3 things - 1 Pac is inhuman- 2- How good must marquez be - 3-Mayweather!

thoughts?

im slowly getting into the fatc that pac v mayweather could happen and pac cou,ld win

BUT

my head tells me im so wrong and pac would go the same way as marquez, the distance but an easy win for mayweather

Boxing is about styles and where people are mentally. Hence why I picked Pacquiao to decimate Cotto.

But Pacquiao would get decimated by Mayweather.

Compared to Marquez, Mayweather is a better counter puncher, has better timing, is faster, is bigger, and hits harder. I think Mayweather would decimate Pacquiao. But the only thing people will say is that Mayweather doesn't look good vs southpaws. But i doubt that would make much of a difference since Pacquiao squares up.

But Mayweather is too good for Pacquiao because of how he locks down with his style, he would shut Pacquiao down. Arum knows that too. Unless Mayweather gets there first Pacquiao will be fighting Mosley or Berto.

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Originally Posted by Majesty

Boxing is about styles and where people are mentally. Hence why I picked Pacquiao to decimate Cotto.

But Pacquiao would get decimated by Mayweather.

Compared to Marquez, Mayweather is a better counter puncher, has better timing, is faster, is bigger, and hits harder. I think Mayweather would decimate Pacquiao. But the only thing people will say is that Mayweather doesn't look good vs southpaws. But i doubt that would make much of a difference since Pacquiao squares up.

But Mayweather is too good for Pacquiao because of how he locks down with his style, he would shut Pacquiao down. Arum knows that too. Unless Mayweather gets there first Pacquiao will be fighting Mosley or Berto.

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styles make fights

Marquez and Mayweather are both counter punchers but Mayweather is an outside boxer while Marquez stands toe to toe. Marquez can't cope with outside boxers. How Pacquaio copes with the outside counter punching of Mayweather remains to be seen.

It's all about the speed. If pac has more speed than mayweather, he'll win. Mayweather will give pac trouble like cotto gave him trouble by running constantly. Pac didn't land many punches when cotto ran for the last 3 rounds.

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Originally Posted by Majesty

Boxing is about styles and where people are mentally. Hence why I picked Pacquiao to decimate Cotto.

But Pacquiao would get decimated by Mayweather.

Compared to Marquez, Mayweather is a better counter puncher, has better timing, is faster, is bigger, and hits harder. I think Mayweather would decimate Pacquiao. But the only thing people will say is that Mayweather doesn't look good vs southpaws. But i doubt that would make much of a difference since Pacquiao squares up.

But Mayweather is too good for Pacquiao because of how he locks down with his style, he would shut Pacquiao down. Arum knows that too. Unless Mayweather gets there first Pacquiao will be fighting Mosley or Berto.

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That is exactly how I see Mayweather - Pac. I think Mayweathers style is all wrong for Pac and because of Pacs agressive tendencies when he is starting to get tagged i actually see Mayweather stopping Pac.

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Originally Posted by rjj tszyu

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Originally Posted by Majesty

Boxing is about styles and where people are mentally. Hence why I picked Pacquiao to decimate Cotto.

But Pacquiao would get decimated by Mayweather.

Compared to Marquez, Mayweather is a better counter puncher, has better timing, is faster, is bigger, and hits harder. I think Mayweather would decimate Pacquiao. But the only thing people will say is that Mayweather doesn't look good vs southpaws. But i doubt that would make much of a difference since Pacquiao squares up.

But Mayweather is too good for Pacquiao because of how he locks down with his style, he would shut Pacquiao down. Arum knows that too. Unless Mayweather gets there first Pacquiao will be fighting Mosley or Berto.

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That is exactly how I see Mayweather - Pac. I think Mayweathers style is all wrong for Pac and because of Pacs agressive tendencies when he is starting to get tagged i actually see Mayweather stopping Pac.

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IF Cotto didn't flat down Pacman, you can be sure that Mayweather can't, especially as he's a really careful boxer who doesn't like to trade and their respective punching power has nothing in common.

LOL at Mayweather decimating Pacquaio. Will it be just like the Gatti fight or just like the Chavez fight?

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Originally Posted by OumaFan

LOL at Mayweather decimating Pacquaio. Will it be just like the Gatti fight or just like the Chavez fight?

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I was right about Pacquiao decimating Cotto in a one sided fight.

Pacquao would get dominated by Mayweather badly. Maybe give him some issues in the first 2 rounds but that will be the end of it.

Mayweather won't stand toe to toe like Marquez did but he will counter the hell out of Pacquiao the same way. Mayweather also has a good consistant jab, something no one has used against Pacquiao. Jabs offset speed and Mayweathers timing AND speed make a problem. Pacquiao has showed against Marquez, his rhythm can be found out and he can be timed. Mayweather has better timng is faster and hts harder then Marquez and he's bigger. Pacquao has tendencies when he bounces out and and in to do it with his hands down and thats why Marquez would catch hm coming out. Mayweather would do it a lot worse. Cotto did it for one round and only with one left hook.

Pacquiao can't deal with counter punchers that have a composed mind and great timing like Marquez, Mayweather s better in every way then Marquez and is a bad style matchup for Pacquiao.

I stand by this like I stood by my prediction for Cotto and Pacquiao. If Pacquiao and Mayweather ever fight Pacquiao is going to get destroyed.

I agree that Marquez gave Pac two tough fights. I was fine with the draw for the first fight and I thought Pac won the 2nd.

After last nights performance I'm convinced that a the ole counter puncher can beat Pac theory is no longer valid.

The man has filled the holes he had and has literally grown physically and in skill with each fight. He's not the same fighter that fought Marquez.

Mayweather is capable of a win with out a doubt, but I'm back to picking Pac for this matchup. Best of luck to both fighters though.

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Originally Posted by belakbox

I agree that Marquez gave Pac two tough fights. I was fine with the draw for the first fight and I thought Pac won the 2nd.

After last nights performance I'm convinced that a the ole counter puncher can beat Pac theory is no longer valid.

The man has filled the holes he had and has literally grown physically and in skill with each fight. He's not the same fighter that fought Marquez.

Mayweather is capable of a win with out a doubt, but I'm back to picking Pac for this matchup. Best of luck to both fighters though.

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How is it no longer valid when Cotto didn't even fight like Mayweather would against Pacquiao? Not even close.

And it's not just any counter puncher, its the best counter puncher in the game today and the best pure boxer as well, not to mention the fastest and most disciplined guy Manny's ever fought.

Pacquiao didn't change, his opponents did. Pacquiao drew with Marquez when he was just jab jab straight left. He then became the new and improved Pacquiao with right hook version and still went life or death with the same Marquez. Pacquiao could change in all shades of the sun and still have major issues with Marquez. Because Marquez found his rhythm and timed him. Mayweather would do the same. I just don't see Mayweather losing to Pacquiao. Mayweather's style is made to shut down styles like Pacquiao's. So we'll see. But I'm sure Arum knows this. Hence why he is gonna try to get the winner of Berto vs Mosley before Mayweather does. Because then there's no one else for either of them to fight besides Paul Williams. And NOBODY is fighting that guy.

Honestly.. I wouldn't put it past Arum to try to set up a Margarito vs Pacquiao fight .... dumb as that is Arum wants to keep all the money inside. So, I don't see why he wouldn't. I can imagine Arum trying to hype it "They both beat Cotto, It can be argued Cotto was damaged goods after Margarito, Margarito wants redemption." Wouldn't put it past that guy.

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Originally Posted by belakbox

I agree that Marquez gave Pac two tough fights. I was fine with the draw for the first fight and I thought Pac won the 2nd.

After last nights performance I'm convinced that a the ole counter puncher can beat Pac theory is no longer valid.

The man has filled the holes he had and has literally grown physically and in skill with each fight. He's not the same fighter that fought Marquez.

Mayweather is capable of a win with out a doubt, but I'm back to picking Pac for this matchup. Best of luck to both fighters though.

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I'm with you on this, Pac is not the same as he was at lower weights, he has moved up better than I could have ever imagined, retained his speed and has more power. He also boxes smart and seems to have a very good understanding with what he is capable of, when I saw him standing in front of Cotto I was amazed, even more so when he moved about and threw combos.

The speed of foot and hand really is quite scary and it's not something you can prepare for because where can you get a sparring partner that can replicate that shit?

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Originally Posted by Majesty

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Originally Posted by OumaFan

LOL at Mayweather decimating Pacquaio. Will it be just like the Gatti fight or just like the Chavez fight?

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I was right about Pacquiao decimating Cotto in a one sided fight.

Pacquao would get dominated by Mayweather badly. Maybe give him some issues in the first 2 rounds but that will be the end of it.

Mayweather won't stand toe to toe like Marquez did but he will counter the hell out of Pacquiao the same way. Mayweather also has a good consistant jab, something no one has used against Pacquiao. Jabs offset speed and Mayweathers timing AND speed make a problem. Pacquiao has showed against Marquez, his rhythm can be found out and he can be timed. Mayweather has better timng is faster and hts harder then Marquez and he's bigger. Pacquao has tendencies when he bounces out and and in to do it with his hands down and thats why Marquez would catch hm coming out. Mayweather would do it a lot worse. Cotto did it for one round and only with one left hook.

Pacquiao can't deal with counter punchers that have a composed mind and great timing like Marquez, Mayweather s better in every way then Marquez and is a bad style matchup for Pacquiao.

I stand by this like I stood by my prediction for Cotto and Pacquiao. If Pacquiao and Mayweather ever fight Pacquiao is going to get destroyed.

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Destroyed is a strong word. Mayweather should beat Pac and will be the favorite going into the fight. But, Pac walked through Cotto's punches and I don't think Mayweather hits as hard or harder than Cotto. A bigger Pac would beat Mayweather. Pac will have trouble getting to Mayweather because of his size and that should spell his downfall. The fight itself won't be half as fun to watch as Pac v. Cotto. I know the Mayweather fight must happen, but to me Pac v. Mosley sounds like a more fun boxing match to watch.

Great article on Pac v. Cotto by Graham Houston: THAT WAS PHENOMENAL: Manny Pacquiao TKO12 Miguel Cotto | FightWriter
This is how he ended the article: "but I can tell you that as I left the MGM Grand Garden Arena on Saturday night it was with the feeling that I had been privileged to have seen one of the great performances in modern boxing history."

One more thing. Pac beating Mayweather is bigger for Pac's legacy than Mayweather beating Pac is for Mayweather.

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Originally Posted by Majesty

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Originally Posted by OumaFan

LOL at Mayweather decimating Pacquaio. Will it be just like the Gatti fight or just like the Chavez fight?

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I was right about Pacquiao decimating Cotto in a one sided fight.

Pacquao would get dominated by Mayweather badly. Maybe give him some issues in the first 2 rounds but that will be the end of it.

Mayweather won't stand toe to toe like Marquez did but he will counter the hell out of Pacquiao the same way. Mayweather also has a good consistant jab, something no one has used against Pacquiao. Jabs offset speed and Mayweathers timing AND speed make a problem. Pacquiao has showed against Marquez, his rhythm can be found out and he can be timed. Mayweather has better timng is faster and hts harder then Marquez and he's bigger. Pacquao has tendencies when he bounces out and and in to do it with his hands down and thats why Marquez would catch hm coming out. Mayweather would do it a lot worse. Cotto did it for one round and only with one left hook.

Pacquiao can't deal with counter punchers that have a composed mind and great timing like Marquez, Mayweather s better in every way then Marquez and is a bad style matchup for Pacquiao.

I stand by this like I stood by my prediction for Cotto and Pacquiao. If Pacquiao and Mayweather ever fight Pacquiao is going to get destroyed.

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Maybe you want to remind us that you got the Cotto fight rite once again??

Give it a fucking rest you predict a fight rite and now you think your fucking some boxing expert, Pac destroyed by Mayweather hahahahaha give your head a fucking wobble, when the fight happens I will bring this post up.

Styles do make fights. After that fight I think Pacquaio would beat Mayweather. I don't think either fighter will win by KO but I do think Pacquaio will throw 5 to Mayweather's 2 and win on points

I did not think Pac Man would beat Mayweather but after the Cotto display, he definitely does. I hope they fight and he batters Floyd.

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Originally Posted by The Fightfan

Styles do make fights. After that fight I think Pacquaio would beat Mayweather. I don't think either fighter will win by KO but I do think Pacquaio will throw 5 to Mayweather's 2 and win on points

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I agree...I don't care how much of a defensive genius you are - How do you deal with that speed, work rate and punch selection?

I think Pac could be too taxing for Mayweathers defence.

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Originally Posted by skel1983

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Originally Posted by Majesty

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Originally Posted by OumaFan

LOL at Mayweather decimating Pacquaio. Will it be just like the Gatti fight or just like the Chavez fight?

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I was right about Pacquiao decimating Cotto in a one sided fight.

Pacquao would get dominated by Mayweather badly. Maybe give him some issues in the first 2 rounds but that will be the end of it.

Mayweather won't stand toe to toe like Marquez did but he will counter the hell out of Pacquiao the same way. Mayweather also has a good consistant jab, something no one has used against Pacquiao. Jabs offset speed and Mayweathers timing AND speed make a problem. Pacquiao has showed against Marquez, his rhythm can be found out and he can be timed. Mayweather has better timng is faster and hts harder then Marquez and he's bigger. Pacquao has tendencies when he bounces out and and in to do it with his hands down and thats why Marquez would catch hm coming out. Mayweather would do it a lot worse. Cotto did it for one round and only with one left hook.

Pacquiao can't deal with counter punchers that have a composed mind and great timing like Marquez, Mayweather s better in every way then Marquez and is a bad style matchup for Pacquiao.

I stand by this like I stood by my prediction for Cotto and Pacquiao. If Pacquiao and Mayweather ever fight Pacquiao is going to get destroyed.

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Maybe you want to remind us that you got the Cotto fight rite once again??

Give it a fucking rest you predict a fight rite and now you think your fucking some boxing expert, Pac destroyed by Mayweather hahahahaha give your head a fucking wobble, when the fight happens I will bring this post up.

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To be fair Majesty most likely picked Pac big so he could act like it wasn't a big deal if it happened and if it didn't happen OMG he sucks, Floyd!

Who here picked Scott Lawton to KO Derry Matthews and made it their joker pick all the while knowing dude had only 5 KO's in 26 wins? Fenster? LOL, No. I did. That's boxrec magic.

Wow! I have tremendous respect for Pac...but i think people are getting a bit carried away. If you listen to Roach before Pac's last three fights...he himself pointed out their individual glaring weaknesses. Fact remains...Roach for the most part handpicked Manny's last three opponents. He is definitely not handpicking the Floyd fight. This will be a fight that the market demands. All of the HUGE advantages Pac had over Cotto, Oscar, and Hatton...will either be gone or neutrilized against Floyd. Skill, speed, endurance, defense, intelligence...there is no glaring weakness in Floyd's arsenal. Another thing i think people miss from the Pac/Cotto fight...Pac, for all of his speed and improvements...still gets hit frequently. Cotto has no where near the speed, accuracy, or overall skill of Floyd...yet he still tagged Manny. People keep focusing on IF FLOYD CAN KNOCKOUT MANNY. But Floyd's game has never been about knocking people out. If anything...Manny's huge rise will make Floyd train harder than ever (which is scary considering how hard he trains normally). I am not saying Floyd will definitely win...but for people to think that this will play out like Pac's recent performances...highly doubtful.

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Originally Posted by Nameless

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Originally Posted by rjj tszyu

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Originally Posted by Majesty

Boxing is about styles and where people are mentally. Hence why I picked Pacquiao to decimate Cotto.

But Pacquiao would get decimated by Mayweather.

Compared to Marquez, Mayweather is a better counter puncher, has better timing, is faster, is bigger, and hits harder. I think Mayweather would decimate Pacquiao. But the only thing people will say is that Mayweather doesn't look good vs southpaws. But i doubt that would make much of a difference since Pacquiao squares up.

But Mayweather is too good for Pacquiao because of how he locks down with his style, he would shut Pacquiao down. Arum knows that too. Unless Mayweather gets there first Pacquiao will be fighting Mosley or Berto.

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That is exactly how I see Mayweather - Pac. I think Mayweathers style is all wrong for Pac and because of Pacs agressive tendencies when he is starting to get tagged i actually see Mayweather stopping Pac.

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IF Cotto didn't flat down Pacman, you can be sure that Mayweather can't, especially as he's a really careful boxer who doesn't like to trade and their respective punching power has nothing in common.

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I'm not sure about this. On one or two occasions Cotto caught Manny coming in, and Manny looked stunned for a moment, though his legs held. What's going to happen if Mayweather hits him every time he jumps in to unleash one of those trademark flurries? And we all know Mayweather is capable of doing it, too. Did you see the state of Manny's face after the fight, btw? Cotto didn't even land that many shots, but he still looks like he's fallen down a flight of stairs. Also, when Cotto kept to boxing, tucked his chin in and had his guard high he got the better of Manny [before the second knockdown, after which he went totally defensive]. Mayweather can box far better [on or off the back foot] than Cotto, so I could see Manny getting badly hurt, though whether he would be stopped really depends on whether Mayweather wants to try and finish him or not. I think if he caught Manny and Pac was set off-balance/wobbled/dazed for a moment, Mayweather would be all over him trying to KO him and cement his 'legacy'. He would definitely win on points otherwise, imo, for a few reasons:

1. Manny struggles with good boxers [Morales, Marquez and even Cotto for a few rounds], and particularly counter-punchers who are able to hurt him on the way in.
2. PBF is just as fast as Pac.
3. Manny has never fought anyone as defensively sound as Mayweather.
4. Even though everything was stacked against Marquez [weight, age, hand-speed] Mayweather made him look average after being outside of the ring for over a year. This is a man who arguably beat Manny, and at the very least, offered a stern challenge that he only just overcame by the good grace of the judges.
5. Styles do make fights, and Manny's is perfectly suited to PBF's. This will be the bull vs the matador, and, whilst it would only take one mistake for PBF to get mauled, I don't see it happening - the matador rarely loses, as Floyd's record reflects.

You know with all the comparisons between how Floyd versus Pacquaio would go as opposed to Pacquaio-JMM you can see a difference between the two in SRR's sig.

If Manny starts his work from too far and lunges he's gonna create some openings for Floyd but Floyd most likely wouldn't even throw that second punch that really got Manny's attention in that video, the left hook, JMM counters in combination and very accurately which is pretty rare, Floyd would have most likely just thrown a counter right and tried to get out of the way. JMM is a much more offensive counter puncher than Floyd, anytime Manny made a mistake he could be punished with multiple shots by JMM, not sure that's the case with Floyd.

Still Floyd could win definitely, just not sure if he could do it one shot at a time and play defense. It won't be anything like the JMM fight size or not, JMM just can't play to his strengths against a guy like Floyd. Make him come forward and lead, especially against a guy like Floyd, and he's lost.

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Originally Posted by OumaFan

You know with all the comparisons between how Floyd versus Pacquaio would go as opposed to Pacquaio-JMM you can see a difference between the two in SRR's sig.

If Manny starts his work from too far and lunges he's gonna create some openings for Floyd but Floyd most likely wouldn't even throw that second punch that really got Manny's attention in that video, the left hook, JMM counters in combination and very accurately which is pretty rare, Floyd would have most likely just thrown a counter right and tried to get out of the way. JMM is a much more offensive counter puncher than Floyd, anytime Manny made a mistake he could be punished with multiple shots by JMM, not sure that's the case with Floyd.

Still Floyd could win definitely, just not sure if he could do it one shot at a time and play defense. It won't be anything like the JMM fight size or not, JMM just can't play to his strengths against a guy like Floyd. Make him come forward and lead, especially against a guy like Floyd, and he's lost.

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Like I said, I'm not sure he'd KO him, but I definitely think he'd win on points. He would avoid 90% of Pac's output, make him miss big where possible and accentuate every mistake whilst setting up eye-catching shots for the judges. And no, Floyd doesn't string together combinations as much as he once did, or as aggressively as Marquez did against Pac, but he has always shown that he is excellent at selecting shots when he wants to, and that can be damaging even when on the defensive - especially against a fighter who you know will come to you all night long. And if Pac is rocked/in trouble I think Mayweather will try to finish him, which he is very good at doing, tbf - we just don't see much of it.

What kills me is everyone is using Jmm Vs Pacquiao and Jmm Vs Mayweather as a measuring stick for how Pac Vs Floyd would go but what I don't see is...

People realizing that JMM is not the fighter he was then, Manny is not the fighter he was then.

JMM took an beating from J Diaz most of their fight a good but certainly not P4P class fighter.

Everyone looks for excuses on why Pacquiao is so good be it his opp was weight drained, past thyeir best they were over rated or my favorite of them all is

I knew he would win but I rooted for the other guy...Then the..

Styles make fights line.

What I don't hear is,

Pacquiao keeps improving so much that he makes world class fighters look like club fighters, Manny and Roach together as a team make Manny so good or Manny has a cool haircut so he is so good!!!!

Just reasons to take away from what he has accomplished.

Now all of a sudden Cotto was over rated, Cotto has the wrong style, Cotto was ruined by Margarito thats why Manny was able to dominate him....

A bunch of shit talking guys who refuse to give credit where credit is due!!!

JMM is a great fighter who is on the slide ( though not washed up by any means)

DLH was weight drained but that was his fault, his size advantage should have been an equalizer and just a yr before he gave PBF all he could handle.

Hatton was without question the best 140 lbr in the world and unbeaten at the weight when Manny destroyed him and Ricky had just come off a one sided beat down of Malinaggi

Cotto is prime, is a huge body puncher (The spot everyone swore he would break Manny down with), Cotto holds wins over the Ring Champ at WW Mosley, Former champ Quintana b(one sided) Beat Clottey in a tough tough fight and even dropped the iron Jawed native of Ghana.

Fact is Manny has beaten all these guys with ease, easier then I have seen Mayweather beat anyone since Gatti!!!!!

Now Pacquiao nut huggers annoy the shit out of me but I'll be damned if I will just agree with any of the bullshit excuses on why Manny is doing so well.

Pacquiao is walking through these guys because he is just that good!!!

Nothing more nothing less and with the amount of money that could be made in a fight Vs Floyd there is a reason why Floyd is not jumping at this like a kid in the candy store.

And it's certainly not because he is a bigger draw then Manny at the moment

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Originally Posted by DaxxKahn

What kills me is everyone is using Jmm Vs Pacquiao and Jmm Vs Mayweather as a measuring stick for how Pac Vs Floyd would go but what I don't see is...

People realizing that JMM is not the fighter he was then, Manny is not the fighter he was then.

JMM took an beating from J Diaz most of their fight a good but certainly not P4P class fighter.

Everyone looks for excuses on why Pacquiao is so good be it his opp was weight drained, past thyeir best they were over rated or my favorite of them all is

I knew he would win but I rooted for the other guy...Then the..

Styles make fights line.

What I don't hear is,

Pacquiao keeps improving so much that he makes world class fighters look like club fighters, Manny and Roach together as a team make Manny so good or Manny has a cool haircut so he is so good!!!!

Just reasons to take away from what he has accomplished.

Now all of a sudden Cotto was over rated, Cotto has the wrong style, Cotto was ruined by Margarito thats why Manny was able to dominate him....

A bunch of shit talking guys who refuse to give credit where credit is due!!!

JMM is a great fighter who is on the slide ( though not washed up by any means)

DLH was weight drained but that was his fault, his size advantage should have been an equalizer and just a yr before he gave PBF all he could handle.

Hatton was without question the best 140 lbr in the world and unbeaten at the weight when Manny destroyed him and Ricky had just come off a one sided beat down of Malinaggi

Cotto is prime, is a huge body puncher (The spot everyone swore he would break Manny down with), Cotto holds wins over the Ring Champ at WW Mosley, Former champ Quintana b(one sided) Beat Clottey in a tough tough fight and even dropped the iron Jawed native of Ghana.

Fact is Manny has beaten all these guys with ease, easier then I have seen Mayweather beat anyone since Gatti!!!!!

Now Pacquiao nut huggers annoy the shit out of me but I'll be damned if I will just agree with any of the bullshit excuses on why Manny is doing so well.

Pacquiao is walking through these guys because he is just that good!!!

Nothing more nothing less and with the amount of money that could be made in a fight Vs Floyd there is a reason why Floyd is not jumping at this like a kid in the candy store.

And it's certainly not because he is a bigger draw then Manny at the moment

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Roach said Hatton was washed up and one dimensional. Roach said Oscar was past it and would fade. Roach said Cotto isn't the same fighter as he was before the Tony fight. It seems to me Roach was smart enough to pick the right fighters for Manny at this point. Props for Manny for handling his business...but Mayweather is a huge step up in quality. Different fighters win in different ways. Pac's wins seem more impressive because he is an offensive/all action fighter. Floyd doesn't have to knock his opponents out. He technically dismantles them. I am not saying any of this as a fan or hater of either fighter. Just saying...as impressive as Pac has been...for me...the BEST fighter he has faced to this point of his career is Marquez. And those where two pick em fights. You could say Manny could beat Marquez easier now...but we really don't know unless they fight again. The Floyd vs. Pac fight will truly determine who is the pfp champ. And that is a fight that is going to happen because the market demands it!! Not because Roach thinks it will suit Pac's strengths.

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Originally Posted by zhubin

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DaxxKahn

What kills me is everyone is using Jmm Vs Pacquiao and Jmm Vs Mayweather as a measuring stick for how Pac Vs Floyd would go but what I don't see is...

People realizing that JMM is not the fighter he was then, Manny is not the fighter he was then.

JMM took an beating from J Diaz most of their fight a good but certainly not P4P class fighter.

Everyone looks for excuses on why Pacquiao is so good be it his opp was weight drained, past thyeir best they were over rated or my favorite of them all is

I knew he would win but I rooted for the other guy...Then the..

Styles make fights line.

What I don't hear is,

Pacquiao keeps improving so much that he makes world class fighters look like club fighters, Manny and Roach together as a team make Manny so good or Manny has a cool haircut so he is so good!!!!

Just reasons to take away from what he has accomplished.

Now all of a sudden Cotto was over rated, Cotto has the wrong style, Cotto was ruined by Margarito thats why Manny was able to dominate him....

A bunch of shit talking guys who refuse to give credit where credit is due!!!

JMM is a great fighter who is on the slide ( though not washed up by any means)

DLH was weight drained but that was his fault, his size advantage should have been an equalizer and just a yr before he gave PBF all he could handle.

Hatton was without question the best 140 lbr in the world and unbeaten at the weight when Manny destroyed him and Ricky had just come off a one sided beat down of Malinaggi

Cotto is prime, is a huge body puncher (The spot everyone swore he would break Manny down with), Cotto holds wins over the Ring Champ at WW Mosley, Former champ Quintana b(one sided) Beat Clottey in a tough tough fight and even dropped the iron Jawed native of Ghana.

Fact is Manny has beaten all these guys with ease, easier then I have seen Mayweather beat anyone since Gatti!!!!!

Now Pacquiao nut huggers annoy the shit out of me but I'll be damned if I will just agree with any of the bullshit excuses on why Manny is doing so well.

Pacquiao is walking through these guys because he is just that good!!!

Nothing more nothing less and with the amount of money that could be made in a fight Vs Floyd there is a reason why Floyd is not jumping at this like a kid in the candy store.

And it's certainly not because he is a bigger draw then Manny at the moment

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Roach said Hatton was washed up and one dimensional. Roach said Oscar was past it and would fade. Roach said Cotto isn't the same fighter as he was before the Tony fight. It seems to me Roach was smart enough to pick the right fighters for Manny at this point. Props for Manny for handling his business...but Mayweather is a huge step up in quality. Different fighters win in different ways. Pac's wins seem more impressive because he is an offensive/all action fighter. Floyd doesn't have to knock his opponents out. He technically dismantles them. I am not saying any of this as a fan or hater of either fighter. Just saying...as impressive as Pac has been...for me...the BEST fighter he has faced to this point of his career is Marquez. And those where two pick em fights. You could say Manny could beat Marquez easier now...but we really don't know unless they fight again. The Floyd vs. Pac fight will truly determine who is the pfp champ. And that is a fight that is going to happen because the market demands it!! Not because Roach thinks it will suit Pac's strengths.

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Good points and well backed up statements, I give credit for not just using any random excuse for your not thinking Manny is a good as it seems.,

The statements of Roach have even been said about Floyd, though not the downslide or not the same fighter as he once was part but he has stated Floyd was over rated.

My comments were more or less based on the faqct that until Manny is proven other then what he is maybe people (No one in particular because I have heard writers at other fights in the press room use stupid reasoning as well) should just give him credit.

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Originally Posted by zhubin

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I am not saying Floyd will definitely win...but for people to think that this will play out like Pac's recent performances...highly doubtful.

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Well then I'll say it for you.

Mayweather will beat Manny.

Definitely. Barring puncher's luck, which is always the wild card when folks are hitting each other, Floyd should be expected to win by most anyone, particularly by boxing fans. Like yous.

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Originally Posted by Majesty

Boxing is about styles and where people are mentally. Hence why I picked Pacquiao to decimate Cotto.

But Pacquiao would get decimated by Mayweather.

Compared to Marquez, Mayweather is a better counter puncher, has better timing, is faster, is bigger, and hits harder. I think Mayweather would decimate Pacquiao. But the only thing people will say is that Mayweather doesn't look good vs southpaws. But i doubt that would make much of a difference since Pacquiao squares up.

But Mayweather is too good for Pacquiao because of how he locks down with his style, he would shut Pacquiao down. Arum knows that too. Unless Mayweather gets there first Pacquiao will be fighting Mosley or Berto.

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Yes, styles do make fights, but here's the thing you are forgetting. Just because fighter A loses to fighter B and fighter B loses to fighter C doesn't mean fighter A will lose to fighter C. Case in point. Ali lost to Frazier, Frazier lost to Foreman, therefore it was widely predicted Ali would lose to Foreman, we all know what happened. Or how about the recent welterweight matches? Mosely loses to Cotto, Cotto loses to Margarito, therefore Mosely would lose to Margarito right? It didn't happen that way.

roach seems to be picking the right opponents for pac. roach said he wanted pbf next, if there is anyone who knows pacs ability its roach. if roach thinks pac can handle pbf then i guess he can.

we cannot compare pacs performances with jmm morales hoya anymore. we all saw that pac is getting better he is not the same pac who fought before. in pacs next fight i will expect the same pac that demolished cotto plus a whole lot more.

pac also showed us that he can take a punch on the body and head. mind you he got tagged by punches that he didnt even see.

the thing with pbf is that he is hard to hit! add that with his ability to pick punches. can pbf damage pac with his punches? maybe can pac open up pbf's defence with his quick gazillion angled punches? pac i think is smart enough not to get over excited or frustrated with pbf's style. does pbf experienced offence same as pac? did he do well?

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Originally Posted by generalbulldog

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Originally Posted by Majesty

Boxing is about styles and where people are mentally. Hence why I picked Pacquiao to decimate Cotto.

But Pacquiao would get decimated by Mayweather.

Compared to Marquez, Mayweather is a better counter puncher, has better timing, is faster, is bigger, and hits harder. I think Mayweather would decimate Pacquiao. But the only thing people will say is that Mayweather doesn't look good vs southpaws. But i doubt that would make much of a difference since Pacquiao squares up.

But Mayweather is too good for Pacquiao because of how he locks down with his style, he would shut Pacquiao down. Arum knows that too. Unless Mayweather gets there first Pacquiao will be fighting Mosley or Berto.

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Yes, styles do make fights, but here's the thing you are forgetting. Just because fighter A loses to fighter B and fighter B loses to fighter C doesn't mean fighter A will lose to fighter C. Case in point. Ali lost to Frazier, Frazier lost to Foreman, therefore it was widely predicted Ali would lose to Foreman, we all know what happened. Or how about the recent welterweight matches? Mosely loses to Cotto, Cotto loses to Margarito, therefore Mosely would lose to Margarito right? It didn't happen that way.

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And Ali also beat Frazier twice after losing to him the first time, and Margacheato used plaster of paris to beat Cotto [Oh c'mon, we all know it, please don't argue the toss :rolleyes:]. And you've kind of missed the point, anyway, since he wasn't just saying that because 'fighter A loses to fighter B and fighter B loses to fighter C doesn't mean fighter A will lose to fighter C', he was saying that Marquez is a less lethal version of Mayweather, who gave Pac fits - and he's right. It's a fact, not an opinion based on who beat who [since Marquez never officially beat Pac, anyway, which makes your point/example null and void].

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Originally Posted by mnmc10

roach seems to be picking the right opponents for pac. roach said he wanted pbf next, if there is anyone who knows pacs ability its roach. if roach thinks pac can handle pbf then i guess he can.

we cannot compare pacs performances with jmm morales hoya anymore. we all saw that pac is getting better he is not the same pac who fought before. in pacs next fight i will expect the same pac that demolished cotto plus a whole lot more.

pac also showed us that he can take a punch on the body and head. mind you he got tagged by punches that he didnt even see.

the thing with pbf is that he is hard to hit! add that with his ability to pick punches. can pbf damage pac with his punches? maybe can pac open up pbf's defence with his quick gazillion angled punches? pac i think is smart enough not to get over excited or frustrated with pbf's style. does pbf experienced offence same as pac? did he do well?

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Roach wants Floyd next because that will be his and his fighters biggest payday. I am not saying he doesn't have confidence in Manny against Floyd...but Roach knows deep down how difficult it is to beat Mayweather. It will also be a challenge for Floyd...because Floyd hasn't faced such a tremendous athlete at the top of his game before.

I like Pacquiao but after I saw PBF dismantling Marquez, I had doubts that Manny will have the tools to win against PBF. However, after the Cotto fight and what was said about PBF's power (or the lack of it), there seems to be a silver lining for Manny against his fight with PBF. Consider this:

1. I finally realized Manny's strength is his being so unorthodox. PBF is sweet science personified. What Manny does goes against every grain of what a boxer should do in the ring. He hits opponents and his feet are not properly planted. There was an article I read where they say Manny hits while suspended in air (?!?). His punches comes from really weird angles. I do not agree with Floyds' statement that Manny is one dimensional. Floyd is the complete package-multi dimensional, but Manny is a package coming from another dimension. The question is: how will Floyd prepapre for a fight against Manny? There is no boxer out there who does it like Pacquiao. Floyd was so good against JMM because he was fighting his shadow. Easy to prepare against. But with Manny, I am beggining to doubt if they will find a sparring partner that fights like Manny. Therefore, Floyd has to depend on his talent (and there is a lot of that) to adjust during the fight.

2. According to Roach and Castillo, Manny hits a lot harder than PBF. Therefore, PBF will only be able to win this bout by unanimous decision. A knockout win is possible but improbable. If Cotto could not put Manny down, it will be very doubtful that Floyd will have the power to put Manny away. Mind you, if Roach will be able to solve the shoulder roll of PBF, PBF will be in trouble (hire Pernel as a consultant perhaps?). Yes, PBF will hit Manny accurately a number of times, but if he is tagged with a big one, what would happen next? PBF will be wary of Manny's power. Manny will come in knowing he will not be that hurt if he gets tagged by PBF. He will not be scared to engage. A recipe for success or disaster?

My prediction? Who cares. I am definitely not an expert like some here in this forum. I just want this fight to happen and see who is the king of the hill.

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Originally Posted by NuthaPug

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Originally Posted by zhubin

<snip />
I am not saying Floyd will definitely win...but for people to think that this will play out like Pac's recent performances...highly doubtful.

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Well then I'll say it for you.

Mayweather will beat Manny.

Definitely. Barring puncher's luck, which is always the wild card when folks are hitting each other, Floyd should be expected to win by most anyone, particularly by boxing fans. Like yous.

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What the??!!! Barring punchers luck??!!! uLOL!!! hahahhahahaha

Pac-Gayweather would be an ugly fight. After having witnessed Pac's power and speed in destroying Cotto, Gayweather will refuse to engage but just hug and run away all night, pecking his way to an excruciatingly boring close but unanimous decision win.

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Originally Posted by miron_lang

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Originally Posted by NuthaPug

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Originally Posted by zhubin

<snip />
I am not saying Floyd will definitely win...but for people to think that this will play out like Pac's recent performances...highly doubtful.

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Well then I'll say it for you.

Mayweather will beat Manny.

Definitely. Barring puncher's luck, which is always the wild card when folks are hitting each other, Floyd should be expected to win by most anyone, particularly by boxing fans. Like yous.

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What the??!!! Barring punchers luck??!!! uLOL!!! hahahhahahaha

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Yeah, well, who was it in another thread who wrote "One shot. And the complexion of the game can turn in pac's favor." Oh, yeah, it was you.

That's basically what I meant, too. Not to dis Manny. He's great, no doubt. I didn't mean to say he is "just a puncher" exactly.

But what I said still stands; Floyd should be expected to win, and if he doesn't, it is more likely to be that "one punch" that changes the game and less likely to be that Manny dominated over the course of the fight.

Totally reasonable. Feel free to be reasonable, too.

ok people are saying manny is such a much more improved fighter now and isnt the same guy who fought marquez thw second time. isnt this the same stuff said before the rematch? how is manny a better fighter now then he was then? like i said he didmt change, his opponents did. we cant say he's a different fighter then he was against marquez because no one he has faced since has fought a disciplined counter punching match against pacquiao so how do we think he somehow has found the answer when he hasnt fought anything close to that style since?