Should transgenered people be allowed to box?

[TitoFan]

Well..... I don't know about women's boxing.... but there sure are a lot of women athletes coming forward now on transgender sports in general.


https://www.dailywire.com/news/45336...nst-frank-camp

"Another Female Athletic Champion Comes Out Against Male-To-Female Transgender Participation In Women’s Sports"



Damn. Paula Radcliffe must not have gotten the memo that by expressing those thoughts, it now makes her "transphobic."

Oh well... it's only the voice of one retired long-distance runner, right? Good thing she didn't post that on Saddo's. She'd be burned at the stake.

Oh but wait...


https://www.pinknews.co.uk/2019/03/3...sgender-women/

"Gabby Logan says transgender women competing in sport is ‘not fair’"


That is the surprisingly uncritical article headline on Pink News, a UK-based online newspaper marketed toward the LGBTQ community.

Gabby is another former woman athlete weighing in on the subject.

There's probably more, right?


https://www.theguardian.com/society/...ender-athletes

"Sports stars weigh in on row over transgender athletes"


So you've got Paula Radcliffe, Gabby Logan, Martina Navratilova, Kelly Holmes, Sharron Davies, and a host of other women athletes speaking out against transgender male-to-females in females sports. And they're not even talking exclusively about women's boxing, where the object of the sport is to beat each other senseless.

Good thing they weren't in here arguing with the likes of Beanz. Or maybe he knows what's best over and above all these women athletes who actually participate in women sports.

But never mind that. Here's the most telling excerpt from the last article which basically puts it all in a nutshell........



"But Fair Play for Women insists women are clearly disadvantaged at both elite and grassroots level when they compete against trans athletes.

“Claims of transphobia are wild and unfounded,” its spokeswoman Dr Nicola Williams told the Guardian. “It is a tool used to shame women into silence. We want to get past not being able to speak out and to encourage a debate that leads to sports bodies implementing policies that are fair to women."


Claims of transphobia are a TOOL USED TO SHAME WOMEN INTO SILENCE. How about that. Did you hear that Beanz? Because when I said it, you pooh-poohed it like you do everything that doesn't agree with your own dirty little agenda. Now that actual women athletes are saying it, maybe it'll bore a hole in your skull and stay there.


News flash, sport: It's entirely possible that some of those women boxers who claim not to have a problem fighting transgenders are AFRAID OF BEING SHAMED INTO SILENCE. So they go with the flow and secretly hope not to get their heads bashed in by a Mike Tyson turned girly.


I know nobody here likes to hear about this subject, but I just thought I'd nail the coffin shut on this one.

[walrus]

Well..... I don't know about women's boxing.... but there sure are a lot of women athletes coming forward now on transgender sports in general.


https://www.dailywire.com/news/45336...nst-frank-camp

"Another Female Athletic Champion Comes Out Against Male-To-Female Transgender Participation In Women’s Sports"



Damn. Paula Radcliffe must not have gotten the memo that by expressing those thoughts, it now makes her "transphobic."

Oh well... it's only the voice of one retired long-distance runner, right? Good thing she didn't post that on Saddo's. She'd be burned at the stake.

Oh but wait...


https://www.pinknews.co.uk/2019/03/3...sgender-women/

"Gabby Logan says transgender women competing in sport is ‘not fair’"


That is the surprisingly uncritical article headline on Pink News, a UK-based online newspaper marketed toward the LGBTQ community.

Gabby is another former woman athlete weighing in on the subject.

There's probably more, right?


https://www.theguardian.com/society/...ender-athletes

"Sports stars weigh in on row over transgender athletes"


So you've got Paula Radcliffe, Gabby Logan, Martina Navratilova, Kelly Holmes, Sharron Davies, and a host of other women athletes speaking out against transgender male-to-females in females sports. And they're not even talking exclusively about women's boxing, where the object of the sport is to beat each other senseless.

Good thing they weren't in here arguing with the likes of Beanz. Or maybe he knows what's best over and above all these women athletes who actually participate in women sports.

But never mind that. Here's the most telling excerpt from the last article which basically puts it all in a nutshell........



"But Fair Play for Women insists women are clearly disadvantaged at both elite and grassroots level when they compete against trans athletes.

“Claims of transphobia are wild and unfounded,” its spokeswoman Dr Nicola Williams told the Guardian. “It is a tool used to shame women into silence. We want to get past not being able to speak out and to encourage a debate that leads to sports bodies implementing policies that are fair to women."


Claims of transphobia are a TOOL USED TO SHAME WOMEN INTO SILENCE. How about that. Did you hear that Beanz? Because when I said it, you pooh-poohed it like you do everything that doesn't agree with your own dirty little agenda. Now that actual women athletes are saying it, maybe it'll bore a hole in your skull and stay there.


News flash, sport: It's entirely possible that some of those women boxers who claim not to have a problem fighting transgenders are AFRAID OF BEING SHAMED INTO SILENCE. So they go with the flow and secretly hope not to get their heads bashed in by a Mike Tyson turned girly.


I know nobody here likes to hear about this subject, but I just thought I'd nail the coffin shut on this one.

They are professional athletes what do they know. This is an outrage to the LBGTBP people

[TitoFan]

Well..... I don't know about women's boxing.... but there sure are a lot of women athletes coming forward now on transgender sports in general.


https://www.dailywire.com/news/45336...nst-frank-camp

"Another Female Athletic Champion Comes Out Against Male-To-Female Transgender Participation In Women’s Sports"



Damn. Paula Radcliffe must not have gotten the memo that by expressing those thoughts, it now makes her "transphobic."

Oh well... it's only the voice of one retired long-distance runner, right? Good thing she didn't post that on Saddo's. She'd be burned at the stake.

Oh but wait...


https://www.pinknews.co.uk/2019/03/3...sgender-women/

"Gabby Logan says transgender women competing in sport is ‘not fair’"


That is the surprisingly uncritical article headline on Pink News, a UK-based online newspaper marketed toward the LGBTQ community.

Gabby is another former woman athlete weighing in on the subject.

There's probably more, right?


https://www.theguardian.com/society/...ender-athletes

"Sports stars weigh in on row over transgender athletes"


So you've got Paula Radcliffe, Gabby Logan, Martina Navratilova, Kelly Holmes, Sharron Davies, and a host of other women athletes speaking out against transgender male-to-females in females sports. And they're not even talking exclusively about women's boxing, where the object of the sport is to beat each other senseless.

Good thing they weren't in here arguing with the likes of Beanz. Or maybe he knows what's best over and above all these women athletes who actually participate in women sports.

But never mind that. Here's the most telling excerpt from the last article which basically puts it all in a nutshell........



"But Fair Play for Women insists women are clearly disadvantaged at both elite and grassroots level when they compete against trans athletes.

“Claims of transphobia are wild and unfounded,” its spokeswoman Dr Nicola Williams told the Guardian. “It is a tool used to shame women into silence. We want to get past not being able to speak out and to encourage a debate that leads to sports bodies implementing policies that are fair to women."


Claims of transphobia are a TOOL USED TO SHAME WOMEN INTO SILENCE. How about that. Did you hear that Beanz? Because when I said it, you pooh-poohed it like you do everything that doesn't agree with your own dirty little agenda. Now that actual women athletes are saying it, maybe it'll bore a hole in your skull and stay there.


News flash, sport: It's entirely possible that some of those women boxers who claim not to have a problem fighting transgenders are AFRAID OF BEING SHAMED INTO SILENCE. So they go with the flow and secretly hope not to get their heads bashed in by a Mike Tyson turned girly.


I know nobody here likes to hear about this subject, but I just thought I'd nail the coffin shut on this one.

They are professional athletes what do they know. This is an outrage to the LBGTBP people

You missed the Q and the XYZ.

[Beanz]

Well..... I don't know about women's boxing.... but there sure are a lot of women athletes coming forward now on transgender sports in general.


https://www.dailywire.com/news/45336...nst-frank-camp

"Another Female Athletic Champion Comes Out Against Male-To-Female Transgender Participation In Women’s Sports"



Damn. Paula Radcliffe must not have gotten the memo that by expressing those thoughts, it now makes her "transphobic."

Oh well... it's only the voice of one retired long-distance runner, right? Good thing she didn't post that on Saddo's. She'd be burned at the stake.

Oh but wait...


https://www.pinknews.co.uk/2019/03/3...sgender-women/

"Gabby Logan says transgender women competing in sport is ‘not fair’"


That is the surprisingly uncritical article headline on Pink News, a UK-based online newspaper marketed toward the LGBTQ community.

Gabby is another former woman athlete weighing in on the subject.

There's probably more, right?


https://www.theguardian.com/society/...ender-athletes

"Sports stars weigh in on row over transgender athletes"


So you've got Paula Radcliffe, Gabby Logan, Martina Navratilova, Kelly Holmes, Sharron Davies, and a host of other women athletes speaking out against transgender male-to-females in females sports. And they're not even talking exclusively about women's boxing, where the object of the sport is to beat each other senseless.

Good thing they weren't in here arguing with the likes of Beanz. Or maybe he knows what's best over and above all these women athletes who actually participate in women sports.

But never mind that. Here's the most telling excerpt from the last article which basically puts it all in a nutshell........



"But Fair Play for Women insists women are clearly disadvantaged at both elite and grassroots level when they compete against trans athletes.

“Claims of transphobia are wild and unfounded,” its spokeswoman Dr Nicola Williams told the Guardian. “It is a tool used to shame women into silence. We want to get past not being able to speak out and to encourage a debate that leads to sports bodies implementing policies that are fair to women."


Claims of transphobia are a TOOL USED TO SHAME WOMEN INTO SILENCE. How about that. Did you hear that Beanz? Because when I said it, you pooh-poohed it like you do everything that doesn't agree with your own dirty little agenda. Now that actual women athletes are saying it, maybe it'll bore a hole in your skull and stay there.


News flash, sport: It's entirely possible that some of those women boxers who claim not to have a problem fighting transgenders are AFRAID OF BEING SHAMED INTO SILENCE. So they go with the flow and secretly hope not to get their heads bashed in by a Mike Tyson turned girly.


I know nobody here likes to hear about this subject, but I just thought I'd nail the coffin shut on this one.

The only women shamed into silence in this thread were the female boxers who were quite happy to fight trans people. You pretended they didn't exist and just quoted fighters that agreed with you.

'Dirty little Agenda' "bore a hole in your skull' 'burned at the stake'?

Go back and read and you will see you are just inventing stuff. More than aware of the whole debate and those athletes I expect you have never heard of. Master reffered to it right at the start. Been all over the British media. Great program on Radio 4, I will look up for you about it from weeks ago.

Interesting fact. I once kissed Plymouth legend Sharon Davies. I was 11 and I got to shake Superstars and Judo champ Brian Jack's hand too.

[Master]

I loved Superstars and Brian Jack's was a hero of mines!

Remember kevin keegan crashing on his bike!

[TitoFan]

The only women shamed into silence in this thread were the female boxers who were quite happy to fight trans people. You pretended they didn't exist and just quoted fighters that agreed with you.

'Dirty little Agenda' "bore a hole in your skull' 'burned at the stake'?

Go back and read and you will see you are just inventing stuff. More than aware of the whole debate and those athletes I expect you have never heard of. Master reffered to it right at the start. Been all over the British media. Great program on Radio 4, I will look up for you about it from weeks ago.

Interesting fact. I once kissed Plymouth legend Sharon Davies. I was 11 and I got to shake Superstars and Judo champ Brian Jack's hand too.

Oh c'mon Beanz. You're desperately grasping at straws in a shameful way, just for the sake of trying not to lose an argument. "The only women shamed into silence in this thread were the female boxers who were quite happy to fight trans people"??

Do you even read what you shovel?

Those women aren't reading this thread, Beanz..... not that I should have to clear that up for you.

Those women are quite happy harping on about how they would gladly fight trans people. Probably because #1 they know full well they probably won't really have to face any..... and #2 probably they don't want to sound like wimps. It's a win-win situation. You say the right thing.... and can privately refuse later on if the situation were to come up.

And yet you fail to understand how women objectors are the ones being shamed into silence? Really?....................... Really?

Do you understand that it's not just me saying it.... it's women authority figures in sports? Including athletes?

Is "winning" an argument worth more to you than the safety of women in sports? (Nod your head yes). Go ahead... admit it. Everyone's entitled to their opinion no matter how wrong and disgusting.



BTW, many of these women objectors are talking about sprinting, football, cycling...... sports other than boxing where again the objective is to knock each other senseless.

Logic would say it's even more of an issue in boxing, where permanent damage and injury can occur.



Amazing how you clutch onto your "house of cards" argument.

[Spicoli]

Male to female boxers fighting women in sanctioned matches. Still drumming on about something that doesn't actually happen . No concern and grievance for the dude born a dude hitting on a 'female' by birth in a fight . Just kidding I'm not losing sleep over it.

[Beanz]

The only women shamed into silence in this thread were the female boxers who were quite happy to fight trans people. You pretended they didn't exist and just quoted fighters that agreed with you.

'Dirty little Agenda' "bore a hole in your skull' 'burned at the stake'?

Go back and read and you will see you are just inventing stuff. More than aware of the whole debate and those athletes I expect you have never heard of. Master reffered to it right at the start. Been all over the British media. Great program on Radio 4, I will look up for you about it from weeks ago.

Interesting fact. I once kissed Plymouth legend Sharon Davies. I was 11 and I got to shake Superstars and Judo champ Brian Jack's hand too.

Oh c'mon Beanz. You're desperately grasping at straws in a shameful way, just for the sake of trying not to lose an argument. "The only women shamed into silence in this thread were the female boxers who were quite happy to fight trans people"??

Do you even read what you shovel?

Those women aren't reading this thread, Beanz..... not that I should have to clear that up for you.

Those women are quite happy harping on about how they would gladly fight trans people. Probably because #1 they know full well they probably won't really have to face any..... and #2 probably they don't want to sound like wimps. It's a win-win situation. You say the right thing.... and can privately refuse later on if the situation were to come up.

And yet you fail to understand how women objectors are the ones being shamed into silence? Really?....................... Really?

Do you understand that it's not just me saying it.... it's women authority figures in sports? Including athletes?

Is "winning" an argument worth more to you than the safety of women in sports? (Nod your head yes). Go ahead... admit it. Everyone's entitled to their opinion no matter how wrong and disgusting.



BTW, many of these women objectors are talking about sprinting, football, cycling...... sports other than boxing where again the objective is to knock each other senseless.

Logic would say it's even more of an issue in boxing, where permanent damage and injury can occur.



Amazing how you clutch onto your "house of cards" argument.

Tito you are inventing my argument in order to create a position that I do not inhabit. You are not one of the few objective posters on the site, however many times you keep telling us all. It's always about winning for you, but it is very lazy for you to paint all the other posters with the same brush. That is purely projection on your part.

Female boxers should be forced to fight trans boxers who pre gender reassignment were born male < This is the argument you are inventing in order to give your own position some kind of relevance or credence.

That is your argument nobody else's. So desperate to have that argument represented as a strawman opponent for you to knock down, you then starting mentioning people who had not even offered an opinion in the thread and insisting this was their argument (Myself, Fenster etc) .

It is not, it's your argument, you are the one who said when talking about a post op female trans boxer 'He's being forced onto opponents who want no part of it.'

It's the same bigotry dressed up as bravery argument. Standing up against an imaginary tidal wave you think threatens the very sandy foundations of your own daft arguments.

You continually go an about having a good set of values and casting anyone who doesn't agree with you as some weak willed degenerate without the fortitude to 'stand up' against what you see as some heroic stance against a prevailing wind. Yet right from the start you insisted that anyone disagreeing with you was actually supporting violence against women imposed against their will by men. That was a pretty low place to have to stoop to when nobody you were accusing had even contributed to the thread.

"If we want to play the all high and mighty with this, why not just drop all pretenses and just let women and men fight each other in the ring. Heaven knows we need more examples of men beating up on women in society. .... let's let the Ron's and the Beanzs and the Fensters of the world continue carrying their torch."

At this point only Ron had posted in the thread.

So the only one getting all high and mighty has been you all along. It is about freedom. Freedom of choice. That is as much about offering that opportunity to fight as it is about having the right to turn down that opportunity. It's a pretty basic principle.You want to dictate things as though your morality somehow supersedes that free choice.
Trans people exist and many want to participate in sport. There are not enough of them to have their own classification and so the complications involved will need to be addressed. And they are complicated, you are the loudest advocate for denying this complication. The over riding principle here in a thread with the title it has though, is that it is wrong to deny people opportunity, and that goes for the female fighters who are happy to fight them as much as it goes for those trans fighters.


So there really is no need to claim anyone disagreeing with you is wrong and disgusting and wants to disregard the safety of women. Not just women but fighters engaged in the sport who you also must think are just as disgusting for not agreeing with you. After all in your eyes they are also advocating disregarding the safety of women.


I applaud your desire to fight but really you are shadow boxing imaginary opponents in the corner.

[TitoFan]

The only women shamed into silence in this thread were the female boxers who were quite happy to fight trans people. You pretended they didn't exist and just quoted fighters that agreed with you.

'Dirty little Agenda' "bore a hole in your skull' 'burned at the stake'?

Go back and read and you will see you are just inventing stuff. More than aware of the whole debate and those athletes I expect you have never heard of. Master reffered to it right at the start. Been all over the British media. Great program on Radio 4, I will look up for you about it from weeks ago.

Interesting fact. I once kissed Plymouth legend Sharon Davies. I was 11 and I got to shake Superstars and Judo champ Brian Jack's hand too.

Oh c'mon Beanz. You're desperately grasping at straws in a shameful way, just for the sake of trying not to lose an argument. "The only women shamed into silence in this thread were the female boxers who were quite happy to fight trans people"??

Do you even read what you shovel?

Those women aren't reading this thread, Beanz..... not that I should have to clear that up for you.

Those women are quite happy harping on about how they would gladly fight trans people. Probably because #1 they know full well they probably won't really have to face any..... and #2 probably they don't want to sound like wimps. It's a win-win situation. You say the right thing.... and can privately refuse later on if the situation were to come up.

And yet you fail to understand how women objectors are the ones being shamed into silence? Really?....................... Really?

Do you understand that it's not just me saying it.... it's women authority figures in sports? Including athletes?

Is "winning" an argument worth more to you than the safety of women in sports? (Nod your head yes). Go ahead... admit it. Everyone's entitled to their opinion no matter how wrong and disgusting.



BTW, many of these women objectors are talking about sprinting, football, cycling...... sports other than boxing where again the objective is to knock each other senseless.

Logic would say it's even more of an issue in boxing, where permanent damage and injury can occur.



Amazing how you clutch onto your "house of cards" argument.

Tito you are inventing my argument in order to create a position that I do not inhabit. You are not one of the few objective posters on the site, however many times you keep telling us all. It's always about winning for you, but it is very lazy for you to paint all the other posters with the same brush. That is purely projection on your part.

Female boxers should be forced to fight trans boxers who pre gender reassignment were born male < This is the argument you are inventing in order to give your own position some kind of relevance or credence.

That is your argument nobody else's. So desperate to have that argument represented as a strawman opponent for you to knock down, you then starting mentioning people who had not even offered an opinion in the thread and insisting this was their argument (Myself, Fenster etc) .

It is not, it's your argument, you are the one who said when talking about a post op female trans boxer 'He's being forced onto opponents who want no part of it.'

It's the same bigotry dressed up as bravery argument. Standing up against an imaginary tidal wave you think threatens the very sandy foundations of your own daft arguments.

You continually go an about having a good set of values and casting anyone who doesn't agree with you as some weak willed degenerate without the fortitude to 'stand up' against what you see as some heroic stance against a prevailing wind. Yet right from the start you insisted that anyone disagreeing with you was actually supporting violence against women imposed against their will by men. That was a pretty low place to have to stoop to when nobody you were accusing had even contributed to the thread.

"If we want to play the all high and mighty with this, why not just drop all pretenses and just let women and men fight each other in the ring. Heaven knows we need more examples of men beating up on women in society. .... let's let the Ron's and the Beanzs and the Fensters of the world continue carrying their torch."

At this point only Ron had posted in the thread.

So the only one getting all high and mighty has been you all along. It is about freedom. Freedom of choice. That is as much about offering that opportunity to fight as it is about having the right to turn down that opportunity. It's a pretty basic principle.You want to dictate things as though your morality somehow supersedes that free choice.
Trans people exist and many want to participate in sport. There are not enough of them to have their own classification and so the complications involved will need to be addressed. And they are complicated, you are the loudest advocate for denying this complication. The over riding principle here in a thread with the title it has though, is that it is wrong to deny people opportunity, and that goes for the female fighters who are happy to fight them as much as it goes for those trans fighters.


So there really is no need to claim anyone disagreeing with you is wrong and disgusting and wants to disregard the safety of women. Not just women but fighters engaged in the sport who you also must think are just as disgusting for not agreeing with you. After all in your eyes they are also advocating disregarding the safety of women.


I applaud your desire to fight but really you are shadow boxing imaginary opponents in the corner.

So many words Beanz, only to regurgitate the same tired notion that I am inventing your argument. And yet it was you who came in gleefullly to "like" Ron's assertion that I was being "sexist" for stating my opinion that transgender "female" boxers shouldn't be forced on women boxers. It is an opinion... not a DECREE. But you are genetically incapable of distinguishing between one and the other. It's little wonder Lyle used to ask (toward the end of his posting here) if stating his opinions was ok with you... sarcastically, of course.

The only one I truly dragged in here by mentioning him was Fenster. If he were to claim what you're claiming, I'd have to say he's right. Because unlike you, I know how to admit when the other guy's right. But again, you are genetically incapable of "lowering yourself" to those levels. It's a good thing it was Alpha and not you claiming the Earth is flat. You'd beat that horse into the ground, and probably through the ground until you came out the other side.

As much as it amuses you to talk about my "imaginary opponents", it hasn't been an imaginary opponent writing back through reams of pages of thread, trying to force HIS opinion on everybody else. Not only are you NOT imaginary, but you also have a penchant for twisting words and making your own imaginary counter-arguments.

I've had many an argument here with quite a few people (although nobody holds a candle to your own enviable record). Yet I've managed to agree to disagree with quite a few of them, and I'll even mention Lyle again who... although we totally and extremely disagree on subjects like Trump and guns... we've developed a mutual respect for each other and our opinions. You, on the other hand, just seem to constantly alienate everybody by inventing positions (the very shit you accuse me of), and reflecting your own flaws on others.

I won't be bothered to go dredging up all the posts where you defend the case for transgender "females" fighting women boxers. Suffice it to say there's quite a few, and it would be very adult of you to just come out and admit that's how you think. I respect people who just come out with their opinions, rather than spend all their time trying to tear down others, while never committing to their own. THAT.... is your very well known M.O. on this forum, and deep inside you know it.

Difference between you and me is I'm not afraid to put a controversial opinion out there. You want to debate it? Fine. But be up front about it. Don't go around @mentioning your little tag team and don't twist my words around. Going back to Ron..... he called me "sexist" for stating my opinion, which is only based on women's safety in sports, and HAPPENS to be echoed by ACTUAL women in sports. Ron has his own reputation on the forum. But because you have a hard-on for all things LGBTQ, and because I'm on that list of people you love to argue with...... in you come with your little "like".

And before you childishly say that "liking" is not posting, it's like if someone came in and insulted YOU, and I came by and "liked" the post. You'd probably take notice of that, wouldn't you. But no..... you're Mr. Double Standard here.... and it's so obvious it oozes out of your pores.

[Beanz]

[TIC]

[TitoFan]

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/oth...en/ar-AA1mnozj


Here's an article on this piece of shit decision by spineless morons, thus... formally putting women's boxing at risk.

Fuck these assholes.

I hope this brainless decision gets reversed.

I wish it would reach the SCOTUS, which is thankfully conservative nowadays.

[Dark Lord Al]

Let them have their own Olympics, and their own category in boxing and compete against each other.
Then see how many watch it, as for blokes fighting women NO !

[NoSavingByTheBell]

Who the ~fuck~ is Ron?