What's the deal with Socialism?

[CFH]

Thank you to CFH and miles for taking the time to try and educate me on this issue, or at least expressing your views, because I find those interesting as well.

OK, the reason most of the figures I mentioned were "totalitarian" and "extremists" is because they were the only ones that gained control of entire governments, and although they had the ideals of making things better, making their countries better, they really messed things up instead of improving them. Which Socialist leaders did you want me to look at? Do you guys have a few that I should look into?

Well, the problem with extreme socialism is that it is just that, extreme. I honestly can't think of a single hardcore 'socialist' leader I would be happy living under, though if I am being completely honest I only really know anything about the major ones (Lenin, Mao, Castro etc.). I'd like to learn more about Latin American socialism. But I also wouldn't want to be ruled by anyone who took their ideology to the extreme. I believe a country functions best when there are a number of competing viewpoints.

Those individuals you mention are not socialists in the same way that I am. Like I said in my original reply, comparing my beliefs to theirs is a lot like comparing your beliefs to those on the extreme right. It's neither fair nor accurate.

If you would like to learn about two social democratic leaders for whom I have a ton of respect and who I would have no problems governing Canada I suggest you read about Jack Layton (the man in my sig) and Tommy Douglas. Neither are perfect, in fact a young Douglas once published a paper supporting eugenics (which he would later regret), but they are much more in line with my beliefs than someone like Hugo Chavez.

Wikipedia isn't the greatest source, but it's sure the easiest:

Tommy Douglas - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Jack Layton - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I understand that certain aspects of American economic policies both individual and corporate can be defined as Socialism and that is something I think that hurts the middle class most as they are the ONLY ones not bouyed by the helping hand of the government...the middle class play fair, play by the rules of Capitalism and they are punished with taxation to pay for individual and corporate welfare. If politicians truly cared about the middle class, then they would make adjustments to allow for both the poor and the wealthy to be placed on a level playing field with the middle class. welfare in my view does much more harm than good. With the individual welfare shackles them to be perpetually destitute, it punishes them for striving to dig themselves out of the lower class by taking away benefits. With corporations it increases the tax burden on other companies that don't have the political sway of a GE.

From what I know, the facts do not back up this kind of statement. There are always going to be those who abuse any system, but for the vast majority of people income assistance is a short-term solution to a crisis situation.

How would you like to see the poor, middle class, and wealthy all achieve a 'level playing field' without government intervention and therefor structural change? I'm curious.