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Before he fought Cotto he was number 1 in light Welterweights and in Welterweights it was
1.Mosley
2.Mayweather
3.Cotto
And now Pac is number 1 is it me or is the world just so far up Pacquiao's ARSE!! granted he is P4P#1 but i think he should have just slipped in to Cotto's number 3 spot.
Maybe not P4P but at Welterweight you can't put him above Mayweather or Mosley...
I don't even class the Cotto/Pac fight as a proper WW fight. It was at a catchweight and I don't think any belts should have been on the line either.
Mosley is still number 1 as far as I'm concerned. I have no idea where Mayweather comes in at having last fought a LW and a JWW before that. Maybe Mosley, then Pac and only then Mayweather.
Only right if you ask me
The 2 fights he has had at the weight have been nothing short of remarkable, cotto beat mosley, pac beat cotto
Floyd took a close decision to beat ODLH, pac battered him in 8rounds!
1.Pacquiao
2.Mayweather
3.Mosley
cotto beat mosely, and then Pac-May destroyed Cotto. I have no problem ranking him above Mosely.
Come on, if you are going to use an example, pick another one. Even Roach said that prefight he could see needle tracks in De La Hoya's arms and knew it would be an easy night. The guy was weight drained beyond belief for that fight, something he was not for Mayweather.Quote:
Originally Posted by hattonthehammer
It's close.
Now, a p4p list would look very different. But, I don't see how you rank Floyd above Pacquiao or Mosley and probably Cotto at welterweight at least if the list is based on achievements in the weight class because Floyd hasn't done anything at welterweight...ever really. I could see him above Cotto because of Cotto's recent losses, but even that's close call.
- Mosley: he retains the #1 spot. He lost a razor thin decision to Cotto but then demolished a Margarito who had beat Cotto.
- Pacquiao: beat Cotto who was consensus #2
- Cotto/Floyd: has beat more top opposition at welterweight/jr. welterweight than any of the top guys: Clottey, Shane, Quintana, Judah, Malinaggi, Bailey etc.
- Floyd/Cotto: has not fought one consensus top ten welterweight in five years. Biggest win at welterweight was probably over Baldomir or Marquez who is a lightweight.
Also, unless I'm mistaken, isn't any fight above 140 but below 147 considered a welterweight fight?
Floyd fought ODLH at Light Middle, what does that have to do with the Welterweight rankings?Quote:
Originally Posted by hattonthehammer
Pac beat a weight drained Oscar who wasn't even in the Welterweight top 10 and Floyd beat a big 154lbs WBC champ Oscar who was number 1 at the time in that division. Yes Pac beat Cotto who beat Mosley but Mosley destroyed Margarito who had Destroyed Cotto and Cintron and Pacquiao's fight was at 145lbs not at the 147lbs Welterweight limit.Quote:
Originally Posted by hattonthehammer
Quote:
Originally Posted by TysonbrunoPac beat a weight drained Oscar who wasn't even in the Welterweight top 10 and Floyd beat a big 154lbs WBC champ Oscar who was number 1 at the time in that division. Yes Pac beat Cotto who beat Mosley but Mosley destroyed Margarito who had Destroyed Cotto and Cintron and Pacquiao's fight was at 145lbs not at the 147lbs Welterweight limit.Quote:
Originally Posted by hattonthehammer
Oscars prime weight was always welter, the quartey, whittaker and carr fights proved that years ago surely?
And didnt oscar come in at like 149 when he fought floyd? hardly a massive light middle was he
No ODLH weighed in at the limit of 154 and rehydrated to well over 160 for the PBF fight. When ODLH fought PAC he weighed in at 145 and with the help of an IV rehydrated to 147. Prime at welter you say? ODLH hadn't fought at welter in over 8 years when he stepped into the ring against PAC.Quote:
Originally Posted by hattonthehammerQuote:
Originally Posted by TysonbrunoPac beat a weight drained Oscar who wasn't even in the Welterweight top 10 and Floyd beat a big 154lbs WBC champ Oscar who was number 1 at the time in that division. Yes Pac beat Cotto who beat Mosley but Mosley destroyed Margarito who had Destroyed Cotto and Cintron and Pacquiao's fight was at 145lbs not at the 147lbs Welterweight limit.Quote:
Originally Posted by hattonthehammer
Oscars prime weight was always welter, the quartey, whittaker and carr fights proved that years ago surely?
And didnt oscar come in at like 149 when he fought floyd? hardly a massive light middle was he
Quote:
Originally Posted by killersheepNo ODLH weighed in at the limit of 154 and rehydrated to well over 160 for the PBF fight. When ODLH fought PAC he weighed in at 145 and with the help of an IV rehydrated to 147. Prime at welter you say? ODLH hadn't fought at welter in over 8 years when he stepped into the ring against PAC.Quote:
Originally Posted by hattonthehammerQuote:
Originally Posted by Tysonbruno
Oscars prime weight was always welter, the quartey, whittaker and carr fights proved that years ago surely?
And didnt oscar come in at like 149 when he fought floyd? hardly a massive light middle was he
And lets not forget manny pac hadnt even been in at 140 when he flew up through the weights to fight oscar.
floyd jumped up 7pounds to fight a guy of similar stature. Manny Pac gained 17pounds in just over 9months to fight a guy who had made his millions at said weight!
No Oscar weighed 154lbs for Floyd Floyd weighed 150lbs Oscar had not fought at Welterweight since march 2001 against GattiQuote:
Originally Posted by hattonthehammerQuote:
Originally Posted by TysonbrunoPac beat a weight drained Oscar who wasn't even in the Welterweight top 10 and Floyd beat a big 154lbs WBC champ Oscar who was number 1 at the time in that division. Yes Pac beat Cotto who beat Mosley but Mosley destroyed Margarito who had Destroyed Cotto and Cintron and Pacquiao's fight was at 145lbs not at the 147lbs Welterweight limit.Quote:
Originally Posted by hattonthehammer
Oscars prime weight was always welter, the quartey, whittaker and carr fights proved that years ago surely?
And didnt oscar come in at like 149 when he fought floyd? hardly a massive light middle was he
I place very little value on PAC's win over ODLH, because ODLH was a dehydrated broken man coming into that fight.Quote:
Originally Posted by hattonthehammerQuote:
Originally Posted by killersheepNo ODLH weighed in at the limit of 154 and rehydrated to well over 160 for the PBF fight. When ODLH fought PAC he weighed in at 145 and with the help of an IV rehydrated to 147. Prime at welter you say? ODLH hadn't fought at welter in over 8 years when he stepped into the ring against PAC.Quote:
Originally Posted by hattonthehammer
And lets not forget manny pac hadnt even been in at 140 when he flew up through the weights to fight oscar.
floyd jumped up 7pounds to fight a guy of similar stature. Manny Pac gained 17pounds in just over 9months to fight a guy who had made his millions at said weight!
I give PAC huge credit for his wins over Cotto and Hatton though.
I agreeQuote:
Originally Posted by killersheepI place very little value on PAC's win over ODLH, because ODLH was a dehydrated broken man coming into that fight.Quote:
Originally Posted by hattonthehammerQuote:
Originally Posted by killersheep
And lets not forget manny pac hadnt even been in at 140 when he flew up through the weights to fight oscar.
floyd jumped up 7pounds to fight a guy of similar stature. Manny Pac gained 17pounds in just over 9months to fight a guy who had made his millions at said weight!
I give PAC huge credit for his wins over Cotto and Hatton though.
Just find this theory that pacs blowout of oscar in 8 wasnt as impressive as floyds 115-113 decision??
You can only beat whats put in front of you after all
I think Floyd won easier than the score say to be honest but i give Pac full credit for his win against CottoQuote:
Originally Posted by hattonthehammerI agreeQuote:
Originally Posted by killersheepI place very little value on PAC's win over ODLH, because ODLH was a dehydrated broken man coming into that fight.Quote:
Originally Posted by hattonthehammer
I give PAC huge credit for his wins over Cotto and Hatton though.
Just find this theory that pacs blowout of oscar in 8 wasnt as impressive as floyds 115-113 decision??
You can only beat whats put in front of you after all
This isn't a p4p list, it's a welterweight list, which means what you achieve at welterweight decides where you place. Floyd has only fought Marquez, Baldomir, and Gotti at welterweight (right?)? Cotto is a better win than all of those by a sizable margin.
Pacquiao should number 2 at WW.
Mosley beat the man at 147 in Margarito who beat Cotto before Pacquiao did.
Mosley should be number 1.
Hard to say really if anything Floyd actully beat the last Ring champion at 147 Baldomir, since then there hasnt been a clear number 1, at the moment its all opinions.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pugilistic
This is also the Ring's Welterweight list and Baldomir for all his faults was their champ when Mayweather beat him and you left off Judah. Cotto was not.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rantcatrat
Shane is the best Welter at the moment. Floyd retired and Cotto lost to Marg, who Shane beat, so is the current holder.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tysonbruno
Agree totally mate, one fight doesn't mean he has cleaned up a division. It's a shame coz it's not him that's causing all the hype, he seems a nice humble bloke from what you can tell, but his shit gets your back up.
I completely agree:Quote:
Originally Posted by Rantcatrat
1. Mosley
2. Pacquiao
3. Cotto
4. PBF
5. Berto/Clottey
i kind of see what you are saying but WW isn't 147 though, 147 is the limit, the WW division is 140.1 - 147lbs... there are fighters who come in under 140, judah usualy comes in around 145, floyd often has too...Quote:
Originally Posted by miles
its the same for every weight class, the number is the Limit for that weight, so it is right really.. (i don't agree on these contracted weights much, but a lot of other fighters have done.
anyhow how cares, in his next fight Floyd will have shut him and arum up once and for all.
Floyd retired though.Quote:
Originally Posted by killersheepThis is also the Ring's Welterweight list and Baldomir for all his faults was their champ when Mayweather beat him and you left off Judah. Cotto was not.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rantcatrat
Cotto was then regarded as the man at 147, Margarito beat him and was then regarded as the man then Mosley beat him.
I think its absolute bullshit because the only guy he fought and beat at Welterweight was Oscar.
The Cotto fight was an amazing win, but it wasn't at welterweight. If you want to fight at a catch weight, I don't see how that fight should count at any weight class. It did wonders for his p4p rankings, but how can it move him up at WW if the fight was not at WW?
147 is the WW limit. It means 141-147 is welterweight range. Pac-Cotto fight was a legit WW bout.Quote:
Originally Posted by Beanflicker
The Ring magazine has strongly been a Pac groupie so I don't take much offense to their opinion. Pac fought one welterweight in his career. Its not reasonable to have a guy beat one welterweight, not to mention at a catchweight, who was not even number 1 and then give him the number 1 spot. So basically 2 guys, not named Mosley, fight at a catchweight and Mosley's number 1 spot is on the line. Laughable:rotflmao:But I'm not going to get on Pac. His groupie's aren't his responsibility.
For me this is quite obvious that the RING magazine are trying to hype up and get this fight between Mayweather and Manny properly sorted out straight away.It'll piss off Mayweather and rub salt into his wounds and make him sign the contract a.s.a.p,its a ploy and guess what it'll work.Weather you like Manny as a person or not thats your own opinion,but as a boxing fan you have to respect the guy 100%,just imagine if Manny was'nt doing what he's been doing,boxing would be pretty boring.There's a old saying that goes,"If you've got it flaunt it!!"Manny has it soo why should'nt he flaunt it,after all he deserve it i reckon.He's been the most active fighter over the last 2years!!;)
Quote:
Originally Posted by blegit
The RING magazine is now a PAC groupie?;D;D;D Including DLH?:rolleyes:
I don't know why you're claiming to be a pacfan now but certainly you have been affected by this bandwagon sickness.
I have been here for years but I can't remember you being one of us. :-X
Sorry but I have to correct how you present yourself here.
Officially, we haven't accepted you as one of us.;D;D;D
There's a procedure before you are accepted into the Saddo Pacgroupies. LOL;D;D;D
We have just inducted Master as a new pacfan here I can't remember inducting you as one of our members. LOL.
btw, Saddo is an ex-officio member of the pactards. hehehe. If he wants, I can promote him to ex-officio chairman of the pactards.;D;D;D
Quote:
Originally Posted by brucelee
He's the only one i remember who pick Pac againts Barrera 6 yrs ago. :D
during those days if you come in here posting things about how pac has any kind of chance againts barrera then you dont know anything about boxing.
But saddo was there for pac :D
very true. Actually I was even thinking that he has some alt here and that alt is a known Pac nuthugger. LOL;DQuote:
Originally Posted by miron_langQuote:
Originally Posted by brucelee
He's the only one i remember who pick Pac againts Barrera 6 yrs ago. :D
during those days if you come in here posting things about how pac has any kind of chance againts barrera then you dont know anything about boxing.
But saddo was there for pac :D
btw, I was here during that time bro. it was considered sacrilegious to even think of pacquaio having a chance against barrera.
Pac is one dimensional(and an unknown during that time) and Barrera is just simply the best there is in featherweight. Barrera is slick and fast and simply unbeatable and Manny is way below Barrera's league. Many even considered Barrera here as the pound for pound #1 during that time.
So just like the old days, many believe that Mayweather is unbeatable and simply too slick and fast for Pacquaio.
So I will rest my case by predicting that Mayweather will go down before the 7th round if he exchanges against Pac.:cool:
Quote:
Originally Posted by miron_langQuote:
Originally Posted by brucelee
He's the only one i remember who pick Pac againts Barrera 6 yrs ago. :D
during those days if you come in here posting things about how pac has any kind of chance againts barrera then you dont know anything about boxing.
But saddo was there for pac :D
Yup I remember those days when they said things like" PAC is just another junior jones and will just end up as a gate keeper"
Saddo on the other hand kept it UNbiased and usually gives credit to Manny, thanks Saddo!!!;)
Hey Pareng Miron Lang imagine how time flies our account here is almost 7 years old!!!
Yeah, how time flies.! My account though is only 2 years old. I lost my original account. LOL. I was already here in 2003 or 2004. Forgot the date.:eek:Quote:
Originally Posted by PavlikQuote:
Originally Posted by miron_langQuote:
Originally Posted by brucelee
He's the only one i remember who pick Pac againts Barrera 6 yrs ago. :D
during those days if you come in here posting things about how pac has any kind of chance againts barrera then you dont know anything about boxing.
But saddo was there for pac :D
Yup I remember those days when they said things like" PAC is just another junior jones and will just end up as a gate keeper"
Saddo on the other hand kept it UNbiased and usually gives credit to Manny, thanks Saddo!!!;)
Hey Pareng Miron Lang imagine how time flies our account here is almost 7 years old!!!
Anyway, it does not matter as long as I can still remember the good old days in Saddo. ;D;D;D
by just reading the thread title. Its fucki_n incredibly UNBELIEVABLE!!
I mean. Never in my wildest imagination as a pacnut i ever visualize what Pac did to DLH and Cotto. ( I always thought that he can KTFO Hatton )
to be able to get back to my senses i need to state some of pacquiao's shortcomings
- He got Kayoed by Rustico Torrecampo and Medgeon SIngsurat
- He got Floored by Yasmangbetov and Nedal Hussein
- He didnt beat Agapito Sanchez
- He didnt beat Juan Manuel Marquez in their 1st fight
- Erik 15-13'd him
- He's W over JMM was razor thin. The 3rd judge had it 6 rounds a piece
- He didnt take on some challenges in Humberto Sotto, Joan Guzman, Edwin Valero, Jorge Barrios, Joel Cassamayor, Nate Campbell, Juan Diaz and Zahir Fuc_king Raheem
;D
I agree but i don't think he won 2nd Marquez fight either ;) He is a good fighter but i don't believe he is number 1 at Welterweight till he has beaten number 1 at Welterweight and that is Shane Mosley.Quote:
Originally Posted by miron_lang