Ward vs Calzaghe

[ryanman]

Ward isn't alien to making adjustments either. Like you said, BHOP gave Calzaghe problems, so a version 10-15 years younger might just beat him. Ward for me.

You are Italian that is sacrilegious!

I know mate, I went to watch Joe live a few times as well and I like him, but just trying to tell it as it is.
Having said that , Joe would've beaten every other British SMW there has been, hands down.
So how does it feel that Britain's Rea test ever SMW was in fact ITALIAN? ������������

Mate, I know you say this kind of thing all the time, and I THINK it's a bit tongue-in-cheek, but would you truly consider Calzaghe to be more of an Italian than a Welshman?
For most people he's a Brit/Welsh with Italian heritage.

Also, I'm pretty sure I've seen logic of yours in regards to other fighters that if applied to Calzaghe would preclude him being primarily 'Italian' .

[Primo Carnera]

Ward isn't alien to making adjustments either. Like you said, BHOP gave Calzaghe problems, so a version 10-15 years younger might just beat him. Ward for me.

You are Italian that is sacrilegious!

I know mate, I went to watch Joe live a few times as well and I like him, but just trying to tell it as it is.
Having said that , Joe would've beaten every other British SMW there has been, hands down.
So how does it feel that Britain's Rea test ever SMW was in fact ITALIAN? ������������

Mate, I know you say this kind of thing all the time, and I THINK it's a bit tongue-in-cheek, but would you truly consider Calzaghe to be more of an Italian than a Welshman?
For most people he's a Brit/Welsh with Italian heritage.

Also, I'm pretty sure I've seen logic of yours in regards to other fighters that if applied to Calzaghe would preclude him being primarily 'Italian' .

Mate, you're right, it is a bit tongue in cheek, but I do disagree with you slightly. I see him more as Welsh/Italian , British doesn't come into it. He clearly feels that way as well.
He used to have the Welsh and Italian flags on his shorts , but I never saw a Union Jack.
This is the age old theme where if he's Welsh (or Scottish or Irish) and he's unsuccessful, then he's Welsh. But if he's Welsh and successful, then he's BRITISH.
Whereas if he's English and successful, he's English.
He's clearly Welsh and I'm not really trying to claim him for Italy, that's for him to do himself.
But I know for an absolute fact that he feels more Italian than he does English or even British.

[Beanz]

Ward isn't alien to making adjustments either. Like you said, BHOP gave Calzaghe problems, so a version 10-15 years younger might just beat him. Ward for me.

You are Italian that is sacrilegious!

I know mate, I went to watch Joe live a few times as well and I like him, but just trying to tell it as it is.
Having said that , Joe would've beaten every other British SMW there has been, hands down.
So how does it feel that Britain's Rea test ever SMW was in fact ITALIAN? ������������

Mate, I know you say this kind of thing all the time, and I THINK it's a bit tongue-in-cheek, but would you truly consider Calzaghe to be more of an Italian than a Welshman?
For most people he's a Brit/Welsh with Italian heritage.

Also, I'm pretty sure I've seen logic of yours in regards to other fighters that if applied to Calzaghe would preclude him being primarily 'Italian' .

Mate, you're right, it is a bit tongue in cheek, but I do disagree with you slightly. I see him more as Welsh/Italian , British doesn't come into it. He clearly feels that way as well.
He used to have the Welsh and Italian flags on his shorts , but I never saw a Union Jack.
This is the age old theme where if he's Welsh (or Scottish or Irish) and he's unsuccessful, then he's Welsh. But if he's Welsh and successful, then he's BRITISH.
Whereas if he's English and successful, he's English.
He's clearly Welsh and I'm not really trying to claim him for Italy, that's for him to do himself.
But I know for an absolute fact that he feels more Italian than he does English or even British.

Despite being born in England and Wales being in Britain.

[Primo Carnera]

Ward isn't alien to making adjustments either. Like you said, BHOP gave Calzaghe problems, so a version 10-15 years younger might just beat him. Ward for me.

You are Italian that is sacrilegious!

I know mate, I went to watch Joe live a few times as well and I like him, but just trying to tell it as it is.
Having said that , Joe would've beaten every other British SMW there has been, hands down.
So how does it feel that Britain's Rea test ever SMW was in fact ITALIAN? ������������

Mate, I know you say this kind of thing all the time, and I THINK it's a bit tongue-in-cheek, but would you truly consider Calzaghe to be more of an Italian than a Welshman?
For most people he's a Brit/Welsh with Italian heritage.

Also, I'm pretty sure I've seen logic of yours in regards to other fighters that if applied to Calzaghe would preclude him being primarily 'Italian' .

Mate, you're right, it is a bit tongue in cheek, but I do disagree with you slightly. I see him more as Welsh/Italian , British doesn't come into it. He clearly feels that way as well.
He used to have the Welsh and Italian flags on his shorts , but I never saw a Union Jack.
This is the age old theme where if he's Welsh (or Scottish or Irish) and he's unsuccessful, then he's Welsh. But if he's Welsh and successful, then he's BRITISH.
Whereas if he's English and successful, he's English.
He's clearly Welsh and I'm not really trying to claim him for Italy, that's for him to do himself.
But I know for an absolute fact that he feels more Italian than he does English or even British.

Despite being born in England and Wales being in Britain.

Nice one @Beanz. How about a bit of light reading for you. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/oly...rn-abroad.html
After you've read that, I wonder if you could let me know the nationality of the sportsmen listed below, going by your own rules of eligibility .
Mo Farah, Chris Froome, Bradley Wiggins, Justin Rose, Mike Catt, Mako Vunipola, Manu Tuilagi, Toby Faletau, John Barnes, Owen Hargreaves, Greg Rusedski and let's not even mention Cricketers.
Trust me , that list was concocted in about 5 minutes, I'm sure I could add many,many more.
Remember this was YOUR line of reasoning. Have a nice day.

[TitoFan]

LMAO at the times I've seen someone claim that nationality plays no part in their being fans of certain boxers (I've read this here a LOT)..... and then those very same people scramble to stake a claim in X or Y boxer. Boxing as a whole (including us fans) is a wholly entertaining sport.

Of course, a lot has to do with the fighter's record and skill level. If he's no good, nobody claims him. If he's great, pull out the birth certificates, places and times of residence, Olympic representations, etc, etc.

[sanatogen]

Calzaghe can dig deep and find a way to win due to him being versatile, extremely fast , extremely fit and also a cold hearted bastard when a fight is going against him. He absolutely hates to lose.

He's a mirror image of some of Wards characteristics, making for a great matchup.

Calzaghe nicks it on points

[Beanz]

Ward isn't alien to making adjustments either. Like you said, BHOP gave Calzaghe problems, so a version 10-15 years younger might just beat him. Ward for me.

You are Italian that is sacrilegious!

I know mate, I went to watch Joe live a few times as well and I like him, but just trying to tell it as it is.
Having said that , Joe would've beaten every other British SMW there has been, hands down.
So how does it feel that Britain's Rea test ever SMW was in fact ITALIAN? ������������

Mate, I know you say this kind of thing all the time, and I THINK it's a bit tongue-in-cheek, but would you truly consider Calzaghe to be more of an Italian than a Welshman?
For most people he's a Brit/Welsh with Italian heritage.

Also, I'm pretty sure I've seen logic of yours in regards to other fighters that if applied to Calzaghe would preclude him being primarily 'Italian' .

Mate, you're right, it is a bit tongue in cheek, but I do disagree with you slightly. I see him more as Welsh/Italian , British doesn't come into it. He clearly feels that way as well.
He used to have the Welsh and Italian flags on his shorts , but I never saw a Union Jack.
This is the age old theme where if he's Welsh (or Scottish or Irish) and he's unsuccessful, then he's Welsh. But if he's Welsh and successful, then he's BRITISH.
Whereas if he's English and successful, he's English.
He's clearly Welsh and I'm not really trying to claim him for Italy, that's for him to do himself.
But I know for an absolute fact that he feels more Italian than he does English or even British.

Despite being born in England and Wales being in Britain.

Nice one @Beanz. How about a bit of light reading for you. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/oly...rn-abroad.html
After you've read that, I wonder if you could let me know the nationality of the sportsmen listed below, going by your own rules of eligibility .
Mo Farah, Chris Froome, Bradley Wiggins, Justin Rose, Mike Catt, Mako Vunipola, Manu Tuilagi, Toby Faletau, John Barnes, Owen Hargreaves, Greg Rusedski and let's not even mention Cricketers.
Trust me , that list was concocted in about 5 minutes, I'm sure I could add many,many more.
Remember this was YOUR line of reasoning. Have a nice day.

By any criteria he is British. He was born in Britain, grew up in Britain, fought as Both an Amateur and Pro in Britain as a Brit with a British Passport. Even his dad moved from Italy to England when he was two so quite why you have such a problem with him being British is a bit beyond me. He has not even ever (to the best of my knowledge) represented Italy so you are just clutching at straws now.

[Primo Carnera]

Ward isn't alien to making adjustments either. Like you said, BHOP gave Calzaghe problems, so a version 10-15 years younger might just beat him. Ward for me.

You are Italian that is sacrilegious!

I know mate, I went to watch Joe live a few times as well and I like him, but just trying to tell it as it is.
Having said that , Joe would've beaten every other British SMW there has been, hands down.
So how does it feel that Britain's Rea test ever SMW was in fact ITALIAN? ������������

Mate, I know you say this kind of thing all the time, and I THINK it's a bit tongue-in-cheek, but would you truly consider Calzaghe to be more of an Italian than a Welshman?
For most people he's a Brit/Welsh with Italian heritage.

Also, I'm pretty sure I've seen logic of yours in regards to other fighters that if applied to Calzaghe would preclude him being primarily 'Italian' .

Mate, you're right, it is a bit tongue in cheek, but I do disagree with you slightly. I see him more as Welsh/Italian , British doesn't come into it. He clearly feels that way as well.
He used to have the Welsh and Italian flags on his shorts , but I never saw a Union Jack.
This is the age old theme where if he's Welsh (or Scottish or Irish) and he's unsuccessful, then he's Welsh. But if he's Welsh and successful, then he's BRITISH.
Whereas if he's English and successful, he's English.
He's clearly Welsh and I'm not really trying to claim him for Italy, that's for him to do himself.
But I know for an absolute fact that he feels more Italian than he does English or even British.

Despite being born in England and Wales being in Britain.

Nice one @Beanz. How about a bit of light reading for you. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/oly...rn-abroad.html
After you've read that, I wonder if you could let me know the nationality of the sportsmen listed below, going by your own rules of eligibility .
Mo Farah, Chris Froome, Bradley Wiggins, Justin Rose, Mike Catt, Mako Vunipola, Manu Tuilagi, Toby Faletau, John Barnes, Owen Hargreaves, Greg Rusedski and let's not even mention Cricketers.
Trust me , that list was concocted in about 5 minutes, I'm sure I could add many,many more.
Remember this was YOUR line of reasoning. Have a nice day.

By any criteria he is British. He was born in Britain, grew up in Britain, fought as Both an Amateur and Pro in Britain as a Brit with a British Passport. Even his dad moved from Italy to England when he was two so quite why you have such a problem with him being British is a bit beyond me. He has not even ever (to the best of my knowledge) represented Italy so you are just clutching at straws now.

Mate , I have no problem, I really don't. It seems you do though, as your posts are getting longer and more desperate, yet never addressing the FACTS that I put forward.
I conceded that he is clearly Welsh. All I said was that HE feels more Italian than British.
He wore a Welsh and Italian Flags on his shorts, but never a Union Jack.
Why are you so desperate to claim a part of him? Because he was born in London?
I posted contradictory examples, but you chose not to reply.
It's funny, I never hear anyone talk about Kerry Hope being British.....well not since he lost his European title anyway.😉

[Batman]

Ward isn't alien to making adjustments either. Like you said, BHOP gave Calzaghe problems, so a version 10-15 years younger might just beat him. Ward for me.

You are Italian that is sacrilegious!

I know mate, I went to watch Joe live a few times as well and I like him, but just trying to tell it as it is.
Having said that , Joe would've beaten every other British SMW there has been, hands down.
So how does it feel that Britain's Rea test ever SMW was in fact ITALIAN? ������������

Mate, I know you say this kind of thing all the time, and I THINK it's a bit tongue-in-cheek, but would you truly consider Calzaghe to be more of an Italian than a Welshman?
For most people he's a Brit/Welsh with Italian heritage.

Also, I'm pretty sure I've seen logic of yours in regards to other fighters that if applied to Calzaghe would preclude him being primarily 'Italian' .

Mate, you're right, it is a bit tongue in cheek, but I do disagree with you slightly. I see him more as Welsh/Italian , British doesn't come into it. He clearly feels that way as well.
He used to have the Welsh and Italian flags on his shorts , but I never saw a Union Jack.
This is the age old theme where if he's Welsh (or Scottish or Irish) and he's unsuccessful, then he's Welsh. But if he's Welsh and successful, then he's BRITISH.
Whereas if he's English and successful, he's English.
He's clearly Welsh and I'm not really trying to claim him for Italy, that's for him to do himself.
But I know for an absolute fact that he feels more Italian than he does English or even British.

Despite being born in England and Wales being in Britain.

Nice one @Beanz. How about a bit of light reading for you. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/oly...rn-abroad.html
After you've read that, I wonder if you could let me know the nationality of the sportsmen listed below, going by your own rules of eligibility .
Mo Farah, Chris Froome, Bradley Wiggins, Justin Rose, Mike Catt, Mako Vunipola, Manu Tuilagi, Toby Faletau, John Barnes, Owen Hargreaves, Greg Rusedski and let's not even mention Cricketers.
Trust me , that list was concocted in about 5 minutes, I'm sure I could add many,many more.
Remember this was YOUR line of reasoning. Have a nice day.

By any criteria he is British. He was born in Britain, grew up in Britain, fought as Both an Amateur and Pro in Britain as a Brit with a British Passport. Even his dad moved from Italy to England when he was two so quite why you have such a problem with him being British is a bit beyond me. He has not even ever (to the best of my knowledge) represented Italy so you are just clutching at straws now.

Mate , I have no problem, I really don't. It seems you do though, as your posts are getting longer and more desperate, yet never addressing the FACTS that I put forward.
I conceded that he is clearly Welsh. All I said was that HE feels more Italian than British.
He wore a Welsh and Italian Flags on his shorts, but never a Union Jack.
Why are you so desperate to claim a part of him? Because he was born in London?
I posted contradictory examples, but you chose not to reply.
It's funny, I never hear anyone talk about Kerry Hope being British.....well not since he lost his European title anyway.😉

I never liked Calzaghe, he is Welsh
I don't like Amir Khan, he is Welsh
I don't like David Haye, he is Welsh

if I don't like you then you are Welsh

@Master and all this time you thought you were English...you Welsh cunt

[Beanz]

Ward isn't alien to making adjustments either. Like you said, BHOP gave Calzaghe problems, so a version 10-15 years younger might just beat him. Ward for me.

You are Italian that is sacrilegious!

I know mate, I went to watch Joe live a few times as well and I like him, but just trying to tell it as it is.
Having said that , Joe would've beaten every other British SMW there has been, hands down.
So how does it feel that Britain's Rea test ever SMW was in fact ITALIAN? ������������

Mate, I know you say this kind of thing all the time, and I THINK it's a bit tongue-in-cheek, but would you truly consider Calzaghe to be more of an Italian than a Welshman?
For most people he's a Brit/Welsh with Italian heritage.

Also, I'm pretty sure I've seen logic of yours in regards to other fighters that if applied to Calzaghe would preclude him being primarily 'Italian' .

Mate, you're right, it is a bit tongue in cheek, but I do disagree with you slightly. I see him more as Welsh/Italian , British doesn't come into it. He clearly feels that way as well.
He used to have the Welsh and Italian flags on his shorts , but I never saw a Union Jack.
This is the age old theme where if he's Welsh (or Scottish or Irish) and he's unsuccessful, then he's Welsh. But if he's Welsh and successful, then he's BRITISH.
Whereas if he's English and successful, he's English.
He's clearly Welsh and I'm not really trying to claim him for Italy, that's for him to do himself.
But I know for an absolute fact that he feels more Italian than he does English or even British.

Despite being born in England and Wales being in Britain.

Nice one @Beanz. How about a bit of light reading for you. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/oly...rn-abroad.html
After you've read that, I wonder if you could let me know the nationality of the sportsmen listed below, going by your own rules of eligibility .
Mo Farah, Chris Froome, Bradley Wiggins, Justin Rose, Mike Catt, Mako Vunipola, Manu Tuilagi, Toby Faletau, John Barnes, Owen Hargreaves, Greg Rusedski and let's not even mention Cricketers.
Trust me , that list was concocted in about 5 minutes, I'm sure I could add many,many more.
Remember this was YOUR line of reasoning. Have a nice day.

By any criteria he is British. He was born in Britain, grew up in Britain, fought as Both an Amateur and Pro in Britain as a Brit with a British Passport. Even his dad moved from Italy to England when he was two so quite why you have such a problem with him being British is a bit beyond me. He has not even ever (to the best of my knowledge) represented Italy so you are just clutching at straws now.

Mate , I have no problem, I really don't. It seems you do though, as your posts are getting longer and more desperate, yet never addressing the FACTS that I put forward.
I conceded that he is clearly Welsh. All I said was that HE feels more Italian than British.
He wore a Welsh and Italian Flags on his shorts, but never a Union Jack.
Why are you so desperate to claim a part of him? Because he was born in London?
I posted contradictory examples, but you chose not to reply.
It's funny, I never hear anyone talk about Kerry Hope being British.....well not since he lost his European title anyway.������

Claim a part of him? Do you have shares in him then? I am British. He is British. What is your problem with people being British? I have never heard him say he feels more Italian than British are you going to tell me that the Welsh and and Scots don't feel British next? The Anglo Saxons used to call where I live West Wales so I would like to claim one fifth of him if we are going Dutch.

[ryanman]

[/QUOTE]

Mo Farah, Chris Froome, Bradley Wiggins, Justin Rose, Mike Catt, Mako Vunipola, Manu Tuilagi, Toby Faletau, John Barnes, Owen Hargreaves, Greg Rusedski and let's not even mention Cricketers.
[/QUOTE]

The name's you've listed here Primo are good examples of a template for nationality being impossible.

So, let's take Bradley Wiggins. You've included him because he was born in Belgium. Yet his parents were in Belgium as his dad was a professional cyclist. He was raised in St Helens, is clearly a Lancashire lad and is 100% British IMO. His Belgium link is about as relevant as my mate's Papua New Guinea link.

On the other hand Greg Rusedski. Now, I liked the bloke, but most people wouldn't consider him to be a British man. I mean, he just isn't. He's a Canadian with links to Britain that played under the British flag. As such I supported him. But, is he British like Wiggins? No.
For someone like Mo Farah, being a refugee at a young age, his nationality is mostly defined by his own self-identity. For him, he is British. For me, he's British. Somalian roots of course but he proudly represents his country. In fact, in 2012 when some wag questioned whether he should run for Somalia Mo was rightly outraged.
It's all a rich tapestry

[ryanman]

Sorry fucked the quote there. Bit rusty.

[Primo Carnera]

Mo Farah, Chris Froome, Bradley Wiggins, Justin Rose, Mike Catt, Mako Vunipola, Manu Tuilagi, Toby Faletau, John Barnes, Owen Hargreaves, Greg Rusedski and let's not even mention Cricketers.
[/QUOTE]

The name's you've listed here Primo are good examples of a template for nationality being impossible.

So, let's take Bradley Wiggins. You've included him because he was born in Belgium. Yet his parents were in Belgium as his dad was a professional cyclist. He was raised in St Helens, is clearly a Lancashire lad and is 100% British IMO. His Belgium link is about as relevant as my mate's Papua New Guinea link.

On the other hand Greg Rusedski. Now, I liked the bloke, but most people wouldn't consider him to be a British man. I mean, he just isn't. He's a Canadian with links to Britain that played under the British flag. As such I supported him. But, is he British like Wiggins? No.
For someone like Mo Farah, being a refugee at a young age, his nationality is mostly defined by his own self-identity. For him, he is British. For me, he's British. Somalian roots of course but he proudly represents his country. In fact, in 2012 when some wag questioned whether he should run for Somalia Mo was rightly outraged.
It's all a rich tapestry [/QUOTE]
Mate, I was just using @Beanz's criteria based on where they were born and trying to highlight how fucking stupid it is. Of course I don't believe Bradley Wiggins is Belgian.
in my opinion , every case has its own merits.

[erics44]

in a fair fight joe would win on volume, perfect style to beat ward, particularly in his prime

in America with 3 American judges and an American ref Ward would win

in wales with 3 welsh judges and a welsh ref Joe would win

[Master]

in a fair fight joe would win on volume, perfect style to beat ward, particularly in his prime

in America with 3 American judges and an American ref Ward would win

in wales with 3 welsh judges and a welsh ref Joe would win

Thank you for getting back to the question and this is what I said already.