Why is Lucian Bute regarded as the 2nd best Smw?

[erics44]

I still think Kessler can be the man in this division. I rewatched the Kessler/Ward fight this evening and it was appalling. Ward is the dirtiest, nastiest and most typical Christian I have ever seen.

Kessler does far better in a rematch knowing what that skank is all about. As for Bute, I don't hold him in massive regard. He is far less dirty than S.O.B. though so I like him more.

Froch is clearly more limited, but he has the biggest heart. He just doesn't have any real tools.

I dont agree, Kessler is way past his best

I think he was beaten quite handily by Froch, yes it was a close fight and kess got the decision but Kessler only won any rounds on work rate, or the fact that froch stopped working, some rounds kes looked like he wasnt gonna get through the fight, froch looked stronger and a lot more accurate through-out

[Gandalf]

I still think Kessler can be the man in this division. I rewatched the Kessler/Ward fight this evening and it was appalling. Ward is the dirtiest, nastiest and most typical Christian I have ever seen.

Kessler does far better in a rematch knowing what that skank is all about. As for Bute, I don't hold him in massive regard. He is far less dirty than S.O.B. though so I like him more.

Froch is clearly more limited, but he has the biggest heart. He just doesn't have any real tools.

I dont agree, Kessler is way past his best

I think he was beaten quite handily by Froch, yes it was a close fight and kess got the decision but Kessler only won any rounds on work rate, or the fact that froch stopped working, some rounds kes looked like he wasnt gonna get through the fight, froch looked stronger and a lot more accurate through-out

We can agree to disagree, I thought Kessler won that quite clearly. I do think Kessler is not quite the same, but I want to see him next April to make my mind up.

Froch got hit with an awful lot and lost so many rounds. He did finish the hungrier though.

[Rantcatrat]

I still think Kessler can be the man in this division. I rewatched the Kessler/Ward fight this evening and it was appalling. Ward is the dirtiest, nastiest and most typical Christian I have ever seen.

Kessler does far better in a rematch knowing what that skank is all about. As for Bute, I don't hold him in massive regard. He is far less dirty than S.O.B. though so I like him more.

Froch is clearly more limited, but he has the biggest heart. He just doesn't have any real tools.

I dont agree, Kessler is way past his best

I think he was beaten quite handily by Froch, yes it was a close fight and kess got the decision but Kessler only won any rounds on work rate, or the fact that froch stopped working, some rounds kes looked like he wasnt gonna get through the fight, froch looked stronger and a lot more accurate through-out

We can agree to disagree, I thought Kessler won that quite clearly. I do think Kessler is not quite the same, but I want to see him next April to make my mind up.

Froch got hit with an awful lot and lost so many rounds. He did finish the hungrier though.

Thing is it won't show you much because Stieglitz isn't that great. Kessler will beat Stieglitz and look good doing it. With all the injuries, however, it's clear boxing has taken its toll on Kessler's body. Add to that his age, and it doesn't seem that Kessler is the fighter he once was. I like Kessler though so I'll try and withhold judgment until he faces Froch, Ward or Bute. I doubt that he will though. Remember after Calzaghe beat him, he faced three journeymen in Denmark. I believe that's what he'll do for a few fights after getting a title from Stieglitz; then have one more big fight, lose, and retire a rich man.

[erics44]

I still think Kessler can be the man in this division. I rewatched the Kessler/Ward fight this evening and it was appalling. Ward is the dirtiest, nastiest and most typical Christian I have ever seen.

Kessler does far better in a rematch knowing what that skank is all about. As for Bute, I don't hold him in massive regard. He is far less dirty than S.O.B. though so I like him more.

Froch is clearly more limited, but he has the biggest heart. He just doesn't have any real tools.

I dont agree, Kessler is way past his best

I think he was beaten quite handily by Froch, yes it was a close fight and kess got the decision but Kessler only won any rounds on work rate, or the fact that froch stopped working, some rounds kes looked like he wasnt gonna get through the fight, froch looked stronger and a lot more accurate through-out

We can agree to disagree, I thought Kessler won that quite clearly. I do think Kessler is not quite the same, but I want to see him next April to make my mind up.

Froch got hit with an awful lot and lost so many rounds. He did finish the hungrier though.

watch the first 5 rounds, kessler doesnt land a punch

[Gandalf]

I still think Kessler can be the man in this division. I rewatched the Kessler/Ward fight this evening and it was appalling. Ward is the dirtiest, nastiest and most typical Christian I have ever seen.

Kessler does far better in a rematch knowing what that skank is all about. As for Bute, I don't hold him in massive regard. He is far less dirty than S.O.B. though so I like him more.

Froch is clearly more limited, but he has the biggest heart. He just doesn't have any real tools.

I dont agree, Kessler is way past his best

I think he was beaten quite handily by Froch, yes it was a close fight and kess got the decision but Kessler only won any rounds on work rate, or the fact that froch stopped working, some rounds kes looked like he wasnt gonna get through the fight, froch looked stronger and a lot more accurate through-out

We can agree to disagree, I thought Kessler won that quite clearly. I do think Kessler is not quite the same, but I want to see him next April to make my mind up.

Froch got hit with an awful lot and lost so many rounds. He did finish the hungrier though.

watch the first 5 rounds, kessler doesnt land a punch

No, that isn't true. I've just been watching it. Kessler is way up after 5. Froch doesn't work until down the stretch, same against Ward.

[Gandalf]

I still think Kessler can be the man in this division. I rewatched the Kessler/Ward fight this evening and it was appalling. Ward is the dirtiest, nastiest and most typical Christian I have ever seen.

Kessler does far better in a rematch knowing what that skank is all about. As for Bute, I don't hold him in massive regard. He is far less dirty than S.O.B. though so I like him more.

Froch is clearly more limited, but he has the biggest heart. He just doesn't have any real tools.

I dont agree, Kessler is way past his best

I think he was beaten quite handily by Froch, yes it was a close fight and kess got the decision but Kessler only won any rounds on work rate, or the fact that froch stopped working, some rounds kes looked like he wasnt gonna get through the fight, froch looked stronger and a lot more accurate through-out

We can agree to disagree, I thought Kessler won that quite clearly. I do think Kessler is not quite the same, but I want to see him next April to make my mind up.

Froch got hit with an awful lot and lost so many rounds. He did finish the hungrier though.

Thing is it won't show you much because Stieglitz isn't that great. Kessler will beat Stieglitz and look good doing it. With all the injuries, however, it's clear boxing has taken its toll on Kessler's body. Add to that his age, and it doesn't seem that Kessler is the fighter he once was. I like Kessler though so I'll try and withhold judgment until he faces Froch, Ward or Bute. I doubt that he will though. Remember after Calzaghe beat him, he faced three journeymen in Denmark. I believe that's what he'll do for a few fights after getting a title from Stieglitz; then have one more big fight, lose, and retire a rich man.

Maybe, but that Ward fight was a travesty and not a fair fight.

It was appalling and if I was Kessler I would be saying "why go over there and fight those god bothering weirdo's again as it is all a scam". And it was.

Kessler would do much better and I am certain of that and Ward really is a lot of hot air.

Calzaghe would jump rings around the Orc-esque fool.

[Rantcatrat]

I'm aware that Bute is one of the least favorite guys on this forum as many people dislike him (erics, finito, mar, terrorsid, formerly bilbo to name a few) because they rightly or wrongly believe he is overrated because he hasn't faced Froch, Kessler, or Ward. The only way we can be sure if he is the goods is after he faces Froch or Kessler given that Ward won't fight him now. Do even the naysayers agree that is a fair assessement? The only other thing I would bring up is Ward has leapfrogged up into top 5 p4p essentially because he beat Froch so if Bute can do that too, can we agree that we should place him in the same regard?

[Gandalf]

I'm aware that Bute is one of the least favorite guys on this forum as many people dislike him (erics, finito, mar, terrorsid, formerly bilbo to name a few) because they rightly or wrongly believe he is overrated because he hasn't faced Froch, Kessler, or Ward. The only way we can be sure if he is the goods is after he faces Froch or Kessler given that Ward won't fight him now. Do even the naysayers agree that is a fair assessement? The only other thing I would bring up is Ward has leapfrogged up into top 5 p4p essentially because he beat Froch so if Bute can do that too, can we agree that we should place him in the same regard?

Ward is not top 5 in the world, but Bute does need to fight some more of those opponents. Johnson is soooooooooo old. He should never have been in the Super 6.

[LobowolfXXX]

I think your anti-Christian bias is affecting your assessment of Ward. Perhaps if he goes atheist, you'll be able to more accurately evaluate him. There's just no way in hell Kessler will ever be "the man" in the 168-pound division unless Ward moves up or retires. He has neither the speed nor the versatility to threaten him.

[Gandalf]

I think your anti-Christian bias is affecting your assessment of Ward. Perhaps if he goes atheist, you'll be able to more accurately evaluate him. There's just no way in hell Kessler will ever be "the man" in the 168-pound division unless Ward moves up or retires. He has neither the speed nor the versatility to threaten him.

Are you another Yank with an unscientific mindview? Read some papers which are supported by logic and avoid that Bible nonsense. And it is, it has nothing to support it.

I enjoy boxing, but when fighters talk shit I do laugh at them.

[LobowolfXXX]

I think your anti-Christian bias is affecting your assessment of Ward. Perhaps if he goes atheist, you'll be able to more accurately evaluate him. There's just no way in hell Kessler will ever be "the man" in the 168-pound division unless Ward moves up or retires. He has neither the speed nor the versatility to threaten him.

Are you another Yank with an unscientific mindview? Read some papers which are supported by logic and avoid that Bible nonsense. And it is, it has nothing to support it.

I enjoy boxing, but when fighters talk shit I do laugh at them.

Perhaps your worldview has impaired your ability to understand my argument. I did not say or suggest that lack of belief in Christianity is incorrect; merely that it may be impeding your objectivity. FWIW, I am not a theist (though I know many extremely intelligent and logic-minded people who are).

But that's really a side issue. You've pointed out bias (or at least perceived bias, or the possibility of bias) in others; are you really so sure that absolutely no bias might be affecting your own beliefs? I'm rather inclined to think that nobody is entirely free of bias (though people have it in varying degrees).

[ICB]

I still think Kessler can be the man in this division. I rewatched the Kessler/Ward fight this evening and it was appalling. Ward is the dirtiest, nastiest and most typical Christian I have ever seen.

Kessler does far better in a rematch knowing what that skank is all about. As for Bute, I don't hold him in massive regard. He is far less dirty than S.O.B. though so I like him more.

Froch is clearly more limited, but he has the biggest heart. He just doesn't have any real tools.

I dont agree, Kessler is way past his best

I think he was beaten quite handily by Froch, yes it was a close fight and kess got the decision but Kessler only won any rounds on work rate, or the fact that froch stopped working, some rounds kes looked like he wasnt gonna get through the fight, froch looked stronger and a lot more accurate through-out

We can agree to disagree, I thought Kessler won that quite clearly. I do think Kessler is not quite the same, but I want to see him next April to make my mind up.

Froch got hit with an awful lot and lost so many rounds. He did finish the hungrier though.

watch the first 5 rounds, kessler doesnt land a punch

Only a very small percentage think Carl Froch won, infact on this forum i've only seen you and CFH debate it. Mostly everyone else think's Mikkel Kessler won a clear decision 7-5 7-4-1 or 8-4 in that region, i personally had it 7-5.

[Dia bando]

As regard's to Bute, being second best Smw what I have seen of
him he doe's ever thing well,just get's the job of winning done.?
But when or if he doe's face Ward,it could be a very interesting
fight,I don't think Ward is superman,if I was a betting man may
be just may be a few bob on Bute to win.?

[erics44]

No, that isn't true. I've just been watching it. Kessler is way up after 5. Froch doesn't work until down the stretch, same against Ward.

i cant see it, i dont see kes landing a punch in the first 5, the 4th is frochs best round of the fight, kes looks in trouble

The first 2 are close but it would be harsh not to give them to froch

Give me a round and a time when kes lands in the first 5

[Leighton]

Who cares. This is a perfect opertunity to have a unification fight so Bute can be brought down to earth.
Saying that, when have the top two fighters of a devision ever rushed to fight each other.