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Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
Eddie Hearn rules out US venue for Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch, Ruiz Jr rules out UK
An announcement regarding where the Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch will take place is expected imminently.
However, it still seems as if there’s plenty of dispute over the location of the crucial clash.
Following Ruiz’s stunning upset win over Joshua at MSG in June, the Brit activated his rematch clause and has the right to decide the venue.
This hasn’t stopped the new champion from dragging his heels though, as promoter Eddie Hearn has now admitted.
Hearn told Sky: “They don’t want to come to the UK, they never have done.
“I think they used the Dillian Whyte saga as a little bit of a scapegoat in that decision as well, and we have to take that into consideration.
https://talksport.com/wp-content/upl...60&quality=100
“Contractually we know our position, but we want to make sure we get the fight done. We want to respect Andy Ruiz, but we’ll decide where the venue is.
“A neutral venue, he would be a lot happier with. I think I can rule out America, right now. Cardiff is still the frontrunner, it’s still the favourite.
“There are some other interesting options that would be quite iconic internationally.
“I keep saying this, but in the next 48 hours Andy Ruiz’s team will be alerted to where this fight will take place.”
https://talksport.com/wp-content/upl...60&quality=100
Hearn initially stated that November 29 back at MSG in New York or December 14 at the Principality Stadium in Cardiff were the two options for Ruiz vs Joshua II.
Now, it seems a neutral venue may come into play, with AJ’s side ruling out America and Ruiz adamant he won’t be coming to the UK.
When asked if he was worried about travelling to Joshua’s home country in the midst of the Whyte situation, Ruiz replied to Joe Rogan: “Somewhat, but it’s not gonna be over there.
“Nope, it’s not.”
https://talksport.com/sport/boxing/5...oshua-rematch/
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
Hearn is such a cunt. Since when does the challenger decide where the champion defends his crown?
It was probably in the rematch clause, to be fair But Hearn is still such a cunt.
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
Few fighters are willing to be a road warrior, I guess.
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
Hearn is whistling past the graveyard with location nonsense and bickering while the career of AJ teeters on edge. Do well to focus more on Joshua not being hit with the same punch over and over.
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
Hearn seems like he may be alright if you didnt have to do business with him, but a cunt indeed. Also, the Whyte situation seems less like a scapegoat and more of a very legitimate cause for concern, especially when there is very real reason to doubt AJ is a clean fighter all along. I think the fight does big numbers almost anywhere, if AJ wanted to really make a statement, returning to the place he was beaten would obviously be the best way. There was zero controversy surrounding the first fight, so whats the problem.
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
Do you guys realise how big AJ's team of managers, advisers, lawyers and representatives are? His public reps, Rob McCracken (trainer) and Sky Sports have all been public that the rematch must take place in the UK. Adam Smith (SKY head of boxing) just last week said the rematch has to be primetime UK, as they took a big hit with the middle of the night palaver last time.
I feel dirty defending a promoter but do you honestly think Hearn is creating venue problems for himself? :D
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
The problem with all that is, he got his ass kicked. It shouldnt really matter how big his team is, as they arent in a position to be demanding home court. Likewise with sky taking a hit last time, so what? The americans dont want to watch a fight at 1 in the afternoon either, and Ruiz likely has a lot of new fans/buyers.
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
Quote:
Originally Posted by
p4pking
The problem with all that is, he got his ass kicked. It shouldnt really matter how big his team is, as they arent in a position to be demanding home court. Likewise with sky taking a hit last time, so what? The americans dont want to watch a fight at 1 in the afternoon either, and Ruiz likely has a lot of new fans/buyers.
This.
Although with the impasse over AJ not wanting it in the States and Ruiz not wanting it in the UK..... one has to wonder whether it will happen at all.
I would think it would be in AJ's best interests to give in before it doesn't happen at all.
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
Do you guys realise how big AJ's team of managers, advisers, lawyers and representatives are? His public reps, Rob McCracken (trainer) and Sky Sports have all been public that the rematch must take place in the UK. Adam Smith (SKY head of boxing) just last week said the rematch has to be primetime UK, as they took a big hit with the middle of the night palaver last time.
I feel dirty defending a promoter but do you honestly think Hearn is creating venue problems for himself? :D
Well, wins and losses have consequences yeh. Lawyers and the gaggle, networks will all still be making plenty of money when Joshua is being respectively compared to either Bruno or Lewis as a trivia question.
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
Do you guys realise how big AJ's team of managers, advisers, lawyers and representatives are? His public reps, Rob McCracken (trainer) and Sky Sports have all been public that the rematch must take place in the UK. Adam Smith (SKY head of boxing) just last week said the rematch has to be primetime UK, as they took a big hit with the middle of the night palaver last time.
I feel dirty defending a promoter but do you honestly think Hearn is creating venue problems for himself? :D
Fenster, you're a good guy, but this is what is wrong with boxing today and why it has become a largely minority sport 🙁
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
Pretty sure ruiz will have already signed something that doesn't give him much of a choice where the rematch is... But if he wants to go go fully anti contract hardball, good for him, makes it funny for everyone watching.
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
Still no announcement then. I think any heavyweight champ who managed to lose away from home in an upset is going to try and get the rematch in his own country. You can't fault the Joshua side for that at all. And if it's in the contract then that's that. But how are they going to enforce the contract if Ruiz doesn't play? I'd love to see the relevant clauses.
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
Quote:
Originally Posted by
p4pking
The problem with all that is, he got his ass kicked. It shouldnt really matter how big his team is, as they arent in a position to be demanding home court. Likewise with sky taking a hit last time, so what? The americans dont want to watch a fight at 1 in the afternoon either, and Ruiz likely has a lot of new fans/buyers.
Just explaining the reality.
Ruiz signed a contract for the rematch but is now using his new found clout (rightfully?). Hence asking for $50 million to come to England (not a literal number, bit of fun for the press, however, he was obviously demanding a big raise to whatever he originally agreed and changed his mind about travelling).
AJ, his million man management team and TV company are adamant the fight takes place in the UK (SKY have an exclusive deal with Hearn/AJ, they publicly criticised Hearn for not delivering AJ's Wembley date in April and then taking him to New York, which ruined their summer blockbuster PPV).
Everyone blames Hearn, naturally, as he's the front man (cunt). But he has a contract broken by Ruiz (team) and all sorts of new demands from AJ (team).
Sometimes fans forget the fighter is actually in charge, that's all.
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
Quote:
Originally Posted by
X
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
Do you guys realise how big AJ's team of managers, advisers, lawyers and representatives are? His public reps, Rob McCracken (trainer) and Sky Sports have all been public that the rematch must take place in the UK. Adam Smith (SKY head of boxing) just last week said the rematch has to be primetime UK, as they took a big hit with the middle of the night palaver last time.
I feel dirty defending a promoter but do you honestly think Hearn is creating venue problems for himself? :D
Fenster, you're a good guy, but this is what is wrong with boxing today and why it has become a largely minority sport 🙁
Just explaining the reality. A minority sport worth billions.
As Don King said many years ago - "In boxing, you don't get what you deserve, you get what you negotiate" :)
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
Quote:
Originally Posted by
palmerq
Pretty sure ruiz will have already signed something that doesn't give him much of a choice where the rematch is... But if he wants to go go fully anti contract hardball, good for him, makes it funny for everyone watching.
I am sure Ruiz is playing hard ball and has no legal leg to stand on when he signed the contract for the rematch.
If he is going “fully anti contract hardball” then he will want the fight in USA. I do not blame him as history has shown he will not win a decision over here and have a favourable ref.
If Ruiz does decide to fight in the UK he will be expected to be compensated adequately for fighting AJ in UK. Where that additional money is coming from is probably where the impasse is currently, is it coming from Eddie/Sky/AJ.
The worst case could be Ruiz not having the rematch, being stripped of his title and becoming another people’s champion.
Yes, it does make it funny for everyone watching
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
Do you guys realise Ruiz is "promoted" (advised) by Al Haymon? Look him up if you've never heard of him, the most "powerful" man in boxing.
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
palmerq
Pretty sure ruiz will have already signed something that doesn't give him much of a choice where the rematch is... But if he wants to go go fully anti contract hardball, good for him, makes it funny for everyone watching.
I do not blame him as history has shown he will not win a decision over here and have a favourable ref.
What history proves Ruiz can't win a decision in Britain?
And the fact he can't have a "favourable ref" in the UK is a good thing, right? Nobody should have a "favourable" ref.
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
palmerq
Pretty sure ruiz will have already signed something that doesn't give him much of a choice where the rematch is... But if he wants to go go fully anti contract hardball, good for him, makes it funny for everyone watching.
I do not blame him as history has shown he will not win a decision over here and have a favourable ref.
What history proves Ruiz can't win a decision in Britain?
And the fact he can't have a "favourable ref" in the UK is a good thing, right? Nobody should have a "favourable" ref.
You said yourself AJ is worth millions so things are going to work in his favour.
Why else is Ruiz insisting he has the fight in USA?
I thought Wlad was winning against AJ before the stoppage but I believe AJ was in front by the judges. The ref prematurely stopped the fight against Takam protecting AJ’s knockout record.
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
If I was Ruiz I would demand fucking everything to make sure I was financially secure for life - and the next generation.
If he loses the rematch (for the record , at present, I don't believe he will) he's not going to be getting a rematch or another big pay day any time soon and will have to build up again - these guys who get labelled one time wonders have a habit of disappearing.....
How long have they got to sort this rematch it's doing everyone's head in.
I think it's fair to have it in the UK and will be in the contract. But as for the pay day fuck yes Ruiz should milk it.
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
palmerq
Pretty sure ruiz will have already signed something that doesn't give him much of a choice where the rematch is... But if he wants to go go fully anti contract hardball, good for him, makes it funny for everyone watching.
I do not blame him as history has shown he will not win a decision over here and have a favourable ref.
What history proves Ruiz can't win a decision in Britain?
And the fact he can't have a "favourable ref" in the UK is a good thing, right? Nobody should have a "favourable" ref.
You said yourself AJ is worth millions so things are going to work in his favour.
Why else is Ruiz insisting he has the fight in USA?
I thought Wlad was winning against AJ before the stoppage but I believe AJ was in front by the judges. The ref prematurely stopped the fight against Takam protecting AJ’s knockout record.
So all AJ's fights have been fixed in his favour? Interesting. Even the stoppages are bogus.
Does this corruption, skulduggery and manipulation only apply to AJ or all British fighters? Have you ever noticed it anywhere else in the world? Any other fighters? There are lots and lots of rich ones.
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
palmerq
Pretty sure ruiz will have already signed something that doesn't give him much of a choice where the rematch is... But if he wants to go go fully anti contract hardball, good for him, makes it funny for everyone watching.
I do not blame him as history has shown he will not win a decision over here and have a favourable ref.
What history proves Ruiz can't win a decision in Britain?
And the fact he can't have a "favourable ref" in the UK is a good thing, right? Nobody should have a "favourable" ref.
You said yourself AJ is worth millions so things are going to work in his favour.
Why else is Ruiz insisting he has the fight in USA?
I thought Wlad was winning against AJ before the stoppage but I believe AJ was in front by the judges. The ref prematurely stopped the fight against Takam protecting AJ’s knockout record.
So all AJ's fights have been fixed in his favour? Interesting. Even the stoppages are bogus.
Does this corruption, skulduggery and manipulation only apply to AJ or all British fighters? Have you ever noticed it anywhere else in the world? Any other fighters? There are lots and lots of rich ones.
When did I say all AJ's fights have been fixed in his favour. The stoppage against Takem was not necessary it could have carried on.
This happens is boxing, especially when the fighter carries a lot of power.
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
palmerq
Pretty sure ruiz will have already signed something that doesn't give him much of a choice where the rematch is... But if he wants to go go fully anti contract hardball, good for him, makes it funny for everyone watching.
I do not blame him as history has shown he will not win a decision over here and have a favourable ref.
What history proves Ruiz can't win a decision in Britain?
And the fact he can't have a "favourable ref" in the UK is a good thing, right? Nobody should have a "favourable" ref.
You said yourself AJ is worth millions so things are going to work in his favour.
Why else is Ruiz insisting he has the fight in USA?
I thought Wlad was winning against AJ before the stoppage but I believe AJ was in front by the judges. The ref prematurely stopped the fight against Takam protecting AJ’s knockout record.
So all AJ's fights have been fixed in his favour? Interesting. Even the stoppages are bogus.
Does this corruption, skulduggery and manipulation only apply to AJ or all British fighters? Have you ever noticed it anywhere else in the world? Any other fighters? There are lots and lots of rich ones.
When did I say all AJ's fights have been fixed in his favour. The stoppage against Takem was not necessary it could have carried on.
This happens is boxing, especially when the fighter carries a lot of power.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
history has shown Ruiz will not win a decision over here
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Wlad was winning against AJ before the stoppage and the ref prematurely stopped the fight against Takam protecting AJ’s knockout record.
That's two cases of "corruption" you've identified regarding AJ's career - the ref was "fraudulent" in the Takam contest and "judges" in Wlad's case.
What fights weren't predetermined? Is this shameful, dishonest, unethical practice exclusive to British fighters?
((#not all, #not all, #not all :D)
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
Most fights where there is a lot of money/power at stake there are elements of favouritism for the “house fighter” and it is not exclusive to British fighters.
It has happened for years and can be the difference for a win or loss which is why they stack the odds in their favour no matter how trivial.
Obviously a knockout makes all the posturing redundant but even then fighter like Buster Douglas nearly lost his titles when he beat Tyson.
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
If you watch these arguments for who changes what is said and takes evidence of occurrence to a sarcastic “all” to dismiss the witnessed evidence then you know who has a poor argument.
Fact is UKAD created a real issue for UK fighters in their policy. The only champions that will travel to the UK right now are those that are absolutely sure they are significantly better than their opponent or getting paid through the roof. Until they inform opponents of failed drug tests anyone will be justified in refusing to travel. Contract or not. Does anyone really believe if a fighter fights their contract in court with the argument “they are willing to put me in with a fighter they know is on PEDs without telling me” that said fighter will lose their case? Eddie wouldn’t even take it to court it’s so easy to see the outcome. So what about the commissions, does anyone think they are eager to side with UKAD not informing them?
But let’s say the commissions do strip Ruiz, has it hurt Fury? Can’t Fury get a big fight any time he wants? Don’t they call him the champion without a belt? So wouldn’t they call Ruiz a champion without belts? Who really gets hurt most if Ruiz is stripped? Ruiz, who could still have a PPV with Wilder or Joshua twice going around picking up another mans belts? Maybe you can pick up another mans belts once without a stigma but twice, I don’t know man. I think that puts him in a very bad light.
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
palmerq
Pretty sure ruiz will have already signed something that doesn't give him much of a choice where the rematch is... But if he wants to go go fully anti contract hardball, good for him, makes it funny for everyone watching.
I am sure Ruiz is playing hard ball and has no legal leg to stand on when he signed the contract for the rematch.
If he is going “fully anti contract hardball” then he will want the fight in USA. I do not blame him as history has shown he will not win a decision over here and have a favourable ref.
If Ruiz does decide to fight in the UK he will be expected to be compensated adequately for fighting AJ in UK. Where that additional money is coming from is probably where the impasse is currently, is it coming from Eddie/Sky/AJ.
The worst case could be Ruiz not having the rematch, being stripped of his title and becoming another people’s champion.
Yes, it does make it funny for everyone watching
Depends on the contract Ruiz signed. If he decides not to fight Joshua again and signs to fight somebody else he could contractually be liable for every penny he makes from the new fight plus x million dollars in penalties. And that's before the sanctioning bodies get involved.
Realistically if he tries to duck out of the agreement he'd probably spend an indefinite period out of boxing and in various courtrooms and be stripped of his titles which Joshua would then fight somebody else for and by the time the whole thing was resolved in the courts he'd be a distant memory with no leverage to get any kind of decent fight and massive legal debts.
Ruiz can make as much noise as he wants but the contract he signed will almost certainly mean he has to do what Joshua wants.
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mark TKO
If I was Ruiz I would demand fucking everything to make sure I was financially secure for life - and the next generation.
If he loses the rematch (for the record , at present, I don't believe he will) he's not going to be getting a rematch or another big pay day any time soon and will have to build up again - these guys who get labelled one time wonders have a habit of disappearing.....
How long have they got to sort this rematch it's doing everyone's head in.
I think it's fair to have it in the UK and will be in the contract. But as for the pay day fuck yes Ruiz should milk it.
If Matchroom are even minimally competent at drawing up contracts, and I'm sure they are, Ruiz' purse for the rematch will have been included in the original contract. He'll be able to stamp his foot and make threats and may get a few extra quid but it won't be anything substantial. Maybe he'll get a Nando's all-you-can-eat-free card valid for however long he's in Britain.
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Kirkland Laing
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mark TKO
If I was Ruiz I would demand fucking everything to make sure I was financially secure for life - and the next generation.
If he loses the rematch (for the record , at present, I don't believe he will) he's not going to be getting a rematch or another big pay day any time soon and will have to build up again - these guys who get labelled one time wonders have a habit of disappearing.....
How long have they got to sort this rematch it's doing everyone's head in.
I think it's fair to have it in the UK and will be in the contract. But as for the pay day fuck yes Ruiz should milk it.
If Matchroom are even minimally competent at drawing up contracts, and I'm sure they are, Ruiz' purse for the rematch will have been included in the original contract. He'll be able to stamp his foot and make threats and may get a few extra quid but it won't be anything substantial. Maybe he'll get a Nando's all-you-can-eat-free card valid for however long he's in Britain.
I remember Whyte turning down the April fight specifically because the rematch clause stipulated what he would be entitled to which was in his opinion very low.
These rematch clauses need to be banned and made illegal.
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Kirkland Laing
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mark TKO
If I was Ruiz I would demand fucking everything to make sure I was financially secure for life - and the next generation.
If he loses the rematch (for the record , at present, I don't believe he will) he's not going to be getting a rematch or another big pay day any time soon and will have to build up again - these guys who get labelled one time wonders have a habit of disappearing.....
How long have they got to sort this rematch it's doing everyone's head in.
I think it's fair to have it in the UK and will be in the contract. But as for the pay day fuck yes Ruiz should milk it.
If Matchroom are even minimally competent at drawing up contracts, and I'm sure they are, Ruiz' purse for the rematch will have been included in the original contract. He'll be able to stamp his foot and make threats and may get a few extra quid but it won't be anything substantial. Maybe he'll get a Nando's all-you-can-eat-free card valid for however long he's in Britain.
I remember Whyte turning down the April fight specifically because the rematch clause stipulated what he would be entitled to which was in his opinion very low.
These rematch clauses need to be banned and made illegal.
Even assuming it would be possible to ban the formally legally codified result of the disparity in negotiating leverage between a champion and a challenger, which it isn't, why would you want to do this? What difference does it make?
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Kirkland Laing
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Kirkland Laing
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mark TKO
If I was Ruiz I would demand fucking everything to make sure I was financially secure for life - and the next generation.
If he loses the rematch (for the record , at present, I don't believe he will) he's not going to be getting a rematch or another big pay day any time soon and will have to build up again - these guys who get labelled one time wonders have a habit of disappearing.....
How long have they got to sort this rematch it's doing everyone's head in.
I think it's fair to have it in the UK and will be in the contract. But as for the pay day fuck yes Ruiz should milk it.
If Matchroom are even minimally competent at drawing up contracts, and I'm sure they are, Ruiz' purse for the rematch will have been included in the original contract. He'll be able to stamp his foot and make threats and may get a few extra quid but it won't be anything substantial. Maybe he'll get a Nando's all-you-can-eat-free card valid for however long he's in Britain.
I remember Whyte turning down the April fight specifically because the rematch clause stipulated what he would be entitled to which was in his opinion very low.
These rematch clauses need to be banned and made illegal.
Even assuming it would be possible to ban the formally legally codified result of the disparity in negotiating leverage between a champion and a challenger, which it isn't, why would you want to do this? What difference does it make?
I think they banned "options" in boxing, where the promoter of the champion has a say in the next fight(s) of the challenger should they win. So they could do the same with rematch clauses, it gives the challenger very little say in the next fight in terms of money, venue and other key factors of their career. It could be argued Ruiz could earn far more if he was free to negotiate on a fair level field.
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
Longer they draw it out more chance the ol stripping starts and it comes down to which shiny object Ruiz wants to hold onto. Pretty sure the wba currently has 19 heavyweight champs so rule nothing out. They'll be calling him a ducker within a month ;D. I think Joshua is owed..needs..the easiest and least conflicted path to the actual fight itself and hope the politricks don't mess it up for everyone.
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Kirkland Laing
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Kirkland Laing
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mark TKO
If I was Ruiz I would demand fucking everything to make sure I was financially secure for life - and the next generation.
If he loses the rematch (for the record , at present, I don't believe he will) he's not going to be getting a rematch or another big pay day any time soon and will have to build up again - these guys who get labelled one time wonders have a habit of disappearing.....
How long have they got to sort this rematch it's doing everyone's head in.
I think it's fair to have it in the UK and will be in the contract. But as for the pay day fuck yes Ruiz should milk it.
If Matchroom are even minimally competent at drawing up contracts, and I'm sure they are, Ruiz' purse for the rematch will have been included in the original contract. He'll be able to stamp his foot and make threats and may get a few extra quid but it won't be anything substantial. Maybe he'll get a Nando's all-you-can-eat-free card valid for however long he's in Britain.
I remember Whyte turning down the April fight specifically because the rematch clause stipulated what he would be entitled to which was in his opinion very low.
These rematch clauses need to be banned and made illegal.
Even assuming it would be possible to ban the formally legally codified result of the disparity in negotiating leverage between a champion and a challenger, which it isn't, why would you want to do this? What difference does it make?
I think they banned "options" in boxing, where the promoter of the champion has a say in the next fight(s) of the challenger should they win. So they could do the same with rematch clauses, it gives the challenger very little say in the next fight in terms of money, venue and other key factors of their career. It could be argued Ruiz could earn far more if he was free to negotiate on a fair level field.
How can you ban options? It's something negotiable and something challengers are willing to give up to get a crack at champions. Ruiz could earn more if he was free to negotiate but he isn't because he signed a contract. And he signed the contract because it was a massive opportunity for him that has actually paid off. When he signed it he had zero negotiating leverage. Almost zero, Joshua was desperate for an opponent. But Joshua could have fought anybody really. The contract Ruiz signed was a fair reflection of his worth in a commercial deal. He's only on the hook for one fight and then he's free. Just going back a few years the Klitschkos used to have options on three or four future fights for anybody they fought. Go back a century and fighters would be willing to pay the heavyweight champion most of their future purses for a fight for the title. Champions have the right to look after their interests as much as is legally possible. Joshua is only doing what anybody else in his position would do. It's a short career.
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Most fights where there is a lot of money/power at stake there are elements of favouritism for the “house fighter” and it is not exclusive to British fighters.It has happened for years and can be the difference for a win or loss which is why they stack the odds in their favour no matter how trivial. Obviously a knockout makes all the posturing redundant but even then fighter like Buster Douglas nearly lost his titles when he beat Tyson.
Oh right, so it's not exclusive to British fighters, just the rich/powerful ones like AJ.... and now Ruiz, of course.
Ali, Tyson, Leonard, Floyd, Holyfield, etc - all had corrupt refs and judges throughout their careers. Cool.
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
All of those guys had way cooler styles than AJ though, fact. Probably because they werent limeys, but there could be something else to it. Unlikely.
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
That’s a bit pants if the fee is negotiated as part of rematch clause. Especially if you’re now champion.
I get he was a stand in but still shite for him.
So he could walk away and fight someone else then come back to Joshua later free of contract ??
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mark TKO
That’s a bit pants if the fee is negotiated as part of rematch clause. Especially if you’re now champion.
I get he was a stand in but still shite for him.
So he could walk away and fight someone else then come back to Joshua later free of contract ??
Yes, he could walk away and not decide to fight AJ, beconing another people's champion. AJ would not look great picking up the trinkets but he has done it before so may not mind fighting another Charles Martin again.
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Kirkland Laing
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Kirkland Laing
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Kirkland Laing
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mark TKO
If I was Ruiz I would demand fucking everything to make sure I was financially secure for life - and the next generation.
If he loses the rematch (for the record , at present, I don't believe he will) he's not going to be getting a rematch or another big pay day any time soon and will have to build up again - these guys who get labelled one time wonders have a habit of disappearing.....
How long have they got to sort this rematch it's doing everyone's head in.
I think it's fair to have it in the UK and will be in the contract. But as for the pay day fuck yes Ruiz should milk it.
If Matchroom are even minimally competent at drawing up contracts, and I'm sure they are, Ruiz' purse for the rematch will have been included in the original contract. He'll be able to stamp his foot and make threats and may get a few extra quid but it won't be anything substantial. Maybe he'll get a Nando's all-you-can-eat-free card valid for however long he's in Britain.
I remember Whyte turning down the April fight specifically because the rematch clause stipulated what he would be entitled to which was in his opinion very low.
These rematch clauses need to be banned and made illegal.
Even assuming it would be possible to ban the formally legally codified result of the disparity in negotiating leverage between a champion and a challenger, which it isn't, why would you want to do this? What difference does it make?
I think they banned "options" in boxing, where the promoter of the champion has a say in the next fight(s) of the challenger should they win. So they could do the same with rematch clauses, it gives the challenger very little say in the next fight in terms of money, venue and other key factors of their career. It could be argued Ruiz could earn far more if he was free to negotiate on a fair level field.
How can you ban options? It's something negotiable and something challengers are willing to give up to get a crack at champions. Ruiz could earn more if he was free to negotiate but he isn't because he signed a contract. And he signed the contract because it was a massive opportunity for him that has actually paid off. When he signed it he had zero negotiating leverage. Almost zero, Joshua was desperate for an opponent. But Joshua could have fought anybody really. The contract Ruiz signed was a fair reflection of his worth in a commercial deal. He's only on the hook for one fight and then he's free. Just going back a few years the Klitschkos used to have options on three or four future fights for anybody they fought. Go back a century and fighters would be willing to pay the heavyweight champion most of their future purses for a fight for the title. Champions have the right to look after their interests as much as is legally possible. Joshua is only doing what anybody else in his position would do. It's a short career.
I am sure a smart lawyer could argue that Ruiz is being denied his actual worth, now that he took the chance and won the title. Ruiz could get far more money in a unification against Wilder.
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Most fights where there is a lot of money/power at stake there are elements of favouritism for the “house fighter” and it is not exclusive to British fighters.It has happened for years and can be the difference for a win or loss which is why they stack the odds in their favour no matter how trivial. Obviously a knockout makes all the posturing redundant but even then fighter like Buster Douglas nearly lost his titles when he beat Tyson.
Oh right, so it's not exclusive to British fighters, just the rich/powerful ones like AJ.... and now Ruiz, of course.
Ali, Tyson, Leonard, Floyd, Holyfield, etc - all had corrupt refs and judges throughout their careers. Cool.
Not all. ;)
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Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Kirkland Laing
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Kirkland Laing
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Kirkland Laing
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mark TKO
If I was Ruiz I would demand fucking everything to make sure I was financially secure for life - and the next generation.
If he loses the rematch (for the record , at present, I don't believe he will) he's not going to be getting a rematch or another big pay day any time soon and will have to build up again - these guys who get labelled one time wonders have a habit of disappearing.....
How long have they got to sort this rematch it's doing everyone's head in.
I think it's fair to have it in the UK and will be in the contract. But as for the pay day fuck yes Ruiz should milk it.
If Matchroom are even minimally competent at drawing up contracts, and I'm sure they are, Ruiz' purse for the rematch will have been included in the original contract. He'll be able to stamp his foot and make threats and may get a few extra quid but it won't be anything substantial. Maybe he'll get a Nando's all-you-can-eat-free card valid for however long he's in Britain.
I remember Whyte turning down the April fight specifically because the rematch clause stipulated what he would be entitled to which was in his opinion very low.
These rematch clauses need to be banned and made illegal.
Even assuming it would be possible to ban the formally legally codified result of the disparity in negotiating leverage between a champion and a challenger, which it isn't, why would you want to do this? What difference does it make?
I think they banned "options" in boxing, where the promoter of the champion has a say in the next fight(s) of the challenger should they win. So they could do the same with rematch clauses, it gives the challenger very little say in the next fight in terms of money, venue and other key factors of their career. It could be argued Ruiz could earn far more if he was free to negotiate on a fair level field.
How can you ban options? It's something negotiable and something challengers are willing to give up to get a crack at champions. Ruiz could earn more if he was free to negotiate but he isn't because he signed a contract. And he signed the contract because it was a massive opportunity for him that has actually paid off. When he signed it he had zero negotiating leverage. Almost zero, Joshua was desperate for an opponent. But Joshua could have fought anybody really. The contract Ruiz signed was a fair reflection of his worth in a commercial deal. He's only on the hook for one fight and then he's free. Just going back a few years the Klitschkos used to have options on three or four future fights for anybody they fought. Go back a century and fighters would be willing to pay the heavyweight champion most of their future purses for a fight for the title. Champions have the right to look after their interests as much as is legally possible. Joshua is only doing what anybody else in his position would do. It's a short career.
I am sure a smart lawyer could argue that Ruiz is being denied his actual worth, now that he took the chance and won the title. Ruiz could get far more money in a unification against Wilder.
Any lawyer who has passed the bar can argue anything. It's whether it'll stand up in court that matters. And if Ruiz wants to spend years tied up in court blowing the purse he earned and going into debt to pay his lawyers while the sanctioning bodies hand the belts back to the PPV star/stadium filler/gigantic sanctioning fee producer he won them off then he's more than welcome to try.
He's only worth what he's currently worth because the champion agreed to give him a fight. And the champion only agreed to give him a fight if Ruiz agreed to a variety of terms and conditions. If you sign a contract that's it mate. Have a look at the contracts some bands have signed. The Rolling Stones contract with Allen Klein for instance. His estate still owns the publishing rights and makes millions of dollars in royalties for some of their biggest songs, songs they had no idea he had any ownership over when they signed the deal. Tyson's first contract with Jim Jacobs and Bill Cayton gave Jacobs and Cayton effectively more than half of every dollar Tyson made amongst other things. Tyson's contract with King was even worse. A contract is a contract. If you've signed a contract you're obligated to fulfil everything within the four corners of that contract even if you were badly advised before you signed it. And Ruiz is advised by Al Haymon, supposedly the smartest man in boxing.
-
Re: Andy Ruiz Jr vs Anthony Joshua rematch
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Kirkland Laing
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Kirkland Laing
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Kirkland Laing
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Kirkland Laing
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mark TKO
If I was Ruiz I would demand fucking everything to make sure I was financially secure for life - and the next generation.
If he loses the rematch (for the record , at present, I don't believe he will) he's not going to be getting a rematch or another big pay day any time soon and will have to build up again - these guys who get labelled one time wonders have a habit of disappearing.....
How long have they got to sort this rematch it's doing everyone's head in.
I think it's fair to have it in the UK and will be in the contract. But as for the pay day fuck yes Ruiz should milk it.
If Matchroom are even minimally competent at drawing up contracts, and I'm sure they are, Ruiz' purse for the rematch will have been included in the original contract. He'll be able to stamp his foot and make threats and may get a few extra quid but it won't be anything substantial. Maybe he'll get a Nando's all-you-can-eat-free card valid for however long he's in Britain.
I remember Whyte turning down the April fight specifically because the rematch clause stipulated what he would be entitled to which was in his opinion very low.
These rematch clauses need to be banned and made illegal.
Even assuming it would be possible to ban the formally legally codified result of the disparity in negotiating leverage between a champion and a challenger, which it isn't, why would you want to do this? What difference does it make?
I think they banned "options" in boxing, where the promoter of the champion has a say in the next fight(s) of the challenger should they win. So they could do the same with rematch clauses, it gives the challenger very little say in the next fight in terms of money, venue and other key factors of their career. It could be argued Ruiz could earn far more if he was free to negotiate on a fair level field.
How can you ban options? It's something negotiable and something challengers are willing to give up to get a crack at champions. Ruiz could earn more if he was free to negotiate but he isn't because he signed a contract. And he signed the contract because it was a massive opportunity for him that has actually paid off. When he signed it he had zero negotiating leverage. Almost zero, Joshua was desperate for an opponent. But Joshua could have fought anybody really. The contract Ruiz signed was a fair reflection of his worth in a commercial deal. He's only on the hook for one fight and then he's free. Just going back a few years the Klitschkos used to have options on three or four future fights for anybody they fought. Go back a century and fighters would be willing to pay the heavyweight champion most of their future purses for a fight for the title. Champions have the right to look after their interests as much as is legally possible. Joshua is only doing what anybody else in his position would do. It's a short career.
I am sure a smart lawyer could argue that Ruiz is being denied his actual worth, now that he took the chance and won the title. Ruiz could get far more money in a unification against Wilder.
Any lawyer who has passed the bar can argue anything. It's whether it'll stand up in court that matters. And if Ruiz wants to spend years tied up in court blowing the purse he earned and going into debt to pay his lawyers while the sanctioning bodies hand the belts back to the PPV star/stadium filler/gigantic sanctioning fee producer he won them off then he's more than welcome to try.
He's only worth what he's currently worth because the champion agreed to give him a fight. And the champion only agreed to give him a fight if Ruiz agreed to a variety of terms and conditions. If you sign a contract that's it mate. Have a look at the contracts some bands have signed. The Rolling Stones contract with Allen Klein for instance. His estate still owns the publishing rights and makes millions of dollars in royalties for some of their biggest songs, songs they had no idea he had any ownership over when they signed the deal. Tyson's first contract with Jim Jacobs and Bill Cayton gave Jacobs and Cayton effectively more than half of every dollar Tyson made amongst other things. Tyson's contract with King was even worse. A contract is a contract. If you've signed a contract you're obligated to fulfil everything within the four corners of that contract even if you were badly advised before you signed it. And Ruiz is advised by Al Haymon, supposedly the smartest man in boxing.
Tyson contested the contracts with Jacobs/Cayton and King and essentially won both when they settled with him.
Ruiz will end up getting some concessions from AJ.
Unfair contracts are not worth the paper they are written on.