Haye of 2009/10 vs Joshua and Wilder

[Primo Carnera]

Was Haye really that good as heavyweight than I remember?

It says more about the quality of the current crop.
I like AJ, but at the moment his best win was against a 41 year old.

[Ron Swanson]

People always say todays crop is worse. During Haye's "prime" when he fought nobody before his wasted years when he fought nobody it was called "the worst era in heavyweight history" by most. AJ and Wilder are talented in any era. How much success they would have in different eras can be debated but they are talented without doubt.

[oakleyno1]

Regards Fury - who was clearly a better fight for his bout vs Klit - but Stevie Cunningham put hi down solidly with a right hand - I think Haye takes him out even these days. I've always thought Haye is a bad matchup for Fury since Cunningham

[Primo Carnera]

People always say todays crop is worse. During Haye's "prime" when he fought nobody before his wasted years when he fought nobody it was called "the worst era in heavyweight history" by most. AJ and Wilder are talented in any era. How much success they would have in different eras can be debated but they are talented without doubt.

Hey, we can all slag Haye off, but he went up to HW as the undisputed best CW out there. Bellew went up , probably not even as one of the top 5 CW's and he's fucking ranked in the top 10 ffs.
at the time it probably was "the worst era in heavyweight history" , but it's been overtaken.
in order to give balance, I said in my other reply to this thread, it has to be noted that AJ and Wilder have not peaked yet, so things can definitely change.

[Memphis]

Haye had a laser guided right hand in his pomp and against guys his own size it was devastating. Look back at any highlight real of his, it's all right hand.

He'd struggle to land that punch against the giants of the division. Despite his relationship with Wilder and some footage of him chinning him pretty good. I think Haye loses to both of them at any time.

[Ron Swanson]

People always say todays crop is worse. During Haye's "prime" when he fought nobody before his wasted years when he fought nobody it was called "the worst era in heavyweight history" by most. AJ and Wilder are talented in any era. How much success they would have in different eras can be debated but they are talented without doubt.

Hey, we can all slag Haye off, but he went up to HW as the undisputed best CW out there. Bellew went up , probably not even as one of the top 5 CW's and he's fucking ranked in the top 10 ffs.
at the time it probably was "the worst era in heavyweight history" , but it's been overtaken.
in order to give balance, I said in my other reply to this thread, it has to be noted that AJ and Wilder have not peaked yet, so things can definitely change.

My point is divisions go through ups and downs and we get caught in an era thinking it has to be the worst, but there were probably worse times. I mean who was around for The Cinderella Man to become champ? Dude was as journeyman as they come. Mike Tyson’s early reign was so empty they had to bring names out of retirement. MW is only now starting to fill out with 154 guys coming up to have some depth for the first time since the early 90s. Divisions(other than WW and LW usually) go through slumps.

It is a bad HW era, but there are 2 very talented fighters that could face off. HW there often aren’t 2. It could very well turn into AJ and everyone else, but it isn’t yet.

[Primo Carnera]

People always say todays crop is worse. During Haye's "prime" when he fought nobody before his wasted years when he fought nobody it was called "the worst era in heavyweight history" by most. AJ and Wilder are talented in any era. How much success they would have in different eras can be debated but they are talented without doubt.

Hey, we can all slag Haye off, but he went up to HW as the undisputed best CW out there. Bellew went up , probably not even as one of the top 5 CW's and he's fucking ranked in the top 10 ffs.
at the time it probably was "the worst era in heavyweight history" , but it's been overtaken.
in order to give balance, I said in my other reply to this thread, it has to be noted that AJ and Wilder have not peaked yet, so things can definitely change.

My point is divisions go through ups and downs and we get caught in an era thinking it has to be the worst, but there were probably worse times. I mean who was around for The Cinderella Man to become champ? Dude was as journeyman as they come. Mike Tyson’s early reign was so empty they had to bring names out of retirement. MW is only now starting to fill out with 154 guys coming up to have some depth for the first time since the early 90s. Divisions(other than WW and LW usually) go through slumps.

It is a bad HW era, but there are 2 very talented fighters that could face off. HW there often aren’t 2. It could very well turn into AJ and everyone else, but it isn’t yet.

Firstly, the only reason they had to bring names out of retirement for Tyson is because he was going through everyone like a dose of salts. At his peak , there was simply nobody around that could even take him a few rounds, let alone compete.
Secondly, it is a bad era and you're right in that there are 2 good guys that could face each other. The only stumbling block is , as with every division in this era, that they don't NEED to fight each other. Financially, they can carry on accusing each other of ducking and wanting the fight in their own respective countries because they can still make mega bucks without each other.
It is Laughable that a fight with a 25 stone Coke addict that hasn't boxed for over 2 years , and had only one good (very good actually) win on his record, makes more money for Joshua than a showdown with Wilder does.
This is no different in any division , Thurman/Spence/Crawford , Stevenson/Kovalev , Bellew holding his CW title to ransom when he had it all spring to mind and more.
now we can quite rightly say, "Don't they want to build a legacy?" but the answer is that they want that with the most money, most hype and least risk.
In previous times , guys wanted to , HAD to fight their main rivals because that's where the money was.
Joshua's purse was probably £20 - £30 Million for fighting a late replacement in his last fight. How the fuck is that gonna help make a Wilder fight?

[Ron Swanson]

People always say todays crop is worse. During Haye's "prime" when he fought nobody before his wasted years when he fought nobody it was called "the worst era in heavyweight history" by most. AJ and Wilder are talented in any era. How much success they would have in different eras can be debated but they are talented without doubt.

Hey, we can all slag Haye off, but he went up to HW as the undisputed best CW out there. Bellew went up , probably not even as one of the top 5 CW's and he's fucking ranked in the top 10 ffs.
at the time it probably was "the worst era in heavyweight history" , but it's been overtaken.
in order to give balance, I said in my other reply to this thread, it has to be noted that AJ and Wilder have not peaked yet, so things can definitely change.

My point is divisions go through ups and downs and we get caught in an era thinking it has to be the worst, but there were probably worse times. I mean who was around for The Cinderella Man to become champ? Dude was as journeyman as they come. Mike Tyson’s early reign was so empty they had to bring names out of retirement. MW is only now starting to fill out with 154 guys coming up to have some depth for the first time since the early 90s. Divisions(other than WW and LW usually) go through slumps.

It is a bad HW era, but there are 2 very talented fighters that could face off. HW there often aren’t 2. It could very well turn into AJ and everyone else, but it isn’t yet.

Firstly, the only reason they had to bring names out of retirement for Tyson is because he was going through everyone like a dose of salts. At his peak , there was simply nobody around that could even take him a few rounds, let alone compete.
Secondly, it is a bad era and you're right in that there are 2 good guys that could face each other. The only stumbling block is , as with every division in this era, that they don't NEED to fight each other. Financially, they can carry on accusing each other of ducking and wanting the fight in their own respective countries because they can still make mega bucks without each other.
It is Laughable that a fight with a 25 stone Coke addict that hasn't boxed for over 2 years , and had only one good (very good actually) win on his record, makes more money for Joshua than a showdown with Wilder does.
This is no different in any division , Thurman/Spence/Crawford , Stevenson/Kovalev , Bellew holding his CW title to ransom when he had it all spring to mind and more.
now we can quite rightly say, "Don't they want to build a legacy?" but the answer is that they want that with the most money, most hype and least risk.
In previous times , guys wanted to , HAD to fight their main rivals because that's where the money was.
Joshua's purse was probably £20 - £30 Million for fighting a late replacement in his last fight. How the fuck is that gonna help make a Wilder fight?

I hear ya, you know I’m always going on how the best should fight the best. To the point of annoyance. Even being forced to support guys I hate like Ward and Wilder because they either made or are trying to make the right fights. And arguing against guys I like because they aren’t.

Luckily I hate most of the frauds(not talent wise) in the WW division because that is by far the most frustrating division.

At this point I’m forced to be a CW fan because it’s the only division all the top guys are doing right.

As for AJ, I don’t really believe the numbers, I think Hearn is paying him well but paying himself far more than AJ knows. Hearn is clearly setting up a move to HBO, just look at the deals he’s making with HBO. The only thing I think can make a Wilder/AJ fight is AJs weak viewership. He needs a fight that will get the numbers for the right deal. The UK money is going to be there for him regardless, stacking a bad deal for HBO on top is their goal. The question is will HBO do a bad deal without decent viewership before he comes over.

[Alpha]

Nothing wrong with being a Cruiserweight fan. The division has been pumping along nicely for years.

[nuggetdotcom]

People always say todays crop is worse. During Haye's "prime" when he fought nobody before his wasted years when he fought nobody it was called "the worst era in heavyweight history" by most. AJ and Wilder are talented in any era. How much success they would have in different eras can be debated but they are talented without doubt.

Hey, we can all slag Haye off, but he went up to HW as the undisputed best CW out there. Bellew went up , probably not even as one of the top 5 CW's and he's fucking ranked in the top 10 ffs.
at the time it probably was "the worst era in heavyweight history" , but it's been overtaken.
in order to give balance, I said in my other reply to this thread, it has to be noted that AJ and Wilder have not peaked yet, so things can definitely change.

My point is divisions go through ups and downs and we get caught in an era thinking it has to be the worst, but there were probably worse times. I mean who was around for The Cinderella Man to become champ? Dude was as journeyman as they come. Mike Tyson’s early reign was so empty they had to bring names out of retirement. MW is only now starting to fill out with 154 guys coming up to have some depth for the first time since the early 90s. Divisions(other than WW and LW usually) go through slumps.

It is a bad HW era, but there are 2 very talented fighters that could face off. HW there often aren’t 2. It could very well turn into AJ and everyone else, but it isn’t yet.

Firstly, the only reason they had to bring names out of retirement for Tyson is because he was going through everyone like a dose of salts. At his peak , there was simply nobody around that could even take him a few rounds, let alone compete.
Secondly, it is a bad era and you're right in that there are 2 good guys that could face each other. The only stumbling block is , as with every division in this era, that they don't NEED to fight each other. Financially, they can carry on accusing each other of ducking and wanting the fight in their own respective countries because they can still make mega bucks without each other.
It is Laughable that a fight with a 25 stone Coke addict that hasn't boxed for over 2 years , and had only one good (very good actually) win on his record, makes more money for Joshua than a showdown with Wilder does.
This is no different in any division , Thurman/Spence/Crawford , Stevenson/Kovalev , Bellew holding his CW title to ransom when he had it all spring to mind and more.
now we can quite rightly say, "Don't they want to build a legacy?" but the answer is that they want that with the most money, most hype and least risk.
In previous times , guys wanted to , HAD to fight their main rivals because that's where the money was.
Joshua's purse was probably £20 - £30 Million for fighting a late replacement in his last fight. How the fuck is that gonna help make a Wilder fight?

Very valid point about a 25 stone coke addict who hasn't boxed for 2 years, yet that is the one that Joshua/Hearn are after? Why? Dumb Ass PPV money, not boxing fans.

[Master]

“Playboy fighter” no more: the night David Haye came of age
5 live Boxing with Costello & Bunce

David Haye joins the podcast to look back on his thrilling win over the then undisputed number one cruiserweight in the world in Frenchman Jean Marc Mormeck, which happened ten years ago this week.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p05mwx5n

[Master]

Was Haye really that good as heavyweight than I remember?

It says more about the quality of the current crop.
I like AJ, but at the moment his best win was against a 41 year old.

I think a better question is would a prime Wlad beat AJ and Wilder?

[oakleyno1]

Was Haye really that good as heavyweight than I remember?

It says more about the quality of the current crop.
I like AJ, but at the moment his best win was against a 41 year old.

I think a better question is would a prime Wlad beat AJ and Wilder?

I'd say Yes.... although with the chin you can never be certain.

I do think AJ has space to grow more as a fighter though - and Wilder showed he has become more than jsut a banger in the first Stiverne fight.. so we might not say the same in a couple of years

[X]

Wilder has a much better jab than Joshua.

Watch AJ ..... every time he throws the jab, he brings it back to his hip level. It is not straight, and a decent fighter would make him pay dearly. Just like Schmeling did to Louis

[Primo Carnera]

Was Haye really that good as heavyweight than I remember?

It says more about the quality of the current crop.
I like AJ, but at the moment his best win was against a 41 year old.

I think a better question is would a prime Wlad beat AJ and Wilder?

Yeah of course he would mate, without question. Wlad is seen by some (probably not me) as top 10 of all time , so definitely top 20. AJ and Wilder are nowhere near that yet.
and also, as much as I like AJ, he went life and death with Wlad when Wlad was 41 and been out the ring nearly 2 years, so in his prime , there's no doubt.
People can slag off Wlad for being boring and holding (cue Eric) , but it's about hit and not getting hit and it's about Winning the way that suits you best.
in defence of AJ and Wilder, I have to say , we probably haven't seem them peak yet.