Catch weight fights. Like them, hate them, don't care, or undecided?

[Primo Carnera]

Catchweights are ok for making some decent match ups, but let's not kid ourselves, it is impossible to make a good argument for any title fight having a catchweight. There are weight divisions for a reason, fucking 17 of them!!!
The worst thing is that the governing bodies actually allow it.

If the fight is for a title, by definition it is not a catchweight fight!

Well you would think so wouldn't you? So how do you define the Cotto v Geale fight? It was for a title, and there was a 157lb weight limit.
My point is that the WBC shouldn't have sanctioned it as a title fight.

Both fighters weighed 160 or under, thus it was a Middleweight title fight...
but Geale was told if he weighed in over 157, the fight was off. Dress it up how you like , but who actually runs the show here, the WBC or the promoters?

Nearly thirty years ago the WBC were sanctioning a title fight for two different weights; if the money is right there is no issue.
Actually there is an issue. Are we here to see who the best fighters are in each division, or just let people do what they want because "the money's right?
A catchweight fight is when for example a 199lbs fighter fights in a non title fight against a 165lbs boxer. If it were for a title; if sanction it would be a 'Cruiserweight' fight.

like I said, dress it up and make it sound how you like, but if a Fight is for the MW World title, then either boxer is entitled to come in up to the 160 limit. Therefore, for example, Geale should've been allowed to come in at 160 and Cotto can come in at whatever fucking weight he wants to , up to 160.
Because that was not the case, this means there was an agreed weight limit , i.e. A catchweight. Or is it ok because "the money was right."

[Britkid]

like I said, dress it up and make it sound how you like, but if a Fight is for the MW World title, then either boxer is entitled to come in up to the 160 limit. Therefore, for example, Geale should've been allowed to come in at 160 and Cotto can come in at whatever fucking weight he wants to , up to 160.
Because that was not the case, this means there was an agreed weight limit , i.e. A catchweight. Or is it ok because "the money was right."

Boxing is with the possible exception of Formula One, the most capitalist driven sport in the world, it is ultimately about money, because if you are stepping into the ring to fight and money is not your main motive for doing so, you should for your own health, not be allowed to fight.

Geale got a pay day against a top name fighter; a pay day he may not of got against any other fighter in his division; same went for Lalonde against Leonard. So there really is no issue, and there is no catchweight title fights, that truly is a contradiction in terms...

[Primo Carnera]

like I said, dress it up and make it sound how you like, but if a Fight is for the MW World title, then either boxer is entitled to come in up to the 160 limit. Therefore, for example, Geale should've been allowed to come in at 160 and Cotto can come in at whatever fucking weight he wants to , up to 160.
Because that was not the case, this means there was an agreed weight limit , i.e. A catchweight. Or is it ok because "the money was right."

Boxing is with the possible exception of Formula One, the most capitalist driven sport in the world, it is ultimately about money, because if you are stepping into the ring to fight and money is not your main motive for doing so, you should for your own health, not be allowed to fight.

Geale got a pay day against a top name fighter; a pay day he may not of got against any other fighter in his division; same went for Lalonde against Leonard. So there really is no issue, and there is no catchweight title fights, that truly is a contradiction in terms...

I would venture to say that less than 1% make big money! and for the vast majority that according to you shouldn't be allowed to box, money is not their main motive. Also , money has never been the amateur boxers' main motive now or in the past.
I would also say money wasn't the main motive for many,many boxers in the 30's , 40's, 50's and 60's .
Without these people, the sport you like to watch would not even exist.
This is a whole sport, don't get carried away with the top 1%.

[Jimanuel Boogustus]

Apologies for butting in but actually, I think it is you who is getting carried away with the 1%.

Sorry. I just have a very strong sense of irony.

[Primo Carnera]

Apologies for butting in but actually, I think it is you who is getting carried away with the 1%.

Sorry. I just have a very strong sense of irony.

Not sure exactly what you mean, but if you mean it is way less than 1%, I agree.

[beenKOed]

like I said, dress it up and make it sound how you like, but if a Fight is for the MW World title, then either boxer is entitled to come in up to the 160 limit. Therefore, for example, Geale should've been allowed to come in at 160 and Cotto can come in at whatever fucking weight he wants to , up to 160.
Because that was not the case, this means there was an agreed weight limit , i.e. A catchweight. Or is it ok because "the money was right."

Boxing is with the possible exception of Formula One, the most capitalist driven sport in the world, it is ultimately about money, because if you are stepping into the ring to fight and money is not your main motive for doing so, you should for your own health, not be allowed to fight.

Geale got a pay day against a top name fighter; a pay day he may not of got against any other fighter in his division; same went for Lalonde against Leonard. So there really is no issue, and there is no catchweight title fights, that truly is a contradiction in terms...

I would venture to say that less than 1% make big money! and for the vast majority that according to you shouldn't be allowed to box, money is not their main motive. Also , money has never been the amateur boxers' main motive now or in the past.
I would also say money wasn't the main motive for many,many boxers in the 30's , 40's, 50's and 60's .
Without these people, the sport you like to watch would not even exist.
This is a whole sport, don't get carried away with the top 1%.

First, define big money. PPV big money? Canelo big money? Manny big money? Flyweight big money? Heavyweight big money?

[Primo Carnera]

like I said, dress it up and make it sound how you like, but if a Fight is for the MW World title, then either boxer is entitled to come in up to the 160 limit. Therefore, for example, Geale should've been allowed to come in at 160 and Cotto can come in at whatever fucking weight he wants to , up to 160.
Because that was not the case, this means there was an agreed weight limit , i.e. A catchweight. Or is it ok because "the money was right."

Boxing is with the possible exception of Formula One, the most capitalist driven sport in the world, it is ultimately about money, because if you are stepping into the ring to fight and money is not your main motive for doing so, you should for your own health, not be allowed to fight.

Geale got a pay day against a top name fighter; a pay day he may not of got against any other fighter in his division; same went for Lalonde against Leonard. So there really is no issue, and there is no catchweight title fights, that truly is a contradiction in terms...

I would venture to say that less than 1% make big money! and for the vast majority that according to you shouldn't be allowed to box, money is not their main motive. Also , money has never been the amateur boxers' main motive now or in the past.
I would also say money wasn't the main motive for many,many boxers in the 30's , 40's, 50's and 60's .
Without these people, the sport you like to watch would not even exist.
This is a whole sport, don't get carried away with the top 1%.

First, define big money. PPV big money? Canelo big money? Manny big money? Flyweight big money? Heavyweight big money?

Anyone that can reward themselves sufficiently to set them up in a good lifestyle for the rest of their lives, not necessarily Helicopters and stuff.
If you want a price put on it, I would say anyone who earns over half a million a fight.

[Britkid]

like I said, dress it up and make it sound how you like, but if a Fight is for the MW World title, then either boxer is entitled to come in up to the 160 limit. Therefore, for example, Geale should've been allowed to come in at 160 and Cotto can come in at whatever fucking weight he wants to , up to 160.
Because that was not the case, this means there was an agreed weight limit , i.e. A catchweight. Or is it ok because "the money was right."

Boxing is with the possible exception of Formula One, the most capitalist driven sport in the world, it is ultimately about money, because if you are stepping into the ring to fight and money is not your main motive for doing so, you should for your own health, not be allowed to fight.

Geale got a pay day against a top name fighter; a pay day he may not of got against any other fighter in his division; same went for Lalonde against Leonard. So there really is no issue, and there is no catchweight title fights, that truly is a contradiction in terms...

I would venture to say that less than 1% make big money! and for the vast majority that according to you shouldn't be allowed to box, money is not their main motive. Also , money has never been the amateur boxers' main motive now or in the past.
I would also say money wasn't the main motive for many,many boxers in the 30's , 40's, 50's and 60's .
Without these people, the sport you like to watch would not even exist.
This is a whole sport, don't get carried away with the top 1%.

I stand by what I wrote. If you are fighting for a £Million or for £50; if that money is not your primary motivation, you should not be in the ring.

In this instance Geale I suspect got good to great money because he agreed to fight at 157lbs. What you are suggesting is that, that is wrong. I am not, I want to see fighters make as much money as possible and in some circumstances contract clauses on weight, or indeed catchweight matchmaking can help this.

[Primo Carnera]

like I said, dress it up and make it sound how you like, but if a Fight is for the MW World title, then either boxer is entitled to come in up to the 160 limit. Therefore, for example, Geale should've been allowed to come in at 160 and Cotto can come in at whatever fucking weight he wants to , up to 160.
Because that was not the case, this means there was an agreed weight limit , i.e. A catchweight. Or is it ok because "the money was right."

Boxing is with the possible exception of Formula One, the most capitalist driven sport in the world, it is ultimately about money, because if you are stepping into the ring to fight and money is not your main motive for doing so, you should for your own health, not be allowed to fight.

Geale got a pay day against a top name fighter; a pay day he may not of got against any other fighter in his division; same went for Lalonde against Leonard. So there really is no issue, and there is no catchweight title fights, that truly is a contradiction in terms...

I would venture to say that less than 1% make big money! and for the vast majority that according to you shouldn't be allowed to box, money is not their main motive. Also , money has never been the amateur boxers' main motive now or in the past.
I would also say money wasn't the main motive for many,many boxers in the 30's , 40's, 50's and 60's .
Without these people, the sport you like to watch would not even exist.
This is a whole sport, don't get carried away with the top 1%.

I stand by what I wrote. If you are fighting for a £Million or for £50; if that money is not your primary motivation, you should not be in the ring.

In this instance Geale I suspect got good to great money because he agreed to fight at 157lbs. What you are suggesting is that, that is wrong. I am not, I want to see fighters make as much money as possible and in some circumstances contract clauses on weight, or indeed catchweight matchmaking can help this.

I don't want to harp on about this, it could go on forever, but I would be more worried about allowing a Boxer to fight if he was fighting for £50 or £500 so as not to be flippant, and Money was his main motive. If he was that desperate that would be a worry.
Whereas if somebody was boxing for that money or indeed nothing as a lot of amateurs do , but their main motive was the sport and their own self pride and determination , I don't think it's so bad.
My point about the Geale fight is that if its for a title, Geale should be allowed to come in at 160, and it is the WBC that decides that, not COTTO!
I'm all for boxers earning as much as they can, and good luck to them. But when they start to dictate what weight their opponent comes in at, then the tail starts to wag the Dog!
You will say "Geale could've turned it down," but what should happen is that the WBC should've decided who fights and at what weight.
Infact, we can agree that Money was the main motive for Geale to drop to 157 and box at the lightest he has for many years. Yet if you remember seeing him on the Scales, or in the fight, where he was clearly drained and had No punch absorbency, then surely it is he who shouldn't have been allowed to fight from a safety perspective, and that has to be the No. 1 factor, above all including Money.

[Britkid]

like I said, dress it up and make it sound how you like, but if a Fight is for the MW World title, then either boxer is entitled to come in up to the 160 limit. Therefore, for example, Geale should've been allowed to come in at 160 and Cotto can come in at whatever fucking weight he wants to , up to 160.
Because that was not the case, this means there was an agreed weight limit , i.e. A catchweight. Or is it ok because "the money was right."

Boxing is with the possible exception of Formula One, the most capitalist driven sport in the world, it is ultimately about money, because if you are stepping into the ring to fight and money is not your main motive for doing so, you should for your own health, not be allowed to fight.

Geale got a pay day against a top name fighter; a pay day he may not of got against any other fighter in his division; same went for Lalonde against Leonard. So there really is no issue, and there is no catchweight title fights, that truly is a contradiction in terms...

I would venture to say that less than 1% make big money! and for the vast majority that according to you shouldn't be allowed to box, money is not their main motive. Also , money has never been the amateur boxers' main motive now or in the past.
I would also say money wasn't the main motive for many,many boxers in the 30's , 40's, 50's and 60's .
Without these people, the sport you like to watch would not even exist.
This is a whole sport, don't get carried away with the top 1%.

I stand by what I wrote. If you are fighting for a £Million or for £50; if that money is not your primary motivation, you should not be in the ring.

In this instance Geale I suspect got good to great money because he agreed to fight at 157lbs. What you are suggesting is that, that is wrong. I am not, I want to see fighters make as much money as possible and in some circumstances contract clauses on weight, or indeed catchweight matchmaking can help this.

I don't want to harp on about this, it could go on forever, but I would be more worried about allowing a Boxer to fight if he was fighting for £50 or £500 so as not to be flippant, and Money was his main motive. If he was that desperate that would be a worry.
Whereas if somebody was boxing for that money or indeed nothing as a lot of amateurs do , but their main motive was the sport and their own self pride and determination , I don't think it's so bad.
My point about the Geale fight is that if its for a title, Geale should be allowed to come in at 160, and it is the WBC that decides that, not COTTO!
I'm all for boxers earning as much as they can, and good luck to them. But when they start to dictate what weight their opponent comes in at, then the tail starts to wag the Dog!
You will say "Geale could've turned it down," but what should happen is that the WBC should've decided who fights and at what weight.
Infact, we can agree that Money was the main motive for Geale to drop to 157 and box at the lightest he has for many years. Yet if you remember seeing him on the Scales, or in the fight, where he was clearly drained and had No punch absorbency, then surely it is he who shouldn't have been allowed to fight from a safety perspective, and that has to be the No. 1 factor, above all including Money.

If you think safety comes above money, then you will be struggling to justify the existence of the sport! Money has to be the main object of 'professional' boxing, and thus catchweight fights or contracted weights need to be tools in the sport.

[Master]

Catch weight fights have happened throughout history Chavez v Whitaker and Oscar v B Hop but that does not mean they are right. They should be banned and outlawed - simple.

[Primo Carnera]

like I said, dress it up and make it sound how you like, but if a Fight is for the MW World title, then either boxer is entitled to come in up to the 160 limit. Therefore, for example, Geale should've been allowed to come in at 160 and Cotto can come in at whatever fucking weight he wants to , up to 160.
Because that was not the case, this means there was an agreed weight limit , i.e. A catchweight. Or is it ok because "the money was right."

Boxing is with the possible exception of Formula One, the most capitalist driven sport in the world, it is ultimately about money, because if you are stepping into the ring to fight and money is not your main motive for doing so, you should for your own health, not be allowed to fight.

Geale got a pay day against a top name fighter; a pay day he may not of got against any other fighter in his division; same went for Lalonde against Leonard. So there really is no issue, and there is no catchweight title fights, that truly is a contradiction in terms...

I would venture to say that less than 1% make big money! and for the vast majority that according to you shouldn't be allowed to box, money is not their main motive. Also , money has never been the amateur boxers' main motive now or in the past.
I would also say money wasn't the main motive for many,many boxers in the 30's , 40's, 50's and 60's .
Without these people, the sport you like to watch would not even exist.
This is a whole sport, don't get carried away with the top 1%.

I stand by what I wrote. If you are fighting for a £Million or for £50; if that money is not your primary motivation, you should not be in the ring.

In this instance Geale I suspect got good to great money because he agreed to fight at 157lbs. What you are suggesting is that, that is wrong. I am not, I want to see fighters make as much money as possible and in some circumstances contract clauses on weight, or indeed catchweight matchmaking can help this.

I don't want to harp on about this, it could go on forever, but I would be more worried about allowing a Boxer to fight if he was fighting for £50 or £500 so as not to be flippant, and Money was his main motive. If he was that desperate that would be a worry.
Whereas if somebody was boxing for that money or indeed nothing as a lot of amateurs do , but their main motive was the sport and their own self pride and determination , I don't think it's so bad.
My point about the Geale fight is that if its for a title, Geale should be allowed to come in at 160, and it is the WBC that decides that, not COTTO!
I'm all for boxers earning as much as they can, and good luck to them. But when they start to dictate what weight their opponent comes in at, then the tail starts to wag the Dog!
You will say "Geale could've turned it down," but what should happen is that the WBC should've decided who fights and at what weight.
Infact, we can agree that Money was the main motive for Geale to drop to 157 and box at the lightest he has for many years. Yet if you remember seeing him on the Scales, or in the fight, where he was clearly drained and had No punch absorbency, then surely it is he who shouldn't have been allowed to fight from a safety perspective, and that has to be the No. 1 factor, above all including Money.

If you think safety comes above money, then you will be struggling to justify the existence of the sport! Money has to be the main object of 'professional' boxing, and thus catchweight fights or contracted weights need to be tools in the sport.

You are fucking kidding me , right? Seriously , you must be trolling. So it don't matter if a few blokes are Brain damaged as long as a few blokes at the top make serious money?
You talk about justifying the existence of the sport, well if it wasn't for the guys that earn little or no money , the sport would definitely not exist.
The welfare and safety of the boxers, and not just the superstars that you watch has to be the first and foremost priority.
And back to your "Money has to be the Prime motive" drivel, An example, and I don't want to embarrass anyone, is a guy on this forum that you are probably aware of called Tam Seddon. He regularly posts about his fights, and I may be wrong, and if I am , I hope he corrects me, but I would bet my house that his prime motive is not Money. Are you saying he shouldn't be allowed to box?

[Ron Swanson]

Some stuff being said in this thread that is mindnumbing. Fighters who aren't in it for the money should be banned? Then there is no sport. 99.99% of boxers won't recoup what they put into the sport. I know boxing fans like to be contrarian but come the F on. That's some of the most outlandish shit I have read anywhere, of any kind.

[greynotsoold]

Some stuff being said in this thread that is mindnumbing. Fighters who aren't in it for the money should be banned? Then there is no sport. 99.99% of boxers won't recoup what they put into the sport. I know boxing fans like to be contrarian but come the F on. That's some of the most outlandish shit I have read anywhere, of any kind.

For a long long time every boxer works for free. A lot of hours with no guarantee of any return.