Who is 'Greater' on the all-time list SRL or RJJ?

[ICB]

Easily SRL, Jones doesn't even make my top 100 all-time.

That really surprises me mate. Surely you must be basing some of that on the Taver fights and since? Looking at him up to and including Ruiz, it would be very hard not to have him at least top 20 IMO.

The "Great" Jones Jr had his moments early his career, but I never saw any real "defining" fights, or moving up in weight and outpointing Journeyman HW Chumpion John Ruiz as any great accomplishment. Once Jones' unorthodox style was figured out and the competition got stiffer, he started getting his ass handed to him, first by Tarver, then by Glenn Johnson. I look at a fighters entire career and Roy Jones Jr. turned out to be an overhyped PPV premadona, who got exposed.

Are you serious ? honestly thats absolute garbage, the reason he lost is because he was 35 year's old, and dropped a huge amount of weight. Tarver, Johnson, are stiffer competition than fighters like Toney ? Hopkins ? Hill ? really ?

And didn't SRL also get destroyed by Terry Norris ? and he was younger than RJJ and was coming off a one sided win over Robert Duran.

RJJ winning the Heavyweight title was no great achievement ? it hadn't been done in a century and John Ruiz was coming over flooring a good version of Evander Holyfield. But according to you its not a great achievement.

Talk about total disrespect for a great fighter honestly.

Your love for and defense of RJJ is touching, as for disrespecting him, that's comical, fuck Roy Jones Jr., that is all.

You can rant all you want i didn't see you address anything in my post, and your hate for RJJ is ridiculous. Not even in the top 100 ? that is an absolute joke, you can dislike a fighter without being ridiculously biased and hateful.

[Mars_ax]

Talk about total disrespect for a great fighter honestly.

Your love for and defense of RJJ is touching, as for disrespecting him, that's comical, fuck Roy Jones Jr., that is all.

You can rant all you want i didn't see you address anything in my post, and your hate for RJJ is ridiculous. Not even in the top 100 ? that is an absolute joke, you can dislike a fighter without being ridiculously biased and hateful.

Gosh ICB, are you and Roy dating? You seem to be "ridiculously" all over this mother-fucker's nuts.

Not everyone who disagrees with you is "biased and hateful" or as in love with RJJ as you seem to be, quit acting like an over emotional cunt, and get over yourself.

[TitoFan]

Is it possible to choose one over the other without it being perceived as a diss on the other? RJJ was a remarkable talent, probably an ATG. But SRL's list of opponents stands head and shoulders above RJJ's. Not a slight on Roy, just telling it like it is.

Younger fans who have never seen any SRL footage will find it hard to comprehend... but there was life before RJJ, Tyson, and all the rest.

[Galaxy]

Easily SRL, Jones doesn't even make my top 100 all-time.

That really surprises me mate. Surely you must be basing some of that on the Taver fights and since? Looking at him up to and including Ruiz, it would be very hard not to have him at least top 20 IMO.

The "Great" Jones Jr had his moments early his career, but I never saw any real "defining" fights, or moving up in weight and outpointing Journeyman HW Chumpion John Ruiz as any great accomplishment. Once Jones' unorthodox style was figured out and the competition got stiffer, he started getting his ass handed to him, first by Tarver, then by Glenn Johnson. I look at a fighters entire career and Roy Jones Jr. turned out to be an overhyped PPV premadona, who got exposed.

Are you serious ? honestly thats absolute garbage, the reason he lost is because he was 35 year's old, and dropped a huge amount of weight. Tarver, Johnson, are stiffer competition than fighters like Toney ? Hopkins ? Hill ? really ?

And didn't SRL also get destroyed by Terry Norris ? and he was younger than RJJ and was coming off a one sided win over Robert Duran.

RJJ winning the Heavyweight title was no great achievement ? it hadn't been done in a century and John Ruiz was coming over flooring a good version of Evander Holyfield. But according to you its not a great achievement.

Talk about total disrespect for a great fighter honestly.

Your love for and defense of RJJ is touching, as for disrespecting him, that's comical, fuck Roy Jones Jr., that is all.

You can rant all you want i didn't see you address anything in my post, and your hate for RJJ is ridiculous. Not even in the top 100 ? that is an absolute joke, you can dislike a fighter without being ridiculously biased and hateful.

Gosh ICB, are you and Roy dating? You seem to be "ridiculously" all over this mother-fucker's nuts.

Not everyone who disagrees with you is "biased and hateful" or as in love with RJJ as you seem to be, quit acting like an over emotional cunt, and get over yourself.

Bro ICB is just saying what everyone else is thinking. You don't have to like the guy & most of us have said Leonard is higher. But Jones was brilliant at his best! You say you never saw any defining fights but others have mentioned his wins of Toney, HOF McCallum, HOF bound Hopkins, Tarver when Jones was already on the slide. You don't consider those defining? I agree that some of his opposition wasn't stella but you mention Tarver who had already his ass handed to him by Harding who Jones owned! Give credit where credit is due

[Mars_ax]

Bro ICB is just saying what everyone else is thinking. You don't have to like the guy & most of us have said Leonard is higher. But Jones was brilliant at his best! You say you never saw any defining fights but others have mentioned his wins of Toney, HOF McCallum, HOF bound Hopkins, Tarver when Jones was already on the slide. You don't consider those defining? I agree that some of his opposition wasn't stella but you mention Tarver who had already his ass handed to him by Harding who Jones owned! Give credit where credit is due.

You, ICB, el al, are welcome to your opinions, and however "ridiculous" they may seem to you, I have mine. I can think of at least 100 Pugs i'd put ahead of RJJ on my all-time list, being "hate and bias", have fuck all to do with it.

[Galaxy]

Bro ICB is just saying what everyone else is thinking. You don't have to like the guy & most of us have said Leonard is higher. But Jones was brilliant at his best! You say you never saw any defining fights but others have mentioned his wins of Toney, HOF McCallum, HOF bound Hopkins, Tarver when Jones was already on the slide. You don't consider those defining? I agree that some of his opposition wasn't stella but you mention Tarver who had already his ass handed to him by Harding who Jones owned! Give credit where credit is due.

You, ICB, el al, are welcome to your opinions, and however "ridiculous" they may seem to you, I have mine. I can think of at least 100 Pugs i'd put ahead of RJJ on my all-time list, being "hateful and biased", have fuck all to do with it.

That's cool cuz, but your the one calling ICB names for having his?!

Question: Have you actually seen Jones/ Toney? If not you should watch it. Toney was considered one of the best in the sport at that time, I'm not sure what you think of Toney but even today he is commended for still having some of the best technical abilities. Jones owned him! You can have Jones anywhere you like on your list but the fact is Jones was an amazing talent in his prime!

[Spicoli]

Jones did feed on alphabet ranking cannon fodder but also gets full props for Hopkins, Toney and Hill. McCallum was just about spent at lt hvy and Jones clearly carried him. Toney lost it on the scale and Jones got in his head, he looked like he gave it up to me. Thats on him. Credit Jones jr. Jones was easy to dispise but he did get some scalps and cred. Were they Leonard like, nope. Not here.

[Mars_ax]

Bro ICB is just saying what everyone else is thinking. You don't have to like the guy & most of us have said Leonard is higher. But Jones was brilliant at his best! You say you never saw any defining fights but others have mentioned his wins of Toney, HOF McCallum, HOF bound Hopkins, Tarver when Jones was already on the slide. You don't consider those defining? I agree that some of his opposition wasn't stella but you mention Tarver who had already his ass handed to him by Harding who Jones owned! Give credit where credit is due.

You, ICB, el al, are welcome to your opinions, and however "ridiculous" they may seem to you, I have mine. I can think of at least 100 Pugs i'd put ahead of RJJ on my all-time list, being "hateful and biased", have fuck all to do with it.

That's cool cuz, but your the one calling ICB names for having his?!

Question: Have you actually seen Jones/ Toney? If not you should watch it. Toney was considered one of the best in the sport at that time, I'm not sure what you think of Toney but even today he is commended for still having some of the best technical abilities. Jones owned him! You can have Jones anywhere you like on your list but the fact is Jones was an amazing talent in his prime!

Not for his opinion.

Perhaps Jones was "amazing" until he got figured out.

[Galaxy]

Bro ICB is just saying what everyone else is thinking. You don't have to like the guy & most of us have said Leonard is higher. But Jones was brilliant at his best! You say you never saw any defining fights but others have mentioned his wins of Toney, HOF McCallum, HOF bound Hopkins, Tarver when Jones was already on the slide. You don't consider those defining? I agree that some of his opposition wasn't stella but you mention Tarver who had already his ass handed to him by Harding who Jones owned! Give credit where credit is due.

You, ICB, el al, are welcome to your opinions, and however "ridiculous" they may seem to you, I have mine. I can think of at least 100 Pugs i'd put ahead of RJJ on my all-time list, being "hateful and biased", have fuck all to do with it.

That's cool cuz, but your the one calling ICB names for having his?!

Question: Have you actually seen Jones/ Toney? If not you should watch it. Toney was considered one of the best in the sport at that time, I'm not sure what you think of Toney but even today he is commended for still having some of the best technical abilities. Jones owned him! You can have Jones anywhere you like on your list but the fact is Jones was an amazing talent in his prime!

Not for his opinion.

Perhaps Jones was "amazing" until he got figured out.

You don't think age caught up with him? As it does with everyone

[erics44]

Is it possible to choose one over the other without it being perceived as a diss on the other? RJJ was a remarkable talent, probably an ATG. But SRL's list of opponents stands head and shoulders above RJJ's. Not a slight on Roy, just telling it like it is.

Younger fans who have never seen any SRL footage will find it hard to comprehend... but there was life before RJJ, Tyson, and all the rest.

Again its very easy to say leonard had better opponents but in general did he really?

The era is massively hyped

[ICB]

Talk about total disrespect for a great fighter honestly.

Your love for and defense of RJJ is touching, as for disrespecting him, that's comical, fuck Roy Jones Jr., that is all.

You can rant all you want i didn't see you address anything in my post, and your hate for RJJ is ridiculous. Not even in the top 100 ? that is an absolute joke, you can dislike a fighter without being ridiculously biased and hateful.

Gosh ICB, are you and Roy dating? You seem to be "ridiculously" all over this mother-fucker's nuts.

Not everyone who disagrees with you is "biased and hateful" or as in love with RJJ as you seem to be, quit acting like an over emotional cunt, and get over yourself.

Are you serious ? your the one that needs to get over yourself, your the one getting annoyed and flustered over nothing. To not put RJJ in an ATG top 100 list is a joke, that's not an opinion that's just plain hating.

Not many fighters have achieved what RJJ did, or have dominated the way he did. Based on accomplishments and his dominant performances, aswell as just plain natural talent he's easily top 100 and actually he's more like top 50. And had he retired after John Ruiz fight he'd be rated even higher.

[TitoFan]

Is it possible to choose one over the other without it being perceived as a diss on the other? RJJ was a remarkable talent, probably an ATG. But SRL's list of opponents stands head and shoulders above RJJ's. Not a slight on Roy, just telling it like it is.

Younger fans who have never seen any SRL footage will find it hard to comprehend... but there was life before RJJ, Tyson, and all the rest.

Again its very easy to say leonard had better opponents but in general did he really?

The era is massively hyped

Yeah, you're probably right. Roberto "Manos de Piedra" Duran, Thomas "Hitman" Hearns, Marvin "Marvelous" Hagler, Wilfredo "El Radar de St. Just" Benitez...... massively hyped indeed.

[Mars_ax]

Bro ICB is just saying what everyone else is thinking. You don't have to like the guy & most of us have said Leonard is higher. But Jones was brilliant at his best! You say you never saw any defining fights but others have mentioned his wins of Toney, HOF McCallum, HOF bound Hopkins, Tarver when Jones was already on the slide. You don't consider those defining? I agree that some of his opposition wasn't stella but you mention Tarver who had already his ass handed to him by Harding who Jones owned! Give credit where credit is due.

You, ICB, el al, are welcome to your opinions, and however "ridiculous" they may seem to you, I have mine. I can think of at least 100 Pugs i'd put ahead of RJJ on my all-time list, being "hateful and biased", have fuck all to do with it.

That's cool cuz, but your the one calling ICB names for having his?!

Question: Have you actually seen Jones/ Toney? If not you should watch it. Toney was considered one of the best in the sport at that time, I'm not sure what you think of Toney but even today he is commended for still having some of the best technical abilities. Jones owned him! You can have Jones anywhere you like on your list but the fact is Jones was an amazing talent in his prime!

Not for his opinion.

Perhaps Jones was "amazing" until he got figured out.

You don't think age caught up with him? As it does with everyone

Jones was just 34 when he fought Tarver the 1st time, not exactly ancient eh? And he's still fighting 8 years later at age 42. It could just be that he didn't train as hard as he used to, who knows.

Prior to the 2nd Tarver fight, because of unorthodox style, solid defense, and the fact that he stayed on offense most of time, it was very hard to get a clean flush shot in on RJJ. Jones Jr. achilles heel turned out to be his china chin, Tarver was just the first to expose it.

[Galaxy]

Bro ICB is just saying what everyone else is thinking. You don't have to like the guy & most of us have said Leonard is higher. But Jones was brilliant at his best! You say you never saw any defining fights but others have mentioned his wins of Toney, HOF McCallum, HOF bound Hopkins, Tarver when Jones was already on the slide. You don't consider those defining? I agree that some of his opposition wasn't stella but you mention Tarver who had already his ass handed to him by Harding who Jones owned! Give credit where credit is due.

You, ICB, el al, are welcome to your opinions, and however "ridiculous" they may seem to you, I have mine. I can think of at least 100 Pugs i'd put ahead of RJJ on my all-time list, being "hateful and biased", have fuck all to do with it.

That's cool cuz, but your the one calling ICB names for having his?!

Question: Have you actually seen Jones/ Toney? If not you should watch it. Toney was considered one of the best in the sport at that time, I'm not sure what you think of Toney but even today he is commended for still having some of the best technical abilities. Jones owned him! You can have Jones anywhere you like on your list but the fact is Jones was an amazing talent in his prime!

Not for his opinion.

Perhaps Jones was "amazing" until he got figured out.

You don't think age caught up with him? As it does with everyone

Jones was just 34 when he fought Tarver the 1st time, not exactly ancient eh? And he's still fighting 8 years later at age 42. It could just be that he didn't train as hard as he used to, who knows.

Prior to the 2nd Tarver fight, because of unorthodox style, solid defense, and the fact that he stayed on offense most of time, it was very hard to get a clean flush shot in on RJJ. Jones Jr. achilles heel turned out to be his china chin, Tarver was just the first to expose it.

Just think how good Jones must have been then that no one knew he had no chin for over a decade spanning from 154 to heavy.

[Mars_ax]

Talk about total disrespect for a great fighter honestly.

Your love for and defense of RJJ is touching, as for disrespecting him, that's comical, fuck Roy Jones Jr., that is all.

You can rant all you want i didn't see you address anything in my post, and your hate for RJJ is ridiculous. Not even in the top 100 ? that is an absolute joke, you can dislike a fighter without being ridiculously biased and hateful.

Gosh ICB, are you and Roy dating? You seem to be "ridiculously" all over this mother-fucker's nuts.

Not everyone who disagrees with you is "biased and hateful" or as in love with RJJ as you seem to be, quit acting like an over emotional cunt, and get over yourself.

Are you serious ? your the one that needs to get over yourself, your the one getting annoyed and flustered over nothing. To not put RJJ in an ATG top 100 list is a joke, that's not an opinion that's just plain hating.

Not many fighters have achieved what RJJ did, or have dominated the way he did. Based on accomplishments and his dominant performances, aswell as just plain natural talent he's easily top 100 and actually he's more like top 50. And had he retired after John Ruiz fight he'd be rated even higher.

First off, you may think it's a joke, but it's my ATG list, so I can put anyone I bloody well please, and where on it, no?

"if he'd just retired" can be said about a lot of fighters, the fact is Jones didn't retire after Ruiz, and all the losses, and KO loses since then have tarnished his "legacy".