UK - Council and European Election

[Master]

Dark Lord Al you are entitled to your opinion but do not mix refugees with immigrants.

Also the real issues are the bankers being subsidised, cuts in public services through dogma and political ideology and millionaires being allowed to avoid taxes.

yes those are issues - but just the same as what Al highlights you knobrot. All real issues

I was out in Leeds late other night and was shocked at the number on the streets in town centre just lined up in shop doorways. Enough

The rest and most of them are doing low paid jobs that most people on benefits do not want to do such as cleaning toilets, working in care homes and doing night shifts.

So you make the people on the dole do those job for fucks sake , you change the system , if an immigrant is on a low income he doesn't even pay tax , and we give his family and him health care and education , for fucks sake do the fucking maths .

Do you see me write aggressively, getting emotional, swearing and calling you names?

Reality is the immigrants work for below the minimum wage which is why people are benefits do not take them as they are better off on benefits. They are here because they can earn a better standard of living here than over there. Yes they use the NHS and some commit crimes but where they can they contribute to our culture, society and the economy, as will their children and subsequent generation.

[Dia bando]

Dark Lord Al you are entitled to your opinion but do not mix refugees with immigrants.

Also the real issues are the bankers being subsidised, cuts in public services through dogma and political ideology and millionaires being allowed to avoid taxes.

yes those are issues - but just the same as what Al highlights you knobrot. All real issues

I was out in Leeds late other night and was shocked at the number on the streets in town centre just lined up in shop doorways. Enough

The rest and most of them are doing low paid jobs that most people on benefits do not want to do such as cleaning toilets, working in care homes and doing night shifts.

So you make the people on the dole do those job for fucks sake , you change the system , if an immigrant is on a low income he doesn't even pay tax , and we give his family and him health care and education , for fucks sake do the fucking maths .

Do you see me write aggressively, getting emotional, swearing and calling you names?

Reality is the immigrants work for below the minimum wage which is why people are benefits do not take them as they are better off on benefits. They are here because they can earn a better standard of living here than over there. Yes they use the NHS and some commit crimes but where they can they contribute to our culture, society and the economy, as will their children and subsequent generation.

I agree with you on some point, but driving wages does not help any body bar the employers, and
the employers are taking advantage of this lower wages, friends of mine have lost there jobs to
eastern block workers, they lost there jobs of £7 plus per hour and there jobs went to eastern block
workers on less than minimum wage.
Sorry to say this is happening all over the country, and UKIP have a field day with this information
true, but they never say about the employers exploiting workers immigrant and non immigrant workers
it a disgrace. We are returning to the dark ages, cap in hand, groveling on hands and knees, to the
bosses, we are now devolving it makes me sick.

[Master]

Dark Lord Al you are entitled to your opinion but do not mix refugees with immigrants.

Also the real issues are the bankers being subsidised, cuts in public services through dogma and political ideology and millionaires being allowed to avoid taxes.

yes those are issues - but just the same as what Al highlights you knobrot. All real issues

I was out in Leeds late other night and was shocked at the number on the streets in town centre just lined up in shop doorways. Enough

The rest and most of them are doing low paid jobs that most people on benefits do not want to do such as cleaning toilets, working in care homes and doing night shifts.

So you make the people on the dole do those job for fucks sake , you change the system , if an immigrant is on a low income he doesn't even pay tax , and we give his family and him health care and education , for fucks sake do the fucking maths .

Do you see me write aggressively, getting emotional, swearing and calling you names?

Reality is the immigrants work for below the minimum wage which is why people are benefits do not take them as they are better off on benefits. They are here because they can earn a better standard of living here than over there. Yes they use the NHS and some commit crimes but where they can they contribute to our culture, society and the economy, as will their children and subsequent generation.

I agree with you on some point, but driving wages does not help any body bar the employers, and
the employers are taking advantage of this lower wages, friends of mine have lost there jobs to
eastern block workers, they lost there jobs of £7 plus per hour and there jobs went to eastern block
workers on less than minimum wage.
Sorry to say this is happening all over the country, and UKIP have a field day with this information
true, but they never say about the employers exploiting workers immigrant and non immigrant workers
it a disgrace. We are returning to the dark ages, cap in hand, groveling on hands and knees, to the
bosses, we are now devolving it makes me sick.

What can be worse is that these people have to pay the traffickers which gets them in further debt.

[mattboxingfan]

I have no problem with people moving to England to better there lives. If you are born in a poor country with little opportunities why stay there and suffer? We are lucky to have been born in a wealthy prospering country. Why not share that with others who are less fortunate?

The real problem is people who live in this country and choose not to work and instead live off benefits. They come from both sides. People born in England and people who have immigrated here. I would happily deport them to a desert island.

But we can't stop people who want to come to England to better themselves and improve there family's lives that's just wrong.

[Kirkland Laing]

Dark Lord Al you are entitled to your opinion but do not mix refugees with immigrants.

Also the real issues are the bankers being subsidised, cuts in public services through dogma and political ideology and millionaires being allowed to avoid taxes.

yes those are issues - but just the same as what Al highlights you knobrot. All real issues

I was out in Leeds late other night and was shocked at the number on the streets in town centre just lined up in shop doorways. Enough

The rest and most of them are doing low paid jobs that most people on benefits do not want to do such as cleaning toilets, working in care homes and doing night shifts.

So you make the people on the dole do those job for fucks sake , you change the system , if an immigrant is on a low income he doesn't even pay tax , and we give his family and him health care and education , for fucks sake do the fucking maths .

Do you see me write aggressively, getting emotional, swearing and calling you names?

Reality is the immigrants work for below the minimum wage which is why people are benefits do not take them as they are better off on benefits. They are here because they can earn a better standard of living here than over there. Yes they use the NHS and some commit crimes but where they can they contribute to our culture, society and the economy, as will their children and subsequent generation.

The thing is the "contribute to society" bit is normally a contribution to big and small business profits. It's great for business and the country's GDP but not so great for the people already living in the country as they face increased competition for work, housing, access to school places, healthcare and other social services.

"Contribute to society" is just a mantra repeated by politicians who are just a bunch of corporate servants, saying what they're told to say by the people who fund their parties.

[Master]

Dark Lord Al you are entitled to your opinion but do not mix refugees with immigrants.

Also the real issues are the bankers being subsidised, cuts in public services through dogma and political ideology and millionaires being allowed to avoid taxes.

yes those are issues - but just the same as what Al highlights you knobrot. All real issues

I was out in Leeds late other night and was shocked at the number on the streets in town centre just lined up in shop doorways. Enough

The rest and most of them are doing low paid jobs that most people on benefits do not want to do such as cleaning toilets, working in care homes and doing night shifts.

So you make the people on the dole do those job for fucks sake , you change the system , if an immigrant is on a low income he doesn't even pay tax , and we give his family and him health care and education , for fucks sake do the fucking maths .

Do you see me write aggressively, getting emotional, swearing and calling you names?

Reality is the immigrants work for below the minimum wage which is why people are benefits do not take them as they are better off on benefits. They are here because they can earn a better standard of living here than over there. Yes they use the NHS and some commit crimes but where they can they contribute to our culture, society and the economy, as will their children and subsequent generation.

The thing is the "contribute to society" bit is normally a contribution to big and small business profits. It's great for business and the country's GDP but not so great for the people already living in the country as they face increased competition for work, housing, access to school places, healthcare and other social services.

"Contribute to society" is just a mantra repeated by politicians who are just a bunch of corporate servants, saying what they're told to say by the people who fund their parties.

It is also a real concept, they pay taxes, play a role in the community as do we all. Why should it not be different for them and their children?

[Kirkland Laing]

Dark Lord Al you are entitled to your opinion but do not mix refugees with immigrants.

Also the real issues are the bankers being subsidised, cuts in public services through dogma and political ideology and millionaires being allowed to avoid taxes.

yes those are issues - but just the same as what Al highlights you knobrot. All real issues

I was out in Leeds late other night and was shocked at the number on the streets in town centre just lined up in shop doorways. Enough

The rest and most of them are doing low paid jobs that most people on benefits do not want to do such as cleaning toilets, working in care homes and doing night shifts.

So you make the people on the dole do those job for fucks sake , you change the system , if an immigrant is on a low income he doesn't even pay tax , and we give his family and him health care and education , for fucks sake do the fucking maths .

Do you see me write aggressively, getting emotional, swearing and calling you names?

Reality is the immigrants work for below the minimum wage which is why people are benefits do not take them as they are better off on benefits. They are here because they can earn a better standard of living here than over there. Yes they use the NHS and some commit crimes but where they can they contribute to our culture, society and the economy, as will their children and subsequent generation.

The thing is the "contribute to society" bit is normally a contribution to big and small business profits. It's great for business and the country's GDP but not so great for the people already living in the country as they face increased competition for work, housing, access to school places, healthcare and other social services.

"Contribute to society" is just a mantra repeated by politicians who are just a bunch of corporate servants, saying what they're told to say by the people who fund their parties.

It is also a real concept, they pay taxes, play a role in the community as do we all. Why should it not be different for them and their children?

It's a case of balancing the positives and negatives of immigration. Right now all the positives accrue to a tiny minority of the existing population while all the negatives fall on the vast majority of the existing population.

[Master]

Dark Lord Al you are entitled to your opinion but do not mix refugees with immigrants.

Also the real issues are the bankers being subsidised, cuts in public services through dogma and political ideology and millionaires being allowed to avoid taxes.

yes those are issues - but just the same as what Al highlights you knobrot. All real issues

I was out in Leeds late other night and was shocked at the number on the streets in town centre just lined up in shop doorways. Enough

The rest and most of them are doing low paid jobs that most people on benefits do not want to do such as cleaning toilets, working in care homes and doing night shifts.

So you make the people on the dole do those job for fucks sake , you change the system , if an immigrant is on a low income he doesn't even pay tax , and we give his family and him health care and education , for fucks sake do the fucking maths .

Do you see me write aggressively, getting emotional, swearing and calling you names?

Reality is the immigrants work for below the minimum wage which is why people are benefits do not take them as they are better off on benefits. They are here because they can earn a better standard of living here than over there. Yes they use the NHS and some commit crimes but where they can they contribute to our culture, society and the economy, as will their children and subsequent generation.

The thing is the "contribute to society" bit is normally a contribution to big and small business profits. It's great for business and the country's GDP but not so great for the people already living in the country as they face increased competition for work, housing, access to school places, healthcare and other social services.

"Contribute to society" is just a mantra repeated by politicians who are just a bunch of corporate servants, saying what they're told to say by the people who fund their parties.

It is also a real concept, they pay taxes, play a role in the community as do we all. Why should it not be different for them and their children?

It's a case of balancing the positives and negatives of immigration. Right now all the positives accrue to a tiny minority of the existing population while all the negatives fall on the vast majority of the existing population.

The positives come when their children get educated and earn good salaries and they pay taxes.

[Kirkland Laing]

Dark Lord Al you are entitled to your opinion but do not mix refugees with immigrants.

Also the real issues are the bankers being subsidised, cuts in public services through dogma and political ideology and millionaires being allowed to avoid taxes.

yes those are issues - but just the same as what Al highlights you knobrot. All real issues

I was out in Leeds late other night and was shocked at the number on the streets in town centre just lined up in shop doorways. Enough

The rest and most of them are doing low paid jobs that most people on benefits do not want to do such as cleaning toilets, working in care homes and doing night shifts.

So you make the people on the dole do those job for fucks sake , you change the system , if an immigrant is on a low income he doesn't even pay tax , and we give his family and him health care and education , for fucks sake do the fucking maths .

Do you see me write aggressively, getting emotional, swearing and calling you names?

Reality is the immigrants work for below the minimum wage which is why people are benefits do not take them as they are better off on benefits. They are here because they can earn a better standard of living here than over there. Yes they use the NHS and some commit crimes but where they can they contribute to our culture, society and the economy, as will their children and subsequent generation.

The thing is the "contribute to society" bit is normally a contribution to big and small business profits. It's great for business and the country's GDP but not so great for the people already living in the country as they face increased competition for work, housing, access to school places, healthcare and other social services.

"Contribute to society" is just a mantra repeated by politicians who are just a bunch of corporate servants, saying what they're told to say by the people who fund their parties.

It is also a real concept, they pay taxes, play a role in the community as do we all. Why should it not be different for them and their children?

It's a case of balancing the positives and negatives of immigration. Right now all the positives accrue to a tiny minority of the existing population while all the negatives fall on the vast majority of the existing population.

The positives come when their children get educated and earn good salaries and they pay taxes.

'

So you get a vast number of negatives for twenty years before you may, if the kids so actually gain skilled work rather than just adding to the pool of unskilled labour, get a positive.

I told you last week that the vast majority of immigrants are just adding to the un and semi skilled labout pool and driving down wages of existing Brits, competing with them for housing and social services. And look what we get at the weekend. Old Labour surfaces :

Ed Miliband is facing a backbench revolt over immigration policy as senior Labour MPs publicly warn of catastrophic consequences for the party unless he seeks constraints on the free movement of EU workers.The unrestricted entry of EU citizens from eastern Europe since 2004 is hurting the "very communities that the Labour party was founded to represent", the MPs claim in an open letter published in the Observer.


[..]


The Labour MPs, who represent constituencies from across Britain, claim that "concern with immigration has become an increasingly important priority for a large proportion of working- and middle-class voters".
In one section of the letter they write: "Whilst the benefits of mass migration have been served in abundance to many wealthy people, who are in a position to take advantage of cheap labour, we believe that the lack of affordable housing, school places, hospital capacity and transport infrastructure to accommodate this influx of people means that poorer people's living standards have been squeezed."








Labour must take tougher line on 'mass migration' from Europe, Miliband told | Politics | The Observer




Also, the Danish version of UKIP, the DPP won their elections:




"I think they were going to vote for the DPP, period. The sad fact, speaking as a lifelong Social Democrat, is this: we no longer represent the people we claim to represent. There's a disconnect between voters and the political class."
At fault, Fogh said, is partly a system that produces "young politicians, very bright, very decent, very able – but political science or law graduates who've shaped their lives into becoming politicians, and who represent no one. If you want to represent the working class, you know, it might help to have a few people who've actually worked."
It is an alienation from career politicians perceived as at best out-of-touch and at worst self-serving or corrupt that was also reflected, on the right, in record support for Marine Le Pen's Front National in France and Ukip in Britain, and on the left in countries such as Greece, where the anti-austerity radicals of Syriza topped the poll, and Spain, where a 100-day-old citizen's party, Podemos, captured five seats.
That popular detachment is aggravated in Denmark and elsewhere, Fogh said, by the traditional parties of the right and left pursuing "almost the same policies. Here, there are heated rows about whether the public sector should be frozen, or grow by 0.5% over 15 years. That's it. This is now the fault line. How many people feel that discussion is relevant to them?"


Denmark votes to defend meatballs – via party with the ordinary voice | World news | theguardian.com




The Labour backbenchers are now calling for a points system of immigration like Australia has, like I was advocating last week.


The big problem is that our politicians arrogantly assumed they could run the country without following Kirkland Laing's advice. Now they're beginning to accept the folly of not having listened to the advice of Kirkland Laing, The Infallible One.

[El Kabong]

Beanz, I'm surprised anyone bothers attempting to debate miles anymore....why waste your time? Like many lefties he has no thoughts of his own, he only parrots what guys like Chomsky spout.


Chomsky is a LINGUIST....why anyone gives credence to what a linguist thinks about anything other than words is beyond me. He holds himself (and his held by others) in a much higher than he deserves.

[Beanz]

Beanz, I'm surprised anyone bothers attempting to debate miles anymore....why waste your time? Like many lefties he has no thoughts of his own, he only parrots what guys like Chomsky spout.


Chomsky is a LINGUIST....why anyone gives credence to what a linguist thinks about anything other than words is beyond me. He holds himself (and his held by others) in a much higher than he deserves.

The thing is Miles is not a leftie. Miles is just words with a big stash of gold bars and a seething disrespect for everybody in England, in fact anybody who is not him. I just voted for the Trade Unionist and Socialist Coalition in the local Elections and the Green Party for the European Parliament so I lean about as far left as you can before falling over and yet I can find little in common with Miles and his England for the English tirade and the preposterous position of him being an Immigrant himself and yet being completely devoid of empathy or common sense. I voted left and I find myself doing so because my country is falling so far over to the right that a handful of pointy headed members of the old boys club have ended up running the show and have robbed the coffers from those below.

This whole debate has been massively skewed and weighted form the start. With Miles and Kirkland keen to class all immigrants as the problem and ignore ANY positive contributions that have been made in the hundreds of years of settlers making this country what it is.

[Beanz]

Kirkland you are full of yourself and even fuller of shit. My personal experience of Immigrants form Eastern Europe on a one to one level is my friend from Lithuania who came here about 5 years ago and now has built his one man business up to the point that he now employs three English people, two of whom he trained up from promising unemployed artists into fully qualified and highly skilled tattoo artists.

You will dismiss that as not representative of most Eastern European immigrants but the point is you and Miles are suggesting that all Immigration is about taking benefits and jobs not creating them and paying taxes. You are clearly just presenting one side of a much more complex argument.

[Beanz]

Miles get your head out of your arse you would not last 5 minutes as a single Mother and stop fucking condemning everyone you judgemental cunt. You were apparently brought up by a single Mother so have some respect and stop assuming everyone but you is a sponger. My Brother in law did History and Politics at Uni like you and he is an insufferable prick too.

[Gandalf]

So there we go, Breenbeanz gives in to ad hoc personal attacks as egged on by Lyle, who hasn't made a meaningful post since coming back. There is a reason I am not a single parent and it is because I take responsibility for my actions. If more people did so, then the UK could actually be a place with lower taxes and a more just system. I condemn all who make the most terrible personal choices and potentially fuck with the lives of innocent young people in a society that will most likely continue the cycles of poverty and misery. Marriages go wrong and fair enough, but my concern is where there has never been marriage, the woman has never worked, and still breeds. It is a British problem and the 'rewards' need to be extinguished. If you have never contributed then how can you make claims on the state? It's wrong.

I respect all people who make sensible decisions, plan their lives, and try to get ahead, but in truth it is very hard in England because at the top the spongers don't pay taxes, or are the monarchy, or Dave's banking mates, then at the bottom swathes of people who are bone idle. Everyone else works hard but is screwed as they are paying for the top and the bottom. That is where I am not socialist at all. I am a libertarian, with a few arguments for some core nationalisation. It isn't socialism by any traditional measure, it's a policy of reducing government and taxes, and saying get off your arses. I don't think you should pay for the idleness of others. And as for immigrants then skimming basic wages down, it is criminal that there is even a debate on the issue. Nobody cares for the hard working Brits.

I have to say that I am disappointed with your last two posts Greenbeanz which have been cuntish. You have nothing left to argue and so it boils down to miles has no empathy and is a cunt and Kirkland too. You never sit down to think why you are the lone voice in threads like this. It is you who lack the judgment.

[Beanz]

The reason you have never been a single parent Miles is contrary to all evidence you are actually a man with no womb. Therefore you are highly unlikely to be abandoned by your philandering seed spreading boyfriend. I have a friend who is a single parent and they have worked throughout their childs life because they work in Education with a creche on site. They are also a man.

You are so very predictable and hypocritical. Can you really believe any of the vile nonsense and bile that you spout ? The swathes of people at the bottom who are bone idle are as well as being a vastly exaggerated group to which you as a non UK resident contribute fuck all, are not the biggest percentage of the real struggling poor in this country. The people who really need help are the working poor, because contrary to your self aggrandising and myopic stupid view of my country, MOST people want to work and single parent or not try their hardest to make it pay. You are not a libertarian you are a bigot.

"The woman has never worked and still breeds.." what the fuck is that supposed to mean. That men bear no responsibility? That every women is a sponger ? that being a mother and working are mutually exclusive? Every time you make such an insensitive broad sweeping ignorant elitist statement you put yourself firmly in the camp of the out of touch career politician not the common working man.

I am not the only lone voice in threads like these and even if I were it would not be because I lack judgement. I will not be party to blowing smoke up your arse because you think you are some kind of expert and above the need for common decency or logical reasoning. Do you realise the amount of leeway and allowances people make for you because they think you are a bit of a character or have mental health issues?

The thread is about UK council and European elections. You do not reside in the UK. You do not vote in the UK and you do not pay tax in the UK. So why for fucks sake do you think it is OK to turn the thread into a soap box upon which you can stand and lecture UK taxpaying residents who have voted in the recent elections on what needs to be done to turn England back into the fictional crusty stuffy shit hole of your waffy yah yah youth?

I am glad the England I live in now is different to the one of my youth. I am happy to be able to live in a far more enlightened culture that which I grew up in, in the 1970's. When I was a kid wine was for Middle class families unless you meant Blue Nun and Garlic for the French. There were skinheads who went to my local youth club who ignorantly hated people they called "wogs" who actually created the haircut and Ska music that they were listening to, way before 1977, back in the 1950's . Any Asian with dark skin was routinely called Paki even though most were Indian and provided us with our national dish. Even you with your penchant for fast food would have had to put up with Wimpy which was shit.

Today on the local news they returned a 250 year old torah scroll to the Jewish community in Cornwall from the museum in which it was kept and Yids like me have actually been here in this country for hundreds of years before that. Lending money which Christians would not to set up businesses around which English communities sprang up. So the idea that all immigration is a negative thing is abhorrent to me.

Not once have I said that there is no problem with Immigration. Not once have I said that all our power and legal decisions should be governed by the EU. Not once have I said that people who vote UKIP are racist. And yet you and Kirkland have both made sweeping statements about England and Immigrants as though the solution to everbodies woes was to throw everyone out and turn back the clock as though Immigration in all it's guises had never happened.

You have never acknowledged anything positive about Europe, immigration or the resilience of the British people who pull up their socks and carry on despite the difficulties they face. It's just all negative bollocks not unlike UKIP's campaign and that way leads to nothing but blame, division and the elite at the top continuing to shit on everyone else.