Who will be remembered as the greater fighter: Bernard Hopkins or Floyd Mayweather?

[mikeeod]

In what ways is Bernard Better than Floyd?

He fought everybody, most of them in their prime.

Floyd avoided many, or waited until they faded (Mosley was 40 when Floyd fought his, De La Hoya was past his best). Floyd fought a lot of clubfighters/fringe contenders like Ortiz, Mitchell, and Maidana.

actually floyd probably fought tougher opposition. bhop did clean out the MW division but most of the people he fought werent really that good. the fight that really put him over was against tito who was a welter. same with de la hoya. i would say that floyds best wins are better than hopkins best wins.

but its a joke of a thread anyways. floyd is a top 20 p4p of all time. bernard basically sealed his legacy because of his age. floyd sealed his with his greatness.

I would LOVE for you to explain how you think Floyd faced tougher competition. No way and it isn't even close. Floyd hasn't faced nearly as many top guys as Hop. It's not even close. That statement just completely overshadows any valid points you may have made.

[mikeeod]

Both guys are close and depending on how you weigh the criteria is how you will rank each guy against the other. If you like consistency, multiple titles at multiple weights and no losses you favor Floyd. If you like longevity, historical accomplishments and quality of opposition you favor Hop.

The one aspect of this debate that is asinine is the question of who fought tougher comp. it's not even close. Look at the number of P4P ranked fighters each guy fought while those guys were in their prime and ranked P4P at the time of the fight. This is the only objective method for weighing quality of opposition. Hop wins big here. Not even close...

[ruthless rocco]

One of them deliberately bent and broke the rules at every possible occasion in order to win.
The other used superior skills, talent and athleticism to dominate almost every opponent they faced over 18 years.

Who is the greater fighter... The cheater or the virtuoso?

[p4pking]

I don't really give a shit, bickering over the legacies of people who werent in the same weight class and could never have been rivals is waste of time imo. This thread is basically proof of why. All that said though, I take Floyd!!!

It boils down to whether you prefer longevity over dominance(I certainly don't), how much credit you give a guy for taking fights as opposed to winning them(I actually think FLoyd has more quality wins, but Hopkins has really been through a hell of a gauntlet in the last ten years and has no doubt taken on tougher challenges in that time), and of course white prejudice

It's interesting to note that when Hopkins was Floyds age(which is old!!!) he had basically just emerged on the scene beating Tito. What he has done since then is freakish without question, but on the flip side I don't think Hopkins middleweight reign was THAT impressive as the big fights evaded him in those days regardless.

[Freedom]

When Floyd is Hopkins' age, he won't be fighting. He'll likely be living in a beach home in Mexico, surrounded by several young male prostitutes who resemble Justin Bieber.

[Rantcatrat]

One of them deliberately bent and broke the rules at every possible occasion in order to win.
The other used superior skills, talent and athleticism to dominate almost every opponent they faced over 18 years.

Who is the greater fighter... The cheater or the virtuoso?

Do you recall the Victor Oritz knockout by Mayweather? Hopkins is dirtier but Mayweather is far from clean.

[Beanflicker]

Hopkins and Mayweather are both dirty fighters.

[ruthless rocco]

One of them deliberately bent and broke the rules at every possible occasion in order to win.
The other used superior skills, talent and athleticism to dominate almost every opponent they faced over 18 years.

Who is the greater fighter... The cheater or the virtuoso?

Do you recall the Victor Oritz knockout by Mayweather? Hopkins is dirtier but Mayweather is far from clean.

That was a legit KO.
Ortiz deliberately fouled him, kissed him on the cheek, tapped gloves the ref told them to resume fighting.
Ortiz walked towards Floyd with his hands down.
Floyd KO'd him. Fair play. Not dirty.

[Rantcatrat]

One of them deliberately bent and broke the rules at every possible occasion in order to win.
The other used superior skills, talent and athleticism to dominate almost every opponent they faced over 18 years.

Who is the greater fighter... The cheater or the virtuoso?

Do you recall the Victor Oritz knockout by Mayweather? Hopkins is dirtier but Mayweather is far from clean.

That was a legit KO.
Ortiz deliberately fouled him, kissed him on the cheek, tapped gloves the ref told them to resume fighting.
Ortiz walked towards Floyd with his hands down.
Floyd KO'd him. Fair play. Not dirty.

Hahahahahah. I don't care if it was legal or not. It was the definition of a cheap shot.

Do you consider that a brilliant KO?

Watch it again: Ortiz is backing away with his gloves down and the ref isn't even looking at the fighters and not only does Floyd hit him once, he hits him twice.

Come on, man.

That wasn't a way to end a fight. It was utter crap.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ieJPRhlkVh4

[ruthless rocco]

Hahahahahah. I don't care if it was legal or not. It was the definition of a cheap shot.

Do you consider that a brilliant KO?

Watch it again: Ortiz is backing away with his gloves down and the ref isn't even looking at the fighters and not only does Floyd hit him once, he hits him twice.

Come on, man.

That wasn't a way to end a fight. It was utter crap.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ieJPRhlkVh4

That's how you handle a bitch punk like Ortiz. He had tried to headbutt Floyd 3 different times over the course of the fight. That means all pleasantries are off. There's no cheap shot against a guy who deliberately fouls you in a attempt to injure you. Add to that the kiss on the cheek and the hugs Ortiz kept trying to give Floyd... I think it was the best ending possible. Ortiz just wanted out of the fight anyway. He's not a real fighter despite his natural talent.

Here's a video for you. Keith Kizer the executive director of the Nevada Athletic Commission explains how it was legal. He even mocks Ortiz. It begins at the 25 second mark. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uPt9PodmaPQ

[powerpuncher]

In what ways is Bernard Better than Floyd?

He fought everybody, most of them in their prime.

Floyd avoided many, or waited until they faded (Mosley was 40 when Floyd fought his, De La Hoya was past his best). Floyd fought a lot of clubfighters/fringe contenders like Ortiz, Mitchell, and Maidana.

actually floyd probably fought tougher opposition. bhop did clean out the MW division but most of the people he fought werent really that good. the fight that really put him over was against tito who was a welter. same with de la hoya. i would say that floyds best wins are better than hopkins best wins.

but its a joke of a thread anyways. floyd is a top 20 p4p of all time. bernard basically sealed his legacy because of his age. floyd sealed his with his greatness.

I would LOVE for you to explain how you think Floyd faced tougher competition. No way and it isn't even close. Floyd hasn't faced nearly as many top guys as Hop. It's not even close. That statement just completely overshadows any valid points you may have made.

so they have one common opponent and that is de la hoya. that wasnt an impressive win at all for bhop because i knew that de la hoya was way too small and was actually surprised that he did so well. mayweather did the opposite and went up in weight to fight him. and tito (who really made bhop a bigger name) was a one dimensional fighter who was very good at what he did but easily got outboxed (watch the de la hoya and winky fights). plus tito was a welter, not a middleweight.

those are probably his biggest wins along with probably tarver. most of his wins from tarver on were more impressive because of age instead of who they were against. for example, we were all impressed that he beat pascal, not because pascal is great but because bhop was old and did it convincingly (in their second fight at least). most of his wins at middleweight werent that impressive because his opposition wasnt great. look at the list of guys he fought and you will realize that no name really sticks out.

[Silkeyjoe]

In what ways is Bernard Better than Floyd?

He fought everybody, most of them in their prime.

Floyd avoided many, or waited until they faded (Mosley was 40 when Floyd fought his, De La Hoya was past his best). Floyd fought a lot of clubfighters/fringe contenders like Ortiz, Mitchell, and Maidana.

actually floyd probably fought tougher opposition. bhop did clean out the MW division but most of the people he fought werent really that good. the fight that really put him over was against tito who was a welter. same with de la hoya. i would say that floyds best wins are better than hopkins best wins.

but its a joke of a thread anyways. floyd is a top 20 p4p of all time. bernard basically sealed his legacy because of his age. floyd sealed his with his greatness.

I would LOVE for you to explain how you think Floyd faced tougher competition. No way and it isn't even close. Floyd hasn't faced nearly as many top guys as Hop. It's not even close. That statement just completely overshadows any valid points you may have made.

so they have one common opponent and that is de la hoya. that wasnt an impressive win at all for bhop because i knew that de la hoya was way too small and was actually surprised that he did so well. mayweather did the opposite and went up in weight to fight him. and tito (who really made bhop a bigger name) was a one dimensional fighter who was very good at what he did but easily got outboxed (watch the de la hoya and winky fights). plus tito was a welter, not a middleweight.

those are probably his biggest wins along with probably tarver. most of his wins from tarver on were more impressive because of age instead of who they were against. for example, we were all impressed that he beat pascal, not because pascal is great but because bhop was old and did it convincingly (in their second fight at least). most of his wins at middleweight werent that impressive because his opposition wasnt great. look at the list of guys he fought and you will realize that no name really sticks out.

You conveniently leave out Pavlik, who was one of the most feared fighters at the time. You also fail to mention P4P king Roy Jones Jr, Joe Calzaghe and Kovalev who in my opinion are better P4P then anyone Floyd has fought. Im not argueing who was better I believe its Floyd but I cant see how anyone can think Floyd fought better opposition

[Beanflicker]

You conveniently leave out Pavlik, who was one of the most feared fighters at the time. You also fail to mention P4P king Roy Jones Jr, Joe Calzaghe and Kovalev who in my opinion are better P4P then anyone Floyd has fought. Im not argueing who was better I believe its Floyd but I cant see how anyone can think Floyd fought better opposition

Kovalev better p4p than anyone Floyd has fought? Kovalev isn't even officially the #1 in his division right now, let alone a p4p great...

[Silkeyjoe]

You conveniently leave out Pavlik, who was one of the most feared fighters at the time. You also fail to mention P4P king Roy Jones Jr, Joe Calzaghe and Kovalev who in my opinion are better P4P then anyone Floyd has fought. Im not argueing who was better I believe its Floyd but I cant see how anyone can think Floyd fought better opposition

Kovalev better p4p than anyone Floyd has fought? Kovalev isn't even officially the #1 in his division right now, let alone a p4p great...

I didnt say he was a P4P great I just think he marks for Hopkins a better opponent then anyone Floyd has faced. Kov was likely a stone heavier than Hopkins on the night, a stellar amateur career and one of the most feared punchers. As someone mentioned earlier Hopkins fighting Kov is a similar ask to having Floyd fight GGG, a fight that I could never see Floyd taking. And I think anyone with some sense knows Kov is the best light heavyweight around

[Andre]

Legacy aside if they fought at prime and at the same weight 'imaginary I know' I recon Floyd would win even though he'd have sore balls and few cuts above the eyes he'd come out of 12 as the greater fighter.