I can't remember seeing a better fighter than prime Floyd Mayweather Jr

[IamInuit]

floyd very well could be the best, he looks pretty untouchable at the minute

and as sport progresses it is hard to see anyone in the past beating him, just as the manchester united of today would beat the best of the united teams of yesteryear the best boxers today would beat the best boxers of the past

A problem you will have in this thread is people look at the past with rose tinted glasses, try and tell anyone that any HW since Ali had a chance of beating him, yet there are several before who would have given him a fight

Its not hard to see at all and it does not mean I'm wearing rose coloured glasses.I'm not getting into another debate on the past vs the now as it goes nowhere. There is pro and con on both sides and you cant compare a team sport like soccer to an individual sport such as boxing. Floyd is w/o a doubt the best and most complete fighter of his generation.

whats soccer?

also boxing progresses more than team sports

the gulf in boxing would be more apparent because of the the emphasis on fitness in boxing and the advances in sports science (not to discount boxing technique advances)

Wladimir Klitchko would KO Ali within a few rounds, if ali was around today and had the benefit of the advances that today offers the fight would be different

so relatively to their generaltion floyd might not be that far ahead but if he was to actually share the ring with fighters of the past only as good / fit / athletic as they were in the past there would be little contest

Oh yeah you guys call it football. Sorry about that eric.

"boxing progresses more then team sports" is a statement and not a fact. Boxers have been training in similar fashion for about a hundred years. Many boxers still use all kinds of old school methods as a major part of training. Which progresses more is certainly up for debate. With all of this improvement in science, nutrition and sports medicine, there sure seems to be a lot of fighters across the spectrum of weight that gas out.

That Wlad would ko Ali is just an opinion also and does not speak the the issue here. Nor is it evidence for your desired conclusion See now I think Wlad would resemble Carnera if he fought Ali.

I'm not sure Floyd beats any of the fab 4 from the eighties 5 if you add Benitez let alone everyone in history from 135 to 147. He's brilliant and in real time but that's a huge leap.

Peace

[erics44]

Oh yeah you guys call it football. Sorry about that eric.

"boxing progresses more then team sports" is a statement and not a fact. Boxers have been training in similar fashion for about a hundred years. Many boxers still use all kinds of old school methods as a major part of training. Which progresses more is certainly up for debate. With all of this improvement in science, nutrition and sports medicine, there sure seems to be a lot of fighters across the spectrum of weight that gas out.

That Wlad would ko Ali is just an opinion also and does not speak the the issue here. Nor is it evidence for your desired conclusion See now I think Wlad would resemble Carnera if he fought Ali.

I'm not sure Floyd beats any of the fab 4 from the eighties 5 if you add Benitez let alone everyone in history from 135 to 147. He's brilliant and in real time but that's a huge leap.

Peace

fighters at the top level "Gas Out" the same as they have always done but dont forget their opposition is also "relatively" fitter and stronger

the fab four is overrated because of the situation they were in, im not saying they werent deserved of their stature im just saying as there were 4 fighters with as big a following and interest around at the same time is why they are so fondly remembered

ill give you a shining example of how fighters can be remembered for more than they were - Eubank and Benn will always be remembered most fondly by the british public, a fantastic rivalry at world level, the best we have ever had, when in reality they may not have even been the best 2 SMW from britain at the time

and yep Wlad KOing Ali is an opinion

if Ali was around today and the klits werent, because of ali's personality and what he did outside the ring, in 40 years we would be talking about the golden era of heavyweights, remember them 3 fights between ali and adamek, then the ali v eddie chambers fight, imagine having so many great hws around all at the same time, Ali, Adamek, Chambers, Areolla, Haye, Tony Thompson

[Rantcatrat]

Oh yeah you guys call it football. Sorry about that eric.

"boxing progresses more then team sports" is a statement and not a fact. Boxers have been training in similar fashion for about a hundred years. Many boxers still use all kinds of old school methods as a major part of training. Which progresses more is certainly up for debate. With all of this improvement in science, nutrition and sports medicine, there sure seems to be a lot of fighters across the spectrum of weight that gas out.

That Wlad would ko Ali is just an opinion also and does not speak the the issue here. Nor is it evidence for your desired conclusion See now I think Wlad would resemble Carnera if he fought Ali.

I'm not sure Floyd beats any of the fab 4 from the eighties 5 if you add Benitez let alone everyone in history from 135 to 147. He's brilliant and in real time but that's a huge leap.

Peace

fighters at the top level "Gas Out" the same as they have always done but dont forget their opposition is also "relatively" fitter and stronger

the fab four is overrated because of the situation they were in, im not saying they werent deserved of their stature im just saying as there were 4 fighters with as big a following and interest around at the same time is why they are so fondly remembered

ill give you a shining example of how fighters can be remembered for more than they were - Eubank and Benn will always be remembered most fondly by the british public, a fantastic rivalry at world level, the best we have ever had, when in reality they may not have even been the best 2 SMW from britain at the time

and yep Wlad KOing Ali is an opinion

if Ali was around today and the klits werent, because of ali's personality and what he did outside the ring, in 40 years we would be talking about the golden era of heavyweights, remember them 3 fights between ali and adamek, then the ali v eddie chambers fight, imagine having so many great hws around all at the same time, Ali, Adamek, Chambers, Areolla, Haye, Tony Thompson

There were trainers, like Ray Arcel, who saw fighters from the 20's up to the 90's. They had the historical perspective to be able to analyze contemporary greatness. There are others like him.

[erics44]

There were trainers, like Ray Arcel, who saw fighters from the 20's up to the 90's. They had the historical perspective to be able to analyze contemporary greatness. There are others like him.

dont know what you mean

[bzkfn]

There were trainers, like Ray Arcel, who saw fighters from the 20's up to the 90's. They had the historical perspective to be able to analyze contemporary greatness. There are others like him.

dont know what you mean

He means that to analyse the best fighters you'd have to ask an expert who has been there through a long time period. A trainer like Ray Arcel would have seen it all. Hard to argue with that.

[Fenster]

There were trainers, like Ray Arcel, who saw fighters from the 20's up to the 90's. They had the historical perspective to be able to analyze contemporary greatness. There are others like him.

dont know what you mean

He means that to analyse the best fighters you'd have to ask an expert who has been there through a long time period. A trainer like Ray Arcel would have seen it all. Hard to argue with that.

However, just because Ray Arcel says some dude from the 30s would whip all the current guys means absolutely nothing.

In this modern day, with the benefit of seeing every single fight take place, great trainers and fighters consistently get fights wrong. So why exactly should their "opinion" hold so much weight when comparing fighters from completely different generations?

Boxing is the only sport in the world that apparently stopped evolving and went backwards. Somehow, modern fighters lost the ability to correctly move their arms and legs ().

[Rantcatrat]

There were trainers, like Ray Arcel, who saw fighters from the 20's up to the 90's. They had the historical perspective to be able to analyze contemporary greatness. There are others like him.

dont know what you mean

He means that to analyse the best fighters you'd have to ask an expert who has been there through a long time period. A trainer like Ray Arcel would have seen it all. Hard to argue with that.

However, just because Ray Arcel says some dude from the 30s would whip all the current guys means absolutely nothing.

In this modern day, with the benefit of seeing every single fight take place, great trainers and fighters consistently get fights wrong. So why exactly should their "opinion" hold so much weight when comparing fighters from completely different generations?

Boxing is the only sport in the world that apparently stopped evolving and went backwards. Somehow, modern fighters lost the ability to correctly move their arms and legs ().

There were many more boxers/trainers/experts on boxing between 1920 and 1960 than there are now. There were many more places to learn the craft and refine one's approach. Think about it. In the worst ghetto of Chicago, a den of organized crime, in the first 40 years of the last century, boxing was the most popular sport. There were boxing gyms all over the place. There were fight cards multiple times every week. The biggest stars in the United States weren't football players or basketball players, they were boxers. When they held a lightweight tournament to see who would inherit Benny Leonard's crown in the twenties, 50 people from all over world showed up to fight in it. It only took 6 months to crown a new champion. So, yes, I actually believe boxing has regressed to an extent. There is just no way it couldn't.

To me it's a bit remarkable to think that someone like Jack Dempsey could author an intricate manual on boxing:

Championship Fighting : Jack Dempsey : Free Download & Streaming : Internet Archive

There is just no way that someone who thought and experimented so much with boxing with the challengers he faced isn't a legend. How many guys that you watch on FNF, Showtime, or HBO even know half those tricks?

This is not to put down our generation of fighters at all. There are absolutely still great talents out there. I just think there aren't as many of them, and, thus,l it's harder to determine how good they really are.

[erics44]

There were trainers, like Ray Arcel, who saw fighters from the 20's up to the 90's. They had the historical perspective to be able to analyze contemporary greatness. There are others like him.

dont know what you mean

He means that to analyse the best fighters you'd have to ask an expert who has been there through a long time period. A trainer like Ray Arcel would have seen it all. Hard to argue with that.

yeah he's spot on with that, Ray would have all the answers

anyone got his number?

[bzkfn]

There were trainers, like Ray Arcel, who saw fighters from the 20's up to the 90's. They had the historical perspective to be able to analyze contemporary greatness. There are others like him.

dont know what you mean

He means that to analyse the best fighters you'd have to ask an expert who has been there through a long time period. A trainer like Ray Arcel would have seen it all. Hard to argue with that.

yeah he's spot on with that, Ray would have all the answers

anyone got his number?

eric being a dick as usual I see.

Asking someone who was there is just better than asking someone who is witnessing a grainy black and white picture, or what they've read from a newspaper cutting. That goes without saying. Nobody is sat there saying that guy has all the answers, just that they would have a more informed opinion having seen things first hand.