Floyd's competition vs Manny's competition

[Silkeyjoe]

Comparing Manny and Floyd is like comparing Floyd to fighters from different eras, they just aint gonna fight and we dont really know who would win. Flod is big fav but Ive always maintained speed and movement could cause Floyd to struggle. Thats why I give Khan a great chance against him, a better chance than I would give him of beating Pac.

As for Floyds opposition being much superior to Pacs well if we look at their last 7.

Floyd has Mosly who was well past it, Ortiz who is noy good, Cotto who got obliterated by Pac (easier than Floyd did) Guerrero who again is average, Alavarez (his best opponent) who I again dont rate at that level as I feel he should have lost to Lara and anyone strugling with Trout isnt going to be a match for Floyd and then Maidana twice who in my opinoin was not worthy of a fight with Floyd once let alone twice.

Pac has Margarito nothing special but is as good as Maidana, Mosely shot, Marquez as good as anyone on the floyds list, Bradley twice again as good as anyone on Floyds list and Rios who is just shit.

[imp]

Comparing Manny and Floyd is like comparing Floyd to fighters from different eras, they just aint gonna fight and we dont really know who would win. Flod is big fav but Ive always maintained speed and movement could cause Floyd to struggle. Thats why I give Khan a great chance against him, a better chance than I would give him of beating Pac.

As for Floyds opposition being much superior to Pacs well if we look at their last 7.

Floyd has Mosly who was well past it, Ortiz who is noy good, Cotto who got obliterated by Pac (easier than Floyd did) Guerrero who again is average, Alavarez (his best opponent) who I again dont rate at that level as I feel he should have lost to Lara and anyone strugling with Trout isnt going to be a match for Floyd and then Maidana twice who in my opinoin was not worthy of a fight with Floyd once let alone twice.

Pac has Margarito nothing special but is as good as Maidana, Mosely shot, Marquez as good as anyone on the floyds list, Bradley twice again as good as anyone on Floyds list and Rios who is just shit.

Mosely just beat the monster margacheato and floyd schooled him.
Manny beat a shot paycheck moseley.

Floyd ko a prime undefeated hatton,
Pac ko a shot defeated hatton.

Ortiz is better than rios
Rios is shit (i agree)

Pac beat a catchweight cotto (good win)
Floyd beat a cotto at his weight.

Maidana would beat margacheato and beats all of pacs opponents bar cotto (possibly)

Canelo would beat all of pacs opponents!
Pac wouldnt even entertain a canelo fight.

This back and forth could go on for ages but no matter how you look at it whether its an inch or a mile..winning is winning...and floyd shines in the above.

Floyd would easily beat marquez and bradley and everyone knows that!!

[walrus]

We can go back and fourth all we want but as fans we should be grateful we were alive in this era to see these guys fighting. In the end I think Manny is a far superior fighter, I know each fighter has a style until themselves but Floyd wouldn't go balls to the wall as Manny always does. Floyd would not fighter a fighter who consistently gives him trouble as JMM did Manny. If so Floyd would have taken on Cotto three months after the first fight. Manny New when he stepped in the ring against JMM it wasn't a gimme but so many if Floyd's fights were gimme. I think his rematch with his last opponent was more to fulfill his contract than to prove anything else. If Floyd gets the W with some controversy when has he ever given a shot about proving things to his fans. Floyd has no fans, only people who give him money. I think Manny has an entire different view on such things. One of our members here @pacfan often talks about how like is in the Philippines and how Manny was selling food on the streets to help his family survive. Someone else said comparing these two fighters is comparing apples and oranges.Tough times for Manny were avoiding starvation, tough times for Floyd were doing time for domestic abuse..

I have much more respect for Manny not only in boxing but in humanity. He is tough in ways that Floyd couldn't experience any longer.

To reiterate, I am glad I'm a boxing fan and have been able to pay overpriced numbers to see Floyd fight, absolutely love to see him do his thing but even more so when it comes to Manny. I always feel I'm seeing something beyond special with Manny. Sure he has some loses, but his record overall is mind blowing especially when you look where he came from. I have been left breathless after seeing Manny land combos like nothing I have seen before. He is beyond great and he doesn't need to tell us every five minutes. Manny v Pac will happen in 2015. I hear Mannys team is looking to steal Biber away from team money. If this does happen Manny v Pac may not happen as Beiber is the only thing keeping Floyd from beginning a full "blown" pedophile. Justin looks long enough where he fulfills Floyd's need for young boys to touch and penetrate but losing him from team money will force Floyd to capture what he really wants, eleven year old boys. Manny is going to rescue Beiber and get him the help he needs. Bahai

[imp]

We can go back and fourth all we want but as fans we should be grateful we were alive in this era to see these guys fighting. In the end I think Manny is a far superior fighter, I know each fighter has a style until themselves but Floyd wouldn't go balls to the wall as Manny always does. Floyd would not fighter a fighter who consistently gives him trouble as JMM did Manny. If so Floyd would have taken on Cotto three months after the first fight. Manny New when he stepped in the ring against JMM it wasn't a gimme but so many if Floyd's fights were gimme. I think his rematch with his last opponent was more to fulfill his contract than to prove anything else. If Floyd gets the W with some controversy when has he ever given a shot about proving things to his fans. Floyd has no fans, only people who give him money. I think Manny has an entire different view on such things. One of our members here @pacfan often talks about how like is in the Philippines and how Manny was selling food on the streets to help his family survive. Someone else said comparing these two fighters is comparing apples and oranges.Tough times for Manny were avoiding starvation, tough times for Floyd were doing time for domestic abuse..

I have much more respect for Manny not only in boxing but in humanity. He is tough in ways that Floyd couldn't experience any longer.

To reiterate, I am glad I'm a boxing fan and have been able to pay overpriced numbers to see Floyd fight, absolutely love to see him do his thing but even more so when it comes to Manny. I always feel I'm seeing something beyond special with Manny. Sure he has some loses, but his record overall is mind blowing especially when you look where he came from. I have been left breathless after seeing Manny land combos like nothing I have seen before. He is beyond great and he doesn't need to tell us every five minutes. Manny v Pac will happen in 2015. I hear Mannys team is looking to steal Biber away from team money. If this does happen Manny v Pac may not happen as Beiber is the only thing keeping Floyd from beginning a full "blown" pedophile. Justin looks long enough where he fulfills Floyd's need for young boys to touch and penetrate but losing him from team money will force Floyd to capture what he really wants, eleven year old boys. Manny is going to rescue Beiber and get him the help he needs. Bahai

This post ruined all the good ones you might have made.

When someone has to say this fighter was selling food on the streets and the other was not is really clutching those straws.

Smh

[Beanflicker]

Floyd would not fighter a fighter who consistently gives him trouble as JMM did Manny.

Castillo gave him hell and arguably beat him... rematched.

Maidana gave him hell and came very close... rematched.

When you're talk about who was the most exciting fighter, Manny wins by a landslide. It's not even close.

When you're talking about who the superior fighter was and who had the superior career, it was Floyd Mayweather. You'd have to be crazy to argue with either of those facts.

[Beanflicker]

I see a lot of times people factor in excitement into how great a fighter was, and that's something I never understood.

People seem to have trouble grasping the concept that excitement can often be the result of flaws in a fighter, and being boring is often the result of a fighter being so great that his fights aren't competitive.

[imp]

Roy jones had both.

He was exciting and occasionally boring when he carried opponents.

This thread is about opponents so lets put floyd and mannys last 3 opponents in a boxing competition...who wins and why?

Is anyone happy to discuss in detail mannys losses or will we continue to duck that question like floyd is ducking manny.

"Imp, stop talking about losses!
Ali was a beaten fighter and he is the greatest!"

Manny is no ali.

Duran..yes..minus the quit in his heart.

[mikeeod]

Roy jones had both.

He was exciting and occasionally boring when he carried opponents.

This thread is about opponents so lets put floyd and mannys last 3 opponents in a boxing competition...who wins and why?

Is anyone happy to discuss in detail mannys losses or will we continue to duck that question like floyd is ducking manny.

"Imp, stop talking about losses!
Ali was a beaten fighter and he is the greatest!"

Manny is no ali.

Duran..yes..minus the quit in his heart.

I will talk about the losses, I think it will be enlightening. What's on your mind?

[mikeeod]

I see a lot of times people factor in excitement into how great a fighter was, and that's something I never understood.

People seem to have trouble grasping the concept that excitement can often be the result of flaws in a fighter, and being boring is often the result of a fighter being so great that his fights aren't competitive.

I don't know, some might argue that while boxing is the sweet science, it is still a fight and not a defensive contest. I would argue that true skill is being able to maintain a defense while attacking and dominating for the stoppage. I don't think Rigo is more skilled than Hagler was, or more dominant prime vs prime, but he is WAY more boring. I think the more skilled you are, and the more determined for greatness you are, the higher the chances you will be exciting. Think Ricardo Lopez, Roy Jones, Hearns, Duran, Robinson, Leonard...etc., all of those guys were dominant, defensively sound fighters who were exciting and stopped good n great opposition.

I'm a Floyd fan. Love how slick he is, his work ethic, dedication...etc. my one knock on Floyd, however, is that many times he has had a guy outclassed and been content to just win on points. Additionally, when u talk about destroying a guy in the ring and dominating them like never before...etc., it looks bad to go out and shoe shine and pot shot like he did vs Oscar and Baldomir. Say you will win or outbox them, but don't promise nonstop action and then avoid engaging. Just doesn't look good.

[mikeeod]

Floyd would not fighter a fighter who consistently gives him trouble as JMM did Manny.

Castillo gave him hell and arguably beat him... rematched.

Maidana gave him hell and came very close... rematched.

When you're talk about who was the most exciting fighter, Manny wins by a landslide. It's not even close.

When you're talking about who the superior fighter was and who had the superior career, it was Floyd Mayweather. You'd have to be crazy to argue with either of those facts.

I disagree, so I must be crazy. I think you are correct in stating that Floyd is the better fighter, you won't get any argument out of me on that one. I disagree that Floyd had the superior career. I value quality of opposition and big wins more than avoiding losses and big events.

Manny electrified the sport. Floyd has risen the awareness of the sport to the general public, but more for novelty act reasons. The fans Manny attracted watch for his excitement value, both in how he fights and by taking on TOUGH competition. People watch Floyd, more people in certain instances than Manny, but more for the hope that he gets beat.

I would say right now that their careers are pretty even, but I don't think it is as crazy as you try to make it seem to favor Manny's career. The fact that you try so hard to say that it shouldn't be a topic just makes you seem like a completely biased fanboy. You lose credibility with the valid points you make...

[pacfan]

We can go back and fourth all we want but as fans we should be grateful we were alive in this era to see these guys fighting. In the end I think Manny is a far superior fighter, I know each fighter has a style until themselves but Floyd wouldn't go balls to the wall as Manny always does. Floyd would not fighter a fighter who consistently gives him trouble as JMM did Manny. If so Floyd would have taken on Cotto three months after the first fight. Manny New when he stepped in the ring against JMM it wasn't a gimme but so many if Floyd's fights were gimme. I think his rematch with his last opponent was more to fulfill his contract than to prove anything else. If Floyd gets the W with some controversy when has he ever given a shot about proving things to his fans. Floyd has no fans, only people who give him money. I think Manny has an entire different view on such things. One of our members here @pacfan often talks about how like is in the Philippines and how Manny was selling food on the streets to help his family survive. Someone else said comparing these two fighters is comparing apples and oranges.Tough times for Manny were avoiding starvation, tough times for Floyd were doing time for domestic abuse..

I have much more respect for Manny not only in boxing but in humanity. He is tough in ways that Floyd couldn't experience any longer.

To reiterate, I am glad I'm a boxing fan and have been able to pay overpriced numbers to see Floyd fight, absolutely love to see him do his thing but even more so when it comes to Manny. I always feel I'm seeing something beyond special with Manny. Sure he has some loses, but his record overall is mind blowing especially when you look where he came from. I have been left breathless after seeing Manny land combos like nothing I have seen before. He is beyond great and he doesn't need to tell us every five minutes. Manny v Pac will happen in 2015. I hear Mannys team is looking to steal Biber away from team money. If this does happen Manny v Pac may not happen as Beiber is the only thing keeping Floyd from beginning a full "blown" pedophile. Justin looks long enough where he fulfills Floyd's need for young boys to touch and penetrate but losing him from team money will force Floyd to capture what he really wants, eleven year old boys. Manny is going to rescue Beiber and get him the help he needs. Bahai

Nice post, buds, I couldn't have said it any better.

[SlimTrae]

It's hard for me to say Floyd has cherry picked his way for straight 18 years.

My knock on his competiton is : fighting Zab after he lost to Baldomir.
Not fighting Paul Williams or Antonio Margarito @ WW win they were on the winning side of their careers.

I respect him for 18 years:1 knockdown ( his glove scraped the canvas)
Beat undefeated fighters: Diego Corrales, Ricky Hatton & Canelo

Defeated Mosley after Shane mugged Margarito
+ His last 4-5 fights came against fighters all in their 20's: Ortiz, Guerrero, Canelo & Maidana

My knock with Pacquiao was fighting David Diaz at LW, but not undefeated Juan Diaz (JMM did) or the guy who beat Juan Diaz (Nate Campbell) or the linear champ at the time Casamayor (JMM did) or then undefeated Michael Katsidis (JMM)

@ the time it looked like JMM was chasing Pac UP in weight, while cleaning out divisions.

I totally blame Arum as IMO Pac would fight anyone, but he fought more catchweights than a mutha.

Today they claimed he has won titles in 8 divisions- BUT if you look at what he weighed fight night -not the weigh in against MAB in 03' it was 138, then years later against Margarito @ catchweight it was 147.

How in the hell does a man win 8 different weight classes while coming in between 138-147 from 2003-2014? Catchweighting his ass all the way to the Boxing Hall of Fame.

I do respect Pac for the way he ends fights. No question marks.

In conclusion: Morales outboxed him fight one & busted him up-
JMM & he fought like Frazier-Ali: no definitive winner, rather two guys who know each other too well for a clear winner.

His best win to me is over a young undefeated Bradley- As Hatton proved China chin with Jurango and even stopped by moderate puncher PBF.
Pac totally outclassed Margarito and Rios, great wins over (mediocre fighters)

Floyd hands down has the best career, best resume and fought them more on their terms, while Pac beat most of hs fighters at catchweights, or after they recently lost.

Pac is a great fighter, while Floyd has a great record. Somehow they both cancel each other out..
as they both have question marks. (sorry 4 the long post)

[Beanflicker]

Like with any topic, most people believe what they want to believe and either choose to not look at facts and think critically, or they're incapable of real critical thinking. Most people hate Mayweather and want to believe he's overrated, that he's a coward, that he carefully ducked and hand-picked his way to success, ect. Ok, right, the guy who's gone 18 years undefeated and spent 16 years fighting on a championship level stinks and would have been average in any other era. Cool. :roll eyes:

Floyd's been opportunistic with opponents at times for sure, but to act like that is something unique to Floyd is just disingenuous. Guys have been doing it forever, that's why they have managers and handlers choosing their fights.

[mikeeod]

Like with any topic, most people believe what they want to believe and either choose to not look at facts and think critically, or they're incapable of real critical thinking. Most people hate Mayweather and want to believe he's overrated, that he's a coward, that he carefully ducked and hand-picked his way to success, ect. Ok, right, the guy who's gone 18 years undefeated and spent 16 years fighting on a championship level stinks and would have been average in any other era. Cool. :roll eyes:

Floyd's been opportunistic with opponents at times for sure, but to act like that is something unique to Floyd is just disingenuous. Guys have been doing it forever, that's why they have managers and handlers choosing their fights.

You seem like a good guy who is pretty smart, so don't take this as a personal attack or bashing you in any way. I feel like the majority of Floyd fans are hyper sensitive and act like the guy is untouchable or above critcism. I can say that Floyd is an ATG, phenomenal fighter, but disagree that he is the GOAT or fought better comp than his contemporaries and Floyd fans freak. It goes from what I said to me thinking he's a bum who ducks everyone and a coward with a glass jaw. That is what kills the discussions, people just try to completely distort what you say in an attempt to make your points invalid...

[imp]

Floyd would never end up bankrupt.

Obviously no one can defend his antics outside the ring as floyd and manny are complete opposites including style of fighting.

I will always accept like many other fans that might not like floyd the person that he is a complete genuis in the ring and the best of this era.

Manny is a likable guy but surely its reasonable to accept from every fan that he cant be even considered to be the best until he beats floyd.

Its not hard to understand.

Put away the hate and whatever stereotyping a person might have and concentrate on their skills in the ring and plus points both fighters have.

No one can ignore mannys rise to the top and he has destroyed many opponents but he has also taken losses to opponents that we have all agreed that floyd would never have lost too.

Just think if manny had floyds opponents from 1-47 and I think we can all honestly say he would never be undefeated.

Its not all about losses but in this thread we are talking about opponents so its unfair to skip over the losses pac has had and also the difficult fight floyd had with castillo.

Just imagine it if manny pacquio was undefeated and had advisors (rather than a boss) with hundreds and millions for each fight!

He made a bad move signing up to bob arum again and that was a massive up yours to the floyd camp.