Top fighters out of every country

[Master]

Morales got badly stopped twice . Lopez put formidable fighters in survival mode and look again @ who he fought : Quartey , Page , Davis . Morales' best opponents except from McCullough were destroyed b4 he fought them : Pacquiao , Barera & Junior Jones .
Whereas Jones & Barera in their 3rd fight at least , if not in d 2nd as well were clearly past their prime .
And i m not 1 of those who consider primes as being arbitrarily 2 years long .

Aaron Davis was also past his prime when Lopez beat him but retired unstopped as opposed 2 Barera , Jones & Pacquiao so it means something .

Morales was well passed it when he was stopped, and he's become the ONLY Mexican 4 division champ (even if you don't want to count his title at 140, he was blatantly robbed against Diaz at 135), it's all about resume and his resume is better than both Ramirez and Lopez, and for the record no way in hell did Ramirez beat Whitaker in their first fight in France, I have the original recording of the fight and Whitaker dominated, Ramirez won the fight cause he was the crowd favorite due to the fact that he was living in France at the time of the fight

I watched it twice and Whitaker did not dominate anything but d running contest . How is constantly avoiding contact , doing no damage and always giving ground can b called a domination is a mystery 2 me . Ramirez deserved 2 win .

how does flailing your arms around and hitting nothing but air make you the winner, that's all Ramirez did

Ramirez came forward and was still being hit with jabs on the back foot, then Whitaker would get into the inside and bang the body and counters

i don't remember him getting hit with anything , especially if u refer 2 their 1st fight .
Seems like u refer 2 their 2nd 1 in which Whitaker barely did any better .
Ramirez was also past his prime by their 1st fight .
Whitaker is not all of Ramirez' record though . U forget Ramirez deserved 2 win against Arguello in their 1st fight but got robbed . Even Rosario in their 1st fight did not deserve d decision .
Ramirez fought : Chavez , Rosariio*2 , Camacho , Whitaker*2 , Arguello , Mancini , Olivares , Juan Martin Coggi .
Ramirez is d 3rd greatest Mexican fighter of all times , 5th @ worst .

You must be related to Ramirez because you are blindly re-writing history to suit him.

[ElTerribleMorales]

Morales got badly stopped twice . Lopez put formidable fighters in survival mode and look again @ who he fought : Quartey , Page , Davis . Morales' best opponents except from McCullough were destroyed b4 he fought them : Pacquiao , Barera & Junior Jones .
Whereas Jones & Barera in their 3rd fight at least , if not in d 2nd as well were clearly past their prime .
And i m not 1 of those who consider primes as being arbitrarily 2 years long .

Aaron Davis was also past his prime when Lopez beat him but retired unstopped as opposed 2 Barera , Jones & Pacquiao so it means something .

Morales was well passed it when he was stopped, and he's become the ONLY Mexican 4 division champ (even if you don't want to count his title at 140, he was blatantly robbed against Diaz at 135), it's all about resume and his resume is better than both Ramirez and Lopez, and for the record no way in hell did Ramirez beat Whitaker in their first fight in France, I have the original recording of the fight and Whitaker dominated, Ramirez won the fight cause he was the crowd favorite due to the fact that he was living in France at the time of the fight

I watched it twice and Whitaker did not dominate anything but d running contest . How is constantly avoiding contact , doing no damage and always giving ground can b called a domination is a mystery 2 me . Ramirez deserved 2 win .

how does flailing your arms around and hitting nothing but air make you the winner, that's all Ramirez did

Ramirez came forward and was still being hit with jabs on the back foot, then Whitaker would get into the inside and bang the body and counters

i don't remember him getting hit with anything , especially if u refer 2 their 1st fight .
Seems like u refer 2 their 2nd 1 in which Whitaker barely did any better .
Ramirez was also past his prime by their 1st fight .
Whitaker is not all of Ramirez' record though . U forget Ramirez deserved 2 win against Arguello in their 1st fight but got robbed . Even Rosario in their 1st fight did not deserve d decision .
Ramirez fought : Chavez , Rosariio*2 , Camacho , Whitaker*2 , Arguello , Mancini , Olivares , Juan Martin Coggi .
Ramirez is d 3rd greatest Mexican fighter of all times , 5th @ worst .

You must be related to Ramirez because you are blindly re-writing history to suit him.

yea cause I don't remember him at all that way lol, and no bud, I was referring to the first fight where Whitaker potshotted him the whole fight and was then ROBBED unlike you state Ramirez was against Arguello and Rosario

as for him being the 3rd or at worst 5th greatest Mexican fighter, you're way off your rocker with that one, Chavez, Sanchez, Zarate, Morales, Barrera, Olivares, Lopez, JMM, Pintor, RM, Vazquez, all rank higher than Ramirez and there are still a few I left out

IMO the top 3 to come out of Mexico just due to records are Chavez, Sanchez, and Lopez

Barrera, Morales, and JMM following behind them

[Master]

Morales got badly stopped twice . Lopez put formidable fighters in survival mode and look again @ who he fought : Quartey , Page , Davis . Morales' best opponents except from McCullough were destroyed b4 he fought them : Pacquiao , Barera & Junior Jones .
Whereas Jones & Barera in their 3rd fight at least , if not in d 2nd as well were clearly past their prime .
And i m not 1 of those who consider primes as being arbitrarily 2 years long .

Aaron Davis was also past his prime when Lopez beat him but retired unstopped as opposed 2 Barera , Jones & Pacquiao so it means something .

Morales was well passed it when he was stopped, and he's become the ONLY Mexican 4 division champ (even if you don't want to count his title at 140, he was blatantly robbed against Diaz at 135), it's all about resume and his resume is better than both Ramirez and Lopez, and for the record no way in hell did Ramirez beat Whitaker in their first fight in France, I have the original recording of the fight and Whitaker dominated, Ramirez won the fight cause he was the crowd favorite due to the fact that he was living in France at the time of the fight

I watched it twice and Whitaker did not dominate anything but d running contest . How is constantly avoiding contact , doing no damage and always giving ground can b called a domination is a mystery 2 me . Ramirez deserved 2 win .

how does flailing your arms around and hitting nothing but air make you the winner, that's all Ramirez did

Ramirez came forward and was still being hit with jabs on the back foot, then Whitaker would get into the inside and bang the body and counters

i don't remember him getting hit with anything , especially if u refer 2 their 1st fight .
Seems like u refer 2 their 2nd 1 in which Whitaker barely did any better .
Ramirez was also past his prime by their 1st fight .
Whitaker is not all of Ramirez' record though . U forget Ramirez deserved 2 win against Arguello in their 1st fight but got robbed . Even Rosario in their 1st fight did not deserve d decision .
Ramirez fought : Chavez , Rosariio*2 , Camacho , Whitaker*2 , Arguello , Mancini , Olivares , Juan Martin Coggi .
Ramirez is d 3rd greatest Mexican fighter of all times , 5th @ worst .

You must be related to Ramirez because you are blindly re-writing history to suit him.

yea cause I don't remember him at all that way lol, and no bud, I was referring to the first fight where Whitaker potshotted him the whole fight and was then ROBBED unlike you state Ramirez was against Arguello and Rosario

as for him being the 3rd or at worst 5th greatest Mexican fighter, you're way off your rocker with that one, Chavez, Sanchez, Zarate, Morales, Barrera, Olivares, Lopez, JMM, Pintor, RM, Vazquez, all rank higher than Ramirez and there are still a few I left out

IMO the top 3 to come out of Mexico just due to records are Chavez, Sanchez, and Lopez, Barrera, Morales, and JMM following behind them

That sounds more like it.

[frankenfrank]

You must be related to Ramirez because you are blindly re-writing history to suit him.

yea cause I don't remember him at all that way lol, and no bud, I was referring to the first fight where Whitaker potshotted him the whole fight and was then ROBBED unlike you state Ramirez was against Arguello and Rosario

as for him being the 3rd or at worst 5th greatest Mexican fighter, you're way off your rocker with that one, Chavez, Sanchez, Zarate, Morales, Barrera, Olivares, Lopez, JMM, Pintor, RM, Vazquez, all rank higher than Ramirez and there are still a few I left out

IMO the top 3 to come out of Mexico just due to records are Chavez, Sanchez, and Lopez

Barrera, Morales, and JMM following behind them

That sounds more like it.

So both of u claim that Jose Luis Lopez , a rookie compared 2 Ramirez in terms of resume , is d 3rd greatest Mexican of all times ? this is still bearable . But Barera , whom got KOd in his prime by Junior Jones and then 4a good measure lost 2 him again , that time by decision , deserves a higher ranking by Ramirez ? even Barera's 2 wins over Morales were close . Almost all of Barera's high profile wins were close decisions , even d Hamed fight n overrated per4mance . I had Barera winning it on points , but looking at that fight as a whole has it much closer than d scorecards have it , with Barera barely if at all doing more damage than Hamed did .

As 4 Ramirez vs Whitaker it seems like both of u r feeding of d writings on that fight that became a false myth , rather than on your memories / impressions from watching it , because any1 who watched that fight knows that Whitaker was only concentrated in escaping , retreating and avoiding contact at all cost and did no damage . "Schooling" is what ppl who hadn't watched d fight , but rather recycle d writings of some common great great ancestor once wrote about it and his lie caught strongly 2 this day . I know it's n agonizing fight 2 watch , but at least i watched it and if u argue this much about it at least watch it and not in FFW like i know that some of u do .
Ramirez deserved 2 win against both Whitaker and Arguello , and at least hadn't lost 2 Rosario in their 1st fight (no2 mention what happened in their rematch) .

Ramirez' record consists of 3 * 3 weights titlists , 1 * 2 weights titlist and I don't even bother checking how many 1 weight titlists . On a side note regarding it , if Pryor hadn't cheated in his 1st fight against Arguello (if not in their rematch as well) , then Arguello would have become a 4 weights titlist . Ramirez himself had 2 settle 4 3 reigns @ d same weight , but something tells me that under a somewhat different management , he would've had a title at at least another weight as well .
1 of d reasons 4 that something is d age and Xperience @ top level he had by d time he was matched vs Ruben Olivares (many of fights on paper , but vs cab drivers Xclusively and by d age of 20) .

[Master]

I am sure ElTerribleMorales meant Ricardo Lopez.

[ElTerribleMorales]

You must be related to Ramirez because you are blindly re-writing history to suit him.

yea cause I don't remember him at all that way lol, and no bud, I was referring to the first fight where Whitaker potshotted him the whole fight and was then ROBBED unlike you state Ramirez was against Arguello and Rosario

as for him being the 3rd or at worst 5th greatest Mexican fighter, you're way off your rocker with that one, Chavez, Sanchez, Zarate, Morales, Barrera, Olivares, Lopez, JMM, Pintor, RM, Vazquez, all rank higher than Ramirez and there are still a few I left out

IMO the top 3 to come out of Mexico just due to records are Chavez, Sanchez, and Lopez

Barrera, Morales, and JMM following behind them

That sounds more like it.

So both of u claim that Jose Luis Lopez , a rookie compared 2 Ramirez in terms of resume , is d 3rd greatest Mexican of all times ? this is still bearable . But Barera , whom got KOd in his prime by Junior Jones and then 4a good measure lost 2 him again , that time by decision , deserves a higher ranking by Ramirez ? even Barera's 2 wins over Morales were close . Almost all of Barera's high profile wins were close decisions , even d Hamed fight n overrated per4mance . I had Barera winning it on points , but looking at that fight as a whole has it much closer than d scorecards have it , with Barera barely if at all doing more damage than Hamed did .

As 4 Ramirez vs Whitaker it seems like both of u r feeding of d writings on that fight that became a false myth , rather than on your memories / impressions from watching it , because any1 who watched that fight knows that Whitaker was only concentrated in escaping , retreating and avoiding contact at all cost and did no damage . "Schooling" is what ppl who hadn't watched d fight , but rather recycle d writings of some common great great ancestor once wrote about it and his lie caught strongly 2 this day . I know it's n agonizing fight 2 watch , but at least i watched it and if u argue this much about it at least watch it and not in FFW like i know that some of u do .
Ramirez deserved 2 win against both Whitaker and Arguello , and at least hadn't lost 2 Rosario in their 1st fight (no2 mention what happened in their rematch) .

Ramirez' record consists of 3 * 3 weights titlists , 1 * 2 weights titlist and I don't even bother checking how many 1 weight titlists . On a side note regarding it , if Pryor hadn't cheated in his 1st fight against Arguello (if not in their rematch as well) , then Arguello would have become a 4 weights titlist . Ramirez himself had 2 settle 4 3 reigns @ d same weight , but something tells me that under a somewhat different management , he would've had a title at at least another weight as well .
1 of d reasons 4 that something is d age and Xperience @ top level he had by d time he was matched vs Ruben Olivares (many of fights on paper , but vs cab drivers Xclusively and by d age of 20) .

no, Ricardo "Finito" Lopez is at worst the 3rd greatest Mexican fighter, the fact that you try to play down guys records such as Barrera and Morales because they have stoppage losses against championship level opposition is retarded, if we were to rate a guy higher solely based on the fact that they were never stopped Chuvalo would be considered the greatest HW of all time

[Spicoli]

Ice...

[frankenfrank]

no, Ricardo "Finito" Lopez is at worst the 3rd greatest Mexican fighter, the fact that you try to play down guys records such as Barrera and Morales because they have stoppage losses against championship level opposition is retarded, if we were to rate a guy higher solely based on the fact that they were never stopped Chuvalo would be considered the greatest HW of all time

1) This is even worse . Lopez beat no1 . His record is null and void . Who did he ever beat ? even Rosendo Alvarez was totally unproven by d time he fought him and did not amount 2 very much after either .
i do rank Barera , Morales and probably even Olivares , Castillo , Herera and Zarate higher than Ricardo Lopez and i bet many more deserve a higher ranking . Julio Cesar Gonzalez achieved more : think of this : went d distance with prime Roy Jones , fought Eric Harding*2 , outpointed a still prime Glen Johnson , fought Montell Griffin , Zsolt Erdei , outpointed n undefeated Dariusz Michalczewski in Germany (!) , fought Tavoris Cloud , was only stopped 1ce in a career that lasted in2 d 35th year of his life and that was still on his feet . Does Ricardo Lopez have 25% of this caliber of names in his record ? i even omitted shot David Telesco and old & undersized Reggie Johnson so i did not even try 2 count names 4 d sake of it . I only counted fights that matter . Hail Julio Gonzalez and may he RIP .
I guess I should list him in my all times top 10 Mexicans . It is 1 thing looking like a great fighting novices who barely know how 2 fight , however , remaining consistently mediocre against top level opponents does prove more .

2) (and) regarding Chuvalo , while on paper he was stopped twice , his loss 2 Foreman was 4 very real and had it been carried on , Foreman would have had him down and taken his head off or something like that . Chuvalo was really helpless against Foreman and that stoppage was legit . Against Frazier i believe it was a thumb or something even worse , so i don't count it really , but Chuvalo was stopped legitimately by George Foreman .
Oliver McCall is 1's choice 4 durability . Also Tua > Chuvalo in this department and in other departments .

[ElTerribleMorales]

no, Ricardo "Finito" Lopez is at worst the 3rd greatest Mexican fighter, the fact that you try to play down guys records such as Barrera and Morales because they have stoppage losses against championship level opposition is retarded, if we were to rate a guy higher solely based on the fact that they were never stopped Chuvalo would be considered the greatest HW of all time

1) This is even worse . Lopez beat no1 . His record is null and void . Who did he ever beat ? even Rosendo Alvarez was totally unproven by d time he fought him and did not amount 2 very much after either .
i do rank Barera , Morales and probably even Olivares , Castillo , Herera and Zarate higher than Ricardo Lopez and i bet many more deserve a higher ranking . Julio Cesar Gonzalez achieved more : think of this : went d distance with prime Roy Jones , fought Eric Harding*2 , outpointed a still prime Glen Johnson , fought Montell Griffin , Zsolt Erdei , outpointed n undefeated Dariusz Michalczewski in Germany (!) , fought Tavoris Cloud , was only stopped 1ce in a career that lasted in2 d 35th year of his life and that was still on his feet . Does Ricardo Lopez have 25% of this caliber of names in his record ? i even omitted shot David Telesco and old & undersized Reggie Johnson so i did not even try 2 count names 4 d sake of it . I only counted fights that matter . Hail Julio Gonzalez and may he RIP .
I guess I should list him in my all times top 10 Mexicans . It is 1 thing looking like a great fighting novices who barely know how 2 fight , however , remaining consistently mediocre against top level opponents does prove more .

2) (and) regarding Chuvalo , while on paper he was stopped twice , his loss 2 Foreman was 4 very real and had it been carried on , Foreman would have had him down and taken his head off or something like that . Chuvalo was really helpless against Foreman and that stoppage was legit . Against Frazier i believe it was a thumb or something even worse , so i don't count it really , but Chuvalo was stopped legitimately by George Foreman .
Oliver McCall is 1's choice 4 durability . Also Tua > Chuvalo in this department and in other departments .

hahaha Lopez was nearly a grandfather by the time he fought Alvarez, Lord knows how many title defenses and is regarded the greatest fighter from 105 to 110, only fighters to even be called close to him at that weight are Carbajal and Ivan Calderon

you're bat shit crazy if you're trying to downplay how fucking great Finito Lopez was, IMO he's one of the most technically gifted fighter to ever step into the ring regardless what country, and he was in a completely different category than Ramirez, and again Chuvalo was just an example that durability or the ability to take a beating doesn't make anyone the greatest of anything, Ali was stopped (albeit when he was shot to shit) yet in many people's eyes he's the greatest HW of all time

[frankenfrank]

hahaha Lopez was nearly a grandfather by the time he fought Alvarez, Lord knows how many title defenses and is regarded the greatest fighter from 105 to 110, only fighters to even be called close to him at that weight are Carbajal and Ivan Calderon

you're bat shit crazy if you're trying to downplay how fucking great Finito Lopez was, IMO he's one of the most technically gifted fighter to ever step into the ring regardless what country, and he was in a completely different category than Ramirez, and again Chuvalo was just an example that durability or the ability to take a beating doesn't make anyone the greatest of anything, Ali was stopped (albeit when he was shot to shit) yet in many people's eyes he's the greatest HW of all time

so u agree with me on Julio gonzalez > Ricardo Lopez .
Also Michael Carbajal > Ricardo Lopez and i've never seen any1 who claimed that Ivan Calderon was even d greatest at either 1 of his 2 weights let alone 0-110 . And then there's never been such a division as 110 .. so IDK where your claims r coming from . Ricardo Lopez is a total unproven who only beat bums and barely got by Rosendo Alvarez who also only ever beat bums .

[TitoFan]

hahaha Lopez was nearly a grandfather by the time he fought Alvarez, Lord knows how many title defenses and is regarded the greatest fighter from 105 to 110, only fighters to even be called close to him at that weight are Carbajal and Ivan Calderon

you're bat shit crazy if you're trying to downplay how fucking great Finito Lopez was, IMO he's one of the most technically gifted fighter to ever step into the ring regardless what country, and he was in a completely different category than Ramirez, and again Chuvalo was just an example that durability or the ability to take a beating doesn't make anyone the greatest of anything, Ali was stopped (albeit when he was shot to shit) yet in many people's eyes he's the greatest HW of all time

so u agree with me on Julio gonzalez > Ricardo Lopez .
Also Michael Carbajal > Ricardo Lopez and i've never seen any1 who claimed that Ivan Calderon was even d greatest at either 1 of his 2 weights let alone 0-110 . And then there's never been such a division as 110 .. so IDK where your claims r coming from . Ricardo Lopez is a total unproven who only beat bums and barely got by Rosendo Alvarez who also only ever beat bums .

Terrible, I think Franken is referring to Ricardo Lopez from Tijuana.
(See below)


Ricardo Lopez - Boxer

[ElTerribleMorales]

hahaha Lopez was nearly a grandfather by the time he fought Alvarez, Lord knows how many title defenses and is regarded the greatest fighter from 105 to 110, only fighters to even be called close to him at that weight are Carbajal and Ivan Calderon

you're bat shit crazy if you're trying to downplay how fucking great Finito Lopez was, IMO he's one of the most technically gifted fighter to ever step into the ring regardless what country, and he was in a completely different category than Ramirez, and again Chuvalo was just an example that durability or the ability to take a beating doesn't make anyone the greatest of anything, Ali was stopped (albeit when he was shot to shit) yet in many people's eyes he's the greatest HW of all time

so u agree with me on Julio gonzalez > Ricardo Lopez .
Also Michael Carbajal > Ricardo Lopez and i've never seen any1 who claimed that Ivan Calderon was even d greatest at either 1 of his 2 weights let alone 0-110 . And then there's never been such a division as 110 .. so IDK where your claims r coming from . Ricardo Lopez is a total unproven who only beat bums and barely got by Rosendo Alvarez who also only ever beat bums .

Terrible, I think Franken is referring to Ricardo Lopez from Tijuana.
(See below)


Ricardo Lopez - Boxer

must be because the guy is smoking crack downplaying the most brilliant technician to come out of Mexico in Finito

given his logic Camacho should be ranked the greatest Puerto Rican fighter since he was never dropped let alone stopped , but in reality Trinidad, Benitez, Gomez, and Cotto clearly all rank higher then him as well as bunch of others

and Calderon has been considered the best fighter at 105 and 108 for the last 5 years until well his legs finally went out and he finally slowed and lost to Segura, only reason he didn't get as much media attention was due to his lack of power but in his prime he beat all comers and completely dominated

[frankenfrank]

must be because the guy is smoking crack downplaying the most brilliant technician to come out of Mexico in Finito

who did Ricardo Lopez beat again ?

given his logic Camacho should be ranked the greatest Puerto Rican fighter since he was never dropped

Here u r examplifying your ignorance , again , looking very confident in doing so , again . Edwin Rosario dropped Hector Camacho . Pity u never watched it , but i did .
That Edwin Rosario also dropped Ramirez more than once in their rematch and was close 2 stopping him , until Ramirez stopped him . Rosario is also d only man whom stopped Livingstone Bramble .

let alone stopped , but in reality Trinidad, Benitez, Gomez, and Cotto clearly all rank higher then him as well as bunch of others

in your ignorant list they r , in my list Camacho is only preceded by LaPorte .
Trinidad and Gomez were cheaters , each 1 in his own way . Gomez was stopped both by Nelson and by Sanchez whom stopped Nelson . Every1 is great in your list , unless d greats of course .
So your criteria 4 being great is :
having 1-2 wins against good opponents , .. , being popular of course (!) , losing only by way of stoppage , because losing a decision is unforgiven , but as long as 1 gets his S drilled and then handed 2 him by d way of filmed evdeince , it's great .
Both Sanchez and Nelson stopped him . If Gomez was that great (and he wasn't) then u must agree with me at least about Sanchez whom stopped both Gomez and d man whom KOd him in Nelson , 2 b not only d greatest Mexican of all times but also d greatest featherweight of all times .

and Calderon has been considered the best fighter at 105 and 108 for the last 5 years until well his legs finally went out and he finally slowed and lost to Segura, only reason he didn't get as much media attention was due to his lack of power but in his prime he beat all comers and completely dominated

u2 r d only 1s who appreciate him this much . PPL more familiar than myself and yourself with d history of d below 115 showed no appreciation 4 him .
I personally think that he was good , but probably not very good because :
1) he barely if at all beat any1 of note (like Ricardo Lopez)
2) even vs nobodies he could rarely win impressively (unlike Ricardo Lopez)

[ElTerribleMorales]

must be because the guy is smoking crack downplaying the most brilliant technician to come out of Mexico in Finito

who did Ricardo Lopez beat again ?

given his logic Camacho should be ranked the greatest Puerto Rican fighter since he was never dropped

Here u r examplifying your ignorance , again , looking very confident in doing so , again . Edwin Rosario dropped Hector Camacho . Pity u never watched it , but i did .
That Edwin Rosario also dropped Ramirez more than once in their rematch and was close 2 stopping him , until Ramirez stopped him . Rosario is also d only man whom stopped Livingstone Bramble .

let alone stopped , but in reality Trinidad, Benitez, Gomez, and Cotto clearly all rank higher then him as well as bunch of others

in your ignorant list they r , in my list Camacho is only preceded by LaPorte .
Trinidad and Gomez were cheaters , each 1 in his own way . Gomez was stopped both by Nelson and by Sanchez whom stopped Nelson . Every1 is great in your list , unless d greats of course .
So your criteria 4 being great is :
having 1-2 wins against good opponents , .. , being popular of course (!) , losing only by way of stoppage , because losing a decision is unforgiven , but as long as 1 gets his S drilled and then handed 2 him by d way of filmed evdeince , it's great .
Both Sanchez and Nelson stopped him . If Gomez was that great (and he wasn't) then u must agree with me at least about Sanchez whom stopped both Gomez and d man whom KOd him in Nelson , 2 b not only d greatest Mexican of all times but also d greatest featherweight of all times .

and Calderon has been considered the best fighter at 105 and 108 for the last 5 years until well his legs finally went out and he finally slowed and lost to Segura, only reason he didn't get as much media attention was due to his lack of power but in his prime he beat all comers and completely dominated

u2 r d only 1s who appreciate him this much . PPL more familiar than myself and yourself with d history of d below 115 showed no appreciation 4 him .
I personally think that he was good , but probably not very good because :
1) he barely if at all beat any1 of note (like Ricardo Lopez)
2) even vs nobodies he could rarely win impressively (unlike Ricardo Lopez)

amazing how you re-write history to fit your favorites, I've learned not to argue with the mentally challenged so on that note I'll let you keep hitting the pipe and just walk away, all I have to say is that Ramirez isn't even close to the top 20 of Mexican greats, much less greatest Latino fighters, you solely base greatness on the ability of taking a fucking punch when there are plenty of GREAT fighters who were chinny, Hearns and Jones pretty damn high on that list, maybe when you come down to REALITY well then that's when you'll be taken seriously

[frankenfrank]

amazing how you re-write history to fit your favorites, I've learned not to argue with the mentally challenged so on that note I'll let you keep hitting the pipe and just walk away, all I have to say is that Ramirez isn't even close to the top 20 of Mexican greats, much less greatest Latino fighters, you solely base greatness on the ability of taking a fucking punch when there are plenty of GREAT fighters who were chinny, Hearns and Jones pretty damn high on that list, maybe when you come down to REALITY well then that's when you'll be taken seriously

4d 3rd time : who did Ricardo Lopez beat ?
u keep posting shit , quoting my post , seemingly replying but repeatedly ignoring my simple questions .

U only listed a top 20 4 PR , i really wonder how your top 10 , let alone 20 , of Mexico will look like without Ramirez . He just wasn't chinny enough , was he ? maybe u'd have changed your mind after watching him getting nearly destroyed by Rosario in their rematch , or seemingly dropped by d lighter hitting Camacho . But watching fights is below your level . U don't need 2 watch fights . u were born with d knowledge of greatness .