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Berto clearly has the speed and athleticism, but I'm not sure if his power is all that great. He's going to be in for a rude awaking when he get put in with a top level WW. He barely got by Collazo. Even though he won last night, it was against a mediocre fighter who was taylor made for him and he looked terrible doing it.

A new trainer would probably help.

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Originally Posted by Puerto Rican Punch

Berto is the fight that Cotto needed at this moment to fully regain his confidence, and unify tittles. Cotto would destroy him... I believe that Clottey is a more dangerous fighter today for Cotto compared to Berto.

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I dont think Cotto destroys Berto. Berto is a slick fast fighter with very good stamina. I think his quick combos will trouble cotto and Berto has some pop on those shots, he rocked Juan a couple times last night......

Cotto has had stamina issues and I think Berto would pose problems for Cotto with his lateral movement and fast hands.....

I would give Cotto a points victory at this point but Berto will have his moments....

Berto just needs to calm down in the ring and trust his abilities. He will only get better.

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Originally Posted by JudahShuffle

I think he's too damn short for 147 and needs to drop to 140 if possible. He almost looks like he lifts weights. If he does, then he should stop immediately. His fights at 140 are only going to become less and less dominant as time goes on IMO.

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I don't think he is too short, he is as tall as Cotto and Mayweather and they've done fine at 147, with his speed he shouldn't even be too short for 154, I would just like tosee more fluidity, he has good boxing skills when he boxes, he has amazing speed, and good power, but he can't transition well at all.

I dont know why everyone so up in arms over the fight i mean he won almost every round like Hatton did just in a boring fashion o well. I like Berto really do but he better never step in the ring with Mosely or it game over and Berto going down bad and hard and ending career fashion. If he going to step up he got few option he go for Cotto only reason i say this is because he open for upper cut and has a so so chin and suspect stam. The the other person he can try is Margarito when he comes back and well see how much he has left and see if he was worth anything to start.

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Originally Posted by Puerto Rican Punch

Berto is the fight that Cotto needed at this moment to fully regain his confidence, and unify tittles. Cotto would destroy him... I believe that Clottey is a more dangerous fighter today for Cotto compared to Berto.

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Its hard to say if Cotto would destroy him, remember how badly Cotto looked against Ricardo Torres? Or less than truly dominant performances against Lovermore N'dou, Abdulaev, Oktay Urkal. I honestly see Collazo giving Cotto and Floyd Mayweather Jr a lot of problems because of his speed, durability, and willingness to mix it up, IMO Mosley really good off looking better than he was in the fight against COllazo because Collazo couldn't really throw punches, and even then it wasn't like Mosley was dominating him, most of the rounds Collazo would land 9ish punches to MOsley's 11-15 punches.

My question is, who else is a reasonable test for Berto before going to the elites? Besides Zab Judah who is campaigning at 140, I really don't see a person who is a step up from Collazo or even Urango who isn't an elite fighter.

Well i say right now Berto is like at a Hatton level kinda of fighter well at least what i have seen off the seen vs the same kinda of comp. But like teath said if he can get a trainer to get him to do right things he has the natural gifts to become great but his mind set need some work though. I think he should take some fighters less then elite to fix his flaws and then go after a Mosely, Cotto, Clotty or if he comes back Margarito but before all that few more easy fights need to happen and flaws fixed.

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Originally Posted by Taeth

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Originally Posted by Puerto Rican Punch

Berto is the fight that Cotto needed at this moment to fully regain his confidence, and unify tittles. Cotto would destroy him... I believe that Clottey is a more dangerous fighter today for Cotto compared to Berto.

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Its hard to say if Cotto would destroy him, remember how badly Cotto looked against Ricardo Torres? Or less than truly dominant performances against Lovermore N'dou, Abdulaev, Oktay Urkal. I honestly see Collazo giving Cotto and Floyd Mayweather Jr a lot of problems because of his speed, durability, and willingness to mix it up, IMO Mosley really good off looking better than he was in the fight against COllazo because Collazo couldn't really throw punches, and even then it wasn't like Mosley was dominating him, most of the rounds Collazo would land 9ish punches to MOsley's 11-15 punches.

My question is, who else is a reasonable test for Berto before going to the elites? Besides Zab Judah who is campaigning at 140, I really don't see a person who is a step up from Collazo or even Urango who isn't an elite fighter.

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Keep Berto as far away as possible from Cotto. The Berto from last night would've lasted maybe 5 rounds with Cotto.

;)

I think people are over estimating Cotto(who is a great fighter), I mean he is great, but he hasn't been able to stop high end welterweights early in fights at all, except Quintana.

As for comparing Berto to Hatton, I think their effectiveness is on a similar playing field, but I truly believe Berto's athleticism and speed is going to hinder elite fighters more than Hatton's ruthless pressure. Most elite fighters are there because they themselves are faster fighters, whether its physically, with timing, or superior technique, they are used to having their punches get there first, and for all his flaws Berto is faster than anyone p4p in the sport, and he has good timing. His instincts are all there, he can be very defensively gifted when he wants to be, but he just doesn't know how to dominate guys in that clean efficient way we've grown so accustomed to with guys like Roy Jones Jr, Mayweather, Whitaker, Hopkins, etc.

That being said I think Urango would be an ugly fight for anybody, I don't see Mosley making it look any prettier, I see Mayweather doing the same thing Berto did, but more elegantly. Manny might look really effective against Urango.

Berto almost got a point deducted for holding, threw a few amateurish uppercuts, and managed to get tagged a few times by the "hourglass-speed" hands of Urango. None of this tells me he's ready for the truly elite fighters of the welterweight division. Oh....... AND...... Urango was moving up in weight, which means Berto should've been able to put on a better show. Sorry, he gets mangled by Cotto, Mosley, or any of the elites at 147.

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Originally Posted by Taeth

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Originally Posted by Puerto Rican Punch

Berto is the fight that Cotto needed at this moment to fully regain his confidence, and unify tittles. Cotto would destroy him... I believe that Clottey is a more dangerous fighter today for Cotto compared to Berto.

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Its hard to say if Cotto would destroy him, remember how badly Cotto looked against Ricardo Torres? Or less than truly dominant performances against Lovermore N'dou, Abdulaev, Oktay Urkal. I honestly see Collazo giving Cotto and Floyd Mayweather Jr a lot of problems because of his speed, durability, and willingness to mix it up, IMO Mosley really good off looking better than he was in the fight against COllazo because Collazo couldn't really throw punches, and even then it wasn't like Mosley was dominating him, most of the rounds Collazo would land 9ish punches to MOsley's 11-15 punches.

My question is, who else is a reasonable test for Berto before going to the elites? Besides Zab Judah who is campaigning at 140, I really don't see a person who is a step up from Collazo or even Urango who isn't an elite fighter.

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You could get him in there against Quintana, but other than him, at 147 he's got the elite to deal with. Cintron said he's willing to come back down to 147 to get a title shot and Berto's got a strap. I'm sure Judah wouldn't mind coming back up to get a shot at Berto's strap. Judah gets fights he doesn't deserve.

I wouldn't mind seeing Berto in with the loser of Cotto - Clottey, meaning Clottey. That would be a good test for him.

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Originally Posted by CFH

I wouldn't mind seeing Berto in with the loser of Cotto - Clottey, meaning Clottey. That would be a good test for him.

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That's probably what Berto's team is planning to do. Fight the loser while they're not completely recovered while on the other end, the loser will want to get their name back out there on their next fight leaving Berto as the perfect choice.